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Author Topic: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?  (Read 845 times)

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Offline digilante

  • Posts: 6
TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« on: November 06, 2018, 05:51 PM »
Hi,

The corded TS 55 saw can be mounted on an adapter plate that then goes onto the CMS table.

Would there be any reason to think that the cordless TSC 55 would not fit the adapter plate? Cannot find anything on the Festool site.

Of course one does wonder about the ergonomics of having one's left arm cut off while the right reaches under the table to turn the saw off ;-)

Cheers.

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Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 187
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2018, 07:48 PM »
Hi,

The corded TS 55 saw can be mounted on an adapter plate that then goes onto the CMS table.

Would there be any reason to think that the cordless TSC 55 would not fit the adapter plate? Cannot find anything on the Festool site.

Of course one does wonder about the ergonomics of having one's left arm cut off while the right reaches under the table to turn the saw off ;-)

Cheers.

Most folks will be able to turn the saw off twice with this setup, after that risk of cutting arm off is drastically reduced.

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 1532
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2018, 07:54 PM »
Of course one does wonder about the ergonomics of having one's left arm cut off while the right reaches under the table to turn the saw off ;-)
Most folks will be able to turn the saw off twice with this setup, after that risk of cutting arm off is drastically reduced.
And if you add a string and pedal mechanism you can use your remaining limbs i.e. legs.

Offline digilante

  • Posts: 6
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #3 on: November 12, 2018, 11:51 AM »
Hi,

Humour very much appreciated ;-) However, it would be great to get a definitive response: a) Will I have any issues mounting the TSC 55 in the CMS saw plate, and b) is there a clip or something, like with the cordless jigsaw to keep the saw on while mounted?

Cheers.

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 1532
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2018, 08:11 PM »
I think TSC will fit on the CMS plate just fine (the base is identical), but the depth adjustment lever will interfere with the front battery. There is a switch clip for TS that will fit on TSC, but how will you use it? Dive under the table every time you want to turn the saw on or off?
« Last Edit: November 12, 2018, 08:14 PM by Svar »

Offline digilante

  • Posts: 6
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2018, 06:03 AM »
Hi,

Thanks, I did not think about the front battery interfering.

I have a medium-quality dedicated table saw, with a big red emergency off button at knee height, so I'm ok for bigger cuts but with lower precision.

Having some cordless items already, I bought more these past few months as there is a special offer (one battery free with each item), meaning I can get the Basic version of all the items, saving $. The TSC 55 would be the last purchase.

Since I have the CMS extension to the MFT, as well as the jigsaw plate and the PSC 420 Carvex, it seems logical to just get the CMS saw plate as well.

- Looking at the battery attachment options, it seems that the front one is the optional one, meaning that the saw should fit and the heigtht adjustment should work. Yes, less power, but this would be for small, more precise cuts.

- The PSC 420 came with the accessories systainer, which contains a little plastic clip (with CMS printed on it) to keep the jigsaw on. However, the power switch is press-on-stay-on, press-off-stay-off, meaning the clip is useless, as pulling it out while the jigsaw is on does nothing obviously. So the clip is useful only for the corded version, so power can be controlled from the CMS table or extension.

In summary, yes, until Festool produce a mains adapter with the right shape to slide into the cordless units, it does mean diving under the table for both the Carvex and the TSC 55.

The DTSC 400 cordless delta sander came with a mains adapter which works very well, and yes, I've read the threads here claiming that a mains adapter for the standard shape battery is "impossible", but as an electronics engineer, I just find that somewhat dubious. So it's a choice between cordless freedom but diving under the table when used with the CMS, or corded and then getting upset when the battery-mains adapter comes out at some point.

Thanks!

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1019
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #6 on: November 14, 2018, 04:41 PM »
The DTSC 400 cordless delta sander came with a mains adapter which works very well, and yes, I've read the threads here claiming that a mains adapter for the standard shape battery is "impossible", but as an electronics engineer, I just find that somewhat dubious.
I had a discussion with a festool engineer about a mains adapter for the 18V system, my suggestion was to make one in a 5.2A battery case with a plugit connector. Gist: when you want to transform the amount of power needed for a TSC in that footprint you get interesting thermal problems, should you add active cooling you'll get problems with dust clogging the heatsink, it's also a weight and size issue. TS 55 draws ~1050W according to datasheet, that would be near 60A@18V (as I guess the TSC consumes compareable amounts of power), here is a datasheet for 1KW transformers (1KW@15V/24V output, just to point out the size of these things), these are actively cooled (as of thermal loss ~175W) sized 12x6x20cm and weight of 2kg.
TL;DR: so far everyone thinks it's not technically feasible when you want an economical and ergonomical design.

Don't get me wrong, in case you think it's doable: be my guest, I welcome everyone that hasn't heard that something is impossible and thus is able to come up with something that works. I would buy one should you make a 230V version that can drive a TSC without exploding/melting (so yes, it would need CE and GS certification). Should you be able to design one that is mechanically, thermally and electrically stable when used with a TSC (while being simple enough so BOM isn't a showstopper and not heavier than a normal battery) I'm quite confident that there are quite some (festool included) that would be interested in you selling them that technology.

Back on topic: I would simply forget about using battery powered tools in the CMS. You might be able to do it but there's a reason why power off switches are usually conveniently located: to stop people from interacting with the tool while it's running. And I see ways how you could accidently interact with moving parts (both with TS and PS) when fumbling around under the table to locate the switch.
My advice: Don't. You only have 10 fingers.

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 1532
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2018, 06:39 PM »
DeWalt has 15A 120V adapter for their Flexvolt miter saw and its quite compact. Perhaps its small because its only step down from 120V to 60V and chop saw cuts are short duration (less overheating). However, I think its only a matter of time before FT and others will come up with adapters for high power tools.
« Last Edit: November 14, 2018, 06:45 PM by Svar »

Offline digilante

  • Posts: 6
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #8 on: November 15, 2018, 09:13 AM »
Thanks Gregor,

Just to be clear, I only find the statement "impossible" to be dubious, and I absolutely do not claim to be cleverer than all Festool engineers put together, or that I have some magic solution. I believe that the time will come when such an adapter is available, and probably sooner than we think, what with progress in materials engineering.

As a temporary solution, albeit one to be tested carefully when 60A is involved ;-) would be to purchase a standalone transformer, construct a makeshift adapter (small plastic plate, contacts, some shrinkwrap, potentially some additional components) that would fit the battery slot, and wire that to the transformer, which you could mount near the table.

Certainly not a new idea - our electronics lab at university had rails of 220V sockets and 24V sockets, and way back in time a lot of equipment ran on 60V (or was it 70V) if I recall.

Thanks again!

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1019
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #9 on: November 15, 2018, 09:47 AM »
Just to be clear, I only find the statement "impossible" to be dubious, and I absolutely do not claim to be cleverer than all Festool engineers put together, or that I have some magic solution. I believe that the time will come when such an adapter is available, and probably sooner than we think, what with progress in materials engineering.
We can at least hope for that, as it would be nice to have one.

Quote
As a temporary solution, albeit one to be tested carefully when 60A is involved ;-) would be to purchase a standalone transformer, construct a makeshift adapter (small plastic plate, contacts, some shrinkwrap, potentially some additional components) that would fit the battery slot, and wire that to the transformer, which you could mount near the table.
I though about that variant too (to have the transformation happening apart from the tool) but as 60A DC needs quite thick cables which tend to be quite unflexible... it didn't seem like a practial solution to attach the tool to something that behaves more like a broomstick than a power cord.

BTW: The sample transformers I linked are >350€ (excl. VAT).
For that you can get a quite some original Festool batteries (and a bunch of chargers to keep them full).

Offline digilante

  • Posts: 6
Re: TSC 55 with CMS adapter plate?
« Reply #10 on: November 15, 2018, 10:55 AM »
Hi,

Thick inflexible cable is just fine, it would be used only when the machine is mounted under the CMS table adapter plate. For any other usage I would use the batteries, and this potential duality is what attracts me to the TSC instead of the TS.

Another potential solution to avoid ducking under the table, one that is unfortunately not possible right now (so close, and yet so far): I've been playing with the bluetooth batteries and the bluetooth accessory on the dust extractor. Once the tool starts, the dust extraction starts automatically... how great it would have been if the reverse was configurable too - I push the bluetooth button on the dust extractor, and it turns off the power tool.