Author Topic: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing  (Read 11773 times)

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Offline Ripit

  • Posts: 17
Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« on: April 04, 2018, 09:56 PM »
I just don’t get why one would store their tools in the systainers unless you were one that worked on a jobsite or shop to job site, am I missing something?

I have about 15 of these things and I have never used the systainers. I have been using festool since around 2003 and was trained in traditional furniture making and also did quite a bit of commercial and residential cabinetmaking I mostly always worked in my shop so I had all the tools out and ready to go.
I definitely think that less used tools could stay in the systainer but the saw,routers, sanders and drills i like on a custom built shelf ready to go.

So now fast forward 15 yrs (now in software engineering - go figure) and I am rebuilding my garage shop and as much as I like the idea of the whole diy sysport thing I just can’t wrap my head around it for a few reasons...

1. It’s plasticy, (interestingly enough I work in the Plastic Injection Molding industry - go figure again...) I get it, it’s easy all you have to do is make a platform put some slides on it... but a wood drawer feels so much better...
2. You have to pull out the systainer then open the lid, wood drawer u just open it
3. Most tools are poorly organized with the supplied - wait for it....plastic insert. Ya u can build custom inserts but u can do that in a wood drawer and it’s simpler.
4. I am sure I could complain more but I won’t

Not trying to be negative but I just don’t get it and I want to see If I am missing an opportunity here before I start building out the shop.




« Last Edit: April 04, 2018, 10:25 PM by Ripit »

Offline blaszcsj

  • Posts: 386
  • I like building stuff with my hands.
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2018, 10:19 PM »
I love the systainers (I have them all on drawers now). The main value in them is not if you only work in a shop. If that is the case then quick cubby access or drawers are the way to go. However, if you do onsite work, or a mix of the two then it is super convenient to be able to latch boxes together and take the shop to the site. they just pack so efficiently in a truck or van. anyways, thats my 2cents.
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Offline pettyconstruction

  • Posts: 449
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #2 on: April 04, 2018, 10:22 PM »
Obviously you can use/ not use the systainers .
For me it’s not the storage of the tools,I can keep them safe,but the travel to and from a job.

I do residential construction and remodeling , and over the course of a day , all of the tools needed are out and being used , but what makes a real difference to me is clean up.

At the end of the day, I can stack my tools and carry them out in a larger amount than without a systainer. If I know a basic task , I also carry them into the house in stacks.

Most of my systainers have multiple tools and accessories . By putting task minded tools together ,I can save space.
I have 2 jig saws in one ,1 with a coping foot and the other for jig saw stuff.
I put drills together with a load of screws.
You get the idea.
I do agree that they take up a lot of space,but for they are worth it.
Charlie


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Offline Ripit

  • Posts: 17
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2018, 10:29 PM »
I love the systainers (I have them all on drawers now). The main value in them is not if you only work in a shop. If that is the case then quick cubby access or drawers are the way to go. However, if you do onsite work, or a mix of the two then it is super convenient to be able to latch boxes together and take the shop to the site. they just pack so efficiently in a truck or van. anyways, thats my 2cents.

Yea, I totally get the travel part of it if I was doing site work I would totally be on board with it. Btw I see you are in Cincy, i was born and grew up there also had my business there till I shut-er down and moved to Vt.

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5269
  • Does Anyone Know What Time It Is?
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2018, 11:02 PM »
I like keeping my tools in systainers. I think of them as kits. I keep the ones that frequently use in the same place 2 drills (one for drilling/predrilling one for screwing) and a installers kit for example, My Domino 500 and dominos are kept together. everthing is right there and now I built under MFT storage as I have 3 MFTs and set up work stations.

Offline Peter_C

  • Posts: 695
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2018, 11:47 PM »
I agree with the OP about shop storage. Systainer's take up a lot of space. Drawers and shelving are more efficient. Stacking them is a pain, as the tool you want is always at the bottom.

For mobility Systainer's are great! They protect the tools, and make it easy to grab what tools are needed for the job. A cart of some kind is a requirement. Of course they must be augmented by other rolling tool boxes, and personally a larger more affordable box system with wheels that stack are superior, like Ridgid or Milwaukee Packout. Many of my tools wouldn't even fit in a Systainer.

With my automotive tools that came in plastic storage boxes, the first thing I did was remove the tools and put them into my tool box drawer, then threw the blow molded plastic space waster away. Otherwise I would need one tool box just to hold all the stupid plastic boxes.

Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 562
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2018, 08:09 AM »
The SYSTEM!

The FS tools I acquired beside the Kapex were all accompanied by a systainer. Often tools from different manufacturers comes with accessories that you will never use. To me the systainers are usefull and ease;

1) My tools organization (I do not spend time looking for the tool I need NOW),
2) the use of accessories & kit by having everything together,
3) store consumables near the power tool for quick access,
4) protect the tools from dust accumulation,
5) I could add more but I will stop here :D

I have a systainer for the following items;
Domino Tenons, Domino accessories, Sanders accessories, Sand paper, TS-55 accessories, TS-55 blades, Kapex 120 blades, OF 1400 accessories, OF 1400 bits, LR 32 set, etc.. in the end I know where everything is stored and I like it  [big grin]

I use the tools ~80% inside the shop, so moving from site to site is not a big factor. I even bought Tanos boxes to store several of my Milwaukee power tools.

Mario
Mario

Offline BarneyD

  • Posts: 46
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2018, 08:53 AM »
I agree with @Ripit. I love the look of a wall of systainers, but I don't find them practical for my personal use. 99% of my work is in the shop.  I have a couple of rolling assembly carts (which slide under the radial arm saw table when not being used) and a rolling MFT type table, all with drawers which hold most of my Festools. The OF 1400 resides in a drawer below the router table. The only systainer in my shop is the LR32 kit.

277899-0

I've saved all of my sytainers for use on the rare road trip. They're super handy for that.

Barney

Offline HarveyWildes

  • Posts: 792
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2018, 12:36 PM »
I'm a shop user - rarely travel with my tools.  I think systainers are a mixed bag - I'm still trying to figure them out

One of the things that I like for tools that have consumables is that I can garage the systainer on my vacuum and the consumables are always right there.  Works great for sandpaper, dominos, etc.

Sometimes systainers provide just the right storage that keeps you from having to build and organize a drawer - for me, the organization of the 20mm accessory kit for the MFT is great, so I haven't done anything additional.  I'll save my drawer making time for a pull-out shelf for my planes.  In addition to the shelf, I'll need at least two boxes - one for my mortising planes and one for my skew rabbet planes (all Veritas, if you're trying to visualize).

One of my least favorite systainers is the one that has my clean-up kit in it.  Having to pack and unpack hoses and floor vacuuming attachments actually has contributed to a messier shop.  Not sure where the mental block is there, but I want to spend as few minutes on cleanup as possible.  To a lesser degree, I'd say the same for the routers - having them in a systainer seems to make them less accessible somehow.

Offline manuc

  • Posts: 12
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2018, 01:55 PM »
For me the systainers are great. I don’t really have any room to store my Festool tools in the garage. I keep them in a closet inside the house. Plus I don’t have to worry about someone stealing them when the garage door is left open. Yes we’ve had a few people snooping in the neighborhood from what my neighbors have said. Plus the wife has left the garage doors open a few times at night. Luckily nothing was stolen.

Offline leakyroof

  • Posts: 2197
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #10 on: April 05, 2018, 06:51 PM »
Total Space Saver for me... I have a Basement Shop, and occasional travel with my tools.  There’s no way I could tightly  house all those tools in DIY wood storage as efficiently as my Systainer Stacks do.... Mounted on Sys-Carts, they move where I need, when I need....
Sure, some tools take some head scratching to intergrate into your System....but it’s worth it’s worth it for me.
Next, those same Systainers lock onto one of my Festool Vacs, ready to move in a shop or Jobsite as needed.
No need to stock plywood and other cab parts to build yet another box when a new tool or accessory rolls in, there’s almost always a Plastic box that the tool or accessory cane in or can be fitted for it.
 Inventory control/Check... I scroll through the boxes, assuming the label is still there...and check my stuff
  Seriously, no stress, I just clip or T-loc another box together instead of having to design and redesign tool storage every few years to accommodate new arrivals ....
 Lastly , multiple levels of useful integration with the Systainer system.  With a MFT lid on one, you have a mini workbench that also carries stuff inside AND locks to all the other Systainers for transportation. 
I could go on..... [big grin]
Not as many Sanders as PA Floor guy.....

Online WillAdams

  • Posts: 26
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2018, 10:37 AM »
Currently I have all my tools in a wide variety of places, and am wondering if systainers would work out well. Current setup:

 - assorted tools on pegboard around my workbench
 - (mostly) larger woodworking tools in a traditional floor chest
 - (mostly) medium woodworking tools in a joiners tool box
 - (mostly) smaller woodworking tools in a traditional open tool box which I have two smaller boxes nested into
 - (mostly) mechanics and metalworking tools in a traditional machinist's chest
 - (mostly) electrical/electronics tools as well as bike specific tools and a torque wrench in a coffin-shaped toolbox a friend gave me
 - a tool roll which I'm trying to put all my most frequently used tools into, or fill w/ nicer tools which I would want to use more often
 - a small tool bag filled with tiny tools for precision work (mostly on electronics and the bicycle)
 - two smaller boxes (one cigar box, another custom made) for tools which I use on my CNC machines



I'm here 'cause I bought a Festool CT Midi and Oneida Ultimate Dust Deputy for my CNC --- it's working out quite nicely, but doesn't facilitate jumping onto the Systainer thing. If I understand it correctly, I would need to:

 - purchase (or make) a rolling base / cart (being able to roll things around would help a lot)
 - acquire a reasonable assortment of Systainers which would accommodate the tools which I'd want to store
 - work out arranging the tools and labeling the boxes in an arrangement which makes sense

There was a great post on tool storage a while back: https://bridgerberdel.wordpress.com/2015/01/08/thoughts-on-tool-organization-and-storage/ --- the Systainer thing fits pretty firmly into the Drawer category --- I think though, if I set up a suitable subset of tools which I can make use of by rolling around, and if I have them categorized from most frequently used (top) to least (bottom) and have the containers labeled, it ought to work out well.


Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 562
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #12 on: April 09, 2018, 09:39 AM »
@WillAdams

Personally I would put in a systainer what I want to protect from dust. i.e. Electrical/Electronics tools. But chisels/planes and the like I prefer to have them easy to grab and visible unless you often carry them with you outside of the shop. Another example is Layout/Marking/Measuring tools. For me it's easy to forget to use a tool if it is not in my sight so i keep all those tools on a wall.

I use systainers to store spare accessories like spare blades. That way you can easily keep them from dust and rust with proper coating.

Mario
Mario

Online WillAdams

  • Posts: 26
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #13 on: April 09, 2018, 10:48 AM »
The problem is, my workbench is at one end of the laundry room, so a lot of projects get worked on when then weather is nice on the back deck, so working out some sort of mobile storage / worksurface would help a lot.

Does this sound reasonable?

 - wheeled base for Systainer
 - graduated stack of Systainers (how many?) holding an assortment of tools
 - some sort of work surface on the top (or the bottom?)

Ideally the top unit would have a handle which I could grab to carry things up a flight of basement steps.

Then one would detach the Systainers from the work surface / lid, removing the tools one needed, re-assemble the stack and transfer the work surface top to the top and begin working.

Offline Rob Z

  • Posts: 707
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #14 on: April 09, 2018, 02:12 PM »
When I stopped doing remodel work I started to sell systainers.  When we moved to a smaller house (with a much smaller  shopspace) I really got busy selling systainers.  They do take up a lot of space, although for some of the tools I kept it made sense to put 2-3 tools in one systainer.

I think I only have about ten systainers and sortainers now.  It's a manageable number.  [big grin]  Lots of tools are now in drawers and take less space overall.

Will Adams:  nice insert you made there...

Offline ben_r_

  • Posts: 1119
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #15 on: April 09, 2018, 02:21 PM »
For the non-traveling / shop based power tool user, yea they make a lot less sense. For me personally, while they do keep things organized a bit, they serve little purpose other than that and taking up more space than necessary. And then if you get into building cabinets/shelving/drawers for them, they end COSTING you money. They are also ridiculously overpriced too and NOT super tough as they would have you believe. BUT, they do increase resale value when you upgrade or get rid of tools, so theres that...
If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 649
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #16 on: April 09, 2018, 02:58 PM »
I like how each systainer has an insert to hold the specific tool that came with it.  While this does reduce the space inside, I think it is somewhat better than my Bosch L-BOXXES that just have everything dumped into each box.  That makes it hard to get to stuff at the bottom.  Anyone can also easily tell which tool is in which systainer thanks to the labeling.  That's not the case for my L-BOXXES.  I don't have them labeled so I even occasionally forget what's in which box.

I work out of my half of the 2 car garage.  Normally my car is parked there so I need to be able to pack up all of my tools and move them to the side so the car will fit when I'm not working on a project.  The systainers stack up neatly vertically, which is perfect for me.  I'm planning on buying the Systainer cart to make to easier to move the stack around.  I have the Bosch cart for my L-BOXXES.
Inquiring Minds Want to Know

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Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1808
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #17 on: April 09, 2018, 03:41 PM »
I think the Systainers are great for storing tools you don't use everyday and I have mine stacked on mobile bases. It's not the most convenient way to store them but, until I get around to building something in which all of the Systainers can be installed, it works OK.

As for the Sysport, I could take it or leave it. It seems that building a custom cabinet under my MFT would be the way to go. Since each shop is different each would have different needs which a Sysport may or may not satisfy. It most likely would also be less expensive to build your own storage rather than buy Sysports. Just an opinion.
Randy

Offline Sanderxpander

  • Posts: 160
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #18 on: April 10, 2018, 02:51 PM »
I'm remodeling at the moment so it helps keeping everything tidy. When we're done I don't plan on having a real "shop". I guess I could get a cabinet with drawers and cubbyholes but for me it makes a lot more sense to store and stack the tools in their systainers in the attic so that when I need to do something, I can just get (e.g.) the TS55 and my Rotex. I don't ever plan on having more than 10 of the things though.

Offline Sanderxpander

  • Posts: 160
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #19 on: April 10, 2018, 03:01 PM »
The problem is, my workbench is at one end of the laundry room, so a lot of projects get worked on when then weather is nice on the back deck, so working out some sort of mobile storage / worksurface would help a lot.

Does this sound reasonable?

 - wheeled base for Systainer
 - graduated stack of Systainers (how many?) holding an assortment of tools
 - some sort of work surface on the top (or the bottom?)

Ideally the top unit would have a handle which I could grab to carry things up a flight of basement steps.

Then one would detach the Systainers from the work surface / lid, removing the tools one needed, re-assemble the stack and transfer the work surface top to the top and begin working.
I use my CTL Midi as "wheeled base" since I need it whenever I work anyway. If you store it near the other tools you can just snap everything you need on there and wheel that out. Works for me at least.

Offline BJM9818

  • Posts: 212
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #20 on: April 13, 2018, 01:12 AM »
I easily have over 100 Systainers. Last year I decided to systainerize my non Festool stuff. Best decision ever. No more different size cases everywhere.

I build spec houses and do contracting work so 95% of the time I’m on a job site. A large Jobox can easily hold the majority of my systainers  while working on different stages of a project.

Offline ben_r_

  • Posts: 1119
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #21 on: April 13, 2018, 08:59 PM »
I easily have over 100 Systainers. Last year I decided to systainerize my non Festool stuff. Best decision ever. No more different size cases everywhere.

I build spec houses and do contracting work so 95% of the time I’m on a job site. A large Jobox can easily hold the majority of my systainers  while working on different stages of a project.
Show me a picture of how you store over 100 Systainers...
If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

Online Gregor

  • Posts: 1016
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #22 on: April 14, 2018, 05:22 AM »
Show me a picture of how you store over 100 Systainers...
Like this:
;)

(image lifted from https://twitter.com/tradectory_leon/status/775296481343438848)

Offline leakyroof

  • Posts: 2197
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #23 on: April 14, 2018, 10:22 PM »
I easily have over 100 Systainers. Last year I decided to systainerize my non Festool stuff. Best decision ever. No more different size cases everywhere.

I build spec houses and do contracting work so 95% of the time I’m on a job site. A large Jobox can easily hold the majority of my systainers  while working on different stages of a project.
Show me a picture of how you store over 100 Systainers...
. I don’t have a 100, but I’m more than half way there... [doh].
Not as many Sanders as PA Floor guy.....

Offline BJM9818

  • Posts: 212
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #24 on: April 15, 2018, 12:59 AM »
I easily have over 100 Systainers. Last year I decided to systainerize my non Festool stuff. Best decision ever. No more different size cases everywhere.

I build spec houses and do contracting work so 95% of the time I’m on a job site. A large Jobox can easily hold the majority of my systainers  while working on different stages of a project.
Show me a picture of how you store over 100 Systainers...
Like I said I have some in jobox’s on two spec houses I’m building, have a bunch in a garage and trailer I use for my gutter company and probably 60 in my basement and garage. New 35x45 workshop isn’t getting built till late summer.

I just ordered two sheets of plywood to start building sysports to house them with the Festool drawers. 

Offline live4ever

  • Posts: 790
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #25 on: April 16, 2018, 12:56 PM »
Show me a picture of how you store over 100 Systainers...
Like this: (Attachment Link)
;)

(image lifted from https://twitter.com/tradectory_leon/status/775296481343438848)

I was laughing at that photo and even showed it to my wife (see hun, at least I'm not THAT bad!).  Then I actually counted the number of systainers in the photo and it was only 48.  Then I shut the heck up.
Current systainer to productivity ratio:  very high

Offline Peter_C

  • Posts: 695
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #26 on: April 16, 2018, 02:52 PM »
Systainer's are too small for a contractor to use as primary tool box, let alone too expensive, although cost is secondary. Why put one tool in a box when you can pile 15 tools in? The same tools we accidentally drop on the ground off a ladder can handle a little gentle stacking. What one larger rolling box handles would take probably 3 Systainer's, which also means wasted space. Try to fit a reciprocating saw into anything less than a Sys 5. I can get a majority of my Makita cordless tools, batteries, charger, into a large rolling box. Another one holds all my Milwaukee M18 tools, and a mid size holds most of my M12 tools. A large bin holds my painting equipment. My tiling tools are in a large rolling tool box with the tile leveling system taking it's own box. I have over 80 bins that store everything from tools, supplies, to household goods for organization. A dolly makes the bins easily movable, and they can hold twice as much as any Systainer for $7 each.

Owning over (only) 20 Systainer's, I am not against them, I just don't see them as the do everything tool boxes. Another example is I would never use them to hold my automotive tools, nor metal working tools. A heavy duty metal tool box is superior. Can I stand on a Systainer? NO! Is a Systainer water resistant? NO! I can sure as heck stand on my Ridgid and Milwaukee boxes though, and they should in theory be water resistant.

I guess I need to buy more Festool tools to be cool  [scared] Although I have never been the cool kid, I also have never felt the need to fit in, instead just doing my own thing [tongue]

Online WillAdams

  • Posts: 26
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #27 on: April 17, 2018, 09:26 AM »
I use my CTL Midi as "wheeled base" since I need it whenever I work anyway. If you store it near the other tools you can just snap everything you need on there and wheel that out. Works for me at least.

Unfortunately, the top of my Midi is taken up by an Oneida Ultimate Dust Deputy, so that's not workable for me.

Definitely going to take some thinking about, and the price is a bit daunting for a hobbyist.

Offline leakyroof

  • Posts: 2197
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #28 on: April 17, 2018, 09:35 AM »
I use my CTL Midi as "wheeled base" since I need it whenever I work anyway. If you store it near the other tools you can just snap everything you need on there and wheel that out. Works for me at least.

Unfortunately, the top of my Midi is taken up by an Oneida Ultimate Dust Deputy, so that's not workable for me.

Definitely going to take some thinking about, and the price is a bit daunting for a hobbyist.
   I can put Systainers or Sortainers under my UDD, on top of the vac by using a Festool Boom Arm hose to have that extra height enabled between the Vac and the UDD.  Boom hose is used to connect the output Port of the UDD and the inlet of the Vac. You'll have enough for just one, and not a tall systainer or sortainer, but it's nice to be able to have one at least under the UDD if I want. For a long time I had my First Aid Sortainer between the Vac and the UDD since having drawers instead of a Systainer lid was much easier.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2018, 09:40 AM by leakyroof »
Not as many Sanders as PA Floor guy.....

Offline Sanderxpander

  • Posts: 160
Re: Help me understand this whole systainer/sysport thing
« Reply #29 on: April 17, 2018, 01:50 PM »
Not to diss the usefulness of the UDD, but as a hobbyist who needs to store his tools away most of the time, you could sell the UDD for like 200 bucks (at least it retails for over 300 here and it isn't something that really "wears"), get a more compact setup and buy at least 40 bags for the Midi with your winnings.