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Author Topic: MFK 700 for veneer edge trimming?  (Read 12640 times)
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EcoFurniture

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« on: August 16, 2009, 08:45 PM »

Hi,

Lately, I'm building a lot of plywood cabinets that require thin veneer edge taping. So far I was using a flush plane to trim the overhang off. This task can be very time consuming....
Now my question is:
Has anyone used the MFK 700 to trim down thin veneer edging? Usually edge tape is quite bridle and therefore I'm afraid that a router will be to rough for that task.  This will be a fairly big investment for just this one task, but I'm willing do buy that router if it will do the job better then I can.

Any recommendation/ feedback is welcome!

Thanks!

Andreas
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Dan Rush

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« Reply #1 on: August 16, 2009, 09:25 PM »

The MFK works well for this task, but for this single task only could be a bit expensive.  I like using the Virutex edge band trimmer.  It's very simple to use and I think I may have paid 10-15USD for it.
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« Reply #2 on: August 16, 2009, 09:35 PM »

ECO,

Go to Youtube or TheWoodWhisperer.com and find the video of the woodwhisperer reviewing Festool Routers.  It includes the OF2000 and MFK700.  He talked about just how well this works for veneer edge tape.  He made the comment that he was scared to use laminate trimmers on veneer edge tape before but this router solved the problem.  It's a good review, take a look at it.

-Dave
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EcoFurniture

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« Reply #3 on: August 16, 2009, 09:52 PM »

Thanks for the feedback!
I was already aware of the video review Mark did, but in his video he is using way thicker veneer then I'm using. Maybe I have to ask him directly.
As for the Virutex edge band trimmer, I have several of them and I'm not happy the way they work... there is more ripping then cutting going on.
but you are right, the MFK is way to expensive for just this task... but still cheaper then a full blow edgebanding machine! I guess it all depends how you see it  Wink

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Brice Burrell

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« Reply #4 on: August 16, 2009, 10:36 PM »

Andreas, that's pretty much what the MFK was made for. The first job my MFK was used for was several hundred feet of veneer edge tape for shelving. It was so easy I quickly passed the job off to a fairly inexperienced kid, he did the job with no problems.

While the MFK isn't the most versatile router it certainly does more than just edge trimming. It works for a lot of small routing jobs, I've been using mine for routing hinges lately. You really do need to be aware of its limitations, poor visibility of the cutter, limited size bits fit in it. This seems to be a love it or hate it tool. If you do a lot of edge trimming and don't mind not being able to see the cutter for small routing jobs the MFK could be your cup of tea could be the right tool for you, if you don't you might quickly grow frustrated by its limitations. Good luck with your decision.  

Edit: I just crossed out the line about cup of tea, you might not understand the saying, sorry.  Grin  
« Last Edit: August 16, 2009, 10:38 PM by Brice Burrell » Logged

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Steve-CO

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« Reply #5 on: August 16, 2009, 10:59 PM »

You might check out Jerry Work's site and see how he uses this for other applications. (sliding dovetails)
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mike1967

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« Reply #6 on: August 16, 2009, 11:23 PM »

Andreas, that's pretty much what the MFK was made for. The first job my MFK was used for was several hundred feet of veneer edge tape for shelving. It was so easy I quickly passed the job off to a fairly inexperienced kid, he did the job with no problems.

Did you use the 1.5 degree offset base or the non-offset base?  I am considering getting an mfk 700 for trimming but am thinking that the 1.5 degree offset base will  mean that boards trimmed before joining will not match nicely in their corners where edging touches at, say, 90 degrees.

mike
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EcoFurniture

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« Reply #7 on: August 16, 2009, 11:44 PM »

Andreas, that's pretty much what the MFK was made for. The first job my MFK was used for was several hundred feet of veneer edge tape for shelving. It was so easy I quickly passed the job off to a fairly inexperienced kid, he did the job with no problems.

While the MFK isn't the most versatile router it certainly does more than just edge trimming. It works for a lot of small routing jobs, I've been using mine for routing hinges lately. You really do need to be aware of its limitations, poor visibility of the cutter, limited size bits fit in it. This seems to be a love it or hate it tool. If you do a lot of edge trimming and don't mind not being able to see the cutter for small routing jobs the MFK could be your cup of tea could be the right tool for you, if you don't you might quickly grow frustrated by its limitations. Good luck with your decision.  

Edit: I just crossed out the line about cup of tea, you might not understand the saying, sorry.  Grin  

Thank you sir, that is was I was looking for Grin  No worries about the tea.... I'm a coffee drinker --just kidding, got it  Grin
Another question:
Would you think that the Bosch laminate trimmer could be an alternative? I haven't used one in years as I do most router jobs on the table or with my OF1400. Just wondering....
« Last Edit: August 16, 2009, 11:49 PM by EcoFurniture » Logged

Charimon

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« Reply #8 on: August 17, 2009, 01:49 AM »

Andreas,

You may also want to consider the 1010  after getting mine I think I have had my PC trimmer out once.   Besides once you start using it your 1400 will get lonely cause you never give it the love and attention you used to Grin .

Craig
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« Reply #9 on: August 17, 2009, 07:18 AM »

I use my OF1400 obviously for larger routings and I have a Porter Cable 810 laminate router.  It's a very small and very nice router.  They stopped making them and came out with a newer model thats a lot larger.  I actually have it for sell on this forum.  Anyway, the PC 810 lamiante trimmer is built to last and can take on what you need to do plus other tasks.
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Brice Burrell

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« Reply #10 on: August 17, 2009, 04:56 PM »

Did you use the 1.5 degree offset base or the non-offset base?  I am considering getting an mfk 700 for trimming but am thinking that the 1.5 degree offset base will  mean that boards trimmed before joining will not match nicely in their corners where edging touches at, say, 90 degrees.

mike


Mike, I assume you are referring to edging with some thickness, if so, yes there will be a problem with alignment. The solution is to rout the pieces in place (if you can.) With edge veneer tape the 1.5 degree bevel cut it almost unnoticeable.
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Brice Burrell

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« Reply #11 on: August 17, 2009, 05:01 PM »

Thank you sir, that is was I was looking for Grin  No worries about the tea.... I'm a coffee drinker --just kidding, got it  Grin
Another question:
Would you think that the Bosch laminate trimmer could be an alternative? I haven't used one in years as I do most router jobs on the table or with my OF1400. Just wondering....


Almost any router could be an alternative, you'd have to buy or make an offset base and you'd be able to do the job. Another alternative are the Festool edge routing accessories, they'll fit your OF1400 but that are a little more graceful on the OF1010. Here's a link to my review of the Festool edge routing accessories.
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mike1967

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« Reply #12 on: August 17, 2009, 05:17 PM »

Did you use the 1.5 degree offset base or the non-offset base?  I am considering getting an mfk 700 for trimming but am thinking that the 1.5 degree offset base will  mean that boards trimmed before joining will not match nicely in their corners where edging touches at, say, 90 degrees.

mike


Mike, I assume you are referring to edging with some thickness, if so, yes there will be a problem with alignment. The solution is to rout the pieces in place (if you can.) With edge veneer tape the 1.5 degree bevel cut it almost unnoticeable.

Yes, I'll believe that the bevel with the tape is not noticeable.

Have you used the no-offset base at all with the 700?  I wonder if this tends to cause scratches in the surface of the material being edged.    I have read your OF 1010 review about edge routing.  Have you had this problem (edging bit scratches the case being edged) with the edging plate?

mike
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Brice Burrell

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« Reply #13 on: August 17, 2009, 08:40 PM »

Mike, I'm not sure I follow your questions. Do you mean the zero degree base with the MFK? And by scratching the surface do you mean the bit cutting into the surface of the material being edged since it's not being cut at 1.5 degrees?

I don't have the zero degree base for the MFK, the set comes with the 1.5 degree horizontal and 90 degree vertical bases, that's what I have. With the Festool edging plate and angle arm to rout edging I leave a very small amount of edging to make sure I don't cut into the surface of the material being edged. I then use a sanding block to quickly knock off the remaining edge flush them carefully one light pass to put on a very slight bevel. 
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mike1967

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« Reply #14 on: August 18, 2009, 01:16 AM »

Mike, I'm not sure I follow your questions. Do you mean the zero degree base with the MFK? And by scratching the surface do you mean the bit cutting into the surface of the material being edged since it's not being cut at 1.5 degrees?

I don't have the zero degree base for the MFK, the set comes with the 1.5 degree horizontal and 90 degree vertical bases, that's what I have. With the Festool edging plate and angle arm to rout edging I leave a very small amount of edging to make sure I don't cut into the surface of the material being edged. I then use a sanding block to quickly knock off the remaining edge flush them carefully one light pass to put on a very slight bevel. 

Yes, I mean the zero degree base that comes with the MFK.  And, yes, I was referring to the bit cutting into the material being edged.

You answered my questions.  Thanks.

mike
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« Reply #15 on: August 21, 2009, 09:46 PM »

Update:

I got my new MFK 700 set this morning. Without reading the instructions.... it took me less then 10 minutes to figure out and set up the machine to do some edge trimming. The results are amazing! Crisp and clean edges. Trimming down 40' of edge tape would have taken me, if done with my flush plane, about an hour maybe more. With the MFK I was done in 10 minutes (including breaking the edges with sandpaper). At a shop rate of $50/hour I will have the cost for the router back in within no time!

I love it! Thank you Dan from Ultimate tools in Vancouver for really going out of his way to get the router to my shop within a very short time!!!!!
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Brice Burrell

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« Reply #16 on: August 21, 2009, 10:13 PM »

Update:

I got my new MFK 700 set this morning. Without reading the instructions.... it took me less then 10 minutes to figure out and set up the machine to do some edge trimming. The results are amazing! Crisp and clean edges. Trimming down 40' of edge tape would have taken me, if done with my flush plane, about an hour maybe more. With the MFK I was done in 10 minutes (including breaking the edges with sandpaper). At a shop rate of $50/hour I will have the cost for the router back in within no time!

I love it! Thank you Dan from Ultimate tools in Vancouver for really going out of his way to get the router to my shop within a very short time!!!!!

Everyone loves a story with a happy ending.  Grin Let us know how you like using the MFK for jobs other than edge trimming.
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EcoFurniture

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« Reply #17 on: August 26, 2009, 08:10 PM »

Ok, here we go:


I love that little machine!

P.S. please excuse the mess in the background... too busy to clean up and we are also moving into a different shop in a couple of weeks...
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« Reply #18 on: August 26, 2009, 08:30 PM »

Andreas, that's a great video. Sometimes you tell someone how a tool works or you can show them. Your video really shows the MFK in its element. Nice job.
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« Reply #19 on: August 26, 2009, 08:57 PM »

Andreas,

You did a great job of demonstrating just how effective the MFK is, for the job is was designed for.  Not a tool for everyone or every situation, but you nailed it.  
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« Reply #20 on: August 26, 2009, 09:20 PM »

The more I think about this video the more I realize just how much it really shows. First, it shows how well the FOG works. A guy posts looking for quality feedback and he quickly gets the info he needed. Then a FOG member that is a Festool dealer is able to get the tool to him in a timely manner. Them the guy posts a video showing the how the tool changes his work flow. I feel good for the small part I played in helping this happen.

Another thing that may not be apparent to the causal viewer is just how time consuming and at times nerve racking trimming veneer tape can be. This tool really changed this, it took 30 seconds to do what would have taken much longer in the past. Sure it illustrates Festool's faster, easier, smarter philosophy but there is even more to it than that. When that job is more pleasurable it makes one's job even more rewarding, I mean look at the smile on Andreas' face. When was the last time a DeWalt product put a smile on your face like that? Maybe Festool should change their slogan, Festool, puts a smile on your face.  Grin

Andreas, again, great work!   
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« Reply #21 on: October 17, 2009, 11:21 AM »

Just wanted to second the positive review of the 700. I do alot of edging and this saves me hours of work, made me $, and with a better look. With the 1.5 degree offset its almost impossible to scar the top side. GREAT product for my purposes. If that's all I ever use it for, it will have been a excellent investment. And it does put a smile on my face when I use it!
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« Reply #22 on: November 28, 2009, 06:13 PM »

Andreas, thanks for the video. I just bought the 700 with the idea of making it easier to trim iron-on edge banding and also edge trimming formica countertops and edgebanding. Have not used the router yet, had to order bits for it, which was guesswork. I got the flush cut bit with bearing, which has a chamfering feature on it (part 491 026) and a 2 flute edge trimmer (part 491 670). I have found no advice anywhere about what bit to use for what application and especially, how to make full use of the attachable bearing "feeler" that is provided with the machine. I am pretty well experienced using my 1010 router and a spiral bit w/ bearing to trim formica, etc. The 700 is a whole new animal though, with the two bases, etc. Has anyone done a video or detailed instruction article about what bit and base to set up for particular cuts. Sure, I could experiment for a few hours and probably figure it out, but with a business to run, I would rather not reinvent the wheel. Thanks for any input you may have.
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« Reply #23 on: November 28, 2009, 06:30 PM »

Festocracy,

 Welcome! to the forum!
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« Reply #24 on: November 28, 2009, 06:46 PM »

Andreas, thanks for the video. I just bought the 700 with the idea of making it easier to trim iron-on edge banding and also edge trimming formica countertops and edgebanding. Have not used the router yet.......Sure, I could experiment for a few hours and probably figure it out, but with a business to run, I would rather not reinvent the wheel. Thanks for any input you may have.


Festocracy welcome to the forum. Using the MFK in the horizontal position as Andreas does in the video is where bit selection is critical since bits with cutting lengths over 5/8" (16 mm) won't fit. I'd recommend this bit, part #491666, it's a short straight bit. The feeler bearing is used as a stop for the router in the horizontal position. It allows you to control how of the bit is exposed to cut the material. An exact setting for the feeler bearing generally isn't critical (the depth of cut set by the horizontal base is). It makes sense once you've used the router once or twice.

I like the chamfer/edge trimming bit part # 491026 that you have for using the MFK in the vertical position.

This router is very simple to use, you'll get the hang of it pretty quickly I'm sure. I'd still recommend practicing on scrap first. Good luck and let us know if you have more questions.   
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« Reply #25 on: November 28, 2009, 07:18 PM »

Has anyone done a video or detailed instruction article about what bit and base to set up for particular cuts. Sure, I could experiment for a few hours and probably figure it out, but with a business to run, I would rather not reinvent the wheel.


If you haven't already done so, check out the following links, taken from FOG's Consolidated List of Festool Links...

MFK700 Article "Using the Festool MFK700 Router for Making Fine Furniture" (Jerry Work)
MFK700 Brochure
MFK700 In-Depth Review (Brice Burrell)
MFK700 Official Manual
MFK700 Review (Cabinetmaker Online)
MFK700 Video

Forrest

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« Reply #26 on: November 28, 2009, 08:36 PM »

Andreas, thanks for the video. I just bought the 700 with the idea of making it easier to trim iron-on edge banding and also edge trimming formica countertops and edgebanding. Have not used the router yet, had to order bits for it, which was guesswork. I got the flush cut bit with bearing, which has a chamfering feature on it (part 491 026) and a 2 flute edge trimmer (part 491 670). I have found no advice anywhere about what bit to use for what application and especially, how to make full use of the attachable bearing "feeler" that is provided with the machine. I am pretty well experienced using my 1010 router and a spiral bit w/ bearing to trim formica, etc. The 700 is a whole new animal though, with the two bases, etc. Has anyone done a video or detailed instruction article about what bit and base to set up for particular cuts. Sure, I could experiment for a few hours and probably figure it out, but with a business to run, I would rather not reinvent the wheel. Thanks for any input you may have.

You are welcome. I'm sure you will love that router and will see that it really saves you money as you get the job done faster. It took me one kitchen job to pay for it and now it generates money for me!
As for the router bits. I listened to my dealer who put a couple of routers in the box with it for me to try out. Agreed those bits are not cheap but work very nice. I bought all of the ones he recommended.

Cheers,
Andreas
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« Reply #27 on: November 29, 2009, 04:59 PM »

Thanks to all who replied with advice, I think I'm going to like this forum and hopefully offer some tips I've learned while using the many Festo products I own. To Forrest, the links you gave were great, and as you are Scottish, I must mention that several friends and I are kilt owners who frequent the local pubs here in Florida and are trying to promote the acceptance of kilts as "normal" clothing for daily activities.
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« Reply #28 on: November 29, 2009, 06:22 PM »

Thanks to all who replied with advice, I think I'm going to like this forum and hopefully offer some tips I've learned while using the many Festo products I own. To Forrest, the links you gave were great, and as you are Scottish, I must mention that several friends and I are kilt owners who frequent the local pubs here in Florida and are trying to promote the acceptance of kilts as "normal" clothing for daily activities.

Glad you found the links useful, but I suspect that you might find that it takes longer than expected to convince the locals about the kilts!

Forrest

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« Reply #29 on: February 03, 2010, 10:44 PM »

Again, the MFK 700 is up to the task!

How to apply stubborn 3mm pvc to an plywood edge:

The pvc comes in a roll of  (I think) 50'. The problem with this material is, that it always tries to curl up. Therefore you have to work with a few tricks.

1. I cut the pieces about 5" longer then needed
2. Screwed it down on a scrap piece with a screw on each end.
3. Applied the water based, non-toxic contact cement on both surfaces
4. Let dry for an hour
5. Because those strips were 70" long, I couldn't apply them without help.
6. Rigged up some "spacers" in form of some quick grip clamps.
7. Put the edge on top of the clamps. They also prevented the edge from sliding of the side!
8. Now push the edge down inch by inch. No room for mistakes. Both pieces will bond on contact!
9. Because of the 4mm thickness, it wasn't enough to just use the laminate roller. A rubber mallet did the trick!
10. Trim off the ends with the Fein Multimaster
11. With a perfectly dialed in MFK700 I was able to trim the edge perfectly flush without scratching the pre finished ply! No idea how else I could have done that task.

Edge taping


Festool MFK 700
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