Author Topic: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor  (Read 176407 times)

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Offline jbasen

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TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« on: January 30, 2018, 06:45 PM »
I would like to remove the wood flooring in front of our front door and replace it with slate that matches our mudroom.  I live in the mountains of Idaho and trying to maintain a wood floor there when guests are coming in with their shoes full of snow is simply a challenge. 

The first step of this project is to cut the perimeter of the area where we will pull up the existing wood floor.  I would think that my TS-75 riding on a guide rail would be ideal for this.  I am going to be cutting through lots of nails that were used during the installation of the wood floor. 

So, my question is:  Which blade for the TS-75 would be the best to use?  I want to minimize tear-out of the existing floor but at the same time the blade has to be up to the task of cutting through the nails.

If there is a 3rd party blade that would do the job, and be cheaper than a Festool blade, all the better as I expect the nails will do enough damage to the blade that I will be tossing it in the trash afterwards. 

Thanks in advance for the help.

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Offline Gregor

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2018, 07:16 PM »
Results of cutting through a load of nails could vary between expensive (blade/saw damage) to dangerously interesting (in case a tooth manages to pull one that catches between teeth and parts of the saws case: spontaneously stopping the saws rotation, kickback, gear/housing damage, ...).

I would suggest to mark the line where the kerf will be and then use a crowbar (setting it on the wood you'll remove anway when needing a pivot point, so damage done by it is no issue) to pull any nails that intersect the kerf.
Might take a moment, but replacing blades, exploded saws or parts of your body might take even longer...

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2018, 07:21 PM »
Thanks.  A good friend of mine has owned a wood flooring business for 30+ years.  He does this on a regular basis.  He was going to do it by running his skill saw along a straight edge.  I just thought the TS-75 would do a better job.

Offline Svar

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2018, 07:29 PM »
There is no demolition blade for TS 75. I imagine a blade with smaller rake angle is better for cutting nails. Nails cut easily, hardened steel screws on the other hand are to be avoided.

Offline Bohdan

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2018, 07:36 PM »
See if something like this Makita SPECIALIZED Knot & Nail Cutting Saw Blade is available to fit a TS75

Offline tjbnwi

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2018, 07:45 PM »
Slow and steady wins the race.

Tom

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2018, 07:46 PM »
Thanks.  Unfortunately, it doesn't look like the Makita blades are available in the US.  I did see a place in England that had a 210mm version of the Makita blade.

What I was able to find were some blades from Oshlun on Amazon.  They seem to be reasonably rated and are significantly less expensive than a Festool blade. 

https://www.amazon.com/Oshlun-SBFT-210052-FesPro-Crosscut-Festool/dp/B0030GGFS2/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1517358974&sr=8-3

There are 36, 52, and 72 tooth options though not a true demolition blade.

Offline TinyShop

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2018, 07:57 PM »
The topic of non-OEM blades compatible with the TS 75 has been discussed in detail before on this forum:

http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tools-accessories/aftermarket-blades-for-ts75-(list-of-part-numbers-with-specifications)/msg491083/#msg491083

Plus, a quick search on ebay.co.uk using the search phrase "210mm 30mm arbor saw blade" will produce numerous makes and models of TS 75-compatible blades not discussed in the above referenced thread. Many sellers located outside the U.S. are willing to ship to the U.S.

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2018, 08:08 PM »
Thanks for pointing me to that list @TinyShop


Offline Peter Halle

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #9 on: January 31, 2018, 03:27 AM »
How many feet of cut are you talking about?  I am assuming that your flooring is 3/4" thick?

Peter

Offline Brian Livingstone

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #10 on: January 31, 2018, 07:37 AM »
I removed a kitchen floor several months ago. After removing the ceramic tile there was a quarter inch subfloor nailed every six inches or so to the three quarter inch subfloor.  A hellish job to remove.  I ended up cutting the quarter inch ply into 2 by 2 squares and then prying up with a pry bar.  I used my TS55.  I had to buy a new blade.  A small price to pay for saving me hours of an otherwise unbearable task.
Kapex, TS75, MFT, OF1010, OF2200, DTS400 REQ, Parallel guide rails, 800, 1080, 1400, 1900, 3000 guide rail, Domino 500, CT36, CT Midi, , RS2E, RO150, Boom Arm, Crown stops, 6 drawer Sortainer, Carvex, Syslite II, Festool safety glasses must start to wear.

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #11 on: January 31, 2018, 08:56 AM »
I am going be removing an aprox. a 6' x 8' section of floor.  We will be laying out the slate tiles in front of the door (including spacers), outlining them, and then cutting the opening for the exact fit of the tiles.  In this way there won't be any cutting of tiles required and it will provide a clean look with no partial tiles installed. 

Yes the flooring is 3/4" thick.  The biggest challenge I see is getting the slate to lay even with the existing wood so there isn't a trip hazard.  The tile is 3/8" thick and I'll use 1/4" cement board.  That just leaves 1/8" for thinset. 

Thanks

Offline Brian Livingstone

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #12 on: January 31, 2018, 09:23 AM »
Have you looked into Ditra.  Highly recommend it.

Cement board is hellish to work with.

Brian
Kapex, TS75, MFT, OF1010, OF2200, DTS400 REQ, Parallel guide rails, 800, 1080, 1400, 1900, 3000 guide rail, Domino 500, CT36, CT Midi, , RS2E, RO150, Boom Arm, Crown stops, 6 drawer Sortainer, Carvex, Syslite II, Festool safety glasses must start to wear.

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #13 on: January 31, 2018, 09:30 AM »
Interesting product.  Thanks @Brian Livingstone

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #14 on: January 31, 2018, 09:41 AM »
@jbasen , the reason I asked is that I did two applicable projects in my home.  Although I might be a contractor by profession there are times in my home that I am a DYI / hobbyist (I do stuff in my house that I wouldn't do for others).

When I installed my wooden floors I had to inset a tile area in front of the door for a wet area (like what you are doing) and also change direction of the flooring (to a diagonal).  In both cases I used my TS-55 to make the cuts where obstructions like walls wouldn't come into play and then flipped the rail around so that the non-splinter strip side was on the cut line and finished off with a Fein Multimaster or Festool Vecturo.  Yes, I have done this twice.

Festool blades are not cheap and I understand that.  You could use your TS-75 to make a shallow scoring cut and then finish it off in another way.  Maybe not the way a "professional" would do it, but might be more wallet friendly.

Peter

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #15 on: January 31, 2018, 09:51 AM »
Thanks @Peter Halle.  I am lucky in this situation that I will have a pro flooring installer to help me and he has done this many times before.  I started the thread thinking that my TS-75 could probably do a better job than his skill saw but was wondering about the blade since I wasn't aware of a blade for the TS-75 that was made for cutting through nails.  Just trashing an expensive Festool blade didn't seem to be the best approach  [smile]

Of course threads take on a life of their own; which is a good thing because you learn more than you expected.

Thanks again.

Offline Cheese

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #16 on: January 31, 2018, 09:59 AM »
Have you looked into Ditra.  Highly recommend it.

Ditra heat is also available and if you have a cat/cats, that'll be their favorite place to spend the day. Every day... [big grin]

Offline Rob Z

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #17 on: January 31, 2018, 11:29 AM »
We used to use the FT triple chip blade to cut out hardwood floors, and even when the blades hit nails they kept on cutting with little or no effect on the blade.  We also used the cheaper Oshlun versions , thinking they would be throwaways at the end of the job, but often enough the much-less-expensive Oshlun blades worked well and we would get several jobs out of them before they were trashed.

I just checked and I see there is a triple chip made by Festool for the TS-75.  It's pretty pricey so it's likely better route for you to buy an Oshlun for this one time use.

Someone mentioned Ditra ....The Ditra XL is made for the application you have at your house now.  We used to install tons of Ditra and Ditra XL, so if you have any questions feel free to ask .

« Last Edit: January 31, 2018, 05:17 PM by Rob Z »

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #18 on: January 31, 2018, 02:26 PM »
Thanks so much @Rob Z!

Did you use the 36, 52, or 72 tooth Oshlun blade?

Thanks again

Offline Rob Z

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #19 on: January 31, 2018, 02:42 PM »
Hi,   I would have to ask one of my former employees.  I gave a bunch of blades to him , including those Oshluns.  We used the Festool Panther on the rip cuts (running the long direction of the flooring) where there was no chance of hitting a flooring nail.  The Oshlun were used mostly on the crosscuts and thus had a higher tooth count. 

Remember to use the anti-kickback block on the guide rail when you plunge the saw in for the cut. 

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2018, 02:45 PM »
Thanks @Rob Z!!

Offline Peter_C

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #21 on: January 31, 2018, 03:08 PM »
There is no problem at all with using a tracksaw and rail to rip what you want. A few nails will get whacked thru, which is no big deal. The right blade will help and for me Oslun's fit the bill. I've lost count of how many nails I have cut over the years, especially doing replacement windows and cutting thru the siding. Oops missed pulling a couple! *shrugs*

I used Ditra XL in my own home with flush hardwood floors. Caulked the gap with grout color matched caulk, and they came out just how I wanted them. Ditra also functions as a disconnect to allow some movement without the tile and grout cracking.

I became a big fan of Laticrete epoxy grout too. Super easy to clean down the road, flexible to a point, and easy enough to work with IF you use a kitchen scale and break it down into smaller mixes.

As it is an entry way you should probably seal that slate tile. It WILL change the color though, making it darker.

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #22 on: January 31, 2018, 03:13 PM »
Thanks @Peter_C !!

Great tips!

Offline Cheese

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #23 on: February 01, 2018, 09:59 AM »
I became a big fan of Laticrete epoxy grout too. Super easy to clean down the road, flexible to a point, and easy enough to work with IF you use a kitchen scale and break it down into smaller mixes.

As it is an entry way you should probably seal that slate tile. It WILL change the color though, making it darker.

I'm also a big fan of epoxy grout. It's waterproof and basically stain proof. I used the Bostik variety in the kitchen with stainless steel tiles. Tomato sauce, even if it's not washed off for several days, is easily removed with a damp cloth.

I'd not recommend it for slate though because the haze will be impossible to remove because of the porosity of slate. It works best with tile that is not porous, stainless, porcelain, glass or ceramic.

I've also installed Vermont mottled purple slate in an entry way and sealed it along with a cementious grout. Its held up well for the last 8-9 years. I applied 2 seal coats to the slate & grout. 

Offline Peter_C

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #24 on: February 01, 2018, 11:21 AM »
I'd not recommend it for slate though because the haze will be impossible to remove because of the porosity of slate. It works best with tile that is not porous, stainless, porcelain, glass or ceramic.
Good point on leaving a haze. That is easily overcome by carefully applying sealer to the tops of the stones BEFORE grouting. Flat stones in a shower are a perfect example of when to use a sealer before grouting with epoxy.
http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=34107
^The John Bridge forum is dedicated to tiling, FULL of great information with lots of pros willing to help others. 

Lots of tilers today use urethane grouts too.
https://www.bostik.com/us/markets-and-solutions/flooring-installation-systems/tile-grout/pre-mixed-urethane-grout/

BTW you can freeze epoxy after it is mixed to slow it's cure down. I keep a few glues in my fridge to make them last longer, IE: Aquaseal.

Another thing to quickly check into would be your floor deflection, just to make sure the tile will last a long time.
http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/deflecto.pl

Offline Cheese

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #25 on: February 01, 2018, 11:42 AM »
Good point on leaving a haze. That is easily overcome by carefully applying sealer to the tops of the stones BEFORE grouting. Flat stones in a shower are a perfect example of when to use a sealer before grouting with epoxy.
That's a good point, if a person wants to use epoxy grout with slate, the slate just needs to be sealed first.  [cool]

What drove me to epoxy grout is I asked several local tile retailers their recommended method to seal the standard grout used with the stainless tile. Each one told me to purchase several small artists brushes and carefully paint the sealer on the grout making sure I didn't touch the stainless tile with the brush because that would become visible. They suggested I also apply 3 coats of sealer because it was in the kitchen behind a range.

Really???   Patience is a wonderful thing but there had to be a better way. [big grin]

Enter epoxy grout...I'll also be using it for a bathroom remodel on porcelain tile because of its waterproof characteristics.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2018, 11:45 AM by Cheese »

Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #26 on: February 02, 2018, 12:09 AM »
Thanks again for all the info; especially about the John Bridge forum @Peter_C .  I guess that will be my next stop once the tile order arrives and I've cut the floor.

Offline Peter_C

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #27 on: February 02, 2018, 10:25 AM »
Thanks again for all the info; especially about the John Bridge forum @Peter_C .  I guess that will be my next stop once the tile order arrives and I've cut the floor.
You are very welcome :)

Do this below now, before buying stone. The floor deflection needs to be a high number for slate stone @ L/720. If there is an issue with deflection, post to the board and someone can help you get it resolved.
Another thing to quickly check into would be your floor deflection, just to make sure the tile will last a long time.
http://www.johnbridge.com/vbulletin/deflecto.pl


Offline jbasen

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #28 on: February 02, 2018, 03:46 PM »
Thanks.  I'm pretty confident in the deflection.  We have the exact same slate tile just down the hall in our mudroom and haven't had any issues.  I also know that the builder that constructed this house uses a closer floor joist spacing than is required by code to minimize overall deflection in the flooring as that is a point of pride for him. 

Offline Naildrivingman

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Re: TS-75 Blade for Cutting into Existing Wood Floor
« Reply #29 on: February 03, 2018, 02:27 PM »
Just a quick follow up to cutting...have you considered getting a wood wizard (or similar) metal detector?  Also, do you know that the fasteners are nails?  All the flooring contractors I’ve worked with are using staples. Yes, staples are still metal, but I would rather cut through a staple than a t shank nail.
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