Author Topic: What's my best hose reduction strategy for my shop extraction system?  (Read 1240 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline dave_in_gva

  • Posts: 6
Hello FOG people,

Shortly after Felder started making the Hammer line I purchased a Hammer combination machine and their extraction system. That means I have a stationary 3HP vacuum unit giving me plenty of suction in my workshop, pulling through 120mm anti-static hose into 200 liter bags.

So far the only Festool tool I have is the Domino 500, which I'm quite smitten by. I mostly use this outside of the workshop, and have rigged it up to use a small dedicated vacuum which works quite well.

I am planning on buying the OF 1400 and I would like to set myself up with a better extraction system for my Festool tools in the workshop - ideally a strategy that can cover both the Domino 500 and the OF 1400. I'm tight on space in the workshop and see no need for buying a Festool vacuum unit (and yes I know they are great [wink]) given that I already have the Hammer system.

I can get the following 2 Hammer components that will get me close to Festool hose land:

1. A divider box with pass through for the main 120mm hose and a second outlet that can be opened or closed with a gate and has an 80mm outside diameter.

2. A reducer quick connector that I could fit over the 80mm outlet on the above divider box that has an 80mm internal diameter at one end and a 50mm outer diameter at the other end.

So that gets me down to 50mm outer diameter with a gated control.

I could either mount these two components on the main extraction unit, or mount them somewhere along the line of the 120mm extraction hose, close to the end. If I mount them in-line, I'd leave a meter or so of 120mm hose to allow me to easily plug that last meter of hose into and out of the various Hammer machine dust extraction outlets I have. The in-line option would put the gate control closer to where I would be using the OF 1400 or the Domino, meaning it would make opening or closing of the gate a little easier as well as reducing the overall distance of hose I would need since it would now be reasonably close to where I would be working with the Festool tools.

I see Festool part number 452897 is listed as "Extraction adapter D 50/D 36" but somewhat unhelpfully all the descriptions I find of this adapter do not tell me what the internal and external diameters are. I'm guessing from the looks of it that it is meant to have a 50mm hose that screws inside the larger end and a 36mm hose screwing inside the smaller end but to be honest I have no idea if the insides of this part are threaded, nor how it relates to Festool hoses and tools (e.g. fitting "into" or "over", screw fit, push fit etc.). I just want to place an order for the right stuff and I would rather not guess. I'm hoping the hands on experience of folks here with many more Festool tools can help me.

Can anyone tell me what my simplest and least expensive strategy would be to cover the distance between the OF 1400 dust extraction port and a fitting with a 50mm outer diameter? Distance I would want to be covered would be around 2-4 meters depending on whether I fit the divider box and reducer in-line or on my shop extraction unit.

As per the recommendations elsewhere on FOG I would want to be using at least a 36mm hose here. Indeed, it seems to me that one option I may have would be to run 50mm hose (although it may be more expensive than 36mm hose) direct to my Hammer reducer connector with the 50mm outside diameter and then terminate that hose at the tool end with the 452897 part I mention above...although with that strategy I am not sure if I need another fitting between the hose and the Hammer reducer connector.

Thanks for help/insight from all you Festool gurus who know the ins and outs of the hose possibilities [big grin],

Dave M




Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 890
Re: What's my best hose reduction strategy for my shop extraction system?
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2018, 03:10 PM »
The 452897 you mentioned is ment to attach the #492390 D36 cleanup kit directly to a 50mm hose end, so my guess is it wouldn't really fit the tools (as it's hard plastic and not flexible like the hose ends) - plus you don't really want to directly attach a 50mm hose directly to a Domino or OF as it's quite heavy and stiff, it would ruin the handling of the tools.

Try https://www.festool.de/zubehoer/493047---d-50d-50-vm-as (or https://www.festool.de/zubehoer/499196---ad-d36cs50cs70cms - which in retail is only marginally more expensive where I live, so it added a 50cm 36mm hose for <5€) to get a 50mm inner diameter sleeve where all festool hoses will connect into perfectly. Should fit onto the reducer (you listed as 2. with 50mm outer diameter) without any problem and would also be a good spot to attach a ground wire to have the benefit of the festool antistatic hoses.

A second blast gate to moderate the flow of the main line, thus allowing to increase/reduce the suction of the split off festool one, could have benefits.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2018, 03:23 PM by Gregor »

Offline LooseSox

  • Posts: 114
Re: What's my best hose reduction strategy for my shop extraction system?
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2018, 03:24 PM »
Unfortunately you'll get less than desirable performance. Big dust extractors for static machines operate on high volume, low pressure, the opposite of what a vacuum (eg festool extractor) does. Taking 120mm dust extractor pipe down to 50mm will strangle the extractor and you'll move hardly any air.

With the small ports on hand held tools, trying to use a static dust extractor reduced down that far is a recipe for disappointment, I've seen plenty of people try and fail. I'm unsure of the exact maths (any one studied fluid mechanics can chime in here!) but there is something akin to a theoretical maximum amount of air you can suck under vacuum through a certain diameter, regardless if its a 1hp entry level dusty or a $50k 20hp industrial rig they don't like small hoses.

If you have any form of shop vac, get the reducers needed for your new tools to suit. If not, I'd look into a festool extractor as well as its completely different in operation to what you currently have.

Offline Peter Halle

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 11412
  • Another Avatar Coming Soon
Re: What's my best hose reduction strategy for my shop extraction system?
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2018, 07:21 PM »
I don''t have a big dust collection system.  But as @LooseSox said, if you are just looking for "dust" collection for the Domino and the OF1400 then all you need to do versus the Festool dust extractors is get hearing protection if you don't have it already, and a hose and end that will match.

Peter

Offline dave_in_gva

  • Posts: 6
Re: What's my best hose reduction strategy for my shop extraction system?
« Reply #4 on: February 23, 2018, 11:50 AM »
Hmmm thanks everyone.

So now I am looking at Festool dust extractors. Thinking the Midi could go under my workbench.

From what I have read I can put a D36 hose onto the Midi directly, although that will stick straight up out of the top of the extractor.

Is that correct, and if so, any major disadvantage apart from not being able to place other systainers on there and the extra hassle of the larger hose needing to be carried separately when transporting?


Offline LooseSox

  • Posts: 114
Re: What's my best hose reduction strategy for my shop extraction system?
« Reply #5 on: February 23, 2018, 04:43 PM »
Yes, that's right. Festool hoses share the same port size so the 36mm hose will work with a mini/midi albeit straight up as you suggested prohibiting the use of systainers atop the vac when the larger hose is in use. Other than that there is no other real disadvantage. I only wrap my hose into the garage of my CT36 when going out on site to take up less room in the car, when in the shop I coil it up and hand it on the wall when not in use as it makes for quicker/easier access and packup when needed.