Author Topic: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?  (Read 38792 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 4309
  • Burger Babe Says: I Even Buy Green Bananas
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #60 on: January 06, 2016, 02:40 PM »
theres a cheap festool item?????
Calif Here I come Baby

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline shaun.mcc

  • Posts: 100
  • DIY, Chronic Tool Addict.
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #61 on: January 06, 2016, 04:14 PM »
I think that is a great idea (the plywood unit...though I've needed some phenolic resin board before and it was $$$)...

update on my technique is: I do use the Parf dog...and then use my Woodpeckers MFT square to verify everything is perfect.

The plywood is great...keep in mind that Woodpeckers precision and use of CMM (computerized measurement machines) to ensure their precision is part of what you are paying for...I believe they use a OGP Flash unit (in one of their videos). I was looking at one for my business...in measuring parts we deal with...and our unit will be about $100k...and it's just for measuring.

Obviously...though in my woodworking...thus far I don't need that uber level of precision...not yet. :)
CT 36 HEPA • ETS 125  • TS 55 REQ • RO150 • LR32 • Kapex KS120 • UG Cart and EXT  • Parallel Guide & Extensions • Domino XL DF 700 Set • OF1400 EQ Plunge Router • MFT/3 Table

Online Svar

  • Posts: 913
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #62 on: January 06, 2016, 04:36 PM »
A year or so ago I was wondering just how accurate those holes in the mft/3s  were.  I took two Qwas dogs, stuck them in adjacent holes and measured them with my digital caliper, outside to outside.  I wrote that number on the mft3 right between the holes.  I did that with about half the holes in one mft/3 and about one fourth the holes on my other one, in both the x and y axis.  I was looking for variation.
I just went out and looked at my tables.  Most of the holes were within three thousandths of 4.585 inches.  However, the smallest was 4.575" and the largest was 4.593".  I was very careful to hold the caliper the same on all of them.  I checked all of them twice and the ones that were way off several times more.
Now, when using the dogs as a fence, I keep them as far apart as possible to minimize the error.

Finally, a fellow researcher soul with actual numbers instead of "super duper CNC precision" armwaving!
Was 0.003" the standard deviation? Was there any wiggle in Qwas dogs?
I made my top myself with old Ryobi router and regular Festool guide rail, and I think I got better precision and accuracy. I'll check and report.

Offline JonSchuck

  • Posts: 105
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #63 on: January 07, 2016, 07:44 PM »
A year or so ago I was wondering just how accurate those holes in the mft/3s  were.  I took two Qwas dogs, stuck them in adjacent holes and measured them with my digital caliper, outside to outside.  I wrote that number on the mft3 right between the holes.  I did that with about half the holes in one mft/3 and about one fourth the holes on my other one, in both the x and y axis.  I was looking for variation.
I just went out and looked at my tables.  Most of the holes were within three thousandths of 4.585 inches.  However, the smallest was 4.575" and the largest was 4.593".  I was very careful to hold the caliper the same on all of them.  I checked all of them twice and the ones that were way off several times more.
Now, when using the dogs as a fence, I keep them as far apart as possible to minimize the error.

Finally, a fellow researcher soul with actual numbers instead of "super duper CNC precision" armwaving!
Was 0.003" the standard deviation? Was there any wiggle in Qwas dogs?
I made my top myself with old Ryobi router and regular Festool guide rail, and I think I got better precision and accuracy. I'll check and report.
I would say that 90% or more were within .004" of  4.585".  However, the extremes were .018" or about 1\55".  I didn't notice any slop with the Qwas dogs but even a very little bit that I wouldn't notice could make a difference.  Also, as Corwin has said, any sag in the table would change things.  But it would be nice to start with perfectly square so my own  mistakes wouldn't be compounded. 
It would be very interesting to me if your Ryobi router and Festool guide rail made a more square table.  Please let us know and share how you did it.
Thanks.

Offline Anderson-Plywood

  • Festool Dealer
  • *
  • Posts: 48
  • Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help
    • Anderson Plywood Website
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #64 on: January 27, 2016, 03:05 PM »
Just letting you know that we made a new batch of squares!
They are back in stock now with new packaging!

http://www.andersonplywood.com/square-for-festool-mft-square/


-----------
Anderson Plywood

Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help.

Largest Festool Distributor in Southern California
With a Vast Range of Festool Products, Hard to Find Parts and Accessories





www.andersonplywood.com

Offline Anderson-Plywood

  • Festool Dealer
  • *
  • Posts: 48
  • Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help
    • Anderson Plywood Website
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #65 on: February 24, 2016, 07:40 PM »
Design and manufacture of the Anderson MFT square has taken place here in California.
We welcome any comments or critiques about the MFT square from those who own one or have used it.

Here is the link if you need more info:
Anderson MFT Square
-----------
Anderson Plywood

Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help.

Largest Festool Distributor in Southern California
With a Vast Range of Festool Products, Hard to Find Parts and Accessories





www.andersonplywood.com

Offline Anderson-Plywood

  • Festool Dealer
  • *
  • Posts: 48
  • Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help
    • Anderson Plywood Website
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #66 on: April 07, 2016, 11:39 AM »
The new series of Anderson MFT squares are out!
We have trimmed square edges with Festool Trim Router and used the Festool VAC SYS (the new vacuum clamp) to hold the piece.
They look and feel much nicer now!
I will post pictures later on.  [big grin]

Here is the link to the Anderson MFT Square:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/square-for-festool-mft-square/

Here is the Trim Router we used:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/mfk-700-modular-trim-router-set-festool-574368-fes574368/

Here is the link to Festool VAC SYS Clamp:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/festool-vac-sys-system-set-57000004-fes57000004/
-----------
Anderson Plywood

Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help.

Largest Festool Distributor in Southern California
With a Vast Range of Festool Products, Hard to Find Parts and Accessories





www.andersonplywood.com

Offline jaxx

  • Posts: 2
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #67 on: April 09, 2016, 05:05 PM »
Need some help...got my new MFT/3...before I cut on it I need to square it up.

Well, those nice Woodpecker one-time tools make me yearn for a nice speed square or (if I had ordered earlier and was patient) the new Woodpecker MFT square. What all do you recommend? I'm sure my $10.00 speed square is not sufficient    [embarassed]...I have a little 12" Woodpecker (that doesn't sound right)...T-Square.

I managed to get the large MFT square a few months ago via Ebay as I missed the One Time Deadline. Its simply brilliant and a joy to use, set up the MFT in seconds. Don't hang it on the side of the MFT with the supplied bracket as it tends to get knocked off easily. Down side was the premium price I had to pay to get it. Eye watering but worth it.......... 

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1664
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #68 on: April 09, 2016, 08:50 PM »
you can hang it with the hangar facing inward on the back of the MFT. I've done that and it's out of the way.
Randy

Offline Acrobat

  • Posts: 464
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #69 on: April 20, 2016, 12:29 AM »
Not knocking all the great squares on offer throughout this post but if the original poster or anyone else hasn't purchased a square for their MFT but has the Festool MFS profiles, simply join them into a rectangle and use that. All the sides are very accurate and when assembled you'll get a pretty darn good square for nix.
I believe there is a "Setting up your MFT" guide in the Festools links page here that shows it and other handy info within it too. [smile]
Don't wake me, I'm livin' the dream!

Offline grainhaus

  • Posts: 12
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #70 on: April 20, 2016, 01:15 PM »
Just purchased, looking forward to using this!
 
Thanks!


The new series of Anderson MFT squares are out!
We have trimmed square edges with Festool Trim Router and used the Festool VAC SYS (the new vacuum clamp) to hold the piece.
They look and feel much nicer now!
I will post pictures later on.  [big grin]

Here is the link to the Anderson MFT Square:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/square-for-festool-mft-square/

Here is the Trim Router we used:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/mfk-700-modular-trim-router-set-festool-574368-fes574368/

Here is the link to Festool VAC SYS Clamp:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/festool-vac-sys-system-set-57000004-fes57000004/

Offline Anderson-Plywood

  • Festool Dealer
  • *
  • Posts: 48
  • Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help
    • Anderson Plywood Website
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #71 on: May 27, 2016, 07:33 PM »
Congrats!
Please let us know your feedback!



The new series of Anderson MFT squares are out!
We have trimmed square edges with Festool Trim Router and used the Festool VAC SYS (the new vacuum clamp) to hold the piece.
They look and feel much nicer now!
I will post pictures later on.  [big grin]

Here is the link to the Anderson MFT Square:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/square-for-festool-mft-square/

Here is the Trim Router we used:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/mfk-700-modular-trim-router-set-festool-574368-fes574368/

Here is the link to Festool VAC SYS Clamp:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/festool-vac-sys-system-set-57000004-fes57000004/

Just purchased, looking forward to using this!
 
Thanks!


The new series of Anderson MFT squares are out!
We have trimmed square edges with Festool Trim Router and used the Festool VAC SYS (the new vacuum clamp) to hold the piece.
They look and feel much nicer now!
I will post pictures later on.  [big grin]

Here is the link to the Anderson MFT Square:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/square-for-festool-mft-square/

Here is the Trim Router we used:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/mfk-700-modular-trim-router-set-festool-574368-fes574368/

Here is the link to Festool VAC SYS Clamp:
http://www.andersonplywood.com/festool-vac-sys-system-set-57000004-fes57000004/
-----------
Anderson Plywood

Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help.

Largest Festool Distributor in Southern California
With a Vast Range of Festool Products, Hard to Find Parts and Accessories





www.andersonplywood.com

Offline Anderson-Plywood

  • Festool Dealer
  • *
  • Posts: 48
  • Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help
    • Anderson Plywood Website
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #72 on: June 17, 2016, 01:46 PM »
-----------
Anderson Plywood

Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help.

Largest Festool Distributor in Southern California
With a Vast Range of Festool Products, Hard to Find Parts and Accessories





www.andersonplywood.com

Offline QuailRider43

  • Posts: 57
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #73 on: June 19, 2016, 02:05 AM »
I use qwas dogs and the MFT fence to square everything up.  The MFT fence is a reference straight edge that you already own, and the table holes are CNC'd, so you don't really need to buy another reference.  Slide fence out of the protractor head unit.  Loosen rail alignment screws.  Put qwas dogs in holes immediately left of MFT rail.  Butt loose MFT fence on the right against dogs.  Butt rail on the right against fence & dogs.  Hold dog/fence/rail sandwich in place.  Lock down all rail adjustment screws, brackets etc.  Rail is now dead parallel to holes, and offset by width of the fence.  Now lift up the rail assembly, and reinstall the fence in the protractor head.  Loosen protractor head alignment screws and adjustment knobs.  Set stop to 0 deg.  Butt fence unit against dogs placed in holes parallel to fence.  Tighten down angle alignment screws.  Fence is now aligned with holes, and a perfect 90 deg with rail.  Easy 5 min setup, and no additional squares needed.

Offline Bert Vanderveen

  • Posts: 328
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #74 on: June 19, 2016, 06:04 AM »
Easy 5 min setup, and no additional squares needed.

True, very much so, and the way I do the setup too (although I use an extra rail I have), but the square — whatever kind you prefer — is convenient to check for squareness periodically, without having to go through to whole setup procedure again. I can understand why people would want to do that.
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

TS55 · TS55R · OF1010 · DF500 Mk2 · MFT/3 + CMS TS55 + CMS PS300 + LA-CS 70/CMS · CTL Midi · RTS400 EQ · 2 x CXS Li 1,5 · T15+3 Li 4,2 · TI15 Impact Li 4,2 · PSB300 · LR32-SYS · RO150 · Kapex KS120 · MFK700 · RO90 · OFK700  … | Hammer A3 31 Silent Power · Hammer N4400 

Offline QuailRider43

  • Posts: 57
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #75 on: June 19, 2016, 11:19 AM »
but the square — whatever kind you prefer — is convenient to check for squareness periodically, without having to go through to whole setup procedure again.

Ah, good point.  I hadn't thought of that.

Offline ShawnNYC

  • Posts: 14
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #76 on: June 23, 2016, 01:50 PM »
Just a heads up.
I wanted the Woodpecker 18" square for my MFT and other uses.
Even though the one time order date was back in February, they were happy to get me on the list just a few weeks ago...

Offline PreferrablyWood

  • Posts: 850
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #77 on: June 25, 2016, 09:37 AM »
Not knocking all the great squares on offer throughout this post but if the original poster or anyone else hasn't purchased a square for their MFT but has the Festool MFS profiles, simply join them into a rectangle and use that. All the sides are very accurate and when assembled you'll get a pretty darn good square for nix.
I believe there is a "Setting up your MFT" guide in the Festools links page here that shows it and other handy info within it too. [smile]

Yes i'm getting the MFS setup, as it's rather more expensive then I'd like if it can do more things, then alls good. In another thread I've got going in the wrong topic I've got it down to getting two sets of the MFS 400, and a set MFS 1000 extensions, if I find  need the MFS 700 length I'll get it later.. Otherwise if I still need an additional square I'll go for a large engineers square as Peter Parfitt has suggested..
850 HL E Planer rustic head standard head angle fence, MFS 400x2, MFS extensions MFS VB 700 x 1 MFS VB 1000 x 2 . CMS GE, sliding fence, VB and 2x VL extension tables, OF 2200, Accessory Set ZS OF 2200 M,36mm 5m antistatik hose, CMS OF+ CMS TS 75 insert modules. SYS-MFT Fixing-Set,  3.5m sleeved hose, Syslite duo, Sys 4 sort 3 x3, Sys Roll, Sys 1 Box x2 , classic Sys 3-Sort 4, classic Sys 3 Sort 6 x2, Sys Cart x3 Systainer 4 x2  as toolbox with selfmade inserts Systainer 5 as toolbox with insert.
Festool 18V HKC 55 Li 5.2 EB Plus FSK 420,FSK 250, Extra blade for the HKC 55 W32.TI 15, CXS 2.6 Ah version, RO 90 DX, PDC 18/4 plus DC UNI FF depth stop chuck,AD 3/8 square socket holder FF chuck, Centrotec Bits; -->Bit holder and bit selection BHS 65 CE TL 24x, ,Bradpoint DB WOOD CE SET ,Zobo (Forstner) D 15-35 CE-Zobo SET ,Masonary/stone bits DB STONE CE Set,Extender BV 150 CE, Countersink QLS D2-8 CE Hook turner HD D18, end centrotec<--.  TS 75 EBQ, PSC 420, OF 1010, RS 300 EQ, CTL Midi, MFT 3, Parf dogs x2pair +Bench dogs x2pair, FS 1080, FS 1900 .  will get Domino DF 700 XL,  CMS insert BS 120 Belt sander.

Offline TrophyJoe

  • Posts: 2
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #78 on: June 27, 2016, 12:15 AM »
Recently bought the Anderson square. Dead on accurate and hefty--no thin alum or steel blades. Shipping was worth it because they did an outstanding job of packing it and it arrived in perfect condition. Highly recommended and an excellent value, even with the shipping.

I just wish there was an option for a bigger version, say 24" x 32".

Offline Anderson-Plywood

  • Festool Dealer
  • *
  • Posts: 48
  • Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help
    • Anderson Plywood Website
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #79 on: July 15, 2016, 02:08 PM »
Thanks much for your comment! :)
We are glad you liked it.
The material we used is Euro-Color-Ply Phenolic plywood.

Recently bought the Anderson square. Dead on accurate and hefty--no thin alum or steel blades. Shipping was worth it because they did an outstanding job of packing it and it arrived in perfect condition. Highly recommended and an excellent value, even with the shipping.

I just wish there was an option for a bigger version, say 24" x 32".
-----------
Anderson Plywood

Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help.

Largest Festool Distributor in Southern California
With a Vast Range of Festool Products, Hard to Find Parts and Accessories





www.andersonplywood.com

Offline geoffshep

  • Posts: 136
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #80 on: July 15, 2016, 02:46 PM »
You could try this - it always works  [big grin]


Offline Anderson-Plywood

  • Festool Dealer
  • *
  • Posts: 48
  • Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help
    • Anderson Plywood Website
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #81 on: January 16, 2017, 01:27 PM »
lol..
I love the magic square..
-----------
Anderson Plywood

Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help.

Largest Festool Distributor in Southern California
With a Vast Range of Festool Products, Hard to Find Parts and Accessories





www.andersonplywood.com

Offline Anderson-Plywood

  • Festool Dealer
  • *
  • Posts: 48
  • Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help
    • Anderson Plywood Website
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #82 on: April 25, 2017, 02:00 AM »
We have a promo on the MFT square for a limited time!
Check it out!

Anderson Plywood's Layout Square for MFT Table is made from 3/4" Phenolic Plywood:

-----------
Anderson Plywood

Ask Us Questions, We Are Here To Help.

Largest Festool Distributor in Southern California
With a Vast Range of Festool Products, Hard to Find Parts and Accessories





www.andersonplywood.com

Offline jdw101

  • Posts: 67
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #83 on: April 25, 2017, 10:12 AM »
Woodpeckers 1281 square, it's what they used in the end user classes for years.

http://www.woodpeck.com/1281.html

You can get them at woodcraft and most woodworking stores

I have that square, it's an amazing product.  Very expensive.  I also have lots of other options including the Quas dogs and lots of squares from Woodpecker and others.  I think you could make do with a much less fancy square for sure and the Quas dogs to me seem like a perfect solution.

Offline DrD

  • Posts: 395
  • I might not be fast BUT I sure am slow
Re: What square to buy for MFT/3 squaring?
« Reply #84 on: April 25, 2017, 02:05 PM »
Boy this thread has been going on for some time now, and with a lot of very useful ideas.  All this time I have been trying to see what's best for my needs in my shop by following this thread.  I do like to have reasonable, read eyeball, precision in cut angles and lengths, and as long as all four sides of a box are same length and perpendicular to each other, I'm happy.

All of this is to say, I spent a lot of time and money - mostly on Woodpecker stuff - to achieve the desire goal.  Last week I removed all the Festool protractors, fences, guide stops from my MFT/3s, and found Qwas dogs and a good tape measure like a Tajima or a FastCap were all I needed to cut square and to length.  There is 1 hugh provisio - I needed to start with a straight edge on the sheet goods.  After that aligning the straight edge against 2 or 3 Qwas dogs, and backing my fence up to 2 Qwas dogs set perpendicular to the cut edge, I was good to go.  The length of the cut is set by the tape.  Good, quick, and cheap.  Now if only I could find a use for the OTT 26" square!
Dr.D