Author Topic: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square  (Read 43493 times)

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Offline Colonel Panic

  • Posts: 93
Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« on: March 14, 2016, 11:52 PM »
Clever idea but overpriced like many of their OTTs. I have several of their products like squares and story sticks but I'll pass on this one since I can make one with some birch plywood and a bit of hardware.
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Offline ear3

  • Posts: 3583
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2016, 12:41 AM »
Just saw it as well.  Looks like you have to resquare it every time you take it off and put it back on the rail.

I just don't see how this would be more accurate or even that much more of a time saver compared to careful measuring.
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Offline copcarcollector

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #2 on: March 15, 2016, 12:53 AM »
Similar idea to the Qwas Square (below), and a couple of other shop made versions I have seen here on the FOG.

I think the idea is that you would leave it on the rail more often than not. Interesting...


Offline copcarcollector

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Offline Kev

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #4 on: March 15, 2016, 03:37 AM »
They're just making a little hay till the FSK's hit !!

I'm often very negative about WP and the OTT offerings. $US100 for something you can make with 2 T bolts and a piece of plywood?? Give me a break [mad]

Offline JayStPeter

  • Posts: 363
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2016, 09:31 AM »
I kind of like it.  It does need something to index it to the rail though for me to really pull the trigger on it.  The one I made a few years ago basically had another bar on it similar to the one that mounts the rail.  Used that to align the edge of the rail.  That bar was a little longer to give enough length to get it right each time.
I like the handle on that one and would rather have something made of Aluminum.  Price doesn't bother me, but the re-squaring hassle makes it worse than home made.
Jay St. Peter

Offline anthonyz

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2016, 09:37 AM »
They should have placed an adjustable bar on the top side. That once you squared the Woodpecker square up, the bar on the top could be slid against the track and tightened down so there is a square reference built into the Woodpecker square. Gonna pick up some Aluminum plate and make my own.

Offline Shane Holland

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2016, 09:37 AM »
For anyone who is interested in getting one of these, we have them with free shipping.

Woodpeckers OneTIME Track Saw Square

Thanks.
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Offline Master Carpenter

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #8 on: March 15, 2016, 09:43 AM »
The bar under the rail looks too short. I wonder how much deflection to square you get if you have side pressure at the far end of your cut.
Interesting tool, but I think I'll continue my method of using one arm of my parallel guides for this type of cut.
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Offline Birdhunter

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #9 on: March 15, 2016, 09:46 AM »
I guess I am a tad slow, but how do you hold the "handle" and move the saw more than a foot or so?
Birdhunter

Offline deepcreek

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #10 on: March 15, 2016, 09:53 AM »
I just don't see it working very well in terms of precision.

The slightest error in squaring the Track Square will be magnified as you proceed down the guide rail.

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Offline blaszcsj

  • Posts: 355
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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #11 on: March 15, 2016, 09:57 AM »
I don't like how the knobs make it thicker than 3/4". I use a foam spoil board and with this I would have to make sure I'm always off the edge to make this work with pretty much any sheet good.
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Offline Tayler_mann

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #12 on: March 15, 2016, 10:35 AM »
I agree these are very over priced imho. I could set a CNC file up for something like this in about 10 min and machine it out of aluminum for about $50 a piece. For that matter I could laser them out of 1/2" acrylic or CNC then out 1/2" styrene. If that is all I made I could imagine doing 300 per day in my mahibe shop.

I feel they could have had a better OTT than this I am somewhat disappointed. I usually love and wish I could order all of woodpeckers OTTs.

Offline thedude306

  • Posts: 192
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #13 on: March 15, 2016, 10:46 AM »
I'm not sure you guys are giving it enough credit.  I have the Bosch angle guide (it's basically a similar piece that attaches to bosh and Mafell rails that is adj) and I love the thing.

The concept is sound.
Brad T.

Offline JimH2

  • Posts: 591
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #14 on: March 15, 2016, 11:26 AM »
I agree these are very over priced imho. I could set a CNC file up for something like this in about 10 min and machine it out of aluminum for about $50 a piece. For that matter I could laser them out of 1/2" acrylic or CNC then out 1/2" styrene. If that is all I made I could imagine doing 300 per day in my mahibe shop.

I feel they could have had a better OTT than this I am somewhat disappointed. I usually love and wish I could order all of woodpeckers OTTs.

If your cost to make is $50 then a markup of $49.99 is not too much as you put it. They would not be in business if they sold everything at cost. Consider everyone lucky that they exist and make products that a lot of people like.

If you can make them cheaper and want the hassle of dealing with people, shipping, returns, etc then go for it.

Offline RellikJM

  • Posts: 1
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #15 on: March 15, 2016, 11:29 AM »
Festool already makes an accessory that can do this and more : Angle Unit - 491588 $98


Offline Richard/RMW

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #16 on: March 15, 2016, 12:21 PM »
I was fiddling with something like this last year, it never made it to prime time due to lack of time. Fiddling included making a shop-made version from 2 pieces for 1/4" by 2" AL bar, then the more robust version I posted about. My observations from all this are:
  • I never trusted the first version since it only took a minor whack to knock it out of alignment, something I did nearly every time I used it, often while jostling it into position against the sheet goods
  • It took some time to get it set up dead-on square, I used a WP 16" by 24" square to do so and then tweaked it after a test cut
Also I agree that it would take something much longer than a 12" by 8" square to set up a 15" by 48" right angle, especially using the splinter guard to reference off of.

Just my [2cents] and I am not a designer/professional/etc. but I have worked on the concept a bit. If they have overcome the mounting challenges sufficiently to assure that it can't/won't move, then my only concern would be aligning it easily. I would not reach for it if I had to keep adjusting or checking it every time I used it.

On the other hand, I don't have any issue with their price. After making up 10 copies of the second design and calculating everything they would have to sell for >$200. That is WP territory without even the red anodizing...

RMW
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Offline Colonel Panic

  • Posts: 93
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #17 on: March 15, 2016, 12:50 PM »
Festool already makes an accessory that can do this and more : Angle Unit - 491588 $98

Festool making a better tool at a lower price? What's the world coming to? [big grin] [big grin] [big grin]
What, me worry?

Offline Dogberryjr

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #18 on: March 15, 2016, 01:11 PM »
I'm relieved when a new OTT is announced and I don't lust for it.

Offline Richard/RMW

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #19 on: March 15, 2016, 01:14 PM »
I'm relieved when a new OTT is announced and I don't lust for it.

Amen.

RMW
As of 10/17 I am out of the Dog business and pursuing other distractions. Thanks for a fun ride!

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 4686
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #20 on: March 15, 2016, 01:42 PM »
FWIW...I think it'd be a rather nice addition to a guide rail for breaking down sheet goods.

I only have two issues with it. The first is the initial squaring of the Woodpeckers handle to the guide rail. Using a 1281 is rather hokey.  [poke]  If you're off by only .005"-.006" at the 1 foot mark, you'll be off by .040"-.050" at the 8 foot mark on a sheet of ply. I'd just use a small Woodpeckers Saddle T-Square and 2 pencil marks spaced 95" apart on a 8 foot piece of plywood.
http://www.woodpeck.com/sdltsqr.html

The second issue is how to maintain the perpendicularity while actively using the bulky assembled items. Because we're talking about an 8 foot lever arm (the Festool guide rail) it doesn't take much of a jar/bump to knock this assembly out of square. I think it will work, however, you have to be very, very careful when handling this assembly.

As far as price goes, I think they're in the ballpark. As a matter of fact I was quite surprised to see it under $100.  [eek] After watching the video, it appears that they may be using MIC 6 cast tooling plate which runs about $20+ per square foot. Add in machining time, clear anodizing, fasteners, extra bit & pieces, labeling, QA and packaging and the costs add up pretty fast.

Offline elimelech12

  • Posts: 376
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2016, 02:05 PM »
I'm relieved when a new OTT is announced and I don't lust for it.

Amen.

RMW

 [thumbs up]
Sold my tools but kept a few Fes-tools...just in case.

Offline JayStPeter

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #22 on: March 15, 2016, 05:27 PM »
Festool already makes an accessory that can do this and more : Angle Unit - 491588 $98



As far as price vs. features, the Festool clearly has a lot more features per dollar (it was $45 when I bought it).  As far as price vs. usefulness, I hope the Woodpeck one is a winner.  I may buy it and add my own self-squaring modification to it.  It's the nicest form factor I've seen.  Downside to the OTTs is that you can't read reviews before buying (unless they're the ones that really aren't one-time).

For reference, I've had a hate-hate relationship with my AU for years and would not recommend taking one if it is given to you free.  It will eventually cost you money by screwing up your projects.  Something like it that actually works is infinitely useful.
http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/'fixed'-my-angle-unit/30/
Jay St. Peter

Offline ivanhoe

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #23 on: March 15, 2016, 06:55 PM »
I came to Festool/Mafell by way of a different tracksaw company which had a device similar to this and although it's not the same, it's very similar and was easily knocked out of alignment when using a rail of 55".  As Richard mentioned above, I also found myself fussing with it more than I wanted and abandoned it.  I would much rather use the 3rd party parallel guides with the Incra tracks and saving any shorter crosscuts for my MFT. Mafell makes an angle guide which is mounted permanently to a small piece of guide track which is imo much more reliable for this application. (Albeit I still wouldn't use it for any long cuts)

Offline Scorpion

  • Posts: 556
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2016, 08:44 AM »
I think $100 for that is plenty. Looks like two would nest together nicely.  A large machining center would make short work of such a simple piece.  The two out of place holes to the left of the handle are to hold the material down as its machined...otherwise I'd bet the farm they'd mass cut them on a laser.

I do wonder of it would stay put after setup and if accuracy is really comparable to my current processes using a combo of my parallel guides, MFT, and Kapex.  Traveling lightly with less (unable to take Kapex and MFT), maybe it's a winner.

Offline RL

  • Posts: 3039
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #25 on: March 16, 2016, 10:09 AM »
A guide rail connector costs $18 and is much longer than the Woodpeckers offering. With 4 holes already drilled in it, you could use two to clamp it to the guide rail and two to screw it to a squared piece of plywood, aluminium etc.

You would need to shim it to level it with the bottom of the guide rail, but what could be simpler?


Offline Eden1415

  • Posts: 30
Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #26 on: March 16, 2016, 12:18 PM »
I see your guide rail connector, and cut it in half  [big grin].  Saved $80 bucks. 
I'm going to skip this OTT offer.

Sorry not real good at times with the Jig saw.  One day I will clean it us with my router.

Made two sets of 90 degree clamps that allow me to flip around and be used on either end of the rail.  The holes are for gripping/pushing/clamping. 

A quick alignment with a precision square and away we go.

Offline JimH2

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #27 on: March 16, 2016, 02:10 PM »
Festool already makes an accessory that can do this and more : Angle Unit - 491588 $98



As far as price vs. features, the Festool clearly has a lot more features per dollar (it was $45 when I bought it).  As far as price vs. usefulness, I hope the Woodpeck one is a winner.  I may buy it and add my own self-squaring modification to it.  It's the nicest form factor I've seen.  Downside to the OTTs is that you can't read reviews before buying (unless they're the ones that really aren't one-time).

For reference, I've had a hate-hate relationship with my AU for years and would not recommend taking one if it is given to you free.  It will eventually cost you money by screwing up your projects.  Something like it that actually works is infinitely useful.
http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/'fixed'-my-angle-unit/30/

I agree that the Angle Unit is not great. The OTT addresses one problem and that is getting 90 degree cuts in the field and it should do that well. I use a square for setup and it works quite well. It probably is at least as good as this, but I'd say it can't match the convenience of the OTT, which is easier to carry and use if you don't have a square close by.

Offline Scorpion

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #28 on: March 16, 2016, 03:14 PM »

Made two sets of 90 degree clamps that allow me to flip around and be used on either end of the rail.  The holes are for gripping/pushing/clamping. 

A quick alignment with a precision square and away we go.


That's a really slick idea...nice idea.

Offline Holzhacker

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Re: Latest Woodpecker OTT - Track Square
« Reply #29 on: March 16, 2016, 05:52 PM »
I used to find the woodpecker OTT very creative and desirable. There are a number of older ones I wish I had gotten in on.
Not so much though anymore with the offerings more recently. They seem more like gimmicky quickies to lure in Festoolians rather than actual creative and helpful woodworking tools.
Of course the pricing isn't great either. Nonetheless for the creative or good stuff I'll pay.
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