Ok, finally ordered my first Festool and sorry to say not 100% impressed/ I lurked around here so I knew the miter fence was questionable but for the money was expecting more. Yes it can be set for accuracy but the repeatability is not there without fiddling or checking.

I need more set and cut accuracy as others also have posted so on to the first addition. I have an Osbourne t track miter gauge for a table saw and figured why not router a t track slot and use the Osbourne gauge. It is free and would hopefully eliminate all the flex and non repeatability of the Festool one.

Anybody ever mount a miter fence like this?

Thanks

I find that with the MFT/3 properly set up that it is very accurate and repeatable.  It did take some adjusting and there are a lot of things to tighten down.  At Festool training class they walked through an order of how to set things up and adjust and since I have followed that method everything has checked out fine for me...now I only square things if I take the protractor off and put it back on...otherwise, it stays adjusted.  You can look at the process on Festool TV on YouTube or a call to Festool Service and they can walk you through the adjustments.   

Scot

I have no problems at all with the accuracy (squareness) of my MFT 3 - it is a great piece of kit and an essential tool if you do work away from base. It would be a good idea to get it set up properly in the first place so get some 20mm dogs (from Qwas in North America or Intelligent Workshop in Europe) and follow the routine in either Paul Marcel's video or my video review of the dogs in the 'Other Tool Review' section here on the FOG.

Yes, there is a new dog design on the way which will improve accuracy, repeatability and ease of travel. It will be a couple of weeks more before they are annouced.

Peter

You're right, as a miter gauge it doesn't compare to an Incra etc.
Just think of it as a pivot point with some ballpark angle positions that you have to dial in for your purpose.
Once you have the angle set you should clamp the fence down if you plan to make more than one cut.

Nothing wrong with you saying that at all.  I am curious to know what you're doing with your MFT that you are pushing hard enough on whatever it is that you're cutting that you'd set the fence off by that much.  Also, if there IS that much flex, why not simply put a clamped stopper behind it as mentioned?  I agree with you that it is an expensive piece of gear, but you also have to bear in mind that it was designed to be portable - and to make it rock solid would mean that it would be too heavy to be practical to move.  So, you get a table that will give you very accurate references, you just need to take the extra step of securing them to the point where it's solid enough for whatever you're doing.

As a functional example, I've cut shims of varying widths on each end to true up the subfloor of my house.  I had to cut well over 500 of them, and rarely more than 2 or 3 at a time were the exact same dimensions in a given batch.  I used dogs to attach a rail to two tables, and a 2x4 that I had planed down to give me a straight reference point.  I slid that under the rail and butted it up against the dogs.  From there, I had shims that I had cut, and would insert them as needed.  Now, I could shove on the 2x4s that I'd trim down as hard as I wanted to, and nothing was going to budge ever.

Here are some pictures, hopefully it'll help a bit.  As far as the fence goes, it's the same idea - just have to secure it to meet your needs.



That's one of the spacers



That's the table setup



That's one of the "better" transitions between sheets of ply in terms of elevation changes



And that was the subfloor before a bit of sanding to do some smoothing here and there.  Flat, level, and solid - three things it certainly was NOT before I started.  There was no way I would have been able to do that in any reasonable period of time without the tables and (qwas) dogs.

Finally...



That's the hallway and one of the bedrooms having the first coat of poly applied.  Every room on that floor needed the subfloors corrected, with some areas having a drop of more than 2 inches over 8 feet.

Anyway, long-winded and rambling way of getting to the point I suppose, but it is what it is.  Ripping down 2x4s in random lengths to glue and nail under ply or on their own onto old wavy subfloor was not a gentle task, and there was a lot of slamming of pieces to ensure that they were firmly in place before cutting.  Yes, there were some mistakes, but they were all due to failures relative to things such as simple math.

I also just purchased the track saw and am having the slope issue. I have it dialed in perfectly square, however when I change the angle I am roughly a half of a degree off. A real pain when cutting picture frames. Also I am having an issue with a "D" shape when cutting the stock. Not sure why this is occurring. Does anyone have any ideas?  Oh and the fence does have some slope to it. If i use the lock down at the end of the fence that too is throwing me off from time to time either pushing or pulling the fence back. Any ideas on this as well?

 

This is a $600 table it should not need anything to work properly. I like the bench otherwise but it just is annoying to have to make excuses for it. I am well aware of the outward clamp and yes it will lock it in place but is awkward at best. The design of the miter gauge needs work. There are just too many clamping points that cause the flex and misalignment.

The internet is a very powerful forum. I bet Festools sales have gone up 75% from internet use as the Brands name has been wide spread as people always seek what is supposedly the best. I am the kind that does not mind spending the money as long as the item works, end of story. I do not want to build this or that or I would have just built myself a table.

By saying something works and knowing it is an issue just hurts everyone as the Co will not make changes and it creates dissatisfied buyers like myself. They can develop a miter gauge that works out of the box especially at this price point. Festools are great tools but I did not buy them to look at them and polish them. It should work and I hope someone sees this and redesigns it so it works better in the future.

I will correct to my liking but again shouldn't of had to at that price point. $600 for a folding table.

Amen, I feel the exact same way about my mft/3.

In reply number 12 the statement was made "it should not need anything extra". The "fence rail clamp" (black thingy) is not an extra, it should have been in the MFT package. It is there to secure the free end of the fence.

The fence is over 3' long, the primary connecting point is close to the guide rail. That gives you a lever of about 2'. The engineers knew this could be a problem and supplied the fence rail clamp. Would you use a table saw fence without both ends being clamped to the saw rails? Think about that flex.

The first thing you should do with the fence rail clamp is take it apart (don't loose the spring). Relocate the upper clamp section to the hole that moves the knob farther from the rail. Set the rail, slide the fence rail clamp in position, as previously mentioned, snug the clamp to the rail with the knob, now snug the clamp to the table with the lever. Neither have to be tightened, just snugged.

The above will eliminate any flex in the rail. Both "ends" are now secure to the table.

Tom

I bought the quas dogs and they do make it easier to get a true 90 between the fence and guide rail. I use them to put the fence exactly 90' from the guide rail they square the guide rail to the fence. Its dead nuts

I took a leaf out of Paul Marcel's book and got an extra fence clamp. It is an excellent addition if you are using rear fence and guide rail.

Peter

I'll join team unhappy with my MFT/3. Some of my personal findings:

To be clear, the MFT/3 does work. It can be set to precision (and I constantly have to). The problem is the precision is lost after a few operations and you constantly have to fiddle with the fence/miter gauge to keep it from going out of square.
I'm sorry having to be blunt and say that after everything I've tried, even on a second MFT/3, I simply cannot believe anyone who says their MFT/3 is perfect and does not exibit problems.

MFT issues summary:
- It's not stable. (Cross braces help a lot, but really these should come with the standard package shouldn't they)
- The miter guage is sloppy.
- The fence doesn't stay put.

When you place your miter gauge as close to the guide rail as possible and apply just a little pressure to the part of the fence that slides under the rail, you'll see it flexes back by 2mm.

I've tried PaulMarcel's setup of attaching the fence with 2 rail fixing clamps. But only using 2 of these clamps and not the miter gauge I can't fix the fence in place no matter how hard I bolt it down. The fence totally moves out of square after a couple of sheets have been butted against it. It can't be locked down hard enough to stay in place with this method.

Now before everyone comes arguing, my unit is not faulty. I've tried all this on a second MFT/3. I've also been searching for months, and keep doing so, for Youtube videos on the MFT/3. I've tried just about anything under the rainbow except for permanently fixing it to the table.

This sadly makes me conclude the fence & sloppy miter gauge design is flawed and could definitely be improved.

As to the portability. Technically it is portable. You just have to be a pretty strong guy to move it from a van, through a house and up some stairs with ease.
I have a love/hate realtionship with the MFT/3. It's a good concept and when I have it dialled in it performs lovely. I'm just annoyed to no end I have to keep re-setting it after 20 cuts.

Tim, that isn't the problem. Like I said, I can set the MFT/3 up to be as good as perfectly square. The problem I'm trying to describe is that when you butt up a thin piece of wood to the fence, It can flex out of alignment by about 2mm at the point of cut. So that's 2mm over the distance of about 20cm of fence...

 I have to say, reading on the FOG has swayed me from purchasing an MFT/3. Most reviews are positive but common themes show up such has adjustments and extra jigs necessary for accurate and repeatable cuts. I might as well build my own. See Guido 

I think Guilliaume is right and Ghostfist should not be so worried.

A lot of the discussion in this thread, and many other MFT threads, is about superb accuracy. The MFT3 will deliver good accuracy and certainly enough for the mobile fitter. On the odd occasion when supreme accuracy is required then I do a final check with a square just before the cut. The use of either Rail Dogs or Parf Dogs may help a bit but at the end of the day it is about good workshop (or on site) practices - knowing the limitations and mitigating them when required.

I have been using my MFT3 a lot lately for jig work, mainly in support of Domino work, and it just cannot be beaten. I can do offset face-frame Domino joints in next to no time thanks to the versatile clamping support concept of the MFT3. Check out this link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3zlvdV4ElA

Sawing is important but it is only one part of the MFT story.

Peter