Author Topic: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table  (Read 130221 times)

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Offline mattfc

  • Posts: 553
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #30 on: July 20, 2011, 10:56 AM »
Matt,

Reading throught he thread.  Very impressive. 

I like what you have done with those profiles.  I did have one question though... Where is the 45x90 profile located in the sysport w CMS and MFT?  I see you call out 3 pieces and I dont see where they are in the drawing.  They are essentially 2 of the same profile togehter??

Thanks,

Mike

Hi, if you look at this post http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/sysport-cms-mft-(work-in-progress)/msg157775/#msg157775 and look for the thicker lines in the isometric line drawing top left you can see the 3 x 45x90 uprights in the middle. I used the 45x90 here so that I two slots next to each other for the rears of the drawer runners to connect into.. if that makes sense?

The 45x90 is essentiall the same as two 45x45 as you say, the only difference is interally, obviously no slots just a void internally where the two join

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Offline deadplumb

  • Posts: 7
Re: Router Table + SysPort MFT & CMS
« Reply #31 on: November 22, 2011, 12:14 PM »
very nice !!!!!!! anybody know where to get same profiles in the states? i will nee to build kapex workstation soon

These guys should fill the bill... http://www.faztek.net/index.asp

Offline rookie08

  • Posts: 198
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #32 on: January 16, 2012, 07:53 PM »
Matt,

Was looking for some ideas on a router table with an incra ls positioner and fence and came across your design.  Fantastic!  Can you please tell me where you got the pivots for the incra or how you made them

"so it lifts clear of the table, in case I want to use a template bit and want a free surface.. "

I need to do the same thing with mine.

Thanks!

James

Offline Squasher

  • Posts: 6
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #33 on: January 20, 2012, 04:57 PM »
Mattfc,

I plan to make a similar table for my MFT (1080) and am going to use your design. Before doing so, however, I have a few questions.

1) I assume that your table is sized for an MFT/3 (plus CMS) and not a 1080.....  Obviously, I'll need to measure my 1080 to see if the dimensions are the same.
2) Do you have any issues with way you mount the MFT to the adjustable levelers that protrude from the extruded aluminum? Have you thought of alternative ideas for more rigidly attaching the MFT to the extruded aluminum?
3) Does anyone have any suggestions on where I could buy the  Extruded aluminum? I bought T-slotted aluminum from an online company a number of years ago that provided an online shopping cart where you could order the aluminum (to exact size) and specify machining operations (with running costs in the shopping basket), etc. Unfortunately, I can't remember the company URL or can't find anyone with this service anymore.... 8020 and faztek seem to be manufacturers/distributors and/or don't offer the same type of service.

Thanks in advance.

Offline Richard/RMW

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Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #34 on: January 21, 2012, 10:44 PM »
Mattfc,

I plan to make a similar table for my MFT (1080) and am going to use your design. Before doing so, however, I have a few questions.

1) I assume that your table is sized for an MFT/3 (plus CMS) and not a 1080.....  Obviously, I'll need to measure my 1080 to see if the dimensions are the same.
2) Do you have any issues with way you mount the MFT to the adjustable levelers that protrude from the extruded aluminum? Have you thought of alternative ideas for more rigidly attaching the MFT to the extruded aluminum?
3) Does anyone have any suggestions on where I could buy the  Extruded aluminum? I bought T-slotted aluminum from an online company a number of years ago that provided an online shopping cart where you could order the aluminum (to exact size) and specify machining operations (with running costs in the shopping basket), etc. Unfortunately, I can't remember the company URL or can't find anyone with this service anymore.... 8020 and faztek seem to be manufacturers/distributors and/or don't offer the same type of service.

Thanks in advance.


Squasher,

I stumbled onto a trick with 8020. They don't sell direct as a rule, only thru distributors as you noted. They do, however have an eBay store, ostensibly for "surplus" but I am seeing more stock items added all the time.

The trick is to order whatever you can thru the eBay store from the inventory they have listed online. After that you contact them thru eBay and give them a list of the other materials you want (their entire catalog is available online, along with a price list you can download). They will add those items to your eBay order and issue you a combined invoice on eBay.

Hope this helps.

RMW
As of 10/17 I am out of the Dog business and pursuing other distractions. Thanks for a fun ride!

Offline mattfc

  • Posts: 553
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #35 on: January 22, 2012, 07:12 AM »
Matt,

Reading throught he thread.  Very impressive. 

I like what you have done with those profiles.  I did have one question though... Where is the 45x90 profile located in the sysport w CMS and MFT?  I see you call out 3 pieces and I dont see where they are in the drawing.  They are essentially 2 of the same profile togehter??

Thanks,

Mike
They are in the middle as uprights, provides 2 slots for the drawer runners to fit back to back

Offline Mr Handyman

  • Posts: 12
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #36 on: January 23, 2012, 03:37 AM »
Mattfc,

I plan to make a similar table for my MFT (1080) and am going to use your design. Before doing so, however, I have a few questions.

1) I assume that your table is sized for an MFT/3 (plus CMS) and not a 1080.....  Obviously, I'll need to measure my 1080 to see if the dimensions are the same.


The MFT 1080 is both wider and longer than the MFT/3, but lower.

Very nice job Mattfc! The stuff looks great.

Offline mattfc

  • Posts: 553
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #37 on: January 23, 2012, 07:51 AM »
Mattfc,

I plan to make a similar table for my MFT (1080) and am going to use your design. Before doing so, however, I have a few questions.

1) I assume that your table is sized for an MFT/3 (plus CMS) and not a 1080.....  Obviously, I'll need to measure my 1080 to see if the dimensions are the same.
2) Do you have any issues with way you mount the MFT to the adjustable levelers that protrude from the extruded aluminum? Have you thought of alternative ideas for more rigidly attaching the MFT to the extruded aluminum?
3) Does anyone have any suggestions on where I could buy the  Extruded aluminum? I bought T-slotted aluminum from an online company a number of years ago that provided an online shopping cart where you could order the aluminum (to exact size) and specify machining operations (with running costs in the shopping basket), etc. Unfortunately, I can't remember the company URL or can't find anyone with this service anymore.... 8020 and faztek seem to be manufacturers/distributors and/or don't offer the same type of service.

Thanks in advance.


Yes it's an MFT3. With regards to mounting, the uprights do protrude into the corner casting stopping lateral movement as its a very snug fit, that tight fit along with gravit holds it down fine on the levelling bolts

Offline mattfc

  • Posts: 553
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #38 on: January 23, 2012, 07:55 AM »
Matt,

Was looking for some ideas on a router table with an incra ls positioner and fence and came across your design.  Fantastic!  Can you please tell me where you got the pivots for the incra or how you made them

"so it lifts clear of the table, in case I want to use a template bit and want a free surface.. "

I need to do the same thing with mine.

Thanks!

James

This is the link to the hinges
http://www.aluminium-profile.co.uk/acatalog/Aluminium_Profile_Joints.html

It's a UK company, think you have 8020 in the US who must do similar, else Bosch Rexwroth how make most the stuff KJN sell

Offline richard.selwyn

  • Posts: 631
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #39 on: February 05, 2012, 06:40 AM »
Check out the blue tooth drill from Bosch in the link below. It records how many screws you've driven etc. scary.

Richard

Matt,

Was looking for some ideas on a router table with an incra ls positioner and fence and came across your design.  Fantastic!  Can you please tell me where you got the pivots for the incra or how you made them

"so it lifts clear of the table, in case I want to use a template bit and want a free surface.. "

I need to do the same thing with mine.

Thanks!

James

This is the link to the hinges
http://www.aluminium-profile.co.uk/acatalog/Aluminium_Profile_Joints.html

It's a UK company, think you have 8020 in the US who must do similar, else Bosch Rexwroth how make most the stuff KJN sell

Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7651
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #40 on: February 05, 2012, 09:12 AM »
Check out the blue tooth drill from Bosch in the link below. It records how many screws you've driven etc. scary.

Richard

Matt,

Was looking for some ideas on a router table with an incra ls positioner and fence and came across your design.  Fantastic!  Can you please tell me where you got the pivots for the incra or how you made them

"so it lifts clear of the table, in case I want to use a template bit and want a free surface.. "

I need to do the same thing with mine.

Thanks!

James

This is the link to the hinges
http://www.aluminium-profile.co.uk/acatalog/Aluminium_Profile_Joints.html

It's a UK company, think you have 8020 in the US who must do similar, else Bosch Rexwroth how make most the stuff KJN sell

Let's hope some doesn't decide to try and put a cellular phone in a jig saw - that could be messy  [eek]

Offline rookie08

  • Posts: 198
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #41 on: February 05, 2012, 11:55 AM »
Thanks Matt!

I'll do a search to see if I can find a local based company/dealer to source the from

Cheers,

James

Offline Manish11122

  • Posts: 1
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #42 on: February 26, 2012, 01:15 PM »
Hi,

wow what a great job I am so impressed thank you for your post.

I have been looking for a solution for my small shop for a while to combine my Incra wonder fence with MFT and possible the Kapex 

Kindly could you email me your Visio diagrams with layout and measurements or materiel list? for this and any other that may help in a small shop.

I know Visio better than sketchup

thx again

Manish

manish11122@yahoo.com

Offline tonycartercraig

  • Posts: 6
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #43 on: February 26, 2012, 02:03 PM »
A few questions about your project.

I'm planning a similar type build for my shop cabinets.  I think the use of the aluminum extrusion in strategic locations will allow for the use of clamps, featherboards etc. whether it be on the face of a cabinet or topside. In comparing the t-slot in some of the products on the market, i.e. Kreg's track systems and the Incra track systems, with the track in the aluminum extrusions it appears that the accessories would be interchangeable.

My question for you is do you use your slots for different attachments?

Next question. You say that is a 45mm x 45mm profile. In the pictures that appears to be larger than 1.7" square aluminum tubing. If it is only 1.7" square, is it enough strength for the spans that you are doing or is there some reinforcements being made that aren't in the pictures?

Also, I would like to see some more pics on your drawer slides and points of attachment for them. Where did you source the slides?

Your project pictures are a great inspiration for me. Thanks for posting them in such detail.

One other note, ALUMINUM IS EXPENSIVE.

Offline SRSemenza

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Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #44 on: February 26, 2012, 05:10 PM »
Hi Tony & Manish,

Welcome to the FOG!  [smile]

Good luck with your projects.  Lots of great homebuilt things on here. Please post build threads so we can all enjoy.


Seth

Offline mattfc

  • Posts: 553
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #45 on: February 28, 2012, 04:42 AM »
Hi,

wow what a great job I am so impressed thank you for your post.

I have been looking for a solution for my small shop for a while to combine my Incra wonder fence with MFT and possible the Kapex 

Kindly could you email me your Visio diagrams with layout and measurements or materiel list? for this and any other that may help in a small shop.

I know Visio better than sketchup

thx again

Manish

manish11122@yahoo.com


Have sent you your e-mail, sorry for the delay, forgot to check this thread

Offline mattfc

  • Posts: 553
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #46 on: February 28, 2012, 05:14 AM »
A few questions about your project.

I'm planning a similar type build for my shop cabinets.  I think the use of the aluminum extrusion in strategic locations will allow for the use of clamps, featherboards etc. whether it be on the face of a cabinet or topside. In comparing the t-slot in some of the products on the market, i.e. Kreg's track systems and the Incra track systems, with the track in the aluminum extrusions it appears that the accessories would be interchangeable.

My question for you is do you use your slots for different attachments?

Next question. You say that is a 45mm x 45mm profile. In the pictures that appears to be larger than 1.7" square aluminum tubing. If it is only 1.7" square, is it enough strength for the spans that you are doing or is there some reinforcements being made that aren't in the pictures?

Also, I would like to see some more pics on your drawer slides and points of attachment for them. Where did you source the slides?

Your project pictures are a great inspiration for me. Thanks for posting them in such detail.

One other note, ALUMINUM IS EXPENSIVE.

Re using the slots, I do use them for a long fence on the KAPEX workstation (I have some profile bolter on the top inline with the KAPEX Fence), and I have used the T-Bolts for this, they make it easy to clamp any jig in place, since you just drop them into the profile and twist by 90 degrees to lock in place. The 45x45 slot also allows for the Festool clamps to slide in place if required, providing you leave the end of the profile exposed to slide the clamp in.

The 45x45 is 1.7", but very strong (modulus of elasticity is about 7 times that of oak for example). There is no additional re-enforcing, apart from it being bolted into the square grid that you see which helps stiffen it, that said even on a 2 m section if you stood in the middle you would be hard pushed to deflect it by more than a mm or 2. For the heaviest item I have, the KAPEX workstation with all the drawers full you can see that the base profile is a 90mm x 45mm section which all the weight bears down on, that profile could support a heavy car no problem.. this stuff is very strong, the weakest points will be the connections.

Re the drawer slides, they are just standard fully extening drawer slides (these ones to be exact http://www.ironmongerydirect.co.uk/Products/Cabinet_Furniture_and_Hardware/Runners_and_Cabinet_Systems/1524/Ball_Race_Drawer_Runners_Double_Extension). They are fixed by drilling through the sides at the front and back of the slide with a spacing to match the centre of the slots in the profile, then I just pop a bolt through the whole and into a t-nut which sits inside the profile
T-Nuts


Offline tonycartercraig

  • Posts: 6
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #47 on: February 29, 2012, 03:31 PM »
One other question. What are your thoughts on having the crown stop with base extensions included on the Kapex and allowing the space for the complete assembly to fit into your Kapex workstation? I noticed that your workstation just allows for the saw without any additional width.

Offline mattfc

  • Posts: 553
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #48 on: March 01, 2012, 06:45 AM »
One other question. What are your thoughts on having the crown stop with base extensions included on the Kapex and allowing the space for the complete assembly to fit into your Kapex workstation? I noticed that your workstation just allows for the saw without any additional width.

Would be easy enough to design it as such, I didn't as I wanted to build my own fence, as I intend to add a digital read-out

Offline Coxworth

  • Posts: 1
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #49 on: March 03, 2012, 12:07 AM »
Hey Matt!
This is exactly what I was looking for and the amount of detail you provide is awesome.
I am planning out my workshop for my new home and will Try to replicate something similar here.

The only thing I could not figure out is how you connected your corners. You mention that you drilled and used hex bolts.

This makes sense for 2 pieces joined at a 90 but how to attach the third piece without running into the previous bolt?

You can by 3 sided connectors for this profile but that drives up the cost!

Also, you said all of the bolts were self tapping. Does this mean that you did not need to tap anything? Even the leveling screws?

Thanks for your help, and your great design!

Offline mattfc

  • Posts: 553
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #50 on: March 03, 2012, 03:12 AM »
Hey Matt!
This is exactly what I was looking for and the amount of detail you provide is awesome.
I am planning out my workshop for my new home and will Try to replicate something similar here.

The only thing I could not figure out is how you connected your corners. You mention that you drilled and used hex bolts.

This makes sense for 2 pieces joined at a 90 but how to attach the third piece without running into the previous bolt?

You can by 3 sided connectors for this profile but that drives up the cost!

Also, you said all of the bolts were self tapping. Does this mean that you did not need to tap anything? Even the leveling screws?

Thanks for your help, and your great design!

re the 3 pieces connecting in a corner, you can do this fine since the bolt head sit in the outside channel/slot (e.g. the core bolt only extends about 5mm from the end of the profile you tap the bolt into and then you slide it into the slot of the other profile) and doesn't go right through profile, you have to drill 2 holes that go right the way through though. Make sense? If not I can post a picture

The core bolts are all self tapping, they only tap into the end section of the profile though

Offline Richard/RMW

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Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #51 on: March 03, 2012, 09:42 AM »
Coxworth,

This may help to clarify. This graphic shows the position of the hex screw itself, the access hole is drilled through the t-slot in the top extrusion, directly above the centerline of the extrusion you are attaching to. Then you can reach a hex key through the access hole to tighten the hex screw. I am not sure if I am explaining this clearly but basically the hex screw does not pass through the drilled hole, only the hex key does to tighten it.

48422-0

This is one of the cheapest hardware options for connecting these extrusions and it is easy to do yourself in the shop.

RMW
As of 10/17 I am out of the Dog business and pursuing other distractions. Thanks for a fun ride!

Offline Kodi Crescent

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Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #52 on: March 19, 2012, 03:01 PM »
For anyone planning a bench like this...

I tried configuring one of these using 8020 profiles from eBay.  I have a relatively unsophisticated shop with just a MFT, no drill press, no chop saw.

You need to have a way to get good square cuts on the profiles, and a way to drill nice straight holes.  The 8020 folks on eBay will NOT do this for you, even for a charge.

Finding the connectors was really a pain.  There is a $2 or so per connector option on eBay, but again, you have to be able to machine a 10mm hole through the profile with some precision.

The cost of building one of these using the cheapest 8020 profiles and connectors I could find was $320 + shipping, + cutting, + drilling.  This is for the bench only, and does not include the drawer slides.  Again, this was the cheapest I could get this to.
By the time I was done building this I could have bought a new MFT/3. 

I decided to attempt to replicate this in wood.  So far I'm only $100 into it, and I think that will provide enough material for the build.  All the joints will be Dominos.  I'll provide details as I complete it.

Thanks to MattFC for the design and dimensions.

Offline Richard/RMW

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Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #53 on: March 19, 2012, 06:14 PM »
You are absolutely right that using their stuff has a learning curve and it probably is not worth it for a one-off use. I think 8020 only sells through distributors (other than what you can get on eBay) and in my case there are 3 or 4 distributors who service my area. I have not tried to buy direct from them because I can cut/drill myself. What I learned is that I can buy some of their stuff on eBay and then send them a list of anything they don't offer on eBay and they will add it to the order.

There is another company selling similar stuff (less complete product line) called Faztec, I believe they will cut to length, drill etc. for one-off projects. You just send them a sketch. Still costly.

RMW
As of 10/17 I am out of the Dog business and pursuing other distractions. Thanks for a fun ride!

Offline nsc

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Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #54 on: March 19, 2012, 09:18 PM »
anyone know where you can get that kind off aluminium in the US?

Offline Corwin

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Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #55 on: March 19, 2012, 10:11 PM »
anyone know where you can get that kind off aluminium in the US?

http://www.8020.net/PostalLookup.asp
Looks like your rabbit joint is a hare off! ;)

Offline Kodi Crescent

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Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #56 on: March 20, 2012, 07:29 AM »
You are absolutely right that using their stuff has a learning curve and it probably is not worth it for a one-off use. I think 8020 only sells through distributors (other than what you can get on eBay) and in my case there are 3 or 4 distributors who service my area. I have not tried to buy direct from them because I can cut/drill myself. What I learned is that I can buy some of their stuff on eBay and then send them a list of anything they don't offer on eBay and they will add it to the order.

There is another company selling similar stuff (less complete product line) called Faztec, I believe they will cut to length, drill etc. for one-off projects. You just send them a sketch. Still costly.

RMW

That may be the case.  If you are not using those end tap connectors, then the cost really goes up for these.  I wanted to use the drill through bolt connectors because I could position a profile anywhere perpendicular to another profile without having to drill into the second profile.  These allow adjustability.

I finally got 8020 to commit to cut to length for about $2 per cut.  They would not drill the holes though.  They said it was an easy job, but that the eBay side of things only deals with getting rid of surplus.  I'd have to contact a local distributor.  The "local" distributor was 3 or 4 hours away.  It was just too much hassle and too expensive for a home hobbyist to be worth it.

I figure that making it out of wood would be a better opportunity to learn woodworking, using the Domino, and be a heck of a lot cheaper to boot.

Offline Michael_Swe

  • Posts: 362
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #57 on: January 11, 2013, 10:59 AM »
Hi.
I'm on the fence to build some work benches out of 45x45 Rexroth profiles. The 45x45 profiles has a 10 mm groove.

But I just noticed that the Festool clamps and other common wood working accessories uses 8 mm grooves. That means that the Festool clamps probably are to small for the 100 mm groove. I think they would fall out.

Matt, have you tried the clamps in the groove? Or have you fond any other clamps that fit in the 10 mm grove?

Thank you for your thorough post on this. It made me change my mind from welding the frames. The extrusions will be a heck of a lot easier to build with.

//Michael

Offline mattfc

  • Posts: 553
Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #58 on: January 11, 2013, 11:10 AM »
I do use festool clamps in the grooves, its not a tight fit (you can probably move the clamps about 30degrees side to side, but does work ok)

If in doubt, just get a sample of the profile sent through, most have offcuts knocking about.

Offline Michael_Swe

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Re: SysPort workbench (MFT & CMS) + CMS based Router Table
« Reply #59 on: January 11, 2013, 11:13 AM »
Thanks.
Can you even get the clamp into a closed groove if you tilt it? My thought was to mill some at the start of each groove to widen it. But that might not be needed, or?