Author Topic: One for the Aussies...  (Read 155556 times)

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Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7407
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #870 on: December 29, 2016, 12:09 AM »
@Holmz as soon as I settle and get sorted in a new place a DD40 is on the shopping list .. and you know for sure that's a Euro buy!!

( I really wish there was one model with a gearbox instead of two [mad] )


Offline Pykie

  • Posts: 33
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #871 on: December 29, 2016, 12:32 AM »
Over half of my Festool arsenal is sourced from the UK and Italy, bought a bunch when the dollar was strong a couple of years ago. Was about a 50% saving.

I've just picked up a Hl-850 with the angle stop and bench unit for about $650 Aus out of the U.K.

I'm yet to encounter a warranty issue with any Festool kit I've bought so I'm fairly confident in doing it.

Offline Grakat

  • Posts: 181
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #872 on: December 29, 2016, 07:05 PM »
@Untidy Shop

The last time I read the determination for the price fixing deal there were levels of monitoring for prices across certain tools and pricing had to be reviewed by the ACCC prior to implementation.

Doesn't mean its been followed though, as TTTS do not appear to have held up their end of the bargain.
Regards
Graham

Festool ETS150/3, TS55, CT26, DF500+ Domino set, PS300, HKC55

Offline Untidy Shop

  • Posts: 2351
Re: One for the Aussies...ACCC Determination
« Reply #873 on: December 29, 2016, 07:36 PM »
@Untidy Shop

The last time I read the determination for the price fixing deal there were levels of monitoring for prices across certain tools and pricing had to be reviewed by the ACCC prior to implementation.

Doesn't mean its been followed though, as TTTS do not appear to have held up their end of the bargain.


Hi @Grakat

Whilst the ACCC Determination Document of 38 pages is at times clouded in legal speak, the actual Determination Clause on page 33 states -

Conduct for which the ACCC grants authorisation
162. The ACCC grants conditional authorisation A91433 to Tooltechnic to amend its agreements with its Festool dealers to include a requirement for resellers to not sell any Festool product below a price(s) nominated by Tooltechnic, until
31 December 2018.


The key words with regard to annual price rises are
 '. . . . below a price(s) nominated by Tooltechnic . . .'


As you know, I certainly share your frustration!  [eek]

Stephen
« Last Edit: December 29, 2016, 08:03 PM by Untidy Shop »
If you don't like Signatures, just go to Look and Layout and tick No Signatures.

“The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test. If the machine produces tranquility it's right. If it disturbs you it's wrong until either the machine or your mind is changed.”
― Robert M. Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values

Offline Holmz

  • Posts: 3101
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #874 on: December 29, 2016, 08:13 PM »
@Holmz as soon as I settle and get sorted in a new place a DD40 is on the shopping list .. and you know for sure that's a Euro buy!!
...

Sell your LR32 stuff and you can get one of them.
I ain't no mathematician but i have some negative and positive screwdrivers
I ain't no pilot but i have some planes.
I ain't no sucker but i have a vacuum.
And I has me some saws, and some sandpapers.

Offline Pykie

  • Posts: 33
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #875 on: December 29, 2016, 10:38 PM »
@Holmz as soon as I settle and get sorted in a new place a DD40 is on the shopping list .. and you know for sure that's a Euro buy!!

( I really wish there was one model with a gearbox instead of two [mad] )

I'm a builder and hobby joiner.

What advantages applications are there for the DD40 over a domino?

Offline Holmz

  • Posts: 3101
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #876 on: December 30, 2016, 12:49 AM »
@Holmz as soon as I settle and get sorted in a new place a DD40 is on the shopping list .. and you know for sure that's a Euro buy!!

( I really wish there was one model with a gearbox instead of two [mad] )

I'm a builder and hobby joiner.

What advantages applications are there for the DD40 over a domino?

If you did a lot of 32-mm holes then the DD40 does those, as well as dowels.
For big work the DD40 and the 700 domino overlap a lot.

Thin dominos probably work better for thin wood than dowels.
But for sheets the lamello ClampeX or Tenso are ideal... Or maybe biscuits.

I am not sure there is an overall "right answer", as a proper mortise and tenon are the strongest. But an LR-32, router, and domino are probably more $, € or £ than a DD40 and castleated rail.
I ain't no mathematician but i have some negative and positive screwdrivers
I ain't no pilot but i have some planes.
I ain't no sucker but i have a vacuum.
And I has me some saws, and some sandpapers.

Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7407
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #877 on: December 30, 2016, 03:59 AM »
@Holmz as soon as I settle and get sorted in a new place a DD40 is on the shopping list .. and you know for sure that's a Euro buy!!

( I really wish there was one model with a gearbox instead of two [mad] )

I'm a builder and hobby joiner.

What advantages applications are there for the DD40 over a domino?

The DD40 would make shelf pins a doddle ... just another toy to play with otherwise.

Offline Untidy Shop

  • Posts: 2351
Re: One for the Aussies... price rises.
« Reply #878 on: January 01, 2017, 10:10 PM »
Well the Festool Jan 1 price rises are now known. For example  now -

Kapex 120 - A$1945.00
Domino 500 - A$1550.00
Domino 700 - A$2150.00
TS55R - A$950.00
HK55 with FSK420 - A$835.00
ROTEX 150 - A$965.00

More on Festool Aust. Website.

Overall increases are 'moderate to high''; for example the HK55/FSK420 deal was A$810.00. That's roughly an 8% increase. So the yearly creep in prices continues, and within a market in which many other brands have decreased their prices through competition.
« Last Edit: January 01, 2017, 10:52 PM by Untidy Shop »
If you don't like Signatures, just go to Look and Layout and tick No Signatures.

“The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test. If the machine produces tranquility it's right. If it disturbs you it's wrong until either the machine or your mind is changed.”
― Robert M. Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values

Offline Rollin22Petes

  • Posts: 125
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #879 on: January 01, 2017, 10:47 PM »
Although we still have a couple months here in the US before our annual price increase. In my opinion these once a year increases are getting out of control regardless of any economic factors Festool goes up. Seems to me if you want to attract new customers this is not the way to did it. I like most of my Festool gear but some of it is not that much better than some other brands that sell at a fraction of the cost.

Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7407
Re: One for the Aussies... price rises.
« Reply #880 on: January 02, 2017, 01:37 AM »
Well the Festool Jan 1 price rises are now known. For example  now -

Kapex 120 - A$1945.00
Domino 500 - A$1550.00
Domino 700 - A$2150.00
TS55R - A$950.00
HK55 with FSK420 - A$835.00
ROTEX 150 - A$965.00

More on Festool Aust. Website.

Overall increases are 'moderate to high''; for example the HK55/FSK420 deal was A$810.00. That's roughly an 8% increase. So the yearly creep in prices continues, and within a market in which many other brands have decreased their prices through competition.

@Untidy Shop

Tooltechnic are driving Australians to source their gear from overseas ... Tools from Europe and accessories from the US will probably be much more common. Shipping consolidation services make a lot of sense and will only become more popular.

Offline Grakat

  • Posts: 181
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #881 on: January 02, 2017, 02:41 AM »
@Kev @Untidy Shop

Yes I saw those prices. RO150 went from $999 to $1049, and the C18 basic went from $399 to $410

There is only one way to reverse this trend. Don't buy the tools from TTS. :-\
Regards
Graham

Festool ETS150/3, TS55, CT26, DF500+ Domino set, PS300, HKC55

Offline Untidy Shop

  • Posts: 2351
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #882 on: January 02, 2017, 03:01 AM »
Re RO150 @Grakat , you are right re new price. I had quoted the cardboard box delivery, rather than the model with Systainer.

In December 2014, a dealer discounted RO150 with Systainer was A$890. Now it is $1049. That's a A$159 increase in two years!

http://festoolownersgroup.com/ask-festool/a-question-on-price-increases-and-newer-models/msg358733/#msg358733

@Kev
If you don't like Signatures, just go to Look and Layout and tick No Signatures.

“The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test. If the machine produces tranquility it's right. If it disturbs you it's wrong until either the machine or your mind is changed.”
― Robert M. Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values

Offline Grakat

  • Posts: 181
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #883 on: January 02, 2017, 05:37 AM »
@Untidy Shop

And that's taking into account the superior service we are supposed to be receiving as part of the anti competitive behaviour deal.

Do we need to remind these guys of the Marshall Plan?
Regards
Graham

Festool ETS150/3, TS55, CT26, DF500+ Domino set, PS300, HKC55

Offline DB10

  • Posts: 783
Re: One for the Aussies... price rises.
« Reply #884 on: January 02, 2017, 07:00 AM »
Well the Festool Jan 1 price rises are now known. For example  now -

Kapex 120 - A$1945.00
Domino 500 - A$1550.00
Domino 700 - A$2150.00
TS55R - A$950.00
HK55 with FSK420 - A$835.00
ROTEX 150 - A$965.00

More on Festool Aust. Website.

Overall increases are 'moderate to high''; for example the HK55/FSK420 deal was A$810.00. That's roughly an 8% increase. So the yearly creep in prices continues, and within a market in which many other brands have decreased their prices through competition.
@Untidy Shop  You are right, as a matter of interest I was checking the prices on some of my Metabo 2015 tool purchases and comparing them to the current 2017 prices. In 2015 I paid $489 for my KGS 216 LTX cordless mitre saw (skin) today the same saw can be bought for $299. That's a massive drop in price. The same story with some of my Milwaukee purchases which have also seen prices go down.
Festool in Australia are doing a great job of pricing themselves out of the market.

Offline Untidy Shop

  • Posts: 2351
Re: One for the Aussies... New Releases!
« Reply #885 on: January 03, 2017, 06:11 AM »
Well with the Down Under price rises  on Jan 1; today, Jan 3, there were some new tools released.

KS 60
RTS400
DTS400 and ETS 125 new models
ETS-EC 125/3

And this time some, such as the KS60, before NA.  [big grin]

Details - http://www.festool.com.au
« Last Edit: January 03, 2017, 06:20 AM by Untidy Shop »
If you don't like Signatures, just go to Look and Layout and tick No Signatures.

“The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test. If the machine produces tranquility it's right. If it disturbs you it's wrong until either the machine or your mind is changed.”
― Robert M. Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values

Offline Pykie

  • Posts: 33
Re: One for the Aussies... New Releases!
« Reply #886 on: January 03, 2017, 05:24 PM »
Well with the Down Under price rises  on Jan 1; today, Jan 3, there were some new tools released.

KS 60
RTS400
DTS400 and ETS 125 new models
ETS-EC 125/3

And this time some, such as the KS60, before NA.  [big grin]

Details - http://www.festool.com.au

I'm pretty interested in the KS 60, bit ill wait for some reviews.

I'd use it purely as my saw for fixes, I've currently got the Bosch X glide 12", but it is huge to be lugging around for everything.

KS 60 appeals to me given it's likely precision and dust extraction for stuff like MDF.

It's price point isn't to bad either. Even the decent smaller drop saws from Makita etc are around $700, most good SCMS are around $1000.

Offline Grakat

  • Posts: 181
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #887 on: January 04, 2017, 02:36 AM »
@Kev

Are you currently using a consolidated shipping service? I have a few more Festool purchases to make, but TTS are giving me the you know whats. Looking at options.........
Regards
Graham

Festool ETS150/3, TS55, CT26, DF500+ Domino set, PS300, HKC55

Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7407
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #888 on: January 04, 2017, 03:35 AM »
@Kev

Are you currently using a consolidated shipping service? I have a few more Festool purchases to make, but TTS are giving me the you know whats. Looking at options.........

@Grakat

I've used shipito.com for US purchases, but haven't tried one for Europe.

Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7407
Re: One for the Aussies... New Releases!
« Reply #889 on: January 04, 2017, 05:36 AM »
Well with the Down Under price rises  on Jan 1; today, Jan 3, there were some new tools released.

KS 60
RTS400
DTS400 and ETS 125 new models
ETS-EC 125/3

And this time some, such as the KS60, before NA.  [big grin]

Details - http://www.festool.com.au

I'm pretty interested in the KS 60, bit ill wait for some reviews.

I'd use it purely as my saw for fixes, I've currently got the Bosch X glide 12", but it is huge to be lugging around for everything.

KS 60 appeals to me given it's likely precision and dust extraction for stuff like MDF.

It's price point isn't to bad either. Even the decent smaller drop saws from Makita etc are around $700, most good SCMS are around $1000.

@Pykie

The "set" version goes $1,350 and add $899 for the stand and you're looking at $2,249 ... the price for the blades is massively OTT.

Amusing that they've smashed the price on the Vecturo ... I'm guessing they haven't been flying out the door!

Offline Grakat

  • Posts: 181
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #890 on: January 04, 2017, 04:14 PM »
Hi there

I also agree about the KS60. I think it would be very useful, but I would like to let it get established for a bit first, particularly since every second person seems to have motor issues with the larger Kapex saws.

It would definitely be more compact than my Makita LS1013, which weighs a ton esp with the stand base fitted to it.
Regards
Graham

Festool ETS150/3, TS55, CT26, DF500+ Domino set, PS300, HKC55

Offline Untidy Shop

  • Posts: 2351
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #891 on: January 05, 2017, 12:58 AM »
Well we have had the price rise, now comes the promotion. We had no promotion catalogue in the last 1/4 of 2016, but the Jan - March, 2017 has been released.

The Catalogue celebrates the release of the KS60 with a promotion price on saw/stand  combination. And there are considerable sander 'discounts' particularly on the ETS150/3/5s with discounts of A$139 which nearly brings them back to the price I paid over ten years ago!  [eek]

The three main router models are also discounted, in this case by A$100 each., and yes @Kev  with discounts over A$300 on the Vecturo range, there is room for sales speculation. Fein anyone ; or even a Blue Boch, DeWalt or AEG!

But it is great to to see some real discounting at last;
no matter what the reason.  [thumbs up] [thumbs up]

http://www.festool.com.au/WebRoot/Store/Shops/tooltechnic/MediaGallery/files/campaigns/Festool_Jan-Mar_17_Campaign_Spreads_low.pdf
« Last Edit: January 05, 2017, 12:48 PM by Untidy Shop »
If you don't like Signatures, just go to Look and Layout and tick No Signatures.

“The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test. If the machine produces tranquility it's right. If it disturbs you it's wrong until either the machine or your mind is changed.”
― Robert M. Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values

Offline Grakat

  • Posts: 181
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #892 on: January 05, 2017, 03:29 AM »
Yes it's an interesting promotion. The Routers and the ETS sanders are the stand outs for this one. I have the ETS150/3 sander, would consider the 5mm but was going to cover that off with the Rotex.

I have a cheap Ryobi multi tool, which can't cut custard. Is the Festool Vecturo any better? Can anyone shed any insight?

All going well, will pick up the OF1400 this time around. Decisions decisions :-\
Regards
Graham

Festool ETS150/3, TS55, CT26, DF500+ Domino set, PS300, HKC55

Offline bryan1982

  • Posts: 114
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #893 on: January 05, 2017, 06:41 AM »
What i found interesting between the ks60 and ks120
Was is the weight.

Ks120 weight  about 21kg and the trolley is about 10kg
Ks60 weight about 17.8 and the trolley with adapter is about 13kg

So the foot print of the new saw is only smaller if you dont put it on the stand
And they weight basically the same.


Mmmmm....

Cheers

Bryan

Offline DB10

  • Posts: 783
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #894 on: January 05, 2017, 07:16 AM »
[quote author=Grakat link=topic=32415.msg491374#msg491374

I have a cheap Ryobi multi tool, which can't cut custard. Is the Festool Vecturo any better? Can anyone shed any insight?

All going well, will pick up the OF1400 this time around. Decisions decisions :-\
[/quote]

Should be better as it costs 10x what the Ryobi costs, personally Fein Super cut or Multmaster are much better value for money when it comes to multitools IMO.

Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7407
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #895 on: January 05, 2017, 10:50 AM »
Yes it's an interesting promotion. The Routers and the ETS sanders are the stand outs for this one. I have the ETS150/3 sander, would consider the 5mm but was going to cover that off with the Rotex.

I have a cheap Ryobi multi tool, which can't cut custard. Is the Festool Vecturo any better? Can anyone shed any insight?

All going well, will pick up the OF1400 this time around. Decisions decisions :-\

I've got a Vecturo and Fein (plus a Dremel, but the less said about that the better). I literally fell into a cordless Dewalt multi and the stupid yellow thing has become my "go to" multi. I won it on Ebay when hunting for 2x 2AH batteries and it was huge surprise to me how good it was ... it doesn't have the "Euro finish", but the ergonomics are good and is smooth and quite gutsy.


Offline Pykie

  • Posts: 33
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #896 on: January 05, 2017, 08:22 PM »
What i found interesting between the ks60 and ks120
Was is the weight.

Ks120 weight  about 21kg and the trolley is about 10kg
Ks60 weight about 17.8 and the trolley with adapter is about 13kg

So the foot print of the new saw is only smaller if you dont put it on the stand
And they weight basically the same.

I don't think I'll get the stand, takes up too much room when it's constantly attached.

The Bosch GCM 12 is 33kg's.


« Last Edit: January 05, 2017, 08:24 PM by Pykie »

Online eddomak

  • Posts: 199
Clear out sale in Roseberry NSW.
« Reply #897 on: January 15, 2017, 10:05 PM »
Hi All,

I saw an ad in Gumtree, and followed up a little...

Looks like Vijays Power Tools (897 Botany Rd, Rosebery NSW) is clearing out Festool. The Gumtree ad says they will not entertain queries over the phone, but I gave them a call anyway and he was happy to tell me if he had a specific item in store. He wouldn't disclose any prices over the phone but said it was better than RRP.

They aren't open on weekends, and close at 4:30pm so it pretty much rules out any chance I have of getting down to have a look.

If you're in the area you might want to check it out. If you're going to check it out and willing to do me a favour, then could you get me the prices on the right angle attachment for the PDC Drill (Product Number 769097)? And maybe any quick clamps?

Thanks


Offline Untidy Shop

  • Posts: 2351
Re: Clear out sale in Roseberry NSW.
« Reply #898 on: January 16, 2017, 08:19 AM »
Hi All,

I saw an ad in Gumtree, and followed up a little...

Looks like Vijays Power Tools (897 Botany Rd, Rosebery NSW) is clearing out Festool. The Gumtree ad says they will not entertain queries over the phone, but I gave them a call anyway and he was happy to tell me if he had a specific item in store. He wouldn't disclose any prices over the phone but said it was better than RRP . . . . . . . . . . . .

'Tooltechnic is also likely to face pressure from its dealers if it sets the minimum resale price too high, because dealers will not be able to sell the product at that price. Although dealers will be guaranteed a margin on the product, it is unlikely to be attractive if the dealers are unable to sell the product. Market inquiries indicate that dealers stock a wide range of brands, of which Tooltechnic is one of the smaller suppliers whose brands are less commonly stocked, indicating that dealers have bargaining power to determine whether to stock Festool products. Market inquiries also suggest that dealers often prefer stocking mass market power tool brands such as Makita to stocking higher-priced, low volume brands. Should Tooltechnic raise the prices of Festool products to an extent which causes significant customer switching, dealers are likely to become more reluctant to stock Festool products.'

Australian Competition and Consumer Commission
 Paragraph 92, Page 15, Determination Application for authorisation A91433 lodged by Tooltechnic Systems (Aust) Pty Ltd in respect of resale price maintenance
Date: 5 December 2014 Authorisation number: A91433


Read the paragraph above and like me then wonder what might be behind this dealers decision to stop selling Festool. Could it be the January 1 price rises?!  [eek]
« Last Edit: January 16, 2017, 08:27 AM by Untidy Shop »
If you don't like Signatures, just go to Look and Layout and tick No Signatures.

“The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test. If the machine produces tranquility it's right. If it disturbs you it's wrong until either the machine or your mind is changed.”
― Robert M. Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values

Offline DB10

  • Posts: 783
Re: One for the Aussies...
« Reply #899 on: January 16, 2017, 08:50 AM »
Well we have had the price rise, now comes the promotion. We had no promotion catalogue in the last 1/4 of 2016, but the Jan - March, 2017 has been released.

The Catalogue celebrates the release of the KS60 with a promotion price on saw/stand  combination. And there are considerable sander 'discounts' particularly on the ETS150/3/5s with discounts of A$139 which nearly brings them back to the price I paid over ten years ago!  [eek]

The three main router models are also discounted, in this case by A$100 each., and yes @Kev  with discounts over A$300 on the Vecturo range, there is room for sales speculation. Fein anyone ; or even a Blue Boch, DeWalt or AEG!

But it is great to to see some real discounting at last;
no matter what the reason.  [thumbs up] [thumbs up]

http://www.festool.com.au/WebRoot/Store/Shops/tooltechnic/MediaGallery/files/campaigns/Festool_Jan-Mar_17_Campaign_Spreads_low.pdf

 $300 Is a massive drop in price on the over priced  Vecturo, but I can't help thinking that this new price will just encourage people who purchased one before Christmas to return it under the 30 day rule and re purchase it again at the new price. At least at the current price the Vecturo is now more competitive with Fein.