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Author Topic: Domino XL fail  (Read 3625 times)

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Offline Edward A Reno III

  • Posts: 2951
Domino XL fail
« on: March 26, 2017, 02:40 PM »
Got the Domino XL  this week, and today I pulled it out to start using it, and on the second plunge something went pop.  It's connected with the mortise width setting, because now the lever just swings back and forth and will not engage.  And when I run the motor, there's a distinct knocking sound.

Since I just got it, I will just exchange it for a new unit, but I'm wondering if this has happened to anyone?  I had set the width while the motor was running to the narrow mortise, as per Festool recommendations, but it seems like the lever didn't fully engage the clutch mechanism even when fully turned, or there was a problem with that mechanism to begin with.

Not cool, though I suppose better to happen right out of the box, than some time down the road when I'm in the middle of a project.
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/420 FSK rail • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • DX 93 • HL 850 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

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Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1652
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2017, 03:09 PM »
Actually the only caution both the Manual and Supplemental Manual give for the 700 (that I could find) was to not change the width "during a plunging operation" and the possible damage is to the cutter if you did that. I couldn't find any caution on not changing it while the tool is off nor while it is on, just during the plunging operation.
Randy

Offline Edward A Reno III

  • Posts: 2951
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2017, 03:15 PM »
Yeah -- of course not while plunging, but when the motor is running, as with a clutch system on a standard transmission car.  Anyway, the pop happened on the second plunge, after the adjustment had already been made, and after the first plunge had excavated the mortise just fine.


Actually the only caution both the Manual and Supplemental Manual give for the 700 (that I could find) was to not change the width "during a plunging operation" and the possible damage is to the cutter if you did that. I couldn't find any caution on not changing it while the tool is off nor while it is on, just during the plunging operation.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2017, 03:59 PM by Edward A Reno III »
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/420 FSK rail • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • DX 93 • HL 850 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Online Cheese

  • Posts: 2938
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2017, 03:30 PM »
Actually the manual for the DF 500 states on page 10, "Rotate the (mortise width) adjustment dial only when the motor is running."  I'd surmise this would apply to the 700 also.

Offline John Broomall

  • Posts: 40
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #4 on: March 26, 2017, 05:02 PM »
I seem to remember reading somewhere that the 500 should be changed with the motor running and the 700 with the motor off. I have been following this practice with both of them for over a year without any problems.

Offline copcarcollector

  • Posts: 1310
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #5 on: March 26, 2017, 05:25 PM »
the 500 should be changed with the motor running and the 700 with the motor off

(Mortise width setting, nothing to do with plunging action)

This is what I have been told by Festool trainers

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1652
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #6 on: March 26, 2017, 06:24 PM »
I haven't found any direction on whether to change the width with the tool running or not in either the Festool XL700 Manual or the Supplemental Manual. The 500 manual does instruct to change the width only with the tool running.
Randy

Offline Edward A Reno III

  • Posts: 2951
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #7 on: March 26, 2017, 06:36 PM »
Right, I see now on pg. 11 12 of the manual it only says don't do it during plunging, but nothing about whether to do it while running the motor.  I'd be curious, @TylerC  to get the official recommendation from Festool, given the difference with the 500 -- there's an assumption out there that it operates just like the 500, as for example, in half-inch-shy's video review (starting around 9:10):

I can't imagine my changing the mortise setting while the motor was running (and without plunging) is the cause of the break.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2017, 06:41 PM by Edward A Reno III »
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/420 FSK rail • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • DX 93 • HL 850 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Offline bkharman

  • Posts: 1863
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #8 on: March 26, 2017, 08:29 PM »
I seem to remember reading somewhere that the 500 should be changed with the motor running and the 700 with the motor off. I have been following this practice with both of them for over a year without any problems.

This is correct. Never change the setting while running on a 700. It really sucks that the two machines are so different on this setting. Could easily be confused.

Hope you get it sorted!

Cheers. Bryan.


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Offline Edward A Reno III

  • Posts: 2951
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #9 on: March 26, 2017, 08:39 PM »
Did you hear this from festool @bkharman ? I'm curious why it isn't spelled out in the manual if this is proper operation. Because I'm clearly not the only person who'sent changing the mortise width setting with the motor running.

I seem to remember reading somewhere that the 500 should be changed with the motor running and the 700 with the motor off. I have been following this practice with both of them for over a year without any problems.

This is correct. Never change the setting while running on a 700. It really sucks that the two machines are so different on this setting. Could easily be confused.

Hope you get it sorted!

Cheers. Bryan.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/420 FSK rail • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • DX 93 • HL 850 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Online Peter Halle

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Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #10 on: March 26, 2017, 08:51 PM »
For those waiting for an answer from FESTOOL this weekend, I suspect that those able to answer are in transit or recovering from The show at JLC this weekend.

I am sure an answer will come as soon as they are able.

Peter
Scraps to Smiles.  To be continued.....  Stay Tuned.

Offline bkharman

  • Posts: 1863
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2017, 09:04 PM »
Did you hear this from festool @bkharman ? I'm curious why it isn't spelled out in the manual if this is proper operation. Because I'm clearly not the only person who'sent changing the mortise width setting with the motor running.

I seem to remember reading somewhere that the 500 should be changed with the motor running and the 700 with the motor off. I have been following this practice with both of them for over a year without any problems.

This is correct. Never change the setting while running on a 700. It really sucks that the two machines are so different on this setting. Could easily be confused.

Hope you get it sorted!

Cheers. Bryan.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I just went and double checked where I heard it Edward. It was in the DF 700 supplemental manual. Page 8 has a warning on the width setting.

https://www.festoolusa.com/media/pdf/Domino_XL_DF700.pdf

Here is a screen grab of it.



Good luck!!

Cheers. Bryan.



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People, I just want to say, you know, can we all get along? Can we get along?

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1652
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2017, 10:00 PM »
@bkharmon Actually, the quote from the Manual doesn't exactly say that you shouldn't change the setting while running, but "Never rotate the dial during a plunging operation." You may be right but, if just taken literally, the directions don't say that. So the question is does it mean while plunging or merely when the tool has been turned on?
Randy

Online Cheese

  • Posts: 2938
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2017, 10:27 PM »
Just to add to this discussion, I've always adjusted the width setting on my DF 500 with the motor NOT running. It will slip into and out of the various width settings easily and smoothly. If it is reluctant to shift into a different width, I just give the bit a small turn with my fingers and it will slide easily into the width setting I've selected.

Having worked on motorcycle and car transmissions for the last 50 years, in every instance, a brass synchronizer ring was necessary for each gear to ensure that the gears would mesh at various speeds. It's just a nature of the beast.

However, I do not believe that a synchronizer has been incorporated into the gearbox of the Domino. So...to think that you can just activate the Domino at 21,000-24,000 rpm and that the gears will disengage and then reengage themselves without some sort calamitous result just doesn't make sense to me.

I may be incorrect in my assessment, however it just doesn't make sense to me given the small amount of real estate that the gear  box encompasses and the additional real estate the synchronizer needs in order to be effective.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2017, 10:35 PM by Cheese »

Offline Runhard

  • Posts: 726
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2017, 10:42 PM »
Luckily you can just return it for a new one.

Your post actually made me think that I should probably turn my DF700 on to see if it works before my warranty is up in 16 days. Well good news, it turns on but I didn't actually test it. I also just checked my OF2200 to see if it worked, it's warranty is up in 5 days. I actually hope to use these tools someday.  [embarassed]
Daniel

Offline Samo

  • Posts: 521
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2017, 11:11 PM »
Luckily you can just return it for a new one.

Your post actually made me think that I should probably turn my DF700 on to see if it works before my warranty is up in 16 days. Well good news, it turns on but I didn't actually test it. I also just checked my OF2200 to see if it worked, it's warranty is up in 5 days. I actually hope to use these tools someday.  [embarassed]

 [doh]

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1652
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2017, 11:46 PM »
Just to add to this discussion, I've always adjusted the width setting on my DF 500 with the motor NOT running. It will slip into and out of the various width settings easily and smoothly. If it is reluctant to shift into a different width, I just give the bit a small turn with my fingers and it will slide easily into the width setting I've selected.

Having worked on motorcycle and car transmissions for the last 50 years, in every instance, a brass synchronizer ring was necessary for each gear to ensure that the gears would mesh at various speeds. It's just a nature of the beast.

However, I do not believe that a synchronizer has been incorporated into the gearbox of the Domino. So...to think that you can just activate the Domino at 21,000-24,000 rpm and that the gears will disengage and then reengage themselves without some sort calamitous result just doesn't make sense to me.

I may be incorrect in my assessment, however it just doesn't make sense to me given the small amount of real estate that the gear  box encompasses and the additional real estate the synchronizer needs in order to be effective.

I don't know who is correct. However, the direction that Festool gives for the 500 is to change widths while the Domino is running. From an answer I got at a Festool class, I believe that the 700 should be changed when it is not running. Inconsistent, but  . . . I will be calling Service tomorrow to check this out since I have considered getting the 700 and already use the 500.
Randy

Offline Rick Christopherson

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Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #17 on: March 27, 2017, 07:16 AM »
The 700 doesn't matter when you change it. The 500 should be running, but as long as the dial turns without resistance, no damage will be done if not running.

Offline Edward A Reno III

  • Posts: 2951
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #18 on: April 09, 2017, 07:18 AM »
Got my replacement the other day, so all is well.  Gonna put the machine through its paces later today.
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/420 FSK rail • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • DX 93 • HL 850 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1652
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #19 on: April 09, 2017, 02:05 PM »
Guess not changing the width while running?
Randy

Offline Edward A Reno III

  • Posts: 2951
Re: Domino XL fail
« Reply #20 on: April 09, 2017, 08:40 PM »
Lol

Guess not changing the width while running?
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/420 FSK rail • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • DX 93 • HL 850 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3