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Author Topic: Festool owes me money  (Read 6166 times)

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Offline duburban

  • Posts: 959
Festool owes me money
« on: September 26, 2018, 08:21 PM »
Guys... I don't have the time to draft multiple versions of this post to properly capture the depths of my disappointment in Festool so we'll start here.

I received my $160 FSK 250 new from Amazon this evening, just in time to work on staging tomorrow BUT the splinter strip is falling off because FESTOOL HASN'T ADDRESSED A MAJOR PROBLEM............. STILL.....

What is the point of maintaining the FOG forum if we can't engage in a feedback LOOP? Need I create a paper trail of posts identifying the splinter strip issue dating back to... how long guys...? Years right?

The FSK 250 is worth about $80 but I went for it because I'm a really good sport when it comes to Festool junk.

Festool owes me the time it takes to replace the strip with Makita brand strip and also owes me for the rolls of Makita strip I use to fix my other 7 tracks.

I'm going to fix the strip on the job tomorrow so that the guy I'm working with knows I'm not kidding when I'm telling him to buy the Bosch track system.

Festool, PM me for my address so you can send me a reimbursement and maybe next price increase we can hire someone to figure out what glue Makita is using?

Thanks
« Last Edit: September 26, 2018, 08:23 PM by duburban »
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

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Offline glass1

  • Posts: 432
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #1 on: September 26, 2018, 09:33 PM »
It’s designed to be re usable. I mean unusable.  [scared]. I have had problems in the past but the last strip I put on has held up. The Makita does stick well the only down side is when it needs to be replaced the glue is a mess meter to remove.

Offline duburban

  • Posts: 959
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2018, 09:36 PM »
It’s designed to be re usable. I mean unusable.  [scared]. I have had problems in the past but the last strip I put on has held up. The Makita does stick well the only down side is when it needs to be replaced the glue is a mess meter to remove.

I have other tracks that are not in use because I haven't taken time to replace the loose ends with Makita.
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 681
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2018, 10:43 PM »
One can't but ask why an established company like Festool would let such a small and easy-to-fix product deficiency irritate its customers.    [blink]

Offline TomGadwa1

  • Posts: 403
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #4 on: September 27, 2018, 12:08 AM »
They need to have 3M design a quality adhesive and then have workers who CARE install the strips correctly!!! I have a couple of rails that have the splinter guard strips that are not aligned properly!! For the money I have spent on Festool products thousands and thousands the OP is correct!!!
TS55 EQ  OF1400 EQ  DFQ 500 Q  RO 125  LR32 SET  Guide Rail Acc Kit Parallel Guide Set MFK 700 EQ Set MFS700 ETS 150/3 EQ Domino Cutter Assortment T15-3 Drill Set RO 90 EQ Workshop Cleaning Set CT36 Kapex 120 MFT/3 LR32 1080 FS 1400 FS 1900 WCR1000 PSB300 Boom Arm Set Clamping Elements RS 2 E  Kapex UG Set Zobo Forstner Set Centrotech Installers Set OF1010 OF2200 ZS-OF 2200 SYS1000 Syslite CT MIDI FS 800

There Are Those That Can Do, There Are Those That Can Not Do, Those That Can Not Do Have Those That Can Do Do The Things That They Can Not Do So That They Feel That They Have Done Something.

There ain't no something for nothing machine.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 5159
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #5 on: September 27, 2018, 01:00 AM »
I was hoping that when I joined this forum 3 years ago, that because people were so outspoken about issues with their Festool tools that this forum, because it is owned by Festool, would become a conduit for Festool USA to fast track product issues or product enhancements to their product line.

I also held out hope for that same situation occurring when Festool recently announced the manufacturing of products in the USA.

Well optimism is fine, but pragmatism is more useful.

Not to be a Debbie Downer here, but look at the track record.
An official Festool impact wrench survey was initiated 3 years ago...where’s the wrench?

An official Festool Kapex fact finding commission was initiated 2 years ago...where’s the fix?

Then there’s the imperial tool vs metric tool issue.

Then there’s the old hose connection vs the new hose connection issue.

Then there’s the Festool related story that the 150mm pad won’t fit the ETS EC 125 because:
1. The ETS EC 125 needs to be modified...well that wasn’t right.
2. There’s an imbalance situation if you swap pads...well that wasn’t right.
3. The brake mechanism for the pad won’t work.. well that wasn’t right either.

With that track record, should we really be holding out hope that Festool will dedicate resources to reformulate an adhesive to secure splinter strips on a guide rail?     I’m not.   I’ll just pick out a VHB product from 3M, grab a new splinter strip and move forward.

In the marketing specter it’s called opportunity lost.

« Last Edit: September 27, 2018, 08:26 AM by Cheese »

Offline duburban

  • Posts: 959
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #6 on: September 27, 2018, 08:14 AM »
It’s probably just perception but I feel like this would have been addressed by festool in years past. Perhaps they were just better a pacifying folks like me on this forum.

I’m actively suggesting alternatives to these products because I expect Festool to be the best tool company, not just the most expensive and I feel they’re taking advantage of my loyalty.
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline duburban

  • Posts: 959
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #7 on: September 27, 2018, 06:09 PM »
Still waiting to hear from Festool
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #8 on: September 27, 2018, 06:58 PM »
Still waiting to hear from Festool

And you will probably be waiting for a long time based on your post. I might suggest that if you really want assistance versus venting that you actually call Festool and talk to them about your issue.

Peter Halle - Moderator

Offline duburban

  • Posts: 959
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #9 on: September 27, 2018, 10:09 PM »
So this forum is not a place where we can communicate with Festool?
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 5159
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #10 on: September 27, 2018, 11:39 PM »
So this forum is not a place where we can communicate with Festool?

Yea that’s my read.

The bottom line is, it’s just a forum for old woodworkers to talk to other old workers about Festool tools while the forum slowly dies and eventually becomes extinct. A dinosaur in it’s final throes of life.

The energy of this forum emanates from enthused members yet, it’s not recriprocated from Festool corporate.  They own this platform but there’s no infusion of corporate Festool enthusiasm at any level. They come along every 6 months, offer a new product and then skulk away only maybe to be heard from in another 6 months down the line with another product introduction

Information is power...just produce a road map of where you’re going...what you’re focusing on and the faithful will follow. We don’t need release dates...just a road map of your vision of the future. Tease us...titilate us...reward the faithful.

This platform could become so powerful...yet it’s left to languish and it will eventually die because of a lack of corporate Festool support.

Who wants to talk about things that could be...at 70 years of age I want to talk about things that can be done right now. And there are 3 generations behind me that are looking for answers for the future. .


Offline duburban

  • Posts: 959
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #11 on: September 28, 2018, 12:28 AM »
I've been pretty darn loyal to Festool, especially when considering my means. Its a big deal to own 2+ truck full of Festool in rural Vermont, there's not a lot of money to be made up here. I've helped spread the word to so many people, including a building of architects when I did 5 years of arch. school.

You'll have to excuse my tone but getting a new product with a disconnected strip is analog to Festool sending me a box with a middle finger in it.


 
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline duburban

  • Posts: 959
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #12 on: September 28, 2018, 12:38 AM »
So this forum is not a place where we can communicate with Festool?

Yea that’s my read.

The bottom line is, it’s just a forum for old woodworkers to talk to other old workers about Festool tools while the forum slowly dies and eventually becomes extinct. A dinosaur in it’s final throes of life.


You're perhaps even more grim than I, you'll have to let me catch up. I would hope that this forum pays respect to the professional user that has less time to spend time working on the tools. An understandable by product of packing more performance into a tool is maintenance, setup, etc... but the issue I'm concerned with here is just sloppy.

If I follow Peter's advice and contact Festool I'll end up returning the track and get another one which may have the same issue and definitely will eventually thus magnifying my inconvenience.
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline MGDS

  • Posts: 8
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #13 on: September 28, 2018, 12:43 AM »
Agree with all said, Festool is turning even more boutique from when they owned the market. Much like 10k mountain bikes reserved for dentists and racers, we can now buy comparable tools without spending 2x as much. I bought into the system 3+ years ago...ts75, hkc55, 4 tracks, ets125, rotex125, ct midi, mft/3, carvex420 w/ accessorie kit (I do not recommended this jigsaw, another topic)

I’m happy with all the Festool tool purchases (minus the carved), and there wasn’t many alternatives available at the time. Hindsight, with the new tool brands becoming available/comparable, there isn’t anything else Festool offers that I want other than a domino, and that patent won’t last forever.

The price increases aren’t going to help either, I hope TTS’s pockets are deep, I’ll only be purchasing new sandpaper, maybe...and my dust deputy is -300 cheaper than the new cyclone.

Festool allowed me to learn a new approach, and what real dust collection is, but the other manufacturers learned also.
End rant - millennial

Offline SRSemenza

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #14 on: September 28, 2018, 11:27 AM »


The price increases aren’t going to help either, I hope TTS’s pockets are deep, I’ll only be purchasing new sandpaper, maybe...and my dust deputy is -300 cheaper than the new cyclone.


Isn't it $75 cheaper?  DD for Festool $300 vs. Festool Cyclone $375.   Unless you don't count the catch bin , hoses, connecting stuff etc. And then build / assemble your own. Which is fine, and if you buy the basic DD and do the rest yourself to save $300 then yes. But need to compare apple to apples.

Seth

Offline JD2720

  • Posts: 1029
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #15 on: September 28, 2018, 12:27 PM »


The price increases aren’t going to help either, I hope TTS’s pockets are deep, I’ll only be purchasing new sandpaper, maybe...and my dust deputy is -300 cheaper than the new cyclone.


Isn't it $75 cheaper?  DD for Festool $300 vs. Festool Cyclone $375.   Unless you don't count the catch bin , hoses, connecting stuff etc. And then build / assemble your own. Which is fine, and if you buy the basic DD and do the rest yourself to save $300 then yes. But need to compare apple to apples.

Seth

It depends on the model you get.

This one is normally $99. I have seen it on sale for less than $80. It comes with the cyclone, 2 containers, lid, casters, hose, clamps & elbows.

Dust Deputy Deluxe
« Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 12:34 PM by JD2720 »

Offline MGDS

  • Posts: 8
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #16 on: September 28, 2018, 04:35 PM »
DIY setups a bucket, same results...not that their new setup isn’t cool, but not immediately compatible with the Midi, and I’d buy the Oneida/Sys one instead. It’s that it is all they have to offer in the last 3 years, along with Bluetooth, a new hose that comes with an inferior connector, maybe a radio and some led lights? for 20% more..
I’ve never had to warranty a tool of theirs, and am not knocking their tools, but where does this end...a Domino in 2022 for 2k
I’m just bitter because I jumped all in, then eventually saw the light and won’t be going back, could have saved 2k, with the same results.
This is for the fellow lurkers as a word of caution, Kool-aids isn’t as green.
I still appreciate lurking in the forum and learning from fellow craftsman, but these are tools/consumables, not investments (watch AvE’s tear down of the ts55, not exactly confidence inspiring). TTS is for the share holders more than ever and not the consumer.

100 b.f. of solid milled hickory so you can see I’m serious...

Offline glass1

  • Posts: 432
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #17 on: September 28, 2018, 08:07 PM »
Is this a place to communicate with festool?  Not to be rude but thats pretty funny. This is a place to communicate with the festool secretly paid off apologists pretending to be moderators. This maybe harsh and may get me banned but if y'all are not paid off why blindly defend festool? If it quacks like a duck its a duck, and the kapex is crap, the track saws are under powered, and the jig saws are average. But, the vacuums are good, the routers are awesome and their are some other winners. I post in the hope that festool will see the light and make all their tools kick butt !

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 1561
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #18 on: September 28, 2018, 08:25 PM »
but if y'all are not paid off why blindly defend festool?
Wait, we get paid off? How do I collect my share?
The title of the post is very appropriate I might add.

Offline duburban

  • Posts: 959
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #19 on: September 28, 2018, 08:49 PM »
While I agree that a savvy woodworker can do as much with less, my point is less about value and more about Festool living up to the name they are trying to create for themselves. They are getting lazy and sloppy. I knowingly pay more for a tool that does equal to competitors. I do not knowingly pay more for a tool that needs to be fixed upon receipt... and I do not accept that as a norm from this company.

I agree that there are folks on here that constantly stick up for them because they are dutifully loyal or have connections that gets them better service or whatever. Those that do this do not help the community or the brand.

Look... I can fix the splinter guard but thats not the point... I shouldn't have to.
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3609
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #20 on: September 28, 2018, 09:05 PM »
@glass1 you’ve no cause to make such an accusation against the moderators. I challenge you to copy a single post that demonstrates what you say. Trying to maintain neutrality is not the same thing as “blindly” defending Festool. The mods (Peter for sure) have expressed concern that Festool hasn’t addressed our concerns about the Kapex. Other than weeding out content that violates the guidelines of the forum or espouses dangerous procedures they’re pretty hands off.

I appreciate your honest appraisals of tools but you’re way off base attacking the mods.

Offline Bob Marino

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #21 on: September 28, 2018, 09:23 PM »
@glass1 you’ve no cause to make such an accusation against the moderators. I challenge you to copy a single post that demonstrates what you say. Trying to maintain neutrality is not the same thing as “blindly” defending Festool. The mods (Peter for sure) have expressed concern that Festool hasn’t addressed our concerns about the Kapex. Other than weeding out content that violates the guidelines of the forum or espouses dangerous procedures they’re pretty hands off.

I appreciate your honest appraisals of tools but you’re way off base attacking the mods.

 Agree 100% Michael.

 I also wish Festool was a little more responsive here no doubt. And I agree that something as simple as using the correct adhesive for the splinter-guards this is a problem that should’ve been fixed long ago.

  But the moderators are extremely fair and honest and darn nice guys to boot.  They work  tirelessly to keep this forum friendly and open. I know both Peter and Seth for years and they’re a good people - good down to their bones.
 As imperfect as this forum may be its through their efforts this is still a viable place for Festool information and more.
« Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 09:32 PM by Bob Marino »
Festool  Dealer since 2002; user well before that!
            http://bobmarinosbesttools.com
                   Service As It Should Be

Offline SRSemenza

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  • Finger Lakes Region, NY State , USA
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #22 on: September 28, 2018, 10:17 PM »
Is this a place to communicate with festool?  Not to be rude but thats pretty funny. This is a place to communicate with the festool secretly paid off apologists pretending to be moderators. This maybe harsh and may get me banned but if y'all are not paid off why blindly defend festool? If it quacks like a duck its a duck, and the kapex is crap, the track saws are under powered, and the jig saws are average. But, the vacuums are good, the routers are awesome and their are some other winners. I post in the hope that festool will see the light and make all their tools kick butt !

Well there are only two moderators so I guess you are talking about me and Peter. 

The amount of restraint I am exercising right now might give me an aneurysm. This isn't the first time you have attacked, baited, and trolled members of this forum. And the only reason you are still a member right now, at this moment is because you are attacking the moderators. Just wouldn't look good to ban you on this one. 

I am not blindly defending Festool. Pointing out the  possible   price difference comparison discrepancy in the post above is not defending Festool. It is attempting to gain some accuracy.  I have noticed though that many,  not all but many, times when someone holds a different opinion than yours , or has legitimately achieved different results with a Festool tool than what you have obtained, that leads you to label them an apologist. Just because their opinion and results don't match yours.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I apologize to the rest of the forum members for this post. It is not very moderator like of me.  Every once in a while my typing takes over and I just can't get control of myself.  Please do not read this post of mine as being an acceptable way to post on the forum. I should tell myself to take it private. Peter, could you please come moderate me here?  I am not doing a very good job of it.  [tongue]

Seth

Offline SRSemenza

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #23 on: September 28, 2018, 10:20 PM »
duburban,

    Sorry your splinter strips are falling off. I too wish Festool would start using a better adhesive. Some of mine seem to stay on well and others not so well. It used to be that people complained that the strips were too hard to remove. Need a formulation in between the old and the current.

 

Seth
« Last Edit: September 28, 2018, 10:23 PM by SRSemenza »

Offline glass1

  • Posts: 432
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #24 on: September 28, 2018, 10:20 PM »
Than be honest. The track saws are underpowered and the kapex has a host of issues and the jig saw is average. Put your mouth where the money is. Yes I agree everybody is a nice guy. Never said otherwise. Just stop the bs. Reminds me of an old fable “ The emperors new clothes”. It’s just about honesty and reality for me it’s not personal. I am sure most on this forum are nice folks. That has nothing to do with Festool charging a premium price and claiming to make the best tools. If you boast, no problem if you can back it up.

Offline SRSemenza

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  • Finger Lakes Region, NY State , USA
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #25 on: September 28, 2018, 10:23 PM »
Bob M.

   I agree. I wish Festool was a bit more involved with the forum.

   But times change. Regardless I still think that the forum has some advantages over other internet formats when it comes to the type of information  in play here. Other formats also have strengths.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

   @duburban,  sorry to take your topic off track.



Seth

Offline duburban

  • Posts: 959
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #26 on: September 28, 2018, 11:00 PM »
Bob M.

   I agree. I wish Festool was a bit more involved with the forum.

   But times change. Regardless I still think that the forum has some advantages over other internet formats when it comes to the type of information  in play here. Other formats also have strengths.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

   @duburban,  sorry to take your topic off track.



Seth

All relevant. Understanding the distance between this forum and Festool does help. I cannot recall how many years I've been here but things have changed.

helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline SRSemenza

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  • Finger Lakes Region, NY State , USA
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #27 on: September 28, 2018, 11:12 PM »
Bob M.

   I agree. I wish Festool was a bit more involved with the forum.

   But times change. Regardless I still think that the forum has some advantages over other internet formats when it comes to the type of information  in play here. Other formats also have strengths.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

   @duburban,  sorry to take your topic off track.



Seth

All relevant. Understanding the distance between this forum and Festool does help. I cannot recall how many years I've been here but things have changed.


Looks like this is your seventh anniversary on FOG. Right there under your screen name.  [wink]

Seth

Offline Bob Marino

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #28 on: September 28, 2018, 11:36 PM »
Than be honest. The track saws are underpowered and the kapex has a host of issues and the jig saw is average. Put your mouth where the money is. Yes I agree everybody is a nice guy. Never said otherwise. Just stop the bs. Reminds me of an old fable “ The emperors new clothes”. It’s just about honesty and reality for me it’s not personal. I am sure most on this forum are nice folks. That has nothing to do with Festool charging a premium price and claiming to make the best tools. If you boast, no problem if you can back it up.

 If the "nice guy" comment was in reference to my post, I went further - knowing both moderators over many years - way before they were moderators here (actually were customers of mine) and said they were "good down to their bones." I'll stand by that. They are excellent and moderators. They help keep this place going and shill for no one. Critiques on the tools - understood, let's have that discussion, but your personal attacks on their integrity are both incorrect and unwarranted.
Festool  Dealer since 2002; user well before that!
            http://bobmarinosbesttools.com
                   Service As It Should Be

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 217
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #29 on: September 29, 2018, 12:31 AM »
I would just comment that telling folks they should contact festool directly simply isn't helpful and it's anti to the reason people make a post.

People don't contact companies directly because it's talking to a wall. You get no response, or when you do, it's boilerplate and or completely dodges the question/suggestion/etc that was asked.  I've send messages to many companies over time, sometimes you get feedback and even occasionally something actually gets changed/fixed or comes out as a product a few years later.  But the later is very rare.  I've found myself testing products before and had my input/changes/suggestions put into products, one common thread is that this happens with small companies that aren't too big to listen to outside ideas.

Most folks know that a company won't just drop everything and respond or talk future products etc with random people. But they do like to know that it was at least acknowledged in some way or maybe was at least sent to the right people who then ignore it.  It's like going to a job fair, folks want people to at least take a copy of their resume even if the company will just throw it away soon as they leave. Don't shove it back at the person or refuse to take it.

That's what the internet got people years ago, they can post something and maybe find they aren't alone or so there is more than one voice with the issues/suggestion/etc.  It's like putting together a petition with many signers on it. It has a lot more weight than just one random person talking.

I know no one running a forum wants it to be a angry posting fest at the target company of a forum, but is in the end a fundamental part of how things will be.  Silence means everything is great.


Offline jonathan-m

  • Posts: 324
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #30 on: September 29, 2018, 05:56 AM »
I have not had any direct dealing with Festool myself, but I have heard from other people who have that Festool in Germany is kind of a "we know best" company. A bit snobby like Apple in that they're not really open to suggestions from their customer base but rather tell you how to use their products and have the "you're using it wrong" mentality when something is reported...

Take it for what it's worth and with a grain of salt… but it does seem to conform to what we see here on the forum regarding to feedback... And if it's true, well then all this doesn't really matter does it...
« Last Edit: September 29, 2018, 05:59 AM by jonathan-m »
Festool: 2x MFT/3 // OF-1400 // MFS-400 & 700 // RO-90 // SYS-ROLL // VAC-SYS SET SE1 // CT-ASA CT 26/36/SB // KS 120 EB & UG-L & R //  VECTURO OS 400 EQ-Set  // DSG-AG 125 // DSC-AG 125 // DSC-AG 125 FH // HK 85 EB // HK 55 EB
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Mafell: MT55cc // P1cc // DD40P // Erika 85 Ec

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Offline jacko9

  • Posts: 2378
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #31 on: September 29, 2018, 06:48 AM »
I've contacted Festool here in the USA and the have been completely helpful.  This forum used to have a more onsite connection to Festool but, I haven't been around for a while so I can't comment on their presence.

Offline James Biddle

  • Posts: 146
Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #32 on: September 29, 2018, 07:05 AM »
I've been as critical of Festool as any lately, but I do think the mods here do an outstanding job. Its not their fault I just had to order a replacement receptacle for my Midi to fix the same problem that my CT33 had 10 years ago. Or that my...

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #33 on: September 29, 2018, 07:22 AM »
I've been as critical of Festool as any lately, but I do think the mods here do an outstanding job. Its not their fault I just had to order a replacement receptacle for my Midi to fix the same problem that my CT33 had 10 years ago. Or that my...

Just as a heads up, don’t throw your old one away.  If the issue is the looseness of the contacts (called wipes I believe) they are easily repairable.

Peter

Offline Rick Christopherson

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #34 on: September 29, 2018, 07:41 AM »
I miss @Christian Oltzscher. The whole company has gone to       since he left the U.S. Market. That's why you don't see me posting here anymore.

<<Edit:  Edited with spaces replacing word previously used - P.Halle, Moderator>>
« Last Edit: September 29, 2018, 08:00 AM by Peter Halle »

Offline Brice Burrell

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #35 on: September 29, 2018, 08:33 AM »
I miss @Christian Oltzscher. The whole company has gone to       since he left the U.S. Market. That's why you don't see me posting here anymore.

Yes, when Christian was here he made Festool USA seem like a small family owned business.  With his moving up it feels far more corporate, in many ways disconnected from the customers.   
Check out my new blog, The Green and Dark Blue Blog.

Offline DynaGlide

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #36 on: September 29, 2018, 08:43 AM »
Festool bent over backwards with their customer service when I needed help. Maybe their forum presence isn't strong but their people on the phone are fantastic.

Offline Bob Marino

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #37 on: September 29, 2018, 11:14 AM »
I miss @Christian Oltzscher. The whole company has gone to       since he left the U.S. Market. That's why you don't see me posting here anymore.

Yes, when Christian was here he made Festool USA seem like a small family owned business.  With his moving up it feels far more corporate, in many ways disconnected from the customers.

  Brice,

 I agree. In those days, Christian O and Brian G (CEO and CFO) shared a desk at Festool's office. Many times, when there wasn't enough staff, he's pick up the phone and field the calls. Actually I got to "know" him when I had to call the office asking about my recently purchased PS2E jigsaw. Further phone conversations led to asking me if I wanted to sell the tools. Talk about being in the right place at the right time!

 Christian also attended the larger WW shows and sometimes demonstrated the tools. There were no "dealers" - we were  Independent Sales Agents (ISA's). Shortly before I signed up, Festool would send out a small newsletter to each ISA with info about the tools and the list - with names of the sales amounts of the top 10 ISA's. That was deemed a sales motivator I guess. For a few years, Festool would offer a fully all expense paid trip to Festool's Headquarters in Germany for a select group ISA's. All that is ancient history in the days of Festool USA's very early years here. Christian has been "bumped up" to one of Festool's top positions - not sure what his title is but it is our loss and their gain. I had the pleasure of meeting him again at Festool's Indiana CONNECT a couple of years ago and he still has that warmth and charm (and of course intelligence) that made his office staff jump through hoops for him.

 Yes, those days are long gone as Festool becomes more "corporate." But as they continue to expand, I do hope they start to be more "involved/attentive/communicative."
Festool  Dealer since 2002; user well before that!
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Offline Bob Marino

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #38 on: September 29, 2018, 11:16 AM »
Festool bent over backwards with their customer service when I needed help. Maybe their forum presence isn't strong but their people on the phone are fantastic.

  I also agree with you - being a dealer that calls the office quite often. Extremely helpful and friendly.
Festool  Dealer since 2002; user well before that!
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                   Service As It Should Be

Offline Michael Kellough

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #39 on: September 29, 2018, 02:34 PM »
Sure it's frustrating that Festool corporate doesn't check in much now but even when he was here Christian O. only posted 157 times in the 5 years or so that he was active.

The Festool employee that did the most to provide a friendly and helpful Festool presence in the FOG was Shane Holland (10,458 posts) while he worked directly for Festool. Before that he worked for McFeely's doing a lot to help forum members from the dealer's perspective, as he does now. While working for Festool Shane helped facilitate the transition from Mathew's ownership of FOG to Festool corporate ownership which included persuading Seth and Peter to accept the responsibility (for no compensation) of moderating the forum.

No, we don't hear much from Festool these days but if you just call Festool chances are better than good that you'll get a satisfactory response, from a real person.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2018, 05:51 PM by Michael Kellough »

Offline Bob Marino

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #40 on: September 29, 2018, 02:58 PM »
 
   Right on Michael.
 Major kudos to Shane - well deserved - for many moons in many capacities.
Festool  Dealer since 2002; user well before that!
            http://bobmarinosbesttools.com
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Offline James Biddle

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #41 on: September 29, 2018, 05:15 PM »
Many, if not most, of the complaints we're seeing today are issues that have developed over time and were not around back then (aside from that crappy receptacle).  When the guide rails first came out, the the cut strips were black and we didn't like that we couldn't see the lines beneath them. Back then, Festool was not the giant you see today and made the change in the cut strips to the clear ones and the adhesion problems occurred after that.  We didn't know the Kapex motor issues would occur when it was first released.  Festool had no idea of the backlash that would occur when they introduced the imperial scales.  (OK, the jigsaw has been average at best from the beginning.)  My point is that it's possible that their were fewer known product issues back then and mostly individual problems.

I think Tyler has continued the tradition of helpfulness set back with Christian.  And the dealers and the mods.  They all really try to help if at all possible, but it is more on an individual level, not a product development or change perspective.  I thank you all for your helpfulness.

My issues were, and continue to be, with Festool itself.  A post from them saying "we've heard your concerns over the new style DC hoses and while we continue to work towards giving you the best in class dust collection experience, the new style DC hose end is the direction of the future".  Yes, it's corporate speak for FU, but at least we're given the impression that our concerns were considered.  Or, how about, "we've heard the complaints on the Imperial scale only tools and we will be releasing all US tools in both formats in the future".  All done from a Festool Corporate posting.

I don't care if they agree with my complaints or tell me to pound sand, a response is necessary.  The argument against doing this is that none of the other companies operate in this manner.  My counter would be that none of their lower-cost competitors have positioned themselves as being best-in-class via system, advertising and price point.  Instead, competitors continue to release new products or iterations of products to position themselves to best capture market share.  Festool's model has mostly been create, design, release, move onto the next.  The flaws in that model are obvious, you not only need to create (sorry, radios don't count), you need to improve your original creations to keep ahead of the competition releasing their versions of your creations that include their improvements.

Their appears to be a growing number of Festool owners that are reducing their position in Festool products, myself included.  Relying on growing the customer base while not addressing customer retention is a risky model to follow.

Offline Joe Felchlin

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #42 on: September 29, 2018, 05:40 PM »
Old business saying:
“Ignore your customers. They’ll go away.”

And NOTHING - Tyler, Peter, or Seth - Can say or do -
As “good willed and well intentioned” as they may be -
Will be enough to stop - The ever growing tide... From going out.

Think “Penny”s (CEO and CFO have both recently quit).
Think “K-Mart”. Think “Sears”.
Great companies ruined.
“Ignore your customers. They’ll go away.”
« Last Edit: September 29, 2018, 05:50 PM by Joe Felchlin »
FESTOOL: CT26 and CT33 E HEPA Dust Extractors, MFT 1080, MFT-3, TS 55 REQ-F-Plus USA, TS75 EQ, Guide Rails: 1080's/1400/3000mm, LR 32-SYS/Holey Rail, Parallel Guides and Extensions, OF1400 EQ Plunge Router, OF1010 EQ Plunge Router, HL 850 Planer, RO125 FEQ Rotex Sander, LS 130 EQ Linear Detail Sander, DX93E Detail Sander, C12 Cordless Drill, CXS Cordless Compact Drill Driver, SYS-Centrotec-Set, Domino XL DF 700 EQ Plus Tenon Joiner Set, Domino DF 500 Tenon Joiner | WOODPECKERS: DF 500 Offset Base System | BOSCH: 5412L Compound Miter Saw, 4100-09 10-Inch Table Saw | POWERMATIC: 60HH 8" Jointer, PWBS 14" Bandsaw w/Riser Block | MAKITA: 2012NB Bench Top Planer | JESSEM: Mast-R-Lift XL/Fence/Slide, Rout-R-Plate/Table Stand | RIKON: 50-120 6inX48in Belt-Disc Sander | JET: JBOS-5 Benchtop Oscillating Spindle Sander | PORTER CABLE: 7518 and 690LVRS Routers, 557 Pro Plate Joiner, 16/18/23 Gauge Nailers | LEIGH JIGS: D4R 24 Pro Dovetail Jig, FMT Pro Mortise & Tenon Jig | LIE-NIELSEN: Almost every hand plane | DOWELMAX: 3/8" and 1/4" | KREG: K3 Master System | FEIN: Multimaster FMM 250 Q Kit | TORMEK: Super-Grind 2000 | DUST DEPUTY: Industrial (ALL) Steel Deluxe Cyclone (2)

Offline RJNeal

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #43 on: September 29, 2018, 05:43 PM »
I’m still a little lost on the changing of the stops from black to clear. I know my eye is not great but I could never see thru the clear strip even when it was new.
Rick.
Have you walked your saw today?

Offline SRSemenza

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #44 on: September 29, 2018, 06:43 PM »
I’m still a little lost on the changing of the stops from black to clear. I know my eye is not great but I could never see thru the clear strip even when it was new.
Rick.

For me it is not so much seeing through as it is that I get less shadow from the clear and the clear is visibly more different in color than a pencil mark.

Seth

Offline RJNeal

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #45 on: September 29, 2018, 06:54 PM »
Thanks Seth.
Unfortunately I lost a 75” track yesterday at the highway hardware collection area. So I needed to buy another on and before I take the first cut I’m planning on getting some 3m tape.
Rick.
Have you walked your saw today?

Offline duburban

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #46 on: September 29, 2018, 07:27 PM »
 
   Right on Michael.
 Major kudos to Shane - well deserved - for many moons in many capacities.

Agreed!
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline duburban

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #47 on: September 30, 2018, 09:47 AM »
I fixed the strip last night using loktite 200 spray adhesive. I taped off both parts and gave them a good coat. Sticks great, maybe too much but I’ll deal with that when it comes. If I’m smart I’ll hit more tracks while it’s on my mind.
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline Michael Kellough

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #48 on: September 30, 2018, 11:08 AM »
I fixed the strip last night using loktite 200 spray adhesive. I taped off both parts and gave them a good coat. Sticks great, maybe too much but I’ll deal with that when it comes. If I’m smart I’ll hit more tracks while it’s on my mind.

Don’t go overboard sticking the strips on the rail. It doesn’t take long for the strip to get cut back to the point that is is no longer accurate (useful). If it’s so difficult to re-position that you don’t do it you may as well not have it at all.

I’d rather have a strip that comes loose than one that takes half an hour to re-position.

Offline duburban

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #49 on: September 30, 2018, 01:25 PM »
I bailed on repositioning and go for full replacement when I get tired to interpreting where the blade will cut.
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline glass1

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #50 on: October 02, 2018, 06:34 PM »
Well, Let’s all enjoy the back slapping ....  No, the broader point I make is that the moderators and Festool reviewers and experts on this site are like gurus to many out there. I feel by not being totally honest about what is exceptional and what is mediocre from Festool the aforementioned are doing no favors. I would love to buy tools from people who make them can afford to hire me to build them a house, but that means every thing and I mean everything Festool turns out needs to be tops. So let’s start here, fix the kapex, jig saw, and give the ts saws a pair of balls. For the record I bought a used at 65 f. Out of the box with a who’s knows how old 48 tooth blade it ripped thru 2” sapele better than the 2 ts 75s that had 36 tooth blades.

Offline duburban

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #51 on: October 02, 2018, 06:39 PM »
i generally agree with you. its important to be honest about short comings so they can be addressed and the fleet further tuned in. its also easy to understand that those in the "in-crowd" don't tend to be openly critical. i have not noticed a lot of censoring though, see my post as example.
helper: i used a festool "circular saw" to do something simple and it made it really hard

me: exactly, it makes simple cuts complicated and complicated cuts simple

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Festool Splinter Strip Issues
« Reply #52 on: October 02, 2018, 07:04 PM »
Well, Let’s all enjoy the back slapping ....  No, the broader point I make is that the moderators and Festool reviewers and experts on this site are like gurus to many out there. I feel by not being totally honest about what is exceptional and what is mediocre from Festool the aforementioned are doing no favors. I would love to buy tools from people who make them can afford to hire me to build them a house, but that means every thing and I mean everything Festool turns out needs to be tops. So let’s start here, fix the kapex, jig saw, and give the ts saws a pair of balls. For the record I bought a used at 65 f. Out of the box with a who’s knows how old 48 tooth blade it ripped thru 2” sapele better than the 2 ts 75s that had 36 tooth blades.

@glass1 , Regarding the splinter strips - if you do the search with the term 3M and my member name you will find that I have been outspoken and probably the first one to mention the hope for 3M and Festool to come up with a cure to the failing splinter strip adhesive.  I also mention that I now use contact cement.

I have been outspoken on the Kapex issue and have also used avenues of communication that are available to me.  I assure you that Festool in both Germany and North America have heard my thoughts - both written and even face to face.  My Kapex was purchased on a lunch break in 2010 after my Hitachi failed and I cut thru the base.  That is also documented here.  My Kapex has never been in for service, rides on the front seat of my van, cuts everything I throw at it.  I dislike the 80 tooth blade.

My feelings on the Carvex:  A jigsaw of any brand is the most imperfect of saws and the performance can be greatly affected by body mechanics and other things.  I enjoy my Carvex more than my previous Bosch.  I rarely use the supplemental bases and have removed the dust shroud.  I don't use dust collection because half the dust will be under the workpiece anyway and I don't want a dust collection hose causing drag.  I use a mixture of Festool and Bosch blades.

I have a TS-55 that is a 2006 model.  I won't get rid of it. It does what I want it to do.  Does it sound strange?  YEP.  Would I use it every day to cut wet 1.5 inch thick pressure treated lumber?  Nope.  But it has.  I believe in using the proper blades for best performance and longest life.  I have even posted that the Mafell is probably the best jigsaw out there.  I couldn't afford a Mafell and would not use it enough to justify its cost even I could afford it.

I have no idea what happened with your TS-75 when the vast majority are satisfied.  But I recognize that you weren't and am glad that the return option was available for you.  That is not apologizing but rather recognizing your situation

Festool is not perfect.  But I offer that neither is any other company nor myself.

Peter
« Last Edit: October 02, 2018, 07:22 PM by Peter Halle »

Offline RJNeal

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #53 on: October 02, 2018, 08:17 PM »
Peter, which 3m tape do you use? Or how thick? I need to address some new rails before they head south.
Thanks
Rick.
Have you walked your saw today?

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #54 on: October 02, 2018, 08:34 PM »
Peter, which 3m tape do you use? Or how thick? I need to address some new rails before they head south.
Thanks
Rick.

I don’t.  I use contact cement.

Peter

Offline RJNeal

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Re: Festool owes me money
« Reply #55 on: October 02, 2018, 08:47 PM »
Roger that.
Thank you much.
R
Have you walked your saw today?