Having trouble with your Festool power tool? Well, we're here to help you. Before posting to the forum, give us a chance to diagnose and resolve your issue. In the U.S. and Canada, call us toll-free at 888-337-8600 on Monday-Friday between 8a-5p EST or contact us via email at service@festoolusa.com. For other countries, please visit http://www.festool.com for contact information for your local Festool service department.

Author Topic: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working  (Read 3118 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Big 4

  • Posts: 1
The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« on: March 28, 2018, 05:34 AM »
i removed it and continue to use the saw , was wondering if anyone ever fixed this issue on site and where i can order parts

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Peter Halle

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 11213
  • Another Avatar Coming Soon
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2018, 06:41 AM »
Please contact Festool via phone 888-337-8600.  Operating the saw without a blade guard is dangerous.

Peter

Offline Rob-GB

  • Posts: 1071
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2018, 10:21 AM »
If the mechanism gets gunked up, as mine did when someone used it without extraction (I was off sick) it can get sticky and not move freely.
I took mine apart and cleaned it all up and oiled or greased where I thought appropriate, works just fine again. (charged the client company for my time, they know not to mess with my kit).

As Peter said please do not operate without the guard not just for your sake but if someone else gets hurt using it you may still be liable even if they did not have permission to use it.

Rob.
Problem? No such thing! Only a solution waiting to be found:- RJ

"A $2 guppy swims......" Deke

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 415
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2018, 10:46 AM »
Sometime ago, I came across a shared image on a forum, showing a mitre saw in some jobsite background (cutting hardwood flooring?) with its guard held up by a bungee cord or something. The text suggested the set-up was quick for the operator to see and cut the work. When I went back to the forum later, the image was removed by the administrator. Even the thought of using a mitre saw without the guard is scary enough for me.

Offline bevans

  • Posts: 91
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2018, 10:43 PM »
I posted a similar issue this evening in the Festool How to area. My guard will work when I pull the trigger and start the saw but just pulling the trigger no longer allows the saw to lower. If I manually lift the guard it allows the blade to lower. Purchased my saw in 2012. Was hoping the was an easy fix...something I could do but it may not turn out that way.

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 740
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2018, 05:39 AM »
My guard will work when I pull the trigger and start the saw but just pulling the trigger no longer allows the saw to lower.
If I manually lift the guard it allows the blade to lower.
The saw running or not should make no difference to the guard operating or not.

Sounds like the mechanism (that moves the guard out of the way when lowering the head) catches somewhere right at the beginning, but vibrations from the running motor help to overcome the obstacle.

On my Kapex there is a slight stiffness* to overcome (that goes away as soon as tthe guard starts to rotate) when starting to lower the head.

I suggest to examine the lever (#497504 in the ekat drawing) that connects to the guard (with a roller) and what it's connected to - and if wiggling it slightly (while trying to lower the head) helps.


* no native speaker here, possibly not the optimal word for it.

Offline TXFIVEO

  • Posts: 165
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2018, 06:53 AM »
Now another issue to add to the Kapex list...as much as I would love to have one I just can’t see anyone getting one with any peace of mind that it will be a work horse in their shop.  I bought a used Dewalt DWS780 off Craigslist from a gentleman who purchased it for one hardwood floor job then decided that type of work wasn’t for him.  The saw could have passed for new.  I’ve had it for almost 3 years with ZERO issues. 

Now I’m not hating on FESTOOL, in fact I own many of their tools and I’m sure the list will grow, but I’m holding off on pulling the trigger on the Kapex until an updated version comes out or FESTOOL acknowledges the issue and remedies it.   

Offline Rob-GB

  • Posts: 1071
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2018, 01:49 PM »
Now another issue to add to the Kapex list...as much as I would love to have one I just can’t see anyone getting one with any peace of mind that it will be a work horse in their shop.

Bought my Kapex in September 2010 and the only issue I have had with it is when someone else rudely used it.
It has been used for work in all that time and any home projects that cropped up.
People rarely shout about stuff that does not go wrong so take into context the many thousands of Kapex units that have never been complained about.

Rob.
Problem? No such thing! Only a solution waiting to be found:- RJ

"A $2 guppy swims......" Deke

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3257
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2018, 01:54 PM »
Rob, what is the voltage of your Kapex? There have been relatively few problems reported here about saws with the 220v motors.

Offline Rob-GB

  • Posts: 1071
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #9 on: April 01, 2018, 11:50 AM »
Rob, what is the voltage of your Kapex? There have been relatively few problems reported here about saws with the 220v motors.

110v via transformer due to stupid regulations on UK building sites. When I started buying Festools site work was a big part of my work and had to go the 110v route.
Rob.
Problem? No such thing! Only a solution waiting to be found:- RJ

"A $2 guppy swims......" Deke

Offline Job and Knock

  • Posts: 117
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #10 on: April 15, 2018, 07:37 AM »
Now another issue to add to the Kapex list...as much as I would love to have one I just can’t see anyone getting one with any peace of mind that it will be a work horse in their shop
Please be more realistic! Problems with mitre saw guards have always happened, especially out on site, regardless of brand or model. You have a DW which has had no issues. Well I have a DW which has gone through no less than three return springs in 7 years (mainly due to knots being kicked out of the blade) whilst my Kapex has been faultless to date. I don't complain. I just do the necessary service work, Does that say anything about the respective brands or models? Nothing, I'd say. If you are going to "diss" a tool, at least pick on something you have some depth of experience in
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 07:41 AM by Job and Knock »
Simplicity is the embodiment of purity and unity
- Shaker Maxims

Offline Job and Knock

  • Posts: 117
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #11 on: April 15, 2018, 08:01 AM »
110v via transformer due to stupid regulations on UK building sites.
Stupid? The reason that UK construction sites favour 110v is that the supplying/isolating transformer is centre tapped to earth. Giving supply characteristics of 55 - 0 - 55v.

Any phase (live conductor) will therefore only have a potential to earth of 55v, unlike 110v in the USA which really is 110v to earth, whereas in a UK 230v mains system you have a potential from at least one conductor of 230v to earth.

It's the trailing leads that are really the hazard on a site because they so often run through water (puddle on the floor) and because they are so frequently damaged - often in my case by idiots driving MEWPs (scissor lifts) across them. That's why when you are running a site it is imperative to examine and condemn defective extension cables on a regular basis as well as to insist on regular (3 monthly) PAT testing on cables in particular
Simplicity is the embodiment of purity and unity
- Shaker Maxims

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 740
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #12 on: April 15, 2018, 02:51 PM »
It's the trailing leads that are really the hazard on a site because they so often run through water (puddle on the floor) and because they are so frequently damaged - often in my case by idiots driving MEWPs (scissor lifts) across them. That's why when you are running a site it is imperative to examine and condemn defective extension cables on a regular basis as well as to insist on regular (3 monthly) PAT testing on cables in particular
I would say earth leakage circuit breakers would do the trick without the need to drop the voltage level, avoiding the downside of increasing the amperage requirement (and the downsides that has).

Offline TXFIVEO

  • Posts: 165
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2018, 06:45 AM »
Now another issue to add to the Kapex list...as much as I would love to have one I just can’t see anyone getting one with any peace of mind that it will be a work horse in their shop
Please be more realistic! Problems with mitre saw guards have always happened, especially out on site, regardless of brand or model. You have a DW which has had no issues. Well I have a DW which has gone through no less than three return springs in 7 years (mainly due to knots being kicked out of the blade) whilst my Kapex has been faultless to date. I don't complain. I just do the necessary service work, Does that say anything about the respective brands or models? Nothing, I'd say. If you are going to "diss" a tool, at least pick on something you have some depth of experience in

I would wager you an enormous amount that there are thousands more Dewalt DWS780’s in the field than Kapexs with a higher percentage of the downed units being Kapex.  Any tool can and will fail unexpectedly, but the same issue seams to come up with the Kapex time and time again.  Don’t get so defensive, it is a well known issue with the Kapex.  Do the research and work and you will know. Remove the blinders and you will see so much more..

Offline Peter Halle

  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 11213
  • Another Avatar Coming Soon
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #14 on: April 16, 2018, 09:14 AM »
I’ll agree with the comment previously posted about mitersaw guards having an issue since the beginning of time - despite which company manufactured them.  Mitersaw guard issue was what this thread was started about.

I have had an issue with every mitersaw guard on every saw I have owned since I bought my first one in 1983.  Black and Decker, Makita, Hitachi, and Festool.  On all the brands other than Festool I disabled the guards.  Did I have some scary moments like a blade touching a fingernail while running?  Yes.  Did I sit down and calm down immediately?  Yes.  Did every other finish carpenter I know in the 80’s and 90’s also disable there guards?  Yes.  I suspect that they had some of the same derrière-cheek-tightening moments also.  But that doesn’t mean that we should have put safety ahead of getting work done.  I am typing this with ten fingers although I have had a finger tip removed and then reattached thru a drill accident.

The guards and the parts that control and operate them are subject to grime, wear, and damage.  That is inherent to the operation of the saw in my mind.

My Kapex guard has required cleaning and lubrication.  But it has performed better than the other ones I have had a chance to use.

My personal experiences and observations only.

Peter

Offline TXFIVEO

  • Posts: 165
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #15 on: April 16, 2018, 03:38 PM »
That might be so but I’m talking about the Kapex as a whole.  There is obviously a design flaw.  So many issues with the same problems.  Once again, not hating on FESTOOL.  Have easily $8,000 worth of their products.  And will continue to buy their “proven” products. How many armature issues have been posted on this site alone?  Doesn’t even begin to represent the true number of Kapex issues as whole.  If it wasn’t an issue FESTOOL would have addressed it instead of ignoring it.

Is there anyone out there with a Kapex that will honestly say they confident their Kapex will work all day...all week...all month?  If the Kapex was a PROVEN work horse like the Bosch Glide and Dewalt DWS780 I would buy it today. Nothing wrong with asking a manufacturer of a high end product that comes with a high end price to address and fix common issues? Think not. 

Offline Job and Knock

  • Posts: 117
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #16 on: April 16, 2018, 05:38 PM »
I would wager you an enormous amount that there are thousands more Dewalt DWS780’s in the field than Kapexs with a higher percentage of the downed units being Kapex.  Any tool can and will fail unexpectedly, but the same issue seams to come up with the Kapex time and time again.  Don’t get so defensive, it is a well known issue with the Kapex.  Do the research and work and you will know. Remove the blinders and you will see so much more..
I was actually referring to your comments about the blade guard. In site use blade guards are often subject to abuse  and lack of maintainance, so saying "Now another issue to add to the Kapex list..." was just point scoring, IMHO. I'm not defending the Kapex in this instance.

Simplicity is the embodiment of purity and unity
- Shaker Maxims

Offline Job and Knock

  • Posts: 117
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #17 on: April 16, 2018, 05:46 PM »
It's the trailing leads that are really the hazard on a site because they so often run through water (puddle on the floor) and because they are so frequently damaged - often in my case by idiots driving MEWPs (scissor lifts) across them. That's why when you are running a site it is imperative to examine and condemn defective extension cables on a regular basis as well as to insist on regular (3 monthly) PAT testing on cables in particular
I would say earth leakage circuit breakers would do the trick without the need to drop the voltage level, avoiding the downside of increasing the amperage requirement (and the downsides that has).
I have worked on jobs in Europe where RCDs on 230 volt power are mandated and I've noted that if the RCD keeps tripping the general approach isn't always to check the cables and the tool to find the fault lies - more often the approach is to "rig" the RCD or even remove it so that work can proceed. Not safe practice at all! I've had belts off 230 volts and it felt like I was being bitten (I experienced it quite often on jobs in the Netherlands) - 55 volts (110 volt centre tapped) is nowhere near as unpleasant if you get a shock off it. In 47 years I've had just one or two
Simplicity is the embodiment of purity and unity
- Shaker Maxims

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 740
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #18 on: April 17, 2018, 02:38 AM »
I would say earth leakage circuit breakers would do the trick without the need to drop the voltage level, avoiding the downside of increasing the amperage requirement (and the downsides that has).
I have worked on jobs in Europe where RCDs on 230 volt power are mandated and I've noted that if the RCD keeps tripping the general approach isn't always to check the cables and the tool to find the fault lies - more often the approach is to "rig" the RCD or even remove it so that work can proceed. Not safe practice at all!
Rigging or removing (electrical or not) safety devices is beyond stupid and shouldn't be done, ever.

It would be 'fine' if it could only kill off the one who actually does it, darwin award style, but sadly it dosn't - everyone that does that (or instructs minions to do it) should be fined, jailed and barred from touching such stuff (or instructing minions) again, ever. IMHO.

More related to the topic: I'm confident that a guard for circular saws can be designed in a way that it dosn't fail quickly (getting stuck closed/open/inbetween, being reshaped, breaking) when being confronted with the reality of the device actually seeing intended use (sawing stuff).

Offline Job and Knock

  • Posts: 117
Re: The guard on my Kapex 120 quit working
« Reply #19 on: April 21, 2018, 01:19 AM »
Problem is just how do you deal with dead knots and small wedge-shaped off cuts that occur in day-to-day mitre saw work? It;s those things which can ping off with great force and jam a guard
Simplicity is the embodiment of purity and unity
- Shaker Maxims