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Author Topic: Kapex life span  (Read 266341 times)

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Offline Bohdan

  • Posts: 921
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #360 on: March 12, 2016, 10:23 PM »
Just a suggestion for those of you that have a Kapex in NA.

The kapex is rated on the Festool US website as being a 1600w machine, same as the Aust 230v machine. The spec sheet says 13A which on 110v equates to only 1430w however the actual current draw will depend on many factors such as how hard it is pushed, how thick the material is, type of blade, how sharp the blade is etc.

As a motor burnout will also depend on how long the high amperage lasts a 13A circuit breaker should protect the motor from burnout, while allowing for the occasional overload.

If a saw fitted with a 13A breaker burns out then I think that you have grounds to visit your lawyer as the saw doesn't perform as advertised.

In the 230v world that would be a 7A breaker.

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Offline Holmz

  • Posts: 4010
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #361 on: March 12, 2016, 10:28 PM »
At the price, the saw should have its own over-temp and overload protection.

Offline WarnerConstCo.

  • Posts: 4076
    • Warner Mill Works
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #362 on: March 12, 2016, 10:32 PM »
Holy crap.

Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7652
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #363 on: March 13, 2016, 12:46 AM »
Holy crap.

@WarnerConstCo.

Checking in and shocked? But you are coming to the bonfire aren't you [wink] [big grin]

Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7652
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #364 on: March 13, 2016, 12:58 AM »

I am NOT attempting to further speculation, I'm saying all this because I fear that Festool possibly still hasn't seen the gravity of this and the potential longer term fall out.

Hi
  If it was not recognised then the post above from me would not have been placed.
rg
Phil

@Phil Beckey

Hi Phil, your response is clear, but Tyler's did seem somewhat "final". Plus we have other geographies involved. Here in Oz we don't stand a chance with any potential KAPEX issues unless there's a Festool HO mandate.

I'd personally (selfishly) love to hear something like (sorry to all of my 110v KAPEX user brothers) that the significant issues with the KAPEX are isolated to the 110V version and that the 240V failures are well within acceptable tolerances.

PS Phil, never in a million years would I question your integrity, intend or the message you're sending - hope you didn't read that into what I was saying.

Offline jmbfestool

  • Posts: 6627
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #365 on: March 13, 2016, 04:34 AM »
I DELETED my own post just so others are aware because I am out on a Stag Do and read some posts while traveling and replied but I decided I rather reply when Im not so tired and had a few drinks in me.

 ;D

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Offline Untidy Shop

  • Posts: 2723
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #366 on: March 13, 2016, 04:43 AM »
Is this the 2016 reality? I have no reason or evidence to suggest yes or no. But does this Thread reflect these 2008 statistics? I find the 32 and 19.3% the more interesting statistics.



From -
http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tool-problems/kapex-problem-poll/msg447881/?topicseen#msg447881
« Last Edit: March 13, 2016, 04:49 AM by Untidy Shop »
If you don't like Signatures, just go to Look and Layout and tick No Signatures.

“The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test. If the machine produces tranquility it's right. If it disturbs you it's wrong until either the machine or your mind is changed.”
― Robert M. Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values

Offline Kev

  • Posts: 7652
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #367 on: March 13, 2016, 06:41 AM »
Is this the 2016 reality? I have no reason or evidence to suggest yes or no. But does this Thread reflect these 2008 statistics? I find the 32 and 19.3% the more interesting statistics.

(Attachment Link)

From -
http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-tool-problems/kapex-problem-poll/msg447881/?topicseen#msg447881


As a Q&A stat that looks like "noise".

I do think the reality is that we've had several very public failures in a pool of unknown relative engagement. I hate to draw on NPS thinking, but the climate is definitely provoking - but in no way conclusive.

Offline Untidy Shop

  • Posts: 2723
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #368 on: March 13, 2016, 07:39 AM »
Fair comment @Kev.
If you don't like Signatures, just go to Look and Layout and tick No Signatures.

“The test of the machine is the satisfaction it gives you. There isn't any other test. If the machine produces tranquility it's right. If it disturbs you it's wrong until either the machine or your mind is changed.”
― Robert M. Pirsig, Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance: An Inquiry Into Values

Offline Phil Beckley

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Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #369 on: March 13, 2016, 09:01 AM »
I DELETED my own post just so others are aware because I am out on a Stag Do and read some posts while traveling and replied but I decided I rather reply when Im not so tired and had a few drinks in me.

 ;D

Hi
 Thank you for clearing that up JMB
  Any posts from here on in need to be relevant and on thread. Just a reminder that I asked the moderators to keep this open and it not to be closed unless it descends into a pointless slanging match. I have every intention of that not happening.
RG
Phil
Festool U.K Employee | Festool UK Website


Offline Phil Beckley

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Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #370 on: March 13, 2016, 09:05 AM »

I am NOT attempting to further speculation, I'm saying all this because I fear that Festool possibly still hasn't seen the gravity of this and the potential longer term fall out.

Hi
  If it was not recognised then the post above from me would not have been placed.
rg
Phil

@Phil Beckey

Hi Phil, your response is clear, but Tyler's did seem somewhat "final". Plus we have other geographies involved. Here in Oz we don't stand a chance with any potential KAPEX issues unless there's a Festool HO mandate.

I'd personally (selfishly) love to hear something like (sorry to all of my 110v KAPEX user brothers) that the significant issues with the KAPEX are isolated to the 110V version and that the 240V failures are well within acceptable tolerances.

PS Phil, never in a million years would I question your integrity, intend or the message you're sending - hope you didn't read that into what I was saying.

Hi
Not taken like that in any way Kev. It is the intention to try and bring some calm to the thread and provide some answers to you guys - I cannot guarantee anything, promise anything all I can do is reach out to the right people and wait.
rg
Phil
Festool U.K Employee | Festool UK Website


Offline Phil Beckley

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Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #371 on: March 13, 2016, 09:08 AM »
Hi
Relevant and on thread please.....all the way through. If the comment is not related to the initial title then please post elsewhere. A lot of areas have been touched on.
rg
Phil
Festool U.K Employee | Festool UK Website


Offline T. Ernsberger

  • Posts: 873
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #372 on: March 13, 2016, 09:27 AM »
I just found something really cool. On amazon you can get an additional warranty for 2 years past the manufacturer warranty for an additional  $88.26 on the Kapex.  It says cover 100% of the repair with free shipping. 

Offline tomscf

  • Posts: 41
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #373 on: March 13, 2016, 09:52 AM »
...The Kapex had been opened up various wires removed from position and I think cut or trapped...This meant to diagnose the fault it had to be re assembled - time = money...
    Festool U.K receive Kapex in for service/repair in many different states of condition. Some, believe me do not resemble a Kapex when they arrive and have been used to cut all manner of materials including steel with grinding discs, Quartz with diamond blades, and even used with blades that literally have no teeth left - I use these blades on dealer training courses to show what is or is not good.
rg
Phil


Something like this I'm guessing? Came across this this morning :

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/festool-plunge-saw-/182051262029?nav=SEARCH

Doesn't need an engineer, it needs a funeral director.

Offline Festoolfootstool

  • Posts: 2076
  • The trouble with Bob is its all about Bob
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #374 on: March 13, 2016, 10:04 AM »
...The Kapex had been opened up various wires removed from position and I think cut or trapped...This meant to diagnose the fault it had to be re assembled - time = money...
    Festool U.K receive Kapex in for service/repair in many different states of condition. Some, believe me do not resemble a Kapex when they arrive and have been used to cut all manner of materials including steel with grinding discs, Quartz with diamond blades, and even used with blades that literally have no teeth left - I use these blades on dealer training courses to show what is or is not good.
rg
Phil


Something like this I'm guessing? Came across this this morning :

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/festool-plunge-saw-/182051262029?nav=SEARCH

Doesn't need an engineer, it needs a funeral director.

Well spotted another kapex with a burnt up motor may be the brushes lol. it has a service label hanging off it..

I t hink i'm right in saying that festool send them back in bits,think it might be illegal to reassemble without repair.
« Last Edit: March 13, 2016, 10:07 AM by Festoolfootstool »
If the milk turns out to be sour, I ain't the kind of **** to drink it.......

Why do Festool accessories only have a two month guarantee here in the UK ?

Offline Phil Beckley

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Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #375 on: March 13, 2016, 10:15 AM »
...The Kapex had been opened up various wires removed from position and I think cut or trapped...This meant to diagnose the fault it had to be re assembled - time = money...
    Festool U.K receive Kapex in for service/repair in many different states of condition. Some, believe me do not resemble a Kapex when they arrive and have been used to cut all manner of materials including steel with grinding discs, Quartz with diamond blades, and even used with blades that literally have no teeth left - I use these blades on dealer training courses to show what is or is not good.
rg
Phil


Something like this I'm guessing? Came across this this morning :

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/festool-plunge-saw-/182051262029?nav=SEARCH

Doesn't need an engineer, it needs a funeral director.

Well spotted another kapex with a burnt up motor may be the brushes lol. it has a service label hanging off it..

I t hink i'm right in saying that festool send them back in bits,think it might be illegal to reassemble without repair.

Hi
 Correct - if the quote is not accepted the machine is sent back stripped down. Under regs we cannot return a machine that is not in working order to the customer. (and no comments relating to Kapex and working order please!!)
rg
Phil
Festool U.K Employee | Festool UK Website


Offline Deansocial

  • Posts: 2114
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #376 on: March 13, 2016, 10:30 AM »
I have waited to see what comes of thia for a while and in the end said sod it and ordered a kapex this morning. Its only money at the end of the day.

Offline tomscf

  • Posts: 41
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #377 on: March 13, 2016, 10:41 AM »

I have waited to see what comes of thia for a while and in the end said sod it and ordered a kapex this morning. Its only money at the end of the day.

That's the spirit!

I'm sure you won't regret it - I certainly don't getting mine.

Offline tomscf

  • Posts: 41
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #378 on: March 13, 2016, 10:50 AM »

...The Kapex had been opened up various wires removed from position and I think cut or trapped...This meant to diagnose the fault it had to be re assembled - time = money...
    Festool U.K receive Kapex in for service/repair in many different states of condition. Some, believe me do not resemble a Kapex when they arrive and have been used to cut all manner of materials including steel with grinding discs, Quartz with diamond blades, and even used with blades that literally have no teeth left - I use these blades on dealer training courses to show what is or is not good.
rg
Phil


Something like this I'm guessing? Came across this this morning :

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/festool-plunge-saw-/182051262029?nav=SEARCH

Doesn't need an engineer, it needs a funeral director.

Well spotted another kapex with a burnt up motor may be the brushes lol. it has a service label hanging off it..

I t hink i'm right in saying that festool send them back in bits,think it might be illegal to reassemble without repair.

Hi
 Correct - if the quote is not accepted the machine is sent back stripped down. Under regs we cannot return a machine that is not in working order to the customer. (and no comments relating to Kapex and working order please!!)
rg
Phil

Ah - good to know.
Shame this guy didn't accept the quote though. Given that these saws, at least for now, seem to hold their value pretty well, I'm sure he'd have a better return on the sale if it was at least in one piece (assuming he'd still want to sell it).

Offline bobfog

  • Posts: 838
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #379 on: March 13, 2016, 10:57 AM »
...The Kapex had been opened up various wires removed from position and I think cut or trapped...This meant to diagnose the fault it had to be re assembled - time = money...
    Festool U.K receive Kapex in for service/repair in many different states of condition. Some, believe me do not resemble a Kapex when they arrive and have been used to cut all manner of materials including steel with grinding discs, Quartz with diamond blades, and even used with blades that literally have no teeth left - I use these blades on dealer training courses to show what is or is not good.
rg
Phil


Something like this I'm guessing? Came across this this morning :

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/festool-plunge-saw-/182051262029?nav=SEARCH

Doesn't need an engineer, it needs a funeral director.

Well spotted another kapex with a burnt up motor may be the brushes lol. it has a service label hanging off it..

I t hink i'm right in saying that festool send them back in bits,think it might be illegal to reassemble without repair.

Hi
 Correct - if the quote is not accepted the machine is sent back stripped down. Under regs we cannot return a machine that is not in working order to the customer. (and no comments relating to Kapex and working order please!!)
rg
Phil

This is interesting! So, if a fully assembled Kapex comes into the repair centre with a dead motor and is striped down to establish the motor is faulty, it's against the law to reassemble it to the same condition it was received and return to the customer, should the decline the repair based on the quote?

 What particular regulation is it you're referring to?
« Last Edit: March 13, 2016, 10:59 AM by bobfog »

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #380 on: March 13, 2016, 11:17 AM »
The nit picking in this thread is frankly both annoying and amazing.  Every syllable is being analyzed for some sort of hidden meaning or to get a jab in.

I would venture a guess that it is an insurance and liability issue versus a law.

This thread and similar threads lately really makes me wonder why I have bothered trying to make this place a better and friendly place for all sorts of users for more than 5 years.

I think that I will go watch some Gordon Ramsey episodes on Hulu.

« Last Edit: March 13, 2016, 11:19 AM by Peter Halle »

Offline Festoolfootstool

  • Posts: 2076
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Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #381 on: March 13, 2016, 11:30 AM »
Good idea Peter
you will find things will sort themselves out soon enough with or without your intervention enjoy your sunday.
If the milk turns out to be sour, I ain't the kind of **** to drink it.......

Why do Festool accessories only have a two month guarantee here in the UK ?

Offline mastercabman

  • Posts: 1854
  • NORFOLK,VA
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #382 on: March 13, 2016, 11:40 AM »
...The Kapex had been opened up various wires removed from position and I think cut or trapped...This meant to diagnose the fault it had to be re assembled - time = money...
    Festool U.K receive Kapex in for service/repair in many different states of condition. Some, believe me do not resemble a Kapex when they arrive and have been used to cut all manner of materials including steel with grinding discs, Quartz with diamond blades, and even used with blades that literally have no teeth left - I use these blades on dealer training courses to show what is or is not good.
rg
Phil


Something like this I'm guessing? Came across this this morning :

http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm/festool-plunge-saw-/182051262029?nav=SEARCH

Doesn't need an engineer, it needs a funeral director.

Well spotted another kapex with a burnt up motor may be the brushes lol. it has a service label hanging off it..

I t hink i'm right in saying that festool send them back in bits,think it might be illegal to reassemble without repair.

Hi
 Correct - if the quote is not accepted the machine is sent back stripped down. Under regs we cannot return a machine that is not in working order to the customer. (and no comments relating to Kapex and working order please!!)
rg
Phil

This is interesting! So, if a fully assembled Kapex comes into the repair centre with a dead motor and is striped down to establish the motor is faulty, it's against the law to reassemble it to the same condition it was received and return to the customer, should the decline the repair based on the quote?

 What particular regulation is it you're referring to?
It's policy
Any repair places does the same thing
If you send a tool with a burned motor and they noticed that the plug is missing the ground prong for example they cannot return the tool if it's not fixed
They cannot return a tool that has missing parts (except of course accessories/blades/bits)
I don't understand!?! I keep cutting it,and it's still too short!

Offline D Wood

  • Posts: 139
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #383 on: March 13, 2016, 11:54 AM »
If my Kapex burnt up under warranty I would not complain if it was fixed, which I am assuming it would be. If it was out of warranty it would cost me 368CAD plus shipping and taxes for a field, brushes and armature. (as per EKAT) Oh and as someone said 15 min to tear it apart and 15 min to assemble. I don't see the big deal. In the mean time I have used the saw to make cuts that other saws cannot, saved lots of time on cleanup and have happy customers because their home is cleaner, and have not had to lug around a heavier saw that is inferior to the Kapex. It's an expensive saw and it does a great job. My [2cents]

PS If someone wants to sell their burnt Kapex PM me

Offline Phil Beckley

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Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #384 on: March 13, 2016, 11:59 AM »
The nit picking in this thread is frankly both annoying and amazing.  Every syllable is being analyzed for some sort of hidden meaning or to get a jab in.

I would venture a guess that it is an insurance and liability issue versus a law.

This thread and similar threads lately really makes me wonder why I have bothered trying to make this place a better and friendly place for all sorts of users for more than 5 years.

I think that I will go watch some Gordon Ramsey episodes on Hulu.

Hi
 Correct - all to do with liability and the E.U supply of machinery regs. I will put this on my check list to come back with.

rg
Phil
Festool U.K Employee | Festool UK Website


Offline Phil Beckley

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Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #385 on: March 13, 2016, 12:03 PM »
Good idea Peter
you will find things will sort themselves out soon enough with or without your intervention enjoy your sunday.

Peters and Seths work on here as moderators prevents many topics going the wrong way.........without these two guys there will be no forum.
We all should remember that.....
rg
Phil

  Also remember what I said a few posts back - keep this thread on topic and no side swipes in any form otherwise I will ask it is closed.....just saying as a polite reminder at this point.....
Festool U.K Employee | Festool UK Website


Offline windmill man

  • Posts: 671
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #386 on: March 13, 2016, 12:23 PM »
Ok People,

Can we give this thread a rest now  Phil Beckly is going to find some information  So how about we give him chance, first, before another load of usless contributions are made.

Can we also stop p*88*ng off the moderators too They are doing a thankless task here and now Festool USA is showing no leadership the brunt of the forum seems to be on them

So take a chill pill and politly wait for some news


John
« Last Edit: March 13, 2016, 03:32 PM by windmill man »

Offline jmbfestool

  • Posts: 6627
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #387 on: March 13, 2016, 03:09 PM »
I have waited to see what comes of thia for a while and in the end said sod it and ordered a kapex this morning. Its only money at the end of the day.

I know you liked using my kapex and since then you always wanted one. How long ago was it? Few years ago now ? so I know you wont be disappointed! it is an amazing all round chop saw.
I cant find an alternative apart from this new Metabo one might be a good contender. I wasnt aware of this saw untill now. So would like to see one in person to compare although the stand for it is crap and doesnt come close to the UG stand
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Offline jimbouk

  • Posts: 346
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #388 on: March 13, 2016, 04:24 PM »
Yeah the ug stand is awesome for site.
BHC 18, TSC 55REB, OF 1400, MIDI, TS55, TRION, Df500, CSX...

Offline Laminator

  • Posts: 338
Re: Kapex life span
« Reply #389 on: March 13, 2016, 04:25 PM »
I have a Kapex that does not see a lot of use and when it is used, I would call it "lightweight" work.  I hope it don't burn up as it would be the first tool burned up in my 30 year tenure of using power tools. 
 Having just bought a UG stand set last week, I guess I have confidence that it will last and if it burns up, I'll be mad for sure, but I will just have to limp along with my makita ls1310 until it gets back from repair.  The Kapex does what I need it to do and I could have any saw I want, as it "just money" as has been said before.
 I just recalibrated it  (as it is 5 years old)  with the 5 cut test and now its less than .001 in out on an 8" block.
   I hope Festool gets it sorted out for everybody.