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Author Topic: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.  (Read 4997 times)

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Offline erock

  • Posts: 1254
Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« on: October 21, 2016, 05:01 PM »
Hey guys.  I wanted to check with anyone using the Vecturo to see if the sparking inside the housing is normal.

I don't use the Vecturo very often.  Today I've been using it for a flooring demo and it's very hot.  Almost too hot to handle.  And I notice a lot of sparking going on inside.   Here is a quick video.   The sound level is high....so you may want to turn your volume down before you watch.  Any input you can offer would be great.   But I'm thinking this may be my first time using Festools service center.

I shot this video with my phone....



Thanks,
Eric

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Offline mleny77

  • Posts: 52
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #1 on: October 21, 2016, 05:11 PM »
I have a Dewalt version and it gets hot after a few minuets of use. I've also used another brand and had the same experience. Theirs  a lot of movement in those machines and the energy has to go somewhere.  [unsure]

Offline erock

  • Posts: 1254
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #2 on: October 21, 2016, 05:42 PM »

Well, I'm thinking I will have to send this in for service.

I just used my Porter-Cable multi-tool for the past half hour or so......it's not hot nor is it sparking like the Vecturo.

Sucks.....the Porter-Cable has only 1/3 the dangling man marbles that the Vecturo has.   So it's take me a little longer to make a cut with the Porter-Cable that the Vecturo would fly through.

Stuff happens.   Oh-well.

Eric

Offline ScotF

  • Posts: 2390
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #3 on: October 21, 2016, 06:54 PM »
The sparking is from the brushes, obviously. If it is under the warranty and you do not need it then no harm sending it in. I have a couple of tools where I see sparking. Could be dirt and dust or some bad brushes. The unit should not be overly hot in the body of the machine, but on my Fein the head can get very warm with use. Please share what service tells you when you hear back.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 3982
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #4 on: October 21, 2016, 06:56 PM »
If the Venturo is fairly new and has had little use, maybe it's just the brushes bedding in.  [unsure]  Can't explain the heat issue though.

Offline Rick Christopherson

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Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #5 on: October 21, 2016, 07:14 PM »
The amount of sparking shown in your video is typical for any brushed motor. That's their purpose. They connect and disconnect the armature windings as the motor rotates. Whenever you break an electrical circuit, you will get a spark. That circuit inside the motor is opening and closing 10's of thousands of times per second.

The heat issue is more subjective, but depending on how extreme it is, it may be typical. I assume it is mainly coming from the gear head. The motor will of course heat up, but so will the gear head. You are taking a rotational movement and converting it into a linear movement. Doing so will cause friction and heating.

Offline antss

  • Posts: 1453
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2016, 07:29 PM »
It doesn't sound abnormal to me, maybe it doesn't come across in the video though.

Part of the reason it cuts better is the larger/longer oscillation arc as well as the wattage.

Offline Xoncention

  • Posts: 111
  • Build a bridge and get over it...
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2016, 07:39 PM »

I don't use the Vecturo very often.  Today I've been using it for a flooring demo and it's very hot.  Almost too hot to handle. 


It should not be getting too hot to handle - it is not that type of electrical device.  The noise is normal for the machine.  That quantity of sparks may not be normal.  I used to machine armatures and the affect of a properly machined commutator and proper undercutting on commutator on electrical efficiency was staggering.  In a properly designed armature, the segments of the commutator limit the sparks as this is wasted energy in the switching process.  It may also be indicative of problems elsewhere.  In high quality motors there is almost no sparking.  For example, in my OF2200 I observe an occasional spark. There are several explanations, Brush Holders not equally spaced, Brush holders off electrical neutral, Brush Holders damaged or dirty, Holders too far from commutator surface, Wrong interpole strength, Overloads, Defective armature windings, Incorrect spring pressure, Poor undercutting of commutator, Foreign material on commutator surface, Black commutator films, Brushes binding in holder, Restricted brush motion, Out-of-round commutator, but the safest course would be to have the device electrically tested - if still under a service agreement, then return it.

Offline erock

  • Posts: 1254
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #8 on: October 21, 2016, 07:48 PM »
Now that I have more time.  Let me share what I'm doing.

I made my own flooring out of 18mm (3/4" or 23/32"  [tongue])  cabinet grade plywood.
I routed a groove in the plywood and used 5mm ply as my tongue.

Here's a pic of what I'm removing.....




I was using the depth stop with then round saw blade for long straight cuts (500 139 ).   I was cutting along the joint cutting through the 5mm tongue.
The flooring is 2' wide by 4' long.  I made one 4' long cut and one 2' long cut.  Then I notice that the Vecturo was getting hot.
After I made two cuts, I thought the blade wasn't the proper blade.  I removed the depth stop and switched to a 50/65/J Japan style blade ( 500 131 ).   Obviously, a more aggressive blade than the round blade.  After another 4' long cut, the Vecturo got hotter. 
When I mean by hot.....is the adapter that holds the blade in place, was hot enough to just about made it difficult to touch when I changed the blade.   The housing was hot both at the front and rear near.  Hotter in the front where all the action is, but warmer than I recall near the plug-it cord.



@Rick Christopherson ,   would you consider it normal if the sparks where "spitting" red sparks every once in a while ? ?
The blue sparks I recall seeing them when I used the Vecturo while cutting holes in OSB for electoral boxes when I build my shop.  But I don't recall seeing red sparks, kinda spitting out.   I was hoping to catch the red sparks with my video...but no luck.   

Thanks,
Eric

Offline Rick Christopherson

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Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #9 on: October 21, 2016, 07:59 PM »
No, red sparks should not be good. That could be a sign of the commutator bars sluffing material. You are using this for some very long and difficult cuts. I don't think it is because anything is wrong with the tool, but more that you are pushing its capabilities toward the edge of the envelope. It's not supposed to be a saw. So you may want to give it a few more breaks during such long and deep cuts.

Offline erock

  • Posts: 1254
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2016, 08:04 PM »
No, red sparks should not be good. That could be a sign of the commutator bars sluffing material. You are using this for some very long and difficult cuts. I don't think it is because anything is wrong with the tool, but more that you are pushing its capabilities toward the edge of the envelope. It's not supposed to be a saw. So you may want to give it a few more breaks during such long and deep cuts.


But it's a German engineered tool !    [unsure]    It's bullet proof !   [tongue]

I gave it a long break,  I finished up with my Porter Cable.    Thanks for your input.

Eric

Offline erock

  • Posts: 1254
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2016, 10:01 PM »
Well,  I let the Vectruo cool off.  It's been well over 2 hours since it was on. 
Powered it up, no blade attached so I didn't cut anything and within 20 seconds, I had little red sparks.  I let it run for about a minute, had a couple more red sparks within the minute.  I moved the speed from 6  to 1 and back to 6 watching the blue spark move with the speed setting.  So I can see how the blue spark is normal.  It's the red sparks that have me concerned. And how hot it got.
Since the Vecturo was release in the U.S in December of 2014, I'm under warranty.

The great news.....I went to the Festool USA website and was able to fill out my warranty/repair form.....WITHOUT the need to talk to someone.  LOVED THAT !!!  I HATE.....HATE....talking on the phone.....hate it !     So thank you very much Festool USA for making the process of returning something for service such an easy task.   Fill out your info....print a UPS label, put the tool in a box and ship it.
Piece of cake baby !   I'll ship the Vectruo off on Monday. 

I'm not mad that the Vecturo could possible have a problem.   Considering the number of Festool tools I own and use since 2010....this is my first issue I've ever had with a Festool tool......pretty good track record. 

Stuff happens......which is why I still have all my non Festool tools as backups.     [embarassed]

Thanks for everyone who gave a response and tried helping me !    [thumbs up]

Eric

Offline Scott Burt

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Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #12 on: October 21, 2016, 10:09 PM »
I think I'd finish her up with a circ saw and beater blade. In fact, I think I'd have started there!  [scared]

Offline erock

  • Posts: 1254
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #13 on: October 21, 2016, 10:12 PM »
I think I'd finish her up with a circ saw and beater blade. In fact, I think I'd have started there!  [scared]


Do painter know how to use a circular saw ? ? ?      [tongue]   [poke]


Offline Scott Burt

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Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #14 on: October 21, 2016, 10:13 PM »
I think I'd finish her up with a circ saw and beater blade. In fact, I think I'd have started there!  [scared]


Do painter know how to use a circular saw ? ? ?      [tongue]   [poke]

Yah, probably as much time on the tools as most folks who enjoy talking about tools.  [big grin]

Offline erock

  • Posts: 1254
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #15 on: October 21, 2016, 10:16 PM »
I think I'd finish her up with a circ saw and beater blade. In fact, I think I'd have started there!  [scared]


Do painter know how to use a circular saw ? ? ?      [tongue]   [poke]

Yah, probably as much time on the tools as most folks who enjoy talking about tools.  [big grin]

All jokes aside.... I did think about dragging the TS55, CT midi and a few rails into the house.    But that would have been the easy way.   I don't use the Vecturo much so I wanted to let it out and play.    I guess I asked too much of it.   Lesson learned.   

Offline Scott Burt

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Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #16 on: October 21, 2016, 10:20 PM »
I think I'd finish her up with a circ saw and beater blade. In fact, I think I'd have started there!  [scared]


Do painter know how to use a circular saw ? ? ?      [tongue]   [poke]

Yah, probably as much time on the tools as most folks who enjoy talking about tools.  [big grin]

All jokes aside.... I did think about dragging the TS55, CT midi and a few rails into the house.    But that would have been the easy way.   I don't use the Vecturo much so I wanted to let it out and play.    I guess I asked too much of it.   Lesson learned.

I've done quite a fair amount of demo, with a particular emphasis on floors and subfloors.

Starting with a circ and finishing with a multi would be more practical.

Its a tool selection thing.

When I was younger and chose the wrong tool or didn't use it right, my old man would say:

"Sometimes it ain't the arrow, it's the Indian."

Not that that's the case here, but I always crack up when I think of him saying that in regard to tools.


Offline erock

  • Posts: 1254
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #17 on: October 21, 2016, 10:24 PM »
I think I'd finish her up with a circ saw and beater blade. In fact, I think I'd have started there!  [scared]


Do painter know how to use a circular saw ? ? ?      [tongue]   [poke]

Yah, probably as much time on the tools as most folks who enjoy talking about tools.  [big grin]

All jokes aside.... I did think about dragging the TS55, CT midi and a few rails into the house.    But that would have been the easy way.   I don't use the Vecturo much so I wanted to let it out and play.    I guess I asked too much of it.   Lesson learned.

I've done quite a fair amount of demo, with a particular emphasis on floors and subfloors.

Starting with a circ and finishing with a multi would be more practical.

Its a tool selection thing.

When I was younger and chose the wrong tool or didn't use it right, my old man would say:

"Sometimes it ain't the arrow, it's the Indian."

Not that that's the case here, but I always crack up when I think of him saying that in regard to tools.


 [thumbs up]    "Sometimes it ain't the arrow, it's the Indian."    [thumbs up]     I like it ! ! !

Offline Milvus

  • Posts: 13
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #18 on: October 22, 2016, 10:40 AM »
Hi.

I haven't had the vecturo for too much time ( mine is 230v version), but I can assure you that mine gets quite hot too. In fact I have to hold front metal housing with gloves. And it doesn't need too much time to warm.

About sparks, mine does the same that yours, but I can't see red sparks.

Regards.

Offline DzordanoBruno

  • Posts: 140
Re: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing.
« Reply #19 on: October 22, 2016, 12:47 PM »
Send it. I have FMM cca. 3 years. My FMM don't sparks and hot is only gear head.

Offline erock

  • Posts: 1254
Re: UPDATE: Vecturo running hot and sparking inside the housing. FIXED
« Reply #20 on: October 28, 2016, 06:18 PM »
 UPDATE:

I sent my Vecturo in on Monday.  Festool serviced received it on Tuesday.  I received the Vecturo on Thursday.   [big grin]

Sweet freakin' service.  Wicked fast turnaround.  Plus, it helps that I live in Ohio, about 6 hours from Festool HQ.

Anyways, the invoice stated that the Gear box was serviced, but the postcard in the box stated the gear case assembly was serviced.  I checked the ekat system and could not find either one, I can only find a Gear housing, piece #6.   LOL !

So it's fixed and I'm ready to use it........whenever it's needed.    Next time I guess I won't run it longer that a few minutes without longer breaks between uses.  Lesson learned.   [embarassed]   [doh]

Eric