Author Topic: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.  (Read 56266 times)

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Offline Brad Evans

  • Posts: 75
  • SF Bay Area
    • Urban PhotoBlog: Citysnaps
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #150 on: May 29, 2008, 11:03 PM »
>>>What a bunch of hatefull, spitefull old ladies!  I hope you're all proud of your "contributions"

Not a bit of hate or spite in any of the listed comments - of which a couple were mine.

Why so angry at others expressing constructive opinions, ideas, and suggestions?
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Offline Grinding One

  • Posts: 40
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #151 on: May 29, 2008, 11:19 PM »
These are my .02 cents worth.....
  Festool prices  : Take our dollar and transfer to Euro`s ,what do you get? Our money is way lower in exchange.While I was in Germany in the 60`s one dollar was 4 marks 10 Phennings ...that was like 4 quarters and a nickle for each dollar.Later in the 70`s one dollar was 2 marks in exchange....and I`ll bet its fallen more now too....so when you say Festool cost a lot ,thats not totally right.Our money isn`t worth much anymore.
 Next point,Are they good tools? Well you only have to used them after useing other brands to see the differance.When I first started buying tools I couldn`t find one person to tell me which were best to spend money on....So I went to cabinet shops to see what they used.Thats how I bought tools,the tool mags. wouldn`t tell you because of advertizement loss if they did.
  Now I thought this thread was going to be a good one because people would tell you what experiance they had ,likes or dislikes...it went to heck so fast,and that is sad.I find that the reason may be because people don`t like to spend big money to be told they bought a lemon....so they feel like suckers to be sucked into spending the big money on junk.Well I for one like Festools I own,they work fine for me,yet even with the pricey side of them.I feel you get what you pay for....so whats wrong with telling someone if you have a problem?Its something that if you have a close call with a tool I`d like to know what to watch out for....
  Well thats what I have to say,and Nick ,being a fellow Illinois fellow I liked your Idea.Hope you stick around!!
How many tools are enough

Offline ccmviking

  • Posts: 411
    • Blue River Cabinetry Kitchen and Bath
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #152 on: May 29, 2008, 11:30 PM »
I wonder what ol' Ned Young thinks about all this.  I haven't heard him chime in for a while.  Are you out there Ned???

Chris...

Offline Daviddubya

  • Posts: 704
  • Arizona, USA
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #153 on: May 29, 2008, 11:41 PM »
...did you read that list? I ask because you said I "Chose" to call those quotes "Hateful, spiteful" - what the heck would you call them? Supportive?, constructive?, encouraging?

Of course I read the list - several times - looking for anything that could be called hateful and/or spiteful.  I found one that I thought was distasteful.  What would I call them?  Certainly NOT hateful and/or spiteful.

Quote
If there is anything in my list of quotes that you are not proud of, I'm not responsible for that.

I have no problem with anything I said.

Quote
My point is not to pick on you personally David...

I don't think you were picking on me.  I simply think your hateful/spiteful reaction to most of the comments you quoted is off base and erroneous.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2008, 11:44 PM by Daviddubya »
David W. Falkenstein
in Cave Creek, AZ, USA

Offline pmkierst

  • Posts: 46
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #154 on: May 29, 2008, 11:52 PM »
I don't get it. I didn't buy a MFT 800 because of comments and descriptions I found here; I decided it probably didn't fit my needs. I have held off on a OF1400 for some similar reasons (though did pull the trigger on a MFK 700, in spite of complaints voiced here).

Clearly this is not festoolsucks.com; it is hardly surprising that a festool owners group should be somewhat  enthusiastic about their tools (but you should see Lie-Nielsen vrs. Veritas wars, this place got nothing on dogmatic devotion to a brand), but I have seen lots of careful consideration of the tools. Sure it isn't a loud "THIS TOOL SUCKS", but I think there are lots of reasonably honest assessments here. Better then most, really.

As to price; well, I have found most people who moan loudly about offshoring of jobs seem to moan loudly about european or american  (or Canadian for that matter) made powertool prices, too. You can't have your jobs and your cheap stuff; something has to give.

Offline vteknical

  • Festool Employee
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  • Posts: 160
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #155 on: May 30, 2008, 12:14 AM »
I see that some of the Nick flamers get quite upset when they are called out on the words they chose to type out.

In fact, they respond defensive just as Nick.  How many times in this thread was Nick re-explaining his thought process.
Doesn't feel good does it?

The reality is harsh words were not used towards Nick so does that give people right to respond with a condescending tone?

For me, I will remain an outsider looking in. Too many dominant stubborn Types A's types around here to allow variety to come in with new a perspective.  Don't get me wrong, I'm type A border line nuts too.  How else can you explain justifying buying these expensive tools.  

I find it amusing when a long time contributors words are taken as the gospel.  Yet I bet Nick has more experience and creative juice than many around, definitely including me.  Funny how when he started posting links to his work the hairs on peoples arse's popped up to take notice.  I bet some thought that Nick was just a poor SOB who nothing better to do than to post here.  

In the end, this thread would not be where it's at if some of the members did not have a vested interest or hidden agendas in seeing it shredded to pieces.  You keep hearing their is no cronyism going on but yet actions keep telling you different.

Yes.............. this Forum lost a valuable contributor today.  Oh yeah..........I had quite a bit of quality control issues with the product and it's service...... and yes Festool made it right.  Doesn't mean I'm flaming Festool.  Just asking for what I paid for is all.

Victor




« Last Edit: May 30, 2008, 12:17 AM by vteknical »

Offline Qwas

  • Retailer
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  • Posts: 644
    • Qwas Products
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #156 on: May 30, 2008, 12:34 AM »
Most of you still don't seem to get it. You need to really READ his starting post:
I constantly hear great things about Festools in the Forum. How about tempering that with real experience and some negative aspects.  I am not looking for arguments or the fixes for my problems. ...

Please keep your responses  to the problems only, at least in this thread. ...

He asked for no arguments or comments about him or the purpose of the thread. Then he politely hints if you have problems with this thread then start a new one and complain. And now, 7 pages later, that's all we still have going on. He then tried starting another thread asking for the same. Same thing all over.

He was frustrated by everyone's lack of reading the initial thread. Then he got mad and vented on some members and that certainly didn't help matters. There is no telling what messages got PMed to him that also added to his frustration and anger. No telling what was going on his personal life either.

Nick is right. When we pay these kind of ridiculous prices for a power tool, we should expect perfection. Festool likes to assure us they care and strive for excellence. So what is the beef with this thread??? And if everyone thinks these tools are "God-Like" perfection, then there would be no responses to the thread.

I'm still trying to figure out the alignment issues so many seem to have with a new Domino, even though the factory says every Domino is aligned and a test cut is made. I will not buy a Domino until I know this percentage is small. I have a lot of questions about this.  There is no way I'm starting that thread now.

Offline Qwas

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  • Posts: 644
    • Qwas Products
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #157 on: May 30, 2008, 01:00 AM »
I wonder what ol' Ned Young thinks about all this.  I haven't heard him chime in for a while.  Are you out there Ned???

Chris...

It appears Ned is no longer with us, check the members list. All his old posts show as "Ned, Guest".

Offline Daviddubya

  • Posts: 704
  • Arizona, USA
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #158 on: May 30, 2008, 01:43 AM »
...He asked for no arguments or comments about him or the purpose of the thread....

Has it occurred to many of you that Nick was wrong to expect that he could control the content of this, or any other, forum thread simply because he started the thread?  Threads are a collection of many individual's expressions, opinions, viewpoints and/or thoughts.  Threads take on a life of their own, especially threads with 165 posts and counting and over 4000 views and counting.  What Nick asked for in his initial post in this thread was never going to happen.  And, son of a gun, it has not happened.  What a surprise!
David W. Falkenstein
in Cave Creek, AZ, USA

Offline Qwas

  • Retailer
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  • Posts: 644
    • Qwas Products
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #159 on: May 30, 2008, 02:01 AM »
...He asked for no arguments or comments about him or the purpose of the thread....

Has it occurred to many of you that Nick was wrong to expect that he could control the content of this, or any other, forum thread simply because he started the thread?  Threads are a collection of many individual's expressions, opinions, viewpoints and/or thoughts.  Threads take on a life of their own, especially threads with 165 posts and counting and over 4000 views and counting.  What Nick asked for in his initial post in this thread was never going to happen.  And, son of a gun, it has not happened.  What a surprise!

So if I start a thread on the Trion Jigsaw, I should expect the conversation to be about the TS-55??? Of course not!

And if I start a thread on the Trion Jigsaw and specifically ask for no one to discuss the TS-55, then I should STILL expect the conversation to be about the TS-55???
« Last Edit: May 30, 2008, 02:03 AM by Qwas »

Offline jo041326

  • Posts: 76
  • Czech republic
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #160 on: May 30, 2008, 03:13 AM »
Hi,
it's really interesting. This thread should be about complaints with Festool's tools and you just discuss about nothing. It's clear to me there are people supported by Festool and they must (want) see just positives. Some others should like be in the same position. But what about the rest?

So here are my complaints:

1. MFT 1080
the ruler sucks. it is not sturdy and hard to square to the rail. If you bump too much against it, it's slightly out of square. The miter settings posibility is absolutely useless.

2. CT22
I'd like bigger front wheels.

3. Trion 300
Not so easy blade tuning for perpendicular cuts. The cuts are not so perpendicular as advertised (maybe my error).

4. Domino
The cross stop should be from metall, not plastic. If you push too much, it flexes and you end with bigger mistakes in domino positions. I'd like longer dominoes.

5. OF 1400
The micro adjustment should work as on 2200. The turret has some play (don't know correct english expression) so if you want use it, you must push on it and than tighten the router.

6. Kapex
A little bit underpowered. I'd like at least 2 kW motor.


Josef

(I have C22, C12, Trion 300, Domino, RO150, MFT 1080, OF1400, Kapex, TS55 and a lot of accessories).
« Last Edit: May 30, 2008, 03:14 AM by jo041326 »

Offline tallgrass

  • Posts: 737
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #161 on: May 30, 2008, 03:43 AM »
Josef
what plastic cross stops on the domino? do you have the new one that lacks metal pins?  i would like to know.the trion, i get your complaint.....i have found that the blade tension alignment is very important and your technique is critical if you want the perfect cut......i am still working on it, at least on thick stuff..... and upon further consideration the wheels on the cts could be bette,r considering the load when tools are stacked on  top.

ps these are the kind of comments that should be posted......in my opinion.......

Offline jo041326

  • Posts: 76
  • Czech republic
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #162 on: May 30, 2008, 03:46 AM »
Hi Tallgrass,
I mean cross stop as an accessory (493488). I have a metall pins on my Domino.
Josef

Offline Robert Robinson

  • Posts: 722
  • southern Indiana, U.S.A.
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #163 on: May 30, 2008, 05:26 AM »
I will miss Nick, I hope he comes back. I don't blame anyone here, I believe there was more than this thread bothering him. If you look at some of his posts before starting this thread, you could tell something was bothering him. When he got hurt recently, he said he was thinking about work, and family issues, and then a board kicked back on him. All I can ask is that everyone keep that in mind when discussing who said what in this thread, and look at some of his other posts, maybe read between the lines on them.
TS-55, FS-KS angle unit, 55 inch guide rail, Domino (pin style), 3 Domino systainer assortments(one sipo set),Multi-position Guide Stop 20, Domiplate , PSB-300, FOGtainer 4, CXS set

Offline Robert Robinson

  • Posts: 722
  • southern Indiana, U.S.A.
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #164 on: May 30, 2008, 05:34 AM »
The comment I am referring to was in the thread "table saw kicked me hard.." in general chat and random ideas, response number 22. I will see if this link works.

http://festoolownersgroup.com/index.php?topic=3510.0
« Last Edit: May 30, 2008, 05:36 AM by robtonya »
TS-55, FS-KS angle unit, 55 inch guide rail, Domino (pin style), 3 Domino systainer assortments(one sipo set),Multi-position Guide Stop 20, Domiplate , PSB-300, FOGtainer 4, CXS set

Offline Matthew Schenker

  • Posts: 2619
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #165 on: May 30, 2008, 06:46 AM »
I will miss Nick, I hope he comes back. I don't blame anyone here, I believe there was more than this thread bothering him. If you look at some of his posts before starting this thread, you could tell something was bothering him. When he got hurt recently, he said he was thinking about work, and family issues, and then a board kicked back on him. All I can ask is that everyone keep that in mind when discussing who said what in this thread, and look at some of his other posts, maybe read between the lines on them.

Very good points!  I've been asking people to not assume Nick left the forum because of this thread.  The fact is, whatever happened in this thread, Nick received a warm welcome in many other areas of the forum.  He and I had very good conversations offline in which I encouraged him to keep posting and told him how much I appreciate his involvement.

Another thing, Nick was a judge in the monthly tool contests and was very much a leader in that effort.  Nick shared his opinions freely about the contest.  But when he left the forum, I heard nothing from him.  So let's stop assuming Nick left the forum because of this discussion.

Also, let's make this discussion about the subject itself: issues people want to report about the tools.

Matthew
FOG Designer and Creator

Offline Matthew Schenker

  • Posts: 2619
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #166 on: May 30, 2008, 07:25 AM »
Everyone,
I am going to combine this discussion with Nick's original discussion on the same subject.  They are simply a continuation of the same points, and do not need to be in separate discussions.
Matthew
FOG Designer and Creator

Offline Roger Savatteri

  • Posts: 506
    • www.savatteridesigns.com
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #167 on: May 30, 2008, 09:43 AM »
Whoa!!!!!

I'm gone for a few days and I take a peak and I surmise that Nick has decided to leave?

I am very sad about this and truly hope Nick would reconsider.

Roger
Los Angeles, California

Offline tallgrass

  • Posts: 737
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #168 on: May 30, 2008, 11:34 AM »
josef

the "tabs" you mention are a week point in my mind....the ones i have are great but i have seen some tweeked ones. at $55 i wish it was less flimsy....i was hoping you had the new one with the flappy paddles .....

Offline colinw

  • Posts: 111
  • Bourbonnais IL 60914
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #169 on: May 30, 2008, 12:27 PM »
Yes Nick did have other things on his mind lets not forget (look at some of his previous posts) he was asked to stop posting so much on two separate occasions, I PMed Nick about this and he said "certain people did not like the direction of some of his posts and he was not the voice of the Forum" he did not name names but it was obvious he felt he should be able to post whatever without interference, so I think a combination of these events led to nick leaving.

Colin 
« Last Edit: May 30, 2008, 12:29 PM by colinw »

Offline The Woodentop

  • Posts: 238
  • Buxton, England
Re: Comment on Festools & Improvements you may want to see for them.
« Reply #170 on: May 31, 2008, 04:45 AM »
ss
« Last Edit: May 31, 2008, 10:22 AM by The Woodentop »
Never assume you know....only know you know