Author Topic: Festool's first U.S. production line  (Read 8593 times)

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Offline TylerC

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Festool's first U.S. production line
« on: July 10, 2017, 11:55 AM »
We teased a bit of info about this on the Fourth of July, but tomorrow we'll make the official announcement about Festool's first U.S. production line. The first production line will be for assembly of the FS Guide Rails. There are plans to build additional production lines in the future, and we'll announce those when the time it right.

The press release that we'll be releasing tomorrow is below.

We also have a video about the building the line. It's more for internal use, but it's a nice look at creating the first line and rolling out the first rail. You can watch it here:


FESTOOL ANNOUNCES U.S. MANUFACTURING OPERATIONS
FS Guide Rails are the first products made in Indiana

LEBANON, IN (July 11, 2017) – Festool announced today that it has started producing its FS Guide Rails, an integral system component and accessory of many of its power tools, at the company’s North American headquarters in Lebanon, IN. Festool plans to expand its Lebanon-based manufacturing facilities for additional production lines and other products in the future.

FS Guide Rails production uses U.S.-sourced material and will begin shipping throughout the U.S. and Canadian markets in late 2017.

Essential to the Festool power tool system, FS Guide Rails are aluminum tracks that work in collaboration with some of Festool’s most popular products, including its track saws, routers and jigsaws.

“German engineering and American manufacturing is a powerful combination,” says Ole Held, CEO of Festool USA. “Launching a U.S. production line will allow us to expand the Festool presence in North America and strengthen our commitment to create innovative, precise, superior quality products.”

Festool designs and engineers its portfolio of innovative power tool products in its home country of Germany and all Festool power tools are manufactured in Europe.

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline JimH2

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2017, 12:06 PM »
Making the rails in the US (especially the longer ones) is a good move.

Offline Cheese

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2017, 12:12 PM »

The first production line will be for assembly of the FS Guide Rails.


That doesn't appear to be an extruder, does that mean the bare extrusions are still made in Germany?

Offline Paul G

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2017, 12:18 PM »
Will the USA rails have squared ends?
+1

Offline TylerC

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2017, 12:18 PM »

The first production line will be for assembly of the FS Guide Rails.


That doesn't appear to be an extruder, does that mean the bare extrusions are still made in Germany?

Extrusion for these rails will be done in the U.S. but not as part of the production line in Lebanon.

Offline Cheese

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2017, 12:24 PM »

Extrusion for these rails will be done in the U.S. but not as part of the production line in Lebanon.


Well that's  [cool]

Thanks...

Offline Shane Holland

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #6 on: July 10, 2017, 12:26 PM »
Tyler, will all rails be produced in the USA now? All lengths as well as the LR32 rails?

Also, any plans to expand the offerings in any way?

Thanks for the video and info.

Shane
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Offline TylerC

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #7 on: July 10, 2017, 12:41 PM »
@Shane Holland  The LR and FS 5000 will not be part of the initial launch. All other lengths will be included.

At this point, this shouldn't change the product offerings. All of this could change at some point. We're starting fairly small with plans to continue growing.

Offline Alec Buscemi

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #8 on: July 10, 2017, 12:44 PM »
I dont see the lr32 hole punching unit through which  EVERY new Festool rail of ALL sizes could and should be processed.

Online SRSemenza

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2017, 12:50 PM »
Length cut to order would be a cool expansion ........................  I'd like a 3130 please  [smile]

Seth

Offline six-point socket II

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2017, 01:58 PM »
Hi!

Congrats, this is awesome!

Kind regards,
Oliver

Offline Bob D.

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2017, 05:09 PM »
I dont see the lr32 hole punching unit through which  EVERY new Festool rail of ALL sizes could and should be processed.

That would be nice.
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Online #Tee

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2017, 06:26 PM »
so i dont get it..where did the rails come from ? this plant just threw stickers on and punched some holes?
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Online SRSemenza

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2017, 06:36 PM »
so i dont get it..where did the rails come from ? this plant just threw stickers on and punched some holes?




See below for what Tyler posted above.




The first production line will be for assembly of the FS Guide Rails.


That doesn't appear to be an extruder, does that mean the bare extrusions are still made in Germany?

Extrusion for these rails will be done in the U.S. but not as part of the production line in Lebanon.


And put the glide strips , splinter guard , and anti-slip strips on.


Seth
« Last Edit: July 10, 2017, 06:45 PM by SRSemenza »

Offline Cheese

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #14 on: July 10, 2017, 07:11 PM »
so i dont get it..where did the rails come from ? this plant just threw stickers on and punched some holes?
.

They're starting their manufacturing journey in a small deliberate fashion...nothing wrong with that. It always looks easier than it is.

Basically, they have an approved extruder in the US that they will be working with and then will have someone (could even be the extruder) EVENTUALLY punch the holey rails.

Festool manufacturing adds the label, glide strips, splinter strips and foam grip strips. It's not a huge undertaking but it's a start. That piece of equipment that performs these 3 simple tasks (the label was placed by hand) probably ran $150k-$200k.

Edit: Being made in Germany and using Festo parts, that machine probably cost twice that amount. [eek]

I also saw that in the middle of the machine there was a box that the rails passed under. My guess is that was some type of UV, microwave or thermal curing station for all the adhesive strips. 
« Last Edit: July 11, 2017, 09:17 AM by Cheese »

Offline Gregor

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #15 on: July 10, 2017, 08:41 PM »
I dont see the lr32 hole punching unit through which  EVERY new Festool rail of ALL sizes could and should be processed.
The unholey rails should IMHO simply be discontinued as they don't make sense, neither for the customer nor for Festool: Getting a holey rail with your TS-Set by default would be a direct incentive to buy LR-32 and a router.

Offline Cheese

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #16 on: July 10, 2017, 09:08 PM »

The unholey rails should IMHO simply be discontinued as they don't make sense, neither for the customer nor for Festool: Getting a holey rail with your TS-Set by default would be a direct incentive to buy LR-32 and a router.


Amen...marketing 101...

Offline Bob D.

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #17 on: July 10, 2017, 09:30 PM »

The unholey rails should IMHO simply be discontinued as they don't make sense, neither for the customer nor for Festool: Getting a holey rail with your TS-Set by default would be a direct incentive to buy LR-32 and a router.


Amen...marketing 101...

Ditto, it's been said before here. I guess it only makes sense from our side of the transaction. But also feel that it would be an incentive to some to invest further into the Festool system with the LR32 kit and that leads you to a Festool router. Once you're that far in you're gone, might as well go for broke. :)
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Offline antss

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #18 on: July 10, 2017, 10:54 PM »

The unholey rails should IMHO simply be discontinued as they don't make sense, neither for the customer nor for Festool: Getting a holey rail with your TS-Set by default would be a direct incentive to buy LR-32 and a router.



Amen...marketing 101...

Ditto, it's been said before here. I guess it only makes sense from our side of the transaction. But also feel that it would be an incentive to some to invest further into the Festool system with the LR32 kit and that leads you to a Festool router. Once you're that far in you're gone, might as well go for broke. :)

Speak for yourselves guys, but not everyone.  This customer likes both types of rails.

I'll also bet that ALL of you don't have holey rails exclusively.

And what are y'all going to use a 5000mm rail with holes for anyway ?

Online Bohdan

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #19 on: July 11, 2017, 02:39 AM »

I'll also bet that ALL of you don't have holey rails exclusively.


I have. I converted all of my rails and can now just grab the most convenient size for the job.

Offline Kev

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #20 on: July 11, 2017, 04:44 AM »
I'll put my money on the MFT being the next thing made in the USA [big grin]

We could start a book on guessing what's next [wink] @TylerC you're not allowed to play!

Online #Tee

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #21 on: July 11, 2017, 05:43 AM »
So what does all of this USA production mean for us? price goes up ? stay the same? [huh]
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Offline Gregor

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #22 on: July 11, 2017, 07:24 AM »
Speak for yourselves guys, but not everyone.  This customer likes both types of rails.
Serious question: in what way (or for what use) are the unholey ones better than the holey ones?

Quote
I'll also bet that ALL of you don't have holey rails exclusively.
You're right, I for one have exactly one unholy rail - it came with the TS and it really annoyed me when I decided to get the LR-32 as I needed to get the holey version.
Quote
And what are y'all going to use a 5000mm rail with holes for anyway ?
To add to the question above: where is the downside of it having the holes?

The ones without holes just dosn't make sense, at least to me, even the one on the MFT/3.
Dump the plain ones and have holes on all of them as a reminder to buy additional stuff.

Offline Kev

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #23 on: July 11, 2017, 07:45 AM »
With the US anti metric stance .. will the 1400 be called the FS 3 cubit?

Offline Untidy Shop

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #24 on: July 11, 2017, 07:48 AM »
With the US anti metric stance .. will the 1400 be called the FS 3 cubit?

No. Seth wants his at - 3130mm= 123 15⁄64in  [smile]
« Last Edit: July 11, 2017, 07:51 AM by Untidy Shop »
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Offline Cheese

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #25 on: July 11, 2017, 09:26 AM »
This holey vs unholey thing is rather like framing squares with & without markings. You don't always use the markings on a framing square, but when you need them you got them...bonus round.

Online SRSemenza

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #26 on: July 11, 2017, 09:58 AM »
Regardless of whether all rails should holey or not. I am just curious about those using only holey rails ......... are you just using the two available lengths or have you machined/drilled other lengths?

Seth

Offline HarveyWildes

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #27 on: July 11, 2017, 10:08 AM »
...
And what are y'all going to use a 5000mm rail with holes for anyway ?

If I remember correctly, there was a web site recently that advertised a 55' rail to go with a TS 55, and they allowed substituting a holey rail.  Connect seven of those and you could lay out an American football field.  I did not realize that soccer fields are only specified within a size range, but at any rate seven 16.8m rails would cover at least the smaller end of the range.  So regardless of what football means to you, seven of these larger size rails would do the job.

Ok, done with the semi-random fun...

I haven't used my rails enough yet to know if I would want a different size for anything, but in theory one might order a 55" rail and a custom length 63" rail to make 118", which is around the length needed for cutting 4x8 sheets diagonally.  Or maybe just two 59" rails.

« Last Edit: July 11, 2017, 10:11 AM by HarveyWildes »

Offline leakyroof

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #28 on: July 11, 2017, 10:55 AM »

The unholey rails should IMHO simply be discontinued as they don't make sense, neither for the customer nor for Festool: Getting a holey rail with your TS-Set by default would be a direct incentive to buy LR-32 and a router.



Amen...marketing 101...

Ditto, it's been said before here. I guess it only makes sense from our side of the transaction. But also feel that it would be an incentive to some to invest further into the Festool system with the LR32 kit and that leads you to a Festool router. Once you're that far in you're gone, might as well go for broke. :)

Speak for yourselves guys, but not everyone.  This customer likes both types of rails.

I'll also bet that ALL of you don't have holey rails exclusively.

And what are y'all going to use a 5000mm rail with holes for anyway ?
   It makes it easier to hang that 5000mm Rail on my wall...... [wink] [poke] [poke] [poke]
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Offline WarnerConstCo.

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #29 on: July 11, 2017, 12:19 PM »
I have no use for a rail with holes. I do not want to pay more for something I don't or won't need.

Offline Bob D.

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #30 on: July 11, 2017, 12:28 PM »
I have no use for a rail with holes. I do not want to pay more for something I don't or won't need.

I would think that the savings in reduced inventory and all that goes with it would offset having
only drilled rails and therefore let Festool hold the price to the same as it is now for non-drilled rails.

In short they shouldn't (to my way of thinking) increase the price if they only carried drilled rails in
the future.
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Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Dovetail65

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #31 on: July 11, 2017, 01:01 PM »
I have no use for a rail with holes. I do not want to pay more for something I don't or won't need.

They are the same price right now. A 55" without holes is 136.00 and 55" with holes cost 136.00.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2017, 01:04 PM by Dovetail65 »
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Offline rylim

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #32 on: July 11, 2017, 02:31 PM »
Since it is going to be made in USA (no more import tariff, high shipping cost) ,I just wondering if the price will go down?
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Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #33 on: July 11, 2017, 03:30 PM »
Since it is going to be made in USA (no more import tariff, high shipping cost) ,I just wondering if the price will go down?

I would seriously doubt that the price would go down.
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Offline antss

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #34 on: July 11, 2017, 04:21 PM »
Me too. I mean when has festool EVER lowered prices ?
The rails should be exempt from the ubiquitous 5% yearly increase though.  But I'm guessing that won't happen either.   ::)

Gregor - I never said "better" - that is too subjective.   I said I "prefer" having rails with no holes in some instances, and that I have both kinds.  I like the CHOICE.   For jobsites where we cut cabinetry panels we have no use for a 32 mm drilling system, none.  If the cabinet isn't drilled , we aren't modifying it or constructing them.  The solid rails slip in and out of the carry cases easier than the holey ones. And they and the cases stay cleaner too.

This may not appeal to everyone, especially someone like Kreg who builds cabinets on site and uses the lr32 on every job.  But he has the option of buying either rail and can even substitute a holey rail if he buys a TS "package" .  Festool , or certainly the dealers I've dealt with since the single spine rails have been willing to swap solid for holey at no charge. So having "choice" costs very little or nothing to all customers.

But, drilling all rails will have significant and easily measurable costs to the bottom line.  Where as economies of having two less sku's to is much harder to quantify and will most certainly not be as much in real dollars and euros as the extra time, electricity and tooling cost will be for drilling all rails.

I don't see Festool ever offering custom lengths.  Their production line in Germany has this capability now. They simply don't have the will or the processes in place to offer such a service.  They can't even offer the correct size deflector after a decade, which is only one size.  What makes anyone think they can possibly deliver a random length rail 50+ times a week ?    They just aren't that type of company.  Frankly , I don't know any made to order custom hand tool companies [unsure]

What I'm interested in seeing is whether the new  loooong rails are any straighter than their imported counterparts that many have been reporting lately as having a fair amount of warp in them.
« Last Edit: July 11, 2017, 04:50 PM by antss »

Offline Coen

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #35 on: July 14, 2017, 12:49 PM »
I wonder what the overall % of all rails are the holey ones. I guess <1%...

I got 800/2 with my OF-1010, a 1400/2 with my TS55 and as second rail I bought a holey 1400. Then years later I added the LR32 set itself. Holey rails are ~20% more expensive where I live.

They can't even offer the correct size deflector after a decade

How would you add the railstop if they increase the width of the deflector?

Offline Gregor

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #36 on: July 14, 2017, 04:57 PM »
They can't even offer the correct size deflector after a decade

How would you add the railstop if they increase the width of the deflector?
Put on the stop, put on the deflector?

Offline Paul G

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #37 on: July 14, 2017, 06:05 PM »
Will the USA rails have squared ends?

I'll take the silence to mean no lol
+1

Offline vidkid26

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #38 on: July 14, 2017, 08:22 PM »
Isn't that the point?
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Offline antss

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #39 on: July 14, 2017, 08:53 PM »
They can't even offer the correct size deflector after a decade

How would you add the railstop if they increase the width of the deflector?
[/quote]

Just like you did when the rails had a single spine instead of double.  Like Gregor said: attach stop then attach deflector. 

-or-

Slide it on from the opposite end. Easy peasy lemon squeezy.  Unless you have two joined rails. Then you gotta do as Gregor says.

Are you making a lot of stopped cuts ?  I've used my stop a grand total of one time in 20yrs +/-.  But the deflector gets used on almost every cut. 

Offline Distinctive Interiors

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #40 on: July 15, 2017, 06:44 AM »
I use my Kick Back Stop a lot. I do use my saw & rail for doing plunge cuts into kitchen worktops for sink and hob cutouts.

As has been said, just slide the Kick Back stop on from the other end, simple.

Offline TylerC

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #41 on: July 15, 2017, 08:13 AM »
On the custom guide rail question, keep in mind that we sell exclusively through independent dealers, which would complicate the ability to do custom lengths significantly. When we aren't receiving the end customer's order directly, that's another layer of complexity for customized products.

Offline Kodi Crescent

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #42 on: July 15, 2017, 10:40 AM »

I'll also bet that ALL of you don't have holey rails exclusively.


I have. I converted all of my rails and can now just grab the most convenient size for the job.

How did you convert them?

Offline Gregor

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #43 on: July 15, 2017, 11:09 AM »
On the custom guide rail question, keep in mind that we sell exclusively through independent dealers, which would complicate the ability to do custom lengths significantly. When we aren't receiving the end customer's order directly, that's another layer of complexity for customized products.
That sounds like you havn't heard about some recent innovations: parcel services, computers and internet?

Quite some stuff I ordered from independent dealers was shipped to me directly from festool central warehouse (according to the labels on the boxes), so I wonder where the problem should be with a customer ordering a custom length rail at his local dealer, that one logging into your system via the internet and entering the order that then gets made on demand and shipped directly to the customer.

But looking at the current still in progress desaster with the websites you surely have a valid point, that would be complicated.

Offline Alex

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #44 on: July 15, 2017, 11:13 AM »
On the custom guide rail question, keep in mind that we sell exclusively through independent dealers, which would complicate the ability to do custom lengths significantly. When we aren't receiving the end customer's order directly, that's another layer of complexity for customized products.

Seriously? It's called communication, and shouldn't be a problem in the information age.

Customer to dealer: Please get me rail of xx.xx length. My name is Johnny Woodcutter and live at House Road 555.

Dealer to Festool: please send me a rail of xx.xx length.

Festool: cuts rail, sends it to dealer.

Dealer: gives rail to Johnny Woodcutter and gets money. Festool receives fair share.

Offline waho6o9

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #45 on: July 15, 2017, 11:25 AM »
Just make 12 or 14 footers etc..... and let us cut them to the sizes we want. :)

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #46 on: July 15, 2017, 11:55 AM »
Just make 12 or 14 footers etc..... and let us cut them to the sizes we want. :)

Is that before or after the freight company turns it into a pretzel?  [eek] [scared]

Peter
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Offline waho6o9

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #47 on: July 15, 2017, 12:05 PM »
Just make 12 or 14 footers etc..... and let us cut them to the sizes we want. :)

Is that before or after the freight company turns it into a pretzel?  [eek] [scared]

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Offline Roseland

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #48 on: July 15, 2017, 12:09 PM »
Is there any chance that they'll find a better glue and make the splinter strip stay on?

A  :-)
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Offline Distinctive Interiors

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #49 on: July 15, 2017, 12:55 PM »
Is there any chance that they'll find a better glue and make the splinter strip stay on?

A  :-)

Is that a common problem then..? I have a good number of rails of different lengths, some older than others but have never had a splinter strip start to peel or fall off.
I have peeled the splinter strip off deliberately myself on a couple of my rails and moved them across when they have got a bit worn, but they have stayed stuck after I've reapplied them. Are yours the factory fitted edges that have peeled or edges you have applied yourself...?
When applying an edge back on, its important to ensure the underside of the rail is spotless clean. I use Denatured Alcohol to clean the rail then reapply the splinter strip.

Offline Svar

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #50 on: July 15, 2017, 01:06 PM »
Is there any chance that they'll find a better glue and make the splinter strip stay on?
Festool should simply redesign the strip to slide in a slot. Just like Mafell strips. There is no way this solution is patented, you can find it everywhere.

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #51 on: July 15, 2017, 01:11 PM »
It sure would be wonderful if Festool would get 3M to come up with an adhesive that holds up properly now that they have a relationship with them.

Two weeks ago I went out and found that 5 guiderails had lost their strips overnight in my van and trailer.  So I cured that problem with contact cement.  I don't change my strips out often.  So far so good in 98 degree plus temps.

Peter
Disclaimer:  I have been involved with the development of some TSO Products.  I have offered thoughts and ideas freely.  I am not paid but I may receive products during the development process or afterwards.

Offline Cheese

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #52 on: July 15, 2017, 02:03 PM »
Festool should simply redesign the strip to slide in a slot. Just like Mafell strips. There is no way this solution is patented, you can find it everywhere.

Like on the bottom of storm doors for example.

Offline Bob D.

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #53 on: July 15, 2017, 04:41 PM »
On the custom guide rail question, keep in mind that we sell exclusively through independent dealers, which would complicate the ability to do custom lengths significantly. When we aren't receiving the end customer's order directly, that's another layer of complexity for customized products.

Seriously? It's called communication, and shouldn't be a problem in the information age.

Customer to dealer: Please get me rail of xx.xx length. My name is Johnny Woodcutter and live at House Road 555.

Dealer to Festool: please send me a rail of xx.xx length.

Festool: cuts rail, sends it to dealer.

Dealer: gives rail to Johnny Woodcutter and gets money. Festool receives fair share.

You forgot to ask if he wanted the Holey or the Heathen version. :)
-----
It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?

Offline Paul G

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #54 on: July 15, 2017, 04:44 PM »
On the custom guide rail question, keep in mind that we sell exclusively through independent dealers, which would complicate the ability to do custom lengths significantly. When we aren't receiving the end customer's order directly, that's another layer of complexity for customized products.

265698-0
+1

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #55 on: July 15, 2017, 07:01 PM »
MY OPINION - I realize that there are a lot of wishes and wants in this thread - even by me - but keeping it real Festool is going to go status quo by their statements for the time being or longer.  To change extrusion designs would probably mean worldwide changes and that isn't something that will happen in combination with setting up a production line in another country.

Peter
Disclaimer:  I have been involved with the development of some TSO Products.  I have offered thoughts and ideas freely.  I am not paid but I may receive products during the development process or afterwards.

Online Bohdan

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #56 on: July 15, 2017, 08:02 PM »

Offline TylerC

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #57 on: July 15, 2017, 09:03 PM »
MY OPINION - I realize that there are a lot of wishes and wants in this thread - even by me - but keeping it real Festool is going to go status quo by their statements for the time being or longer.  To change extrusion designs would probably mean worldwide changes and that isn't something that will happen in combination with setting up a production line in another country.

Peter

^^ This. Although I don't work in production, I would imagine that the priority is matching and maintaining the quality and efficiency of the German production operations. Any changes or enhancesments would be secondary.

Offline antss

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #58 on: July 15, 2017, 09:35 PM »
D.I - I can see how the stops would be useful for sink cutouts.  That's the one time I used it , but found it more trouble than it was worth.   Eyeballing a witness mark to the line on the saw shroud is much faster for me.   I think the guide strip glue issue is related to geography.  Here in the SE USA , my guide strips fail often and regularly and have since the late 90's. We have hot and humid weather year round.  Very different than Germany. I rarely hear problems in the Northeast USA or Europe where the temps are much cooler.

Gregor & Alex , your view is often voiced by many who have no clue what it's like to run a manufacturing business, or young uns who have grown up in the Information Age where everything is point, click and deliver tomorrow.   I'm not picking on you.

It's just that running a global manufacturer with hundreds of products that need to be delivered withing a week at a fixed price in twenty different currencies doesn't lend itself to customization.  Even someone like TSO who is small, lean, and has demonstrated the ability to quickly respond to customer feedback doesn't offer customizing of their products.  It's simply a different animal.

Computers/ websites can easily accept orders and UPS can deliver a widget anywhere in the world overnite.  The difficulty is getting that custom order processed, priced,  resent for approval, re-received, materials ordered or machine code written for your one off and then slotted into production.  Produced, then custom packaging needs to be made before it's shipped. THAT takes manpower that you will have to pay for.  How much more are you willing to pay for all that?  And remember , your also going to have to pay for the opportunity cost that is lost by not producing our regular scheduled widgets at a known profit. 

Ford could easily take your order for bronze alligator skin seats, herringbone cashmere roof lining and pink sheepskin carpets. They could also make them as they have plenty of experience with seats, roof liners and carpets in cars. No way is that going to happen though. Rolls Royce is happy to accommodate those requests though.

Peter H.  Could you eleobrate on the new 3m relationship ? 
Changing the extrusion really isn't prefaced by a new U.S. production line.  It would just require a change to that line.  Just like Germany did when they changed the rails from one spine to the current two spine design. The extruder will produce anything they want to design and pay for. Instead of a section that presses a clear stick on strip to the bottom, they would have a section/module insert one into a slot.  Packaging could stay the same, and we sure as shootin know the deflector won't change. 😜

Offline Cheese

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #59 on: July 16, 2017, 01:12 AM »

Peter H.  Could you eleobrate on the new 3m relationship ? 


Here ya go antss...I worked there for 8 years...their VHB tapes are some of the best.

http://investors.3m.com/news/press-release-details/2016/3M-and-Festool-Announce-Strategic-Collaboration-to-Serve-Automotive-Collision-Repair-Industry/default.aspx

Offline Alex

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #60 on: July 16, 2017, 03:19 AM »
Gregor & Alex , your view is often voiced by many who have no clue what it's like to run a manufacturing business, or young uns who have grown up in the Information Age where everything is point, click and deliver tomorrow.   I'm not picking on you.

No, it's not that it can't be done, it's that they can't be bothered because the margin's too low. And thanks for the "no clue" comment. You're always here to bring a shining light to everybody's day.

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Offline Gregor

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #61 on: July 16, 2017, 04:30 AM »
Gregor & Alex , your view is often voiced by many who have no clue what it's like to run a manufacturing business, or young uns who have grown up in the Information Age where everything is point, click and deliver tomorrow.   I'm not picking on you.
Alex beat me to an answer with
No, it's not that it can't be done, it's that they can't be bothered because the margin's too low. And thanks for the "no clue" comment. You're always here to bring a shining light to everybody's day.
but some remarks anyway:

I'm fine with someone (or some company) telling me that they simply won't do something, even without giving a reason or when explicitely stating that they're just not interested as it would be an additional effort (however small) - even lazyness as a reason is acceptable, as it's an honest answer.

Simply don't want to do it for whatever reason? Fine.
It'll be more difficult to do custom stuff compared to off-the-shelf? Certainly.
The bespoke product might take longer to be delivered and possibly be more expensive? Reasonable.
Significant added complexity in carrying an additional dimension parameter in an order? Su... wait, what? In 2017?

I'm also fresh out of kind things to say to people which pull ad hominem, especially without having a clue about me as a person... Thanks @Alex for wording it politely.

Offline Michael Kellough

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #62 on: July 16, 2017, 08:35 AM »
I'm with Alex and Gregor, drop shipping is very common in the States already.

antss, I'm sure you know this so but for others that may not the holes are punched not drilled. I think...

Svar, I like the positive way Mafell the splinter guard attaches to the rail but it requires you to buy a new strip when it wears. With the simple stick-on method Festool uses I can simply move the strip out a little and re-trim. At least I can with the old black neoprene strips (don't yet own a rail with the "clear" strip). On one of my rails the strip has been moved out 10mm from the original position and still works fine.

Offline Cheese

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #63 on: July 16, 2017, 09:49 AM »

antss, I'm sure you know this so but for others that may not the holes are punched not drilled.


Punched because they are slightly oblong, not round.

Offline Bob Marino

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #64 on: July 16, 2017, 09:51 AM »
MY OPINION - I realize that there are a lot of wishes and wants in this thread - even by me - but keeping it real Festool is going to go status quo by their statements for the time being or longer.  To change extrusion designs would probably mean worldwide changes and that isn't something that will happen in combination with setting up a production line in another country.

Peter

 Agree and as a dealer, I am wondering how this would be accomplished in any type of timely manner and what about stocking and pricing for every custom size rail? Right now, there are a good number of sizes available and the ability (not a perfect solution convenience wise) to connect rails together. All these are in stock and ready to ship from the dealers. Ordering a custom size would take time for Festool to make and then ship to the dealers. And I'm sure it would be a costly request.
 
 Having said that, I'm happy to see this first step taken by Festool to start manufacturing items here.
Festool  Dealer since 2002; user well before that!
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Offline JimH2

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #65 on: July 16, 2017, 09:58 AM »
Since it is going to be made in USA (no more import tariff, high shipping cost) ,I just wondering if the price will go down?
Keep dreaming. We are already getting killed with the Euro costing $1.15 USD. When you Euro went into a free fall a few years ago ($1.60+ to close to a dollar) Festool still kept increasing prices, which makes buying stuff in Europe and having it shipped here cheaper than buying it here. With an order a few $100 the savings can be substantial even after shipping is accounted for.

Offline antss

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #66 on: July 16, 2017, 10:32 AM »
Thanks for the 3M info Cheese.  Does this mean they are or are going to OEM festool's entire abrasive line ? Do they already make the adhesives for the rails strips too ?

Alex and Gregor, I never said Festool can't do it. I said their type of operation doesn't lend itself to one offs.   Bob M, a large and well respected dealer has told us why it's not PRACTICAL too.

As seasoned operation managers you guys already know this. So why the animosity ?  Of course FT doesn't want to do this. It's not their core business any more than Ford's is making custom automobiles.  Both companies could do it.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2017, 10:35 AM by antss »

Offline Michael Kellough

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #67 on: July 16, 2017, 11:15 AM »
80/20 extrudes and anodizes in house. You can order anything cut to the mm and pay by the inch (ex. for a piece 26mm you pay for 2 inches). Being custom cut the delivery time ranges from 1 to 2 weeks in my experience.

You can also order the stuff from any of 80/20's dealers but it is still cut by and ships from 80/20.

For a custom length guide rail they could just use a fill-in-the-blank product label and use the next larger size box to ship.

Of course we can already buy a guide rail and cut it down...

Online SRSemenza

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #68 on: July 16, 2017, 11:22 AM »
Lets dial down the negativity and animosity in this thread, please.   Making me wish I hadn't made the --  'it would be cool , but half joking custom length rail post'.

Seth

Offline waho6o9

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #69 on: July 16, 2017, 12:01 PM »
Maybe cut 2 rails at 45 degrees and weld them together. Then cut or mill the places where the saw glides

and hopefully one can square up sheet goods with 2 set ups.......

Just thinking.


265722-0

Offline dennyvielhab

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #70 on: July 18, 2017, 11:16 AM »
As an aside...When I purchased my track saw and rail guard, I inquired about getting a holey rail, as I was thinking forward.  I was told that was fine, and there was no additional charge. I did have to phone in the order, as that option was not specifically listed on their website.

I have often wondered about the cost of a hole punching machine vs. the cost (income) of recycling the leftover punches, and possibility of savings because of reduction in substantially identical inventory.  It seems to make sense to me, but my background is medical, not marketing or manufacturing.

Offline RobBob

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #71 on: July 18, 2017, 11:26 AM »
I am so glad Festool spent the time, money, and resources on this US guide rail production line.  FOGers and potential Festool customers have been asking for this for years!  Things like this US guide rail production line and the changeover to imperial will greatly enhance Festool's reputation for innovation, listening to what customers want and standing behind their products.  I expect many new Festool customers because of this.  Hope the FOG software and servers can handle the expected increase in load.

Why waste valuable resources and money on inconsequential and frivolous things like a new impact driver, LED lights on routers or fixing the Kapex?
« Last Edit: July 18, 2017, 08:23 PM by RobBob »

Offline PeterK

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #72 on: July 18, 2017, 02:10 PM »
Guess I don't really understand the benefits to the customer of "made in USA"? Sure it is good PR to do some manufacturing here - no question about that. As I am unaware of any rail shortages having happened, as the price will not change, as no new rail designs or improvements, is there any benefit to the consumer I am missing? Not trying to be negative but just don't understand the "hoopla" of this announcement.

Offline antss

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #73 on: July 18, 2017, 02:32 PM »
RB - many will miss the sarcasm in that post.  [unsure]

Offline RobBob

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #74 on: July 18, 2017, 03:40 PM »
RB - many will miss the sarcasm in that post.  [unsure]

 [wink]

Offline Richard/RMW

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #75 on: July 18, 2017, 04:55 PM »
I doubt this is going to be a trend. Making guide rails here makes sense for a lot of reasons:
  • Manufacturing is not complex as it entails outsourced extrusions, a single automated line and probably one person with limited training
  • Shipping the rails was probably costly due to their unwieldy nature
  • Likely this is an effort to expand worldwide production capacity without taking up room in another manufacturing plant
  • Raw materials inventory is limited to extrusions, stickers and 2 flavors of strips
  • May be some advantage to exporting to Canada and Mexico from the US versus EU
  • Eliminates exchange rate fluctuations
Given that this is probably the only item in the lineup that does not involve complex assembly my hunch is this is a limited endeavor and I'd be surprised to see more production come to the US.

Then again, I may be all wet.

RMW


 
As of 10/17 I am out of the Dog business and pursuing other distractions. Thanks for a fun ride!

Offline TylerC

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #76 on: July 18, 2017, 04:57 PM »
... I'd be surprised to see more production come to the US.


There will be additional production lines. You're probably right that it will continue to be simpler products — at least in the short/mid-term — it there will be others.

Offline Cheese

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #77 on: July 18, 2017, 05:34 PM »
I heard something about the TS 55 being a potential candidate.  [cool]

Offline PeterK

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #78 on: July 18, 2017, 06:09 PM »
RB - many will miss the sarcasm in that post.  [unsure]

Yea I read that and thought - huh?
We REALLY need a "like" button for posts like his.

Offline Rollin22Petes

  • Posts: 162
Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #79 on: July 18, 2017, 07:36 PM »
RB - many will miss the sarcasm in that post.  [unsure]
  If you have had multiply Kapex motors burn out like me and others you definitely won't miss it!!!!

Offline TOOLTOWN

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #80 on: July 18, 2017, 07:44 PM »
I doubt this is going to be a trend. Making guide rails here makes sense for a lot of reasons:
  • Manufacturing is not complex as it entails outsourced extrusions, a single automated line and probably one person with limited training
  • Shipping the rails was probably costly due to their unwieldy nature
  • Likely this is an effort to expand worldwide production capacity without taking up room in another manufacturing plant
  • Raw materials inventory is limited to extrusions, stickers and 2 flavors of strips
  • May be some advantage to exporting to Canada and Mexico from the US versus EU
  • Eliminates exchange rate fluctuations
Given that this is probably the only item in the lineup that does not involve complex assembly my hunch is this is a limited endeavor and I'd be surprised to see more production come to the US.

Then again, I may be all wet.

RMW

Along these lines I could imagine systainers being not far behind.  Relatively simple and low raw parts inventory.  Plus, shipping a systainer is mostly just shipping air. 

But that's just my conspiracy theory...

Ken

Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #81 on: July 18, 2017, 07:57 PM »
I doubt that Systainers are on the near horizon.  Actually made by a "sister company". 

Totally correct about shipping air though.  I doubt that there is enough ancillary penetration of the product in NA although so many of us like them.

Peter
Disclaimer:  I have been involved with the development of some TSO Products.  I have offered thoughts and ideas freely.  I am not paid but I may receive products during the development process or afterwards.

Online SRSemenza

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Re: Festool's first U.S. production line
« Reply #82 on: July 20, 2017, 10:34 AM »
Nope. Not going off the road on that political / social topic. It will do no good for the FOG or anyone posting about it. The issue would not be resolved helped or hindered by a debate on FOG. But instead, a whole bunch of ill will would be generated.

Also this forum is not the place for such a debate.  FOG is primarily a forum to discuss Festool power tools and related topics.

Some posts were removed. 

I suggest that anyone having an issue with an image presented by Festool take it up with them directly.


Seth

FOG Moderator
« Last Edit: July 20, 2017, 03:46 PM by SRSemenza »