Author Topic: Festool CMS discontinued  (Read 27252 times)

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Offline Dyldo Baggins

  • Posts: 2
Festool CMS discontinued
« on: April 29, 2019, 09:18 AM »
Hi guys. First time poster. Long time reader.

The CMS router table seems to be discontinued here in Australia. And I'm told it will be happening in Europe as well.

Is there something new in development? I'm wondering if I should hold off on spending big money on a solution in the short term and wait?

Thanks

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Online six-point socket II

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  • aka @the_black_tie_diyer
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2019, 09:28 AM »
Hi,

I can't say anything on new developments, obviously only Festool would know. But yes, the CMS is being discontinued. I've heard it doesn't meet certain new? requirements set out by (European?) lawmakers. But I can't tell you more, I didn't look into it.

Kind regards,
Oliver
« Last Edit: April 29, 2019, 09:32 AM by six-point socket II »
Kind regards,
Oliver

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2019, 08:06 PM »
Gah,   this is something that needs more info stat.   I've been planning to buy one and even import parts from Europe.  Between not being at a stage where I fully need it yet, and the lack of metric routers in the US, and lack of some of the inserts, I've been holding off.  If any of this is true, that's now on indefinite hold.

If it's a case that they will be bringing out a new generation of it, and maybe make it more global compliant, then great.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 6030
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2019, 08:52 PM »
Maybe @TylerC can chime in about this.  [big grin]

Offline TylerC

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2019, 11:28 PM »
Maybe @TylerC can chime in about this.  [big grin]

Neither of the CMS tables have been discontinued in North America. (I can’t speak for other countries, but they were on the European websites that I checked.) We haven’t announced any changes.

Offline Dyldo Baggins

  • Posts: 2
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2019, 07:14 AM »
Thanks for your input. Fingers crossed something new comes out

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 395
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2019, 08:44 AM »
If they discontinue the current version and make it better that would be a shame as I'm still setting mine up that I acquired from Bob Marino a few weeks back. .however new models usually mean more money and I can't begin to imagine a $2k table for the set.

The CMS is one of those quirky tools that seems like it has one foot stuck in the past design wise. Kind of like the OF 1000 or OF 2000 before they were changed to the 1010 and 2200. I'm only using mine for the OF router module but if they could redesign the table saw module to fit the current VL and GE bases and introduce to North America. . [cool] I know, wishful thinking.
@matts.garage

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3969
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2019, 10:32 AM »
@DynaGlide   OF1000/1100, do you have both? I only have OF 1000 but haven’t noticed any difference (in photos/specs) except wattage. Anything else?

There is clearly a huge difference OF 2000 and 2200.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2019, 08:17 PM »
If they kill it off, but bring the CS series saws to NA, and take the same chassis as the CS saws and make a router system from that, with the add ons interchange, that would probably be manageable.

I've started considering maybe going for a CS70 (smuggle it in), but that then leaves me without a router option.

I know a lot of folks don't get the CMS, but for me and I think a lot of folks, it works to fill a need as there isn't really anything else that is small, modular, sliding table, etc.

They have made a mess of it in NA, between imperial routers, telling folks they can't use the OF2200,  lack of inserts, it definitely could use help.  Even if they alter the idea a little and it was something like a CS70 insert and a OF2200 based insert,  where it is no longer a kit that adapts the free standing tool, but is dedicated modules that drop into a common chassis, that could work, especially if it gets around safety issues.   

Still, if they have killed if off in one market, it's basically dead

Online six-point socket II

  • Posts: 913
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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #9 on: June 06, 2019, 12:11 PM »
Just for the records, it is gone. Not longer available in Germany.





festool.co.uk / festool.com as well.



Kind regards,
Oliver
« Last Edit: June 06, 2019, 12:26 PM by six-point socket II »
Kind regards,
Oliver

Offline Coen

  • Posts: 442
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #10 on: June 06, 2019, 07:22 PM »
Same on .NL Festool site.

I contemplated buying the CMS extensions some time ago, but some were out of stock. If the whole CMS gets scrapped I'm definitely not going to buy them.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2019, 11:31 PM »
Well, that's a major blow.

I'm glad I hadn't bought anything yet.  Now it leaves the question is what happens next.  I was going to build my working setup largely around a cms setup as I mentioned above.  Of course Festool denying us Metric routers is what held me off from buying a festool router, which then nullified buying a cms, and general chain reaction from there.

Not sure what I'm going to do now, as Festool just threw out a core part of "the system".  I really hope the announce and bring out something to replace it fast. My concern is with the delay to the new world, it could be years.

I had a lot of plans for using this, one of the reason I bought festool stuff was to be able to use it in the CMS. With that gone, things very well would have tipped to Maffel.

I'm going to keep some hope that this is because they have a new version coming, maybe in combination with a new series of routers.  Bit frustrating as no one really makes an equivalent to a CMS for router setup.  Just random kludges of stuff. 

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 1740
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #12 on: June 07, 2019, 12:57 AM »
Of course Festool denying us Metric routers is what held me off from buying a festool router, which then nullified buying a cms, and general chain reaction from there.
Its just a scale sticker. Get it and untangle your whole shop setup chain reaction.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 01:06 AM by Svar »

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #13 on: June 07, 2019, 10:13 AM »
Of course Festool denying us Metric routers is what held me off from buying a festool router, which then nullified buying a cms, and general chain reaction from there.
Its just a scale sticker. Get it and untangle your whole shop setup chain reaction.

Per Festool it was no longer a sticker and could not be changed.  Secondly it didn't matter, sell me the router you make everywhere and what I wanted. No one should have to fix/modify a tool out of the box.  I'm not going to go support the decision to block metric in N.A.  I want to be able to buy the tool I want any day and run with, just like those outside N.A. can. You can change stickers all you want, the package/serial number still is "imperial".   Further it doesn't matter now, the CMS is dead with no word on replacement, so I'm not going to be buying anything CMS or router, etc related until either there is a replacement or festool makes some sort of statement as to what is going on.

My impression is when Festool discontinues, it means the product line is gone. If they were bringing a replacement, they would have announced something first and the old would slowly go away.

Companies like Festool need to learn that buyers plan out things on long timelines and interdependencies.  Soon as you start throwing wrenches in things like 1) random unit of measurement changes in some countries. 2) Sell a system buy don't sell the whole system in some countries (CMS was great example of this),  3) Tell some countries you can't use it as others do (OF2200 in CMS in N.A. banned). 4) Randomly discontinue tools with no idea if things have a replacement or not.   This makes it very hard for people who would buy to hatch a plan. It makes them very cautious to buy as they don't know if they will make purchase 1 and 2, just to have purchases 3, 4, 5 made impossible and thus leave them with 1 and 2 and be incomplete/incompatible.

We all know companies keep plans tight lipped, and aren't going to speak about a lot of things that come up. But they do need to understand they need to show people that they won't be screwed in their purchasing plan.  This is key when the core of your product and the whole pitch is a system.   You got tracks, and you got a CMS and you got the tools the interchange between them.  That's an area you can't just go kill off a part here and there.    It's not like killing off a sander or drill where there really isn't a system to it other than maybe the battery, but still the other tools aren't dependent on the one that just got discontinued. Plus you just buy one from someone else.  Those areas a companies like Festool can do more "whatever". 

Again I hope they are just in the process of an update.  Could be replacing CMS with the CS type system, that could work ok. Just need to tell people if that is the case. 

Offline Svar

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #14 on: June 07, 2019, 10:52 AM »
You can change stickers all you want, the package/serial number still is "imperial".
What bearing does it have on its functionality? I tend to get what fits the task and my wallet and get to work. If you keep chasing perfect setup or matching packaging you'll never get anything done. Products get introduced and discontinued all the time, you need to make the best of it.
CMS is still available from US dealers, typically Festool carries parts for 10 years after tool is discontinued.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 11:02 AM by Svar »

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1269
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #15 on: June 07, 2019, 11:16 AM »
My impression is when Festool discontinues, it means the product line is gone. If they were bringing a replacement, they would have announced something first and the old would slowly go away.
It's possible that new safety regulations gave them similar problems (as with the CMS-TS) for the OF setup, so they had to change things. Same is likely for the CMS-PS plate where the blade extends upwards, without any protection, from where you're likely to collapse onto when having a cardiovascular event.

My guesses:

Something sawstop will replace the TS part, fixed inside a table similar to what they demonstrated the last months.

The CMS-BS-120 didn't seem to sell that well at all.
Likely history.

The PS plate can be OK for certain things but a bandsaw is way superior in both functionality and price/performance unless you need to saw inside holes.
Likely history.

And we have to admit that the CMS-OF is a quite dated design that had been surpassed by many, if not most, other available router tables in both in functionality and price/performance.
Possibly a new dedicated table, or history and 'go buy shaper'.

As it's Festool this dosn't impact availability of spare parts, so the ones that already have one will likely not be shafted that hard as with other suppliers when these drop a product. While it might not be good that the current CMS goes away without further information... I understand the reasoning behind it (desperately needing an update, both for security legislation and usability/precision) - we'll see what will happen.

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 395
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #16 on: June 07, 2019, 11:31 AM »
I just got my CMS GE Set in April secondhand. Had I paid retail I'd probably be annoyed by this 'news.' I've used it a fair bit already and sure it's quirky but if you can get past that it is really capable. If they come out with a better version that's great. I can't really imagine what it would do better for routing tasks. A lot of the shortcomings I read about turned out to be overblown in real world use, at least so far. The 10 year parts availability is nice although there aren't really any wear items on something like this.

Like @Svar I've accepted any tool I buy I'll have to make changes to better suit how I intend to use it. My miter saw got a light and new hold down. My MFT table I scrapped the fence hold downs and went with fence dogs. DeWALT DW745 on the way and I'm already scheming a new zero clearance insert and modular outfeed table.
@matts.garage

Offline jobsworth

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #17 on: June 07, 2019, 01:04 PM »
If I were FT ( I'm just guessing and looking at this logically or illogically depending on your POV)

I would add a router expension to the the new CS 70. Simular to te ones that they currently have which you can either use with the table saw or as a free standing stand alone unit. Im thinking it could easily be adapted to the CS 70.
 
So what would stop FT from adding a plate to fit their routers?
 well thats what I'm thinking though.

 I have been know to be wrong a time or 2.

https://www.woodcraft.com/products/tgp2-27-in-line-router-table-kit

it can be adapted to a bench top router table plus it has a alot of   Kewl accessories for it to, and different tops phenolic, cast iron etc.

https://www.woodcraft.com/products/cast-iron-benchtop-router-table-kit

« Last Edit: June 07, 2019, 01:09 PM by jobsworth »

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 6030
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #18 on: June 07, 2019, 10:55 PM »
Its just a scale sticker. Get it and untangle your whole shop setup chain reaction.

Svar...just take a deep breath and relax.   [smile]

DeformedTree has an opinion and you have an opinion...you’re both entitled to that opinion.

Besides, while you can change the scale on the router, you can’t change the indexing wheel on the height gauge. It will still index in .1 mm increments.

Similar situation to the HKC when I first purchased it, as it was marked in imperial measurements but it only indexed in metric increments.

I spent almost an hour trying to get my IMPERIAL HKC to index in imperial increments. And then I figured it out...the HKC was a gelded tool. That’s still a sore point with me.  [sad]

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 1740
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #19 on: June 07, 2019, 11:11 PM »
Its just a scale sticker. Get it and untangle your whole shop setup chain reaction.
Besides, while you can change the scale on the router, you can’t change the indexing wheel on the height gauge. It will still index in .1 mm increments.
Yes, but metric is exactly what he wants.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 6030
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #20 on: June 07, 2019, 11:32 PM »
Ok, that’s fair...but I still have a knee-jerk reaction to Festool claiming that these are truly imperial tools when they can only be indexed in metric increments.  It's rather like driving an "Imperial" car with a "Metric" speedometer.  [eek]

I prefer the metric tools but if you’re going to brag about going imperial... then do so. Festool is still just performing the shell game. Just another black mark against their shameless marketing group.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2019, 09:36 AM by Cheese »

Offline pettyconstruction

  • Posts: 514
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #21 on: June 08, 2019, 10:58 AM »
I feel that Festool will bring out a Saw Stop type unit to replace it.
A very portable and modular unit would do the trick.
Cheers, Charlie


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Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #22 on: June 08, 2019, 02:54 PM »
I feel that Festool will bring out a Saw Stop type unit to replace it.
A very portable and modular unit would do the trick.
Cheers, Charlie


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Saw stop or not, bringing the CS saws to N.A would address part of the issue, it still doesn't address the router side.  Thus why I think using the CS saw chassis but make a router equivalent could be an option.  Then have all the add on's interchangeable.   It would be overall more stuff ($$$) and more equipment than a user in theory would have with the CMS setup with router and saw inserts, but the trade off there might not be so bad.  If they are making a decision to ditch the interchange/adapter path and instead have a common interface to a dedicated machine, and then offer a saw, router, sander, etc all in that same chassis with tables, sliders, fences, etc all the same for them, I think people would be good. It would be less futzing around. And if power, dust, etc are all in the exact same location it makes it easy for people to swap stuff around.  I would just ask they make these core units the form factor of a Maxi Systainer, or fit in one. So people can pack the tool away with the systainers very nicely.

Obviously the loss of the CMS saw options in places outside N.A. isn't as big of a deal since those places have the dedicated saws. But they will still have a whole when it comes to router setup so I would still expect this to be an issue for folks.

Problem right now is if Festool is going that route, they better have something in the pipe fast.  Otherwise there could be a multi-year gap with nothing for that market.  Maffel might be happy about this right now, but of course they don't have anything CMS router equivalent that I'm aware of, or at least nothing in N.A.

Offline Sanderxpander

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #23 on: June 10, 2019, 03:10 AM »
I have to wonder how many people actually use the CMS router option as a mobile unit. You can get cheaper and better router tables/fences for less money than just the CMS router plate kit and while the OF1400 and 2200 are great routers, they're kind of overkill in a table.

Portability seems the main advantage of the CMS over dedicated tables, even though many green goggled fans use it stationary.

Offline GarryMartin

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #24 on: June 10, 2019, 03:55 AM »
Portability seems the main advantage of the CMS over dedicated tables, even though many green goggled fans use it stationary.

Not *just* portability; the ability to make use of it in small spaces is also a large consideration as is the ability to make use of other elements of the overall "system" such as the Kapex extensions for infeed and outfeed support for instance.

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #25 on: June 10, 2019, 07:09 AM »
Portability seems the main advantage of the CMS over dedicated tables, even though many green goggled fans use it stationary.

Not *just* portability; the ability to make use of it in small spaces is also a large consideration as is the ability to make use of other elements of the overall "system" such as the Kapex extensions for infeed and outfeed support for instance.

I agree with Garry - my small (ish) workshop needs something of the size of the CMS for both router and table saw use. I have seen no other small saw table that comes anywhere close to the quality, accuracy and dust collection capability of the CMS-TS.

However, if Festool are discontinuing the CMS that exists today you can be sure that something at least as good if not better will replace it.

Peter

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #26 on: June 10, 2019, 11:33 PM »
I have to wonder how many people actually use the CMS router option as a mobile unit. You can get cheaper and better router tables/fences for less money than just the CMS router plate kit and while the OF1400 and 2200 are great routers, they're kind of overkill in a table.

Portability seems the main advantage of the CMS over dedicated tables, even though many green goggled fans use it stationary.

Small/Compact are not exactly one in the same as portable or to say Portability is not exactly the reason some people want small/compact.  I think a lot of folks simply want to be able to nicely pack it away in a cabinet when not in use.

Still, I can't see I've seen anything like a CMS for routers.   You have the basic "table" deal you buy at the big box store that doesn't do much but hold a router.  Or you get into big DIY assembly of random parts that people build.  I would be curious if anyone can point to something that is the same as a CMS router setup, not a "buy this", "add this companies lift", etc.  The turn key aspect of it is a winner, and the addition that you could swap it with a saw and such is what put it over the top.  Just adding up various parts to build a nice router setup, I don't see the CMS as being much more expensive or more expensive at all.  It's not like you can buy just a lift and call it a day.  Similar to people who think they can build a MFT for less.  You can't.  You can build a thing for less, but it is a matter of what did you trade off.

I would say an OF2200 is over kill just to mount in a CMS, but that is where if they made a dedicated unit then they could save on a bunch of cost.  But of course it gets back to the whole benefit is that you still have a router to use for anything else and when you need it in the table, you have it. For a lot of folks the hassle of swapping the parts around is worth it if it means you save the price of buying multiple routers, or space savings, etc.

I'm just a person with a small house, and not much room for a workshop when all is done.  When I get my house done, stuff will either need to be able to be stored away for periods of time, or be something that is easy to resell.  This rules lots of big things are out, and DIY home brew stuff is out.  If I had room, I would just skip most festool stuff and get a CNC router setup I could fit a 4x8 sheet in.  Net cost wise it might be cheaper than lots of saws, routers, lr32 setups, and so forth.   I just don't have the space.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #27 on: June 10, 2019, 11:43 PM »


The CMS-BS-120 didn't seem to sell that well at all.

I was never sure if it was a N.A. thing or what that finding information on the sander setup was very hard, even when looking it up in other countries.  Of course my study into it stopped when I realized it took sand paper size that doesn't exist in N.A.  so even if someone took the effort to sneak the parts in, they would have to find a foreign source for sanding belts.

I appreciate them trying to make the most out of the CMS, but the sander setup might have been a step to far verses just buying a run of the mill bench top sander.  But like anything else, once you guy the chassis,  maximize what you can use it for.  I don't know how many folks own/use beltsanders anymore, so that combination of things might have made it a low seller. 

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 6030
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #28 on: June 11, 2019, 12:06 AM »
If I had room, I would just skip most festool stuff and get a CNC router setup I could fit a 4x8 sheet in.  Net cost wise it might be cheaper than lots of saws, routers, lr32 setups, and so forth.   I just don't have the space.

I hear you on that one...all this gear just adds up to more needed space. This reminds me of my neighbor that has a cabin in Wisconsin...a nice leisurely 1 hour drive from the cities. He needed an out-building to hold some of his grass mowing equipment so we built one.

Then he needed another to hold his collection of classic Cadillacs...so we built another one.

Then he needed another to house his Dingo and collection of 1950 Ford tractors along with his power tools...it never ends.

I'm attempting to scale down at this point...how much stuff do I need to efficiently produce a product?

With full CNC and hand held CNC (think Shaper) coming of age, how many of these tools are redundant?  I can wax rhapsodic about the old days when I needed 3-4 tools to produce a particular item or I can simply acquiesce to the fact that producing that same item now only requires one modern CNC tool and it will be generated faster and closer to the original specifications than ever imagined.

I rather like that...
« Last Edit: June 11, 2019, 12:24 AM by Cheese »

Offline DeformedTree

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #29 on: June 11, 2019, 12:48 AM »
I think this is a future companies like Festool (and their parent company) are having to address, and probably in part why they bought shaper.   A lot of tools exist due to history or function they way they due to history.  When it comes down to just producing the desired shape, there isn't a lot that a 3 axis mill can't do.   Can cut any 2D shape, put any hole pattern in, cut any recess, pocket, etc.  With router bits you get all the shapes you need.  Can do planning, thicknessing if you want too.  Need a domino groove, no problem.  Might need a fixture to put some parts on edge.

Probably not going to be someones go to for a cross cut, but you could set one up to if you really wanted too.

For those of us that design parts in computers all day as is, it's a straight forward change.  Software is one of the biggest issues, but that is getting better all the time.  With machines in the couple grand range, you really need to take a look at the cost off all the traditional tools added up.

Honestly if they killed off the CMS with no replacement, the Shaper Origin might get more thought.  Still, the "classic" tools will be around for a while as they work good when you just need to cut something quick and simple. Or when you need to take it someplace (floor, roof, etc).

For sure though, if I was going in business, or starting fresh on building house from scratch,  I would find the space and set up a mill, skip a lot of other tools.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #30 on: June 11, 2019, 08:47 AM »
There may be new saws on the way?
I have an email giving info about upcoming Festool roadshows, and it’s mentioned something like new products will be shown, including a saw with the Saw Stop safety technology etc.
So possibly CS50, CS70 and CMS upgrades or replacements, who knows?

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline jobsworth

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #31 on: June 11, 2019, 11:10 AM »
@Jiggy Joiner


A English friend of mine sent me that flyer via email a couple of days ago.

 Yes its a revamped CS 70 with saw stop technology.

Looking at it from a NA perspective, adding the saw stop techology might just be festools attempt to be able to get it through the UL and get their approval to be able to sell it here in NA.

fingers crossed.

 though it would be quite pricey here. i think you could buy a saw stop cabinet saw for the price of the CS70 over here.


Offline Svar

  • Posts: 1740
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #32 on: June 11, 2019, 11:32 AM »
Still, I can't see I've seen anything like a CMS for routers.   You have the basic "table" deal you buy at the big box store that doesn't do much but hold a router.  Or you get into big DIY assembly of random parts that people build.  I would be curious if anyone can point to something that is the same as a CMS router setup, not a "buy this", "add this companies lift", etc.  The turn key aspect of it is a winner, and the addition that you could swap it with a saw and such is what put it over the top. 
Triton WorkCentre is a modular system similar to CMS. Work table / router / table saw / cross cut saw, all in one. Bunch of reviews on YouTube.
Wolfcraft has a modular system too (low budget, low quality), not available in the US.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2019, 11:50 AM by Svar »

Offline Svar

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #33 on: June 11, 2019, 12:46 PM »
Yes its a revamped CS 70 with saw stop technology.
Unlike CS70 the new one with Sawstop tech is not a pull saw. At least the prototype was not.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #34 on: June 11, 2019, 12:49 PM »
@jobsworth Hi Ron, yes what you say makes sense, I hope Festool's plans work out good for you, and also hopefully, we'll get to be able to buy the safety technology here.
I'm actually looking for a decent mobile table saw, I've hankered for an Erika 85e for quite some time but, I think I'll wait and see if Festool can pull something out of the bag  [thumbs up]

Offline Jiggy Joiner

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #35 on: June 11, 2019, 12:50 PM »
Yes its a revamped CS 70 with saw stop technology.
Unlike CS70 the new one with Sawstop tech is not a pull saw. At least the prototype was not.

Hi Svar, is that because the technology would only work on a fixed head set up?

Offline Svar

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #36 on: June 11, 2019, 01:12 PM »
Yes its a revamped CS 70 with saw stop technology.
Unlike CS70 the new one with Sawstop tech is not a pull saw. At least the prototype was not.
Hi Svar, is that because the technology would only work on a fixed head set up?
I think it is possible to mount it on moving carriage as well. Perhaps it gets too complicated or bulky. You'd probably have to immobilize the carriage when the SawStop mechanism fires up.
« Last Edit: June 11, 2019, 01:18 PM by Svar »

Offline jobsworth

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #37 on: June 11, 2019, 01:14 PM »
@Jiggy Joiner

Ive been lusting after a Erica 85 myself. Im interested to see what the cost is of the new CS 70 if it gets over here. It better be pretty darned good and I mean over and above the Saw Stop Technology if they are going to ask the same as a Erica 85.

Thats about $4000 when ya add in some of the accessories.

Offline jobsworth

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #38 on: June 11, 2019, 01:16 PM »
One thing about the saw stop is that when the thing goes off it destroys the blade and the cost of replacement for the mechanism isnt exactly cheap. I imagine in true festool fashion the replacement mechanism will cost a fortune

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #39 on: June 11, 2019, 01:20 PM »
@Svar Thanks, yes, makes sense.

@jobsworth Yes, part of me thinks the Erika might be overkill but, I just love the saw, even taking into account it's hefty price tag. I have chased after a couple of really nice used examples but, they sell in the blink of an eye and I was just too late both times.
A CS70 would do for a lot of our needs but, there are time when I'd need to take advantage of the 85mm cut. Perhaps Festool will do a 90mm machine?  [blink] ;)

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #40 on: June 11, 2019, 01:23 PM »
One thing about the saw stop is that when the thing goes off it destroys the blade and the cost of replacement for the mechanism isnt exactly cheap. I imagine in true festool fashion the replacement mechanism will cost a fortune

That's something I've thought about too.
Doesn't another company have a similar safety tech but, one that is re settable without damage, Felder maybe? Can't remember.

Offline Sanderxpander

  • Posts: 356
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #41 on: June 11, 2019, 01:31 PM »
I suppose the small form factor is a fair point in favor of the CMS. I guess it would be smaller than a DW745 tablesaw and a generic decent router table, but perhaps not by much. I don't have any hands on experience with the CMS router option but part of the reason for that is that just the plate unit costs like 600 euros. That's without a (Festool plunge) router or a CMS ground unit. Altogether that would be somewhere nearing 2k, just to be able to save some space and have a handheld router. With all due respect to those who use it, with a price like that and a very limited market, I can't imagine it was a huge seller.

Offline Svar

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #42 on: June 11, 2019, 01:42 PM »
Doesn't another company have a similar safety tech but, one that is re settable without damage, Felder maybe? Can't remember.
Yes, two so far. Bosch requires a new cartridge but does not affect the blade. Felder resets with a push of a button, no consumables.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #43 on: June 11, 2019, 03:03 PM »
Thanks Svar, I wonder if Felder started from scratch with their design, or copied/improved on the SawStop design?

Either way, a very clever package.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2019, 02:00 PM by Jiggy Joiner »

Offline DeformedTree

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #44 on: June 11, 2019, 09:49 PM »
Yes its a revamped CS 70 with saw stop technology.
Unlike CS70 the new one with Sawstop tech is not a pull saw. At least the prototype was not.
Hi Svar, is that because the technology would only work on a fixed head set up?
I think it is possible to mount it on moving carriage as well. Perhaps it gets too complicated or bulky. You'd probably have to immobilize the carriage when the SawStop mechanism fires up.

I would say it's the complexity factor and loads into the carriage, cost and weight start going up.  I'm still not fully getting the purpose of pull saws, but I would think they would cause your hands to not be near the blade so less of a need for the saw stop function.  Having an interlock where it only works when in conventional mode could make sense.   Still it might come back down to not trying to do too many things at one time.  They may simply want to get a Gen 1 product out, and if that goes well, they can address pull saw function for Gen 2.

Do people want a saw stop CS sooner than later?  Add functions like pull saw ability just means it's more later than sooner.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #45 on: June 11, 2019, 10:03 PM »
Still, I can't see I've seen anything like a CMS for routers.   You have the basic "table" deal you buy at the big box store that doesn't do much but hold a router.  Or you get into big DIY assembly of random parts that people build.  I would be curious if anyone can point to something that is the same as a CMS router setup, not a "buy this", "add this companies lift", etc.  The turn key aspect of it is a winner, and the addition that you could swap it with a saw and such is what put it over the top. 
Triton WorkCentre is a modular system similar to CMS. Work table / router / table saw / cross cut saw, all in one. Bunch of reviews on YouTube.
Wolfcraft has a modular system too (low budget, low quality), not available in the US.

Thanks

Yeah, it is similar, and funny it's a lot like what some of us have mentioned, that being merge of the CS/CMS line.  The dedicated saw module verses adapt a TS is a nice way to do it, though I would still want to see both offered as I'm sure many folks would like to just leave their TS 75 in the plate, and only pull it out when they have a job their TS55 isn't up to.

Offline GarryMartin

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #46 on: June 12, 2019, 02:57 AM »
Seems to a little confusion and some missed information from previous posts in this thread.

The revised CS 70 doesn't incorporate SawStop technology.

The new TKS 80 *does* include the SawStop technology, but is not a pull saw. The TKS 80 prototype is the saw that has been seen doing the rounds of a few shows recently. It will also be on the UK Festool Truck tour for those that want to catch a glimpse of it.

The new CS 70 did not have US part numbers in the list from last year, but the TKS 80 did. I assume this means the US will get the TKS 80, but I don't have any information regarding timing of release in Europe or elsewhere.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #47 on: June 12, 2019, 02:32 PM »
I'm still not fully getting the purpose of pull saws

The idea behind the push/pull saws, is to add a little safety when ripping smaller stock, as the stck can be clamped, the saw blade pulled through, which eliminates the cause of many accidents with table saws. The other thinking behind them, is mitres, especially compound mitres are achievable in a safer, and slightly easier way, instead of a sled set up. Plus a few other things that are made easier with the push/pull.

The first time I ever used one, it felt a bit awkward until I got the hang of it, and with further use, I seemed to work more efficiently, and I think a bit safer.

They are not for everybody though, I’ve used a Mafell Erika 85 often, as a friend has one. They are a really superb machine, even if possibly over priced. I’ve been after one for a long time but, I’m struggling with the £3000 price, as all said and done, it’s a portable table saw, albeit a very nice one.
I will look at the TKS 80 though, as it may be a contender.

Offline Alex

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #48 on: June 12, 2019, 03:18 PM »
Why would a pull saw not be for everyone? It's a great concept, everything's safer and easier. And you can just as easily use it as a standard saw. On my CS70 I'm switching all the time between the two modes. I really hope they put the SawStop technology in it soon.

Sad to see the CMS go, I was planning on getting one one day, though I'm not sure I'd really need it. My sawing needs are already covered, and I think there are better options for a router table.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #49 on: June 12, 2019, 11:21 PM »
I will say this got me looking back at the Erika again.  What I hadn't seen before is they do have a router add on setup for it.  So I would say you can get to a similar place, but the router setup is just an add on off the side.  So not great.  Also the Maffell is a lot more money for their stuff.  Not so crazy about only having one US legit source.  But considering how flaky Festool is with things it might not be a bad option. Of course for LR32 stuff I'd still find myself looking for a router as I don't see Maffell having a good option there. Of course their friends as Bosch have a solution.

It is very frustrating that the whole reason I found Festool was a search for metric tools, and before I got to buying tools, they took metric away from the N.A. market.  Then I start plotting things I would buy and things go away,  the MFS,  now the CMS, and who knows how many other things I've considered over time.  Being able to leverage the saw in a CMS in the future was one of the reasons I bought the TS55 over the Maffel, with CMS gone, that would take a big hit.  The L32 was still in play in the choice, but then that connected back to the routers which connect back to the CMS.  So then it might have just come down to plug-it, which is a very nice thing, but not an impossible change to be made to other tools.

I'm happy with my Festool sanders, and CT, and those work nice on their own, probably will still buy a Domino.  But this is a trend that makes it ever harder to even consider waiting around for them to get their act back together.  What is someone to buy from a company if everything that made them interesting goes away and the products one is interested in buying go away.  Since buying the CT26, some of my non-festool stuff got new life as it's dust collection now could be used (having hoses that fit, autostart), they have all been put in systainers so the work flow with them is very nice now. 

I don't think I'm going to go throwing my TS55 and tracks away, but I think it's definitely time to re-consider things.  Festool needs to show what they are going to do to fill the void and do so quick.  I'd like to replace my compact Bosch table saw which aggravates me to no end.  I don't think I will sit around for 2 years with the hope that Festool brings out something I would want.

I just don't know what they expect to sell if they discontinue everything.  This is more so in N.America were the don't sell a whole lot of different products in the first place.

Offline Svar

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #50 on: June 13, 2019, 05:56 PM »
Of course for LR32 stuff I'd still find myself looking for a router as I don't see Maffell having a good option there.
There is: Mafell DD40 and Template Guide Rail.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #51 on: June 13, 2019, 10:12 PM »
Of course for LR32 stuff I'd still find myself looking for a router as I don't see Maffell having a good option there.
There is: Mafell DD40 and Template Guide Rail.

Mind blown!   Why the heck do they call it the DD40 and not DD32.   I never made the connection that they drilled 32mm apart and had this as an option. I thought just drilled for dowels 40mm apart, and was overall a not very versatile machine.  This is definitely interesting.   Have to think about what is easier when trying to do cabinets, this or the LR32 setup from Festool.   Granted you get LR32 and domino replacement in one machine.  Of course gone are the option for the nifty knock down hardware Festool made for dominos.    This brings up the obvious question of why Festool made the domino in the first place, aside from just to be different.  First glance I think they both probably still have a place.

Think if Maffell called it the dual holer 32  DH32 it would have drawn more attention.

I will say some of this is the issue of having just one sales portal (and it being a 3rd party) for the US market.  Nothing against TW, but they don't exactly provide a lot of info on the tools.

Of course if I were to start buying maffell, they would probably launch a US division, offer tools in inch and discontinue stuff too :)

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #52 on: June 14, 2019, 01:44 AM »
I'm still not fully getting the purpose of pull saws

The idea behind the push/pull saws, is to add a little safety when ripping smaller stock, as the stck can be clamped, the saw blade pulled through, which eliminates the cause of many accidents with table saws. The other thinking behind them, is mitres, especially compound mitres are achievable in a safer, and slightly easier way, instead of a sled set up. Plus a few other things that are made easier with the push/pull.

The first time I ever used one, it felt a bit awkward until I got the hang of it, and with further use, I seemed to work more efficiently, and I think a bit safer.

They are not for everybody though, I’ve used a Mafell Erika 85 often, as a friend has one. They are a really superb machine, even if possibly over priced. I’ve been after one for a long time but, I’m struggling with the £3000 price, as all said and done, it’s a portable table saw, albeit a very nice one.
I will look at the TKS 80 though, as it may be a contender.

So looking at them more, videos and such and thinking about this more I came to the realization they get us back to good old radial arm saws.  The more I thought about it, I would think you could in many ways replace a compound miter box with one if used in the right ways.  Grew up with table saw and radial arm saw.  Never used a chop saw,  compound or slider until I owned one.   Depending on shop layout and what someone does, maybe one could skip the Kapex and put that money at a saw like an Erika.   May not be a great setup, but probably workable.  Sliding compounds are nice, but I would say they are far from a perfect tool.  I see the pull function on a 85 is nearly 18".  Pretty sure that's getting thru more wood than my 12" slider.

Still, the price is a very really thing.  4 grand for a saw.  And the 85 is only a little more than the 70, but the 85 is 230V only, so that would be an issue for auto start with vacuum.... the cycle begins again.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #53 on: June 14, 2019, 06:46 AM »
Why would a pull saw not be for everyone? It's a great concept, everything's safer and easier. And you can just as easily use it as a standard saw. On my CS70 I'm switching all the time between the two modes. I really hope they put the SawStop technology in it soon.

Sad to see the CMS go, I was planning on getting one one day, though I'm not sure I'd really need it. My sawing needs are already covered, and I think there are better options for a router table.

I love push/pull saws Alex, and my preference if buying a new table saw would be to have the push/pull facility. However, like many things in life, strawberries and cream, tea, coffee, cigars etc etc, they're are not for everybody. some like a table saw where the stock is pushed towards a spinning blade, some prefer to pull the spinning blade toward the stock. All down to preference.

I saw the TSK 80 being demo'd with the superb SawStop safety technology, a lovely and very safe saw with an 80mm cut, 10mm deeper than the CS70. What more could you ask for? Well according to some of the comments, and my own preference, a push/pull facility would make this saw a contender.
From what I understand, the SawStop tech cannot be implemented with a push/pull design? Shame really.
The saw is said to go on European release very late 2020 but, Festool as we know, can be late at times  ;)

The saw was well received by onlookers, many whom said they aren't bothered it isn't push/pull.
I would like the option of a CS85 if it ever materialised, even without SawStop tech but, not sure it will happen? For me, in the portable table saw category, the Mafell Erika 85 is still king, not the price though.  [blink]

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #54 on: June 14, 2019, 05:02 PM »
I'm still not fully getting the purpose of pull saws

The idea behind the push/pull saws, is to add a little safety when ripping smaller stock, as the stck can be clamped, the saw blade pulled through, which eliminates the cause of many accidents with table saws. The other thinking behind them, is mitres, especially compound mitres are achievable in a safer, and slightly easier way, instead of a sled set up. Plus a few other things that are made easier with the push/pull.

The first time I ever used one, it felt a bit awkward until I got the hang of it, and with further use, I seemed to work more efficiently, and I think a bit safer.

They are not for everybody though, I’ve used a Mafell Erika 85 often, as a friend has one. They are a really superb machine, even if possibly over priced. I’ve been after one for a long time but, I’m struggling with the £3000 price, as all said and done, it’s a portable table saw, albeit a very nice one.
I will look at the TKS 80 though, as it may be a contender.

So looking at them more, videos and such and thinking about this more I came to the realization they get us back to good old radial arm saws.  The more I thought about it, I would think you could in many ways replace a compound miter box with one if used in the right ways.  Grew up with table saw and radial arm saw.  Never used a chop saw,  compound or slider until I owned one.   Depending on shop layout and what someone does, maybe one could skip the Kapex and put that money at a saw like an Erika.   May not be a great setup, but probably workable.  Sliding compounds are nice, but I would say they are far from a perfect tool.  I see the pull function on a 85 is nearly 18".  Pretty sure that's getting thru more wood than my 12" slider.

Still, the price is a very really thing.  4 grand for a saw.  And the 85 is only a little more than the 70, but the 85 is 230V only, so that would be an issue for auto start with vacuum.... the cycle begins again.

Yes, I often compare push/pull saws to radial arm saws. I had a very big radial arm saw in a workshop years ago, that machine was in constant use every day, and more than earned it’s keep. We eventually replaced it with another tables saw, and a large mitre saw. I don’t know why we never kept it, it was so versatile, and never any trouble.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #55 on: June 15, 2019, 11:52 AM »
So a bit more back on subject.  Discontinuing the CMS non-north American places isn't as impactful on the saw front, as the CS saws exist, and in north America we never had saw inserts.  So putting the saws to the side for now.  About router tabling.  While north America got a slightly limited version, in the end everyone had the CMS for the festool routers globally.  With CMS discontinued, what does Festool offer folks anyplace for router table functions?

If the CMS concept is gone, I would think they would still find a need for some sort of router table function.   

I'm trying to understand if this is a hint to new routers.  It looks like in the past, new routers/cms were co-launched.  This makes sense since if you alter the base of the router you need new CMS insert.  Could they have new routers on the way?  Maybe Festool is going to revolutionize routers and add a light  [wink]   .  Maybe the old CMS would need updates for this, so it was deemed to just discontinue.

What happened on previous launch?  I assume there was OF1000, OF2000 and plate for the Basis system, and then they want OF1010, OF2200, CMS  all as one change.   Did the Basis system get discontinued and then CMS came along after new router launch?

Online Peter Halle

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Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #56 on: June 15, 2019, 06:02 PM »
@DeformedTree ,  I am not that much about dialog these days, but the common facts in life is that any manufacturer will discontinue products for their own internal reasons.  Think Saturn and even Pontiac.

Festool hasn't said that the CMS is going to discontinued here but any sensible person would see the writing on the wall.  We were the last country to get it after all.

So, respectfully, if you want a CMS then step away from the keyboard and buy one.  If you want other stuff to add on to it, go grey market before all that stuff disappears and set yourself up.  Then do what you want in your shop.

But just typing and typing about it isn't going to alter the path that corporate has decided (and I have no idea what that is).

I offer this politely as practical advice.

Peter

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #57 on: June 15, 2019, 07:58 PM »
@DeformedTree ,  I am not that much about dialog these days, but the common facts in life is that any manufacturer will discontinue products for their own internal reasons.  Think Saturn and even Pontiac.

Festool hasn't said that the CMS is going to discontinued here but any sensible person would see the writing on the wall.  We were the last country to get it after all.

So, respectfully, if you want a CMS then step away from the keyboard and buy one.  If you want other stuff to add on to it, go grey market before all that stuff disappears and set yourself up.  Then do what you want in your shop.

But just typing and typing about it isn't going to alter the path that corporate has decided (and I have no idea what that is).

I offer this politely as practical advice.

Peter

I think you mis-understand my comments,  I agree with you, it's discontinued and that is their decision.  Since it's discontinued, I have no interest in buying it.  My question now is if this is a hint of new things coming or not, since it would seam to leave a hole in their lineup that they would want to fill.

I'm bummed it goes away, but we never had the full system here anyway.  It just means re-thinking things.  I think if I was someone who was part way in setting up a CMS setup or just bought one I'd be less happy right now.  Stuff comes and goes, it just gets much more complex when products interconnect with each other.  I don't know how Festool handles things when they break compatibility from one generation to the next.  Do they just change. Do they discontinue, purge inventory, then bring new out.  Do they have overlap where folks can decide if they pick up the old stuff or work on shifting to the new.


Offline Alex

  • Posts: 5987
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #58 on: June 16, 2019, 03:33 AM »
I'm trying to understand if this is a hint to new routers.  It looks like in the past, new routers/cms were co-launched.  This makes sense since if you alter the base of the router you need new CMS insert.  Could they have new routers on the way?  Maybe Festool is going to revolutionize routers and add a light  [wink]   .  Maybe the old CMS would need updates for this, so it was deemed to just discontinue.

This is really the type of speculation you should only keep to yourself. No base here whatsoever, there are so many steps in there building on each other and that kind of fantasy is simply not going to happen.

Routers will stay the same, and CMS will go away. That's how it works.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #59 on: June 16, 2019, 04:30 AM »
I think from an upgrade point of view, if a company does discontinue a product and it’s accessories from their saleable catalogue. They should continue to manufacture and makes spares available for quite some time. Otherwise somebody who recently has invested heavily in a set up, and told very soon after that it’s to be discontinued, would be rightly upset?

I am still able to buy parts from some very old tools that I still have in use, all of these tools have been discontinued for many years but, the fact that the parts are still available, means I can continue to use them when needed.

I didn’t know that the full system CMS was never available in some countries, this is a bit strange as the CMS is a modular system, offering lots of possibilities in a compact set up, if you invest in the accessories but, if you are not offered the accessories to buy, what is the point? [scratch chin]

Hopefully any new or replacement systems, will be available to any countries where dealers are based, especially the countries that have heavily invested in the brand.
It’s obvious that European countries get the products when first released, but surely this could be amended so that the products are available globally on release.
The voltage differences have been around long enough now, for companies to know what is required from a legal and safety point of view. So they could get everything in place before a product is launched. That way, everything is available, and can be offered to anybody with dealer outlets, regardless of their location?

Festool currently have a few things in the pipeline, so maybe a replacement or re designed CMS type set up will be available?
If so, I hope it’s available in it’s entirety to all  ;)

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 6030
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #60 on: June 16, 2019, 10:44 AM »

I didn’t know that the full system CMS was never available in some countries, this is a bit strange as the CMS is a modular system, offering lots of possibilities in a compact set up, if you invest in the accessories but, if you are not offered the accessories to buy, what is the point? [scratch chin]


Ya, we were denied the table saw insert and the jig saw insert. The jig saw insert has some interest for me although I've never tried one out. [sad]

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Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5690
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #61 on: June 16, 2019, 11:06 AM »
@Cheese

Its pretty kewl. I use mine mainly for jig and template making

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #62 on: June 16, 2019, 12:21 PM »

I didn’t know that the full system CMS was never available in some countries, this is a bit strange as the CMS is a modular system, offering lots of possibilities in a compact set up, if you invest in the accessories but, if you are not offered the accessories to buy, what is the point? [scratch chin]

It’s obvious that European countries get the products when first released, but surely this could be amended so that the products are available globally on release.
The voltage differences have been around long enough now, for companies to know what is required from a legal and safety point of view. So they could get everything in place before a product is launched. That way, everything is available, and can be offered to anybody with dealer outlets, regardless of their location?


Only module the US got was the router, and even with that the OF2200 was not allowed to be used with it.  I think, but very well could be wrong, all the add on bits (outfeeds tables, etc) were available.  From reading articles from the past, it sounds like they did originally intend to bring things like the saw modules to N.A. but that clearly never panned out.  Folks brought other parts in from other parts of the world.

The CMS was a nifty thing, how well it sold none of us will ever know.  I would assume Festool kept it going in the US in it's limited form just so they had a router table solution to offer customers even if they couldn't get the other modules.  The saw stop Festool saw doesn't look like it will be in N.A (or anywhere really) anytime soon.  Since festool doesn't sell Table saws here now, there isn't a real need to make it happen fast since it's not like there is a gap in product offerings.  Other places have the new Saws so they are good.

CMS may have been a good idea that was just too hard to really implement well globally due to different safety rules, voltages and such.  I don't know if anything has changed in the EU that would trigger a re-design.  Having to tailor tools to each country region is expensive and a pain for a company, having to tailor multiple levels of tools to work (tool + CMS) becomes much more of a pain and expense.   

Festool USA website has been running really poorly, the CMS stuff doesn't fully load.  As has been mentioned, pretty obvious it will be discontinued at some point. 

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #63 on: June 16, 2019, 04:58 PM »
I honestly do feel for you chaps, it must be  very frustrating. If it is down to laws and safety, it makes me wonder what will happen if/when the UK leaves Europe?

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 500
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #64 on: June 17, 2019, 12:36 AM »
I honestly do feel for you chaps, it must be  very frustrating. If it is down to laws and safety, it makes me wonder what will happen if/when the UK leaves Europe?

I doubt there would be too much sudden change other than pricing maybe.  All the network/infrastructure/people are there. I wouldn't worry about it until things happen.  It's not like anyone is going to change all your codes/safety regs that day.  I'm no expert on the UK connections to the EU but I understand even as is the UK has never been all in on everything.  Festool supports 2 voltages of tools, the BS plug today which is different from other EU locations, no reason that would suddenly stop. Prices/Taxes are where I'd expect all change to revolve around, and that's not going to be unique to Festool products.

Also remember due to it's size, the US is a bit of a walled garden.  Generally folks never buy anything from a different country if they live here, it's often not an option, though the last few years sites like Amazon have started allowing some international sales. Most non-USA retailers will ship to almost anyplace, except the US, but like Amazon this has started to change some in recent times.  We tend to end up with a US division of a company or a specific importer.  Thus what you can get has a filter on it.  UK isn't going to suddenly become an island... [wink]

Still, I wouldn't think about it too much until things actually happen.

Offline Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 483
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #65 on: June 17, 2019, 02:45 PM »
Oh I’m not worried or bothered about it either way, I do hope we get nearer to being an island again though.  ;)

Offline Coen

  • Posts: 442
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #66 on: June 22, 2019, 02:13 PM »

I didn’t know that the full system CMS was never available in some countries, this is a bit strange as the CMS is a modular system, offering lots of possibilities in a compact set up, if you invest in the accessories but, if you are not offered the accessories to buy, what is the point? [scratch chin]


Ya, we were denied the table saw insert and the jig saw insert. The jig saw insert has some interest for me although I've never tried one out. [sad]

You can clamp the jigsaw under the router insert  [tongue]

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5690
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: Festool CMS discontinued
« Reply #67 on: June 22, 2019, 11:50 PM »
@DeformedTree

you can get them. You see them for sale occasionally in the classifieds.

Theres a guy selling the complete pkg right now. CMS, TS75, TS 75 module, fence side table et etc


Just noticed another guy selling the TS75 module in the classifieds
« Last Edit: June 23, 2019, 04:53 PM by jobsworth »