Author Topic: Kapex Precision  (Read 2006 times)

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Offline clifton clowers

  • Posts: 3
Kapex Precision
« on: November 02, 2017, 02:03 PM »
Hello. This is my first post, and my first Festool. After a lot of reading here and elsewhere, I recently ordered a Kapex (from Amazon, which is perhaps not the best idea.) The reason I chose a Kapex over various other saws is that I am strictly interested in a precision saw. Repeatability, ease of setting angles, etc. (I frankly would just buy a second table saw for cross cutting, but I don't have the room.) I don't care about the lasers, the dust system, the portability, etc. I am an artist who works in wood sometimes, not a contractor, so I really only about cutting precision.

My saw showed up, and it appeared to have been treated roughly by UPS, and possibly refurbished (lots of fingerprints, some sawdust). I called Festool to ask about condition, and they suggested I just return it for a replacement. The replacement arrived today. It appears to have been just as roughly treated (styrofoam in the box is broken into large pieces) and indeed the box was open, missing the plastic straps the first one had, and missing at least one small part (an allen key.)

Now to the question - all else aside, there seems to be considerable play in the saw head. It looks like, if I tried, a cut measured at 12" could be anywhere from 11 15/16 to 12 1/16. Obviously I am not going to try pushing the saw side to side as I use it, but it is definitely not that rigid. Doing work where 1/1000" matters, certainly when cutting a miter angle, applying perfectly angled pressure is less likely which will throw off cuts. This also looks like a recipe for kickback.

I asked the person at Festool if this was expected, and he said "no" which is why I ultimately returned the first one. This is my first miter saw, so perhaps I am expecting something that is not possible - but I expected there to be as little play as there is in my table saw fence. So is this endemic to this design? To this type of tool? Am I looking for something that simply does not exist? Thanks.

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Offline Upscale

  • Posts: 722
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2017, 02:16 PM »
Highly suggest you return the second one too. And then, visit a Festool vendor where you can examine a Kapex in person to confirm that it's in good condition. Since all Festool products have the same price universally, it's to your advantage to see what you're buying. Of course, this is dependent on having a Festool dealer within traveling range.  ;D
« Last Edit: November 02, 2017, 02:18 PM by Upscale »
DF 500 Q Domino, CT22, Carvex PSBC 420 Jigsaw, 7 systainers and several accessories. I'm just a rank Festool beginner, but I'm trying hard. :) Oh yeah, now that I own a FOG hat 2011 edition, I guess I'm not such a beginner anymore.

Offline Birdhunter

  • Posts: 1975
  • Woodworker, Sportsman, Retired
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #2 on: November 02, 2017, 03:08 PM »
Upscale is exactly correct. You are getting damaged goods. Return the saw and get one directly from a dealer.
Birdhunter

Offline clifton clowers

  • Posts: 3
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #3 on: November 02, 2017, 03:59 PM »
Both packed up to go back. I must say, the fault here does not lie with either Amazon or UPS - Festool's packing for this saw is wholly inadequate to withstand shipping.

Offline bnaboatbuilder

  • Posts: 77
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #4 on: November 02, 2017, 04:31 PM »
You say you have a table saw. I suggest you make a sled for it, plenty of good how-tos on youtube and then calibrate that to a 1/1000". At that point you can probably make more accurate cuts, even at other angles using some basic jigs and save yourself $1500.
- John

Offline antss

  • Posts: 1373
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #5 on: November 02, 2017, 04:35 PM »
I disagree that the packaging is not adequate.  Many of these saws go back to Festool for motor repairs and the shipping boxes seem to hold up quite well from the pics I've seen.  And UPS is the go to shipper for warranty work.

When you buy from Amazon it's sometimes pot luck as to who actually fulfills your order.  It might be a Bezos employee, or it might be a dealer and it might be from their warehouse or some other arrangement.

If you got an open box , especially a saw with dust and fingerprints - you definitely didn't get a factory fresh saw.  Again , this may or may not be caused by Amazon.   Think we can be pretty certain UPS didn't open the box and make a few cuts with it.  At any rate; Amazon will make it right.  You'll have to deal with the time and frustration though. I wouldn't try for a third strike. though.

Perhaps you should consider one of our forum members for your purchase.  Bob Marino  or Shane at ToolNut can help you out with a Kapex.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2017, 04:39 PM by antss »

Offline clifton clowers

  • Posts: 3
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #6 on: November 02, 2017, 04:43 PM »
An update - and an apology to Festool. I talked to them, and they said that when these ship to Amazon they are double boxed. So Amazon seems to have removed the outer box, which the Festool employee I spoke to indicated would be inadequate for UPS.

Yes, I have sleds and jigs. But there are times when the cost of a second saw is justified in order to avoid having to change blades and readjust the angle back and forth.

Online Peter Halle

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Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #7 on: November 02, 2017, 04:59 PM »
When you end up getting your new Kapex, do be on the lookout for the laser adjusting hex key.  They have been known to work their way underneath the styrofoam between the styrofoam and the box.

Peter
Disclaimer:  I have been involved with the development of some TSO Products.  I have offered thoughts and ideas freely.  I am not paid but I may receive products during the development process or afterwards.

Offline ear3

  • Posts: 3348
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #8 on: November 02, 2017, 06:09 PM »
In any sliding miter saw, even Festool's there will always be potential for play, especially when doing longer/wider cuts or if you're cutting a bevel.  But the tolerances on the Kapex are in my experience much tighter than on other sliding miter saws I've worked with (I have never used the Bosch glide, however).  Even if the saw cuts perfectly at 90, one thing you will definitely want to check is how much deflection there is when cutting an extreme bevel, like between 30-45 degrees.  My Kapex had a fair amount of deflection doing bevel cuts out of the box, and I ultimately sent mine in for service, which corrected the issue.

Hello. This is my first post, and my first Festool. After a lot of reading here and elsewhere, I recently ordered a Kapex (from Amazon, which is perhaps not the best idea.) The reason I chose a Kapex over various other saws is that I am strictly interested in a precision saw. Repeatability, ease of setting angles, etc. (I frankly would just buy a second table saw for cross cutting, but I don't have the room.) I don't care about the lasers, the dust system, the portability, etc. I am an artist who works in wood sometimes, not a contractor, so I really only about cutting precision.

My saw showed up, and it appeared to have been treated roughly by UPS, and possibly refurbished (lots of fingerprints, some sawdust). I called Festool to ask about condition, and they suggested I just return it for a replacement. The replacement arrived today. It appears to have been just as roughly treated (styrofoam in the box is broken into large pieces) and indeed the box was open, missing the plastic straps the first one had, and missing at least one small part (an allen key.)

Now to the question - all else aside, there seems to be considerable play in the saw head. It looks like, if I tried, a cut measured at 12" could be anywhere from 11 15/16 to 12 1/16. Obviously I am not going to try pushing the saw side to side as I use it, but it is definitely not that rigid. Doing work where 1/1000" matters, certainly when cutting a miter angle, applying perfectly angled pressure is less likely which will throw off cuts. This also looks like a recipe for kickback.

I asked the person at Festool if this was expected, and he said "no" which is why I ultimately returned the first one. This is my first miter saw, so perhaps I am expecting something that is not possible - but I expected there to be as little play as there is in my table saw fence. So is this endemic to this design? To this type of tool? Am I looking for something that simply does not exist? Thanks.
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • DX 93 • RS 2 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 4482
  • Burger Babe Says: I Even Buy Green Bananas
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #9 on: November 02, 2017, 10:45 PM »
I suggest returning the saw to Amazon get your refund and then buy the saw from a online dealer who frequents this site such as Bob Marino, Aldo at InTouch, tool nut etc etc When even I order from one of the dealers who are active here, when I receive my order it’s packaged to withstand a nuke bomb.
Loving the Calif sun....

Offline pettyconstruction

  • Posts: 358
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #10 on: November 02, 2017, 11:15 PM »
I suggest returning the saw to Amazon get your refund and then buy the saw from a online dealer who frequents this site such as Bob Marino, Aldo at InTouch, tool nut etc etc When even I order from one of the dealers who are active here, when I receive my order it’s packaged to withstand a nuke bomb.
Yes ,all my orders have been very well packaged .
Charlie


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Offline Naildrivingman

  • Posts: 338
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #11 on: November 03, 2017, 07:12 AM »
Call me old fashioned, but I don’t buy tools online unless I know that I will never need support or service.  I develop relationships with brick and mortar vendors, so that if I have a problem, I simply bring the tool to the vendor and the problem is resolved.  This approach has never failed me.

I am not disparaging online vendors at all.  I simply need a quicker and less painless  solution than most online vendors can deliver.

As to your question regarding precision, I have found the Kapex to be very precise in almost all applications.  Severe bevels are generally the weak link for most saws because of that nasty thing called gravity.  If I can cut a bevel upright by setting the miter gauge, I do so.

As to your comment regarding precision to 1/1000”...I think your expectations are lofty.  A human hair averages about 3/1000” in diameter.  I checked runout on my Kapex and it is about 5/1000” (0.005”).  If you are experiencing a variance of +/- 1/16” then there is something dramatically wrong with the blade or the saw or both.  This variance equates to between 0.0625” and 0.125”.  I can’t even accept that error in a circular saw. If your cuts are consistently this bad, then the saw needs attention.

Good luck.
Dance with who brung ya...

Offline Troutbum86

  • Posts: 8
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #12 on: November 03, 2017, 10:05 PM »
I've order all my festool from Tool Nut and never had a problem with any shipping what so ever. Just my .02cent
Tool List: OF1400, MFT/3, DF500, EC125, LR32, TS55, CT36, Plus tons of accessories.

Offline SS Teach

  • Posts: 263
Re: Kapex Precision
« Reply #13 on: November 11, 2017, 06:46 PM »
Welcome. Amazon delivers to “Wolverton Mountain”? I buy from Bob Marino. Except for the KAL II, my recycle bin is filled after I unpack my order. I’ve also ordered from Toolnut, never had a problem.
RTS 400, LS 130, Sandpaper Systainer, Profile Systainer. ETS 125, Sandpaper Systainer, Ro 90, Sandpaper Systainer,  Ro 150, Sandpaper Systainer, OF 1400, TS 55 REQ, CT36, CXS Li 1.5 Set, Centrotec Wood-Drill-Set/8pcs, CT Wings, Surfix Set.