Author Topic: Which Festool Drill?  (Read 2412 times)

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Offline mattbyington

  • Posts: 146
Which Festool Drill?
« on: July 23, 2018, 03:39 PM »
Hey team,

Thinking about getting a drill from festool. The sys port I made a month ago or so was built with one extra space for a sys 2 and I already installed the drawers so it must be filled :)

As with the sanders I’m a little overwhelmed by the options - what are the main differences ?

Thanks!

Matt

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Offline Don T

  • Posts: 1821
  • Phoenix, Az
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #1 on: July 23, 2018, 04:01 PM »
I have a C12, (2) CXS, and a C18. I recently purchased the C18 and have only used it a couple of times but I can tell you it is a beast. I may be saying that because I use the CXS most of the time since I purchased the first one a 1 ½ years ago. I love the CXS for the weight and power. The C12 worked well for me and still does. Again it is relatively light but has good power. As for C or T drills that is a personal preference. If you are only going to be doing shorter screws, I would go with the CXS. Hope this helps, I’m sure you will get a ample amount of feedback.
RO150, C12, DF 500 Q, CT33, TS75, MFT3, Kapex 120, MFT3/Kapex, MFK 700, RO 90, ETS150/3, CT22, Centrotec Installers Kit, Parallel Guides & Ext, Carvex, OF1400, LR32 Set, MFS400 w/700 rails, KA UG Set, First Aid Kit, RTS 400 EQ, Vecturo OS400 Set, CT Wings, CT Drill Guide, Pro 5, CXS, C18, HL850, Vac Sys set

Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #2 on: July 23, 2018, 04:18 PM »
You really need to get your hands on them, literally.

I have worked professionally with a drill in hand for the last fifteen years and I can't even decide which Festool drill I like the best. Maybe because none of them are perfect, so far.

The T18 is arguably the best allrounder for weight, flexibility and performance. It has a "normal" grip which is nice and takes compact high performance batteries as well as larger higher Ah batteries if needed.

The CXS is my go to drill for small work and assembly work. Light, nimble, plenty of options for hard to reach areas and a superb belt clip. Good onboard storage for bits. It is a bit weak for some types of jobs but paired with the T18 I think there is little to complain about. Both are a bit low in RPM at high gear.

With any of these two as a starting point you might be happy. The CXS is surely not a do-it-all drill, it is too weak. But it is also the only one I would  never part with. Mind you the T18 shares charger with the entire 18V platform and the CXS/TXS are the only drills that use that proprietary charger. I don't mind the extra charger for the CXS. It is a specialty driver that hits the sweet spot for me and will stay in the stable regardless of whatever brand passes my fingers. :)

The CXS only takes up to 10mm drill bits in the chuck. Forget hole saws with the CXS. I have toasted one, almost two CXS machines over the years - and I personally think I didn't push them that hard. They are not brushless and they are not able to withstand too much abuse. For general assembly work they are superb for me though.

The TXS is the sibling of the CXS but I think it is redundant, only marginally smaller than the T18 and as weak as the CXS and the belt clip isn't as nice.

Some people (me included) like the C18 though some loathe the grip. It is very similar in performance to the T18 (virtually identical specs) it has onboard bit storage like the CXS and is powerful enough for most jobs.

The DRC/4 has a better light and is more powerful than the T18, also has a great grip though you need to mod the machine if you want a belt clip that doesn't slip off your person easily. It has four gears and they are all useful but I think they are slightly off for me though sometimes they do hit the sweet spot.

The PDC/4 is a percussion drill, some like it. I don't. They are loud. It is not an impact. Festool does not have an impact in the line up, I sure wish they did.

Of the above drills I own the CXS, the C18, the T18 and the DRC as well as an older T12+3.  I use them all. I use the T18 and the CXS the most but on a current job I use the DRC as the main machine and the T18 as a backup and I use the BHC 18 for drilling larger stuff. I also own the DWC2500 drywall gun which I have been very impressed with.

« Last Edit: July 23, 2018, 04:21 PM by Henrik R / Pingvinlakrits »
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline neilc

  • Posts: 2514
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #3 on: July 23, 2018, 04:30 PM »
I have CXS and T18.  Those have served me well for right angle chucks, eccentric, battery compatibility with other tools in the case of the T series and performance.  I REALLY like the small size and weight of the CXS but use the T18 when I need a larger chuck size or more power.  I also find having two great for drilling pilot holes and then following with screws without having to change bits.

I also own the brushless Makita drill and impact driver combo set purchased a year or so ago since FT was not offering an impact and I needed one on a couple of jobs.  It's an excellent drill/driver combo with great ergonomics if you are looking beyond FT.  They are between the sizes of the CSX and T18 but offer great performance and light weight.  And you can get two for a fraction of the price of one Festool.  Add a Systainer for storage and your Systainer port is filled!

https://www.toolnut.com/makita-cx200rb-18v-lxt-sub-compact-brushless-drill-impact-driver-combo-kit.html
« Last Edit: July 23, 2018, 04:34 PM by neilc »

Online GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 649
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #4 on: July 23, 2018, 04:53 PM »
I was going to ask - does it really have to be a Festool Drill?

I was under the impression that one of the major advantages to getting a Festool Drill (depending on the model) is that I think the battery may be interchangeable with some other Festool cordless tools (like maybe the TSC)?  I really like my CXS set that I have, but I think the newer CXS battery is only also compatible with the TXS drills?  As much as I like my CXS, I honestly find myself reaching for my Bosch Flexi-click more often.

Pretty much all of my drills and impact drivers from the last 15 years have been 18v Makitas (I believe they're all brushed models).  They've been great workhorses and very reasonably priced.
Inquiring Minds Want to Know

TS55, CT26, RO150, CXS, ETS 150/3, ETS EC 150/5, MFT/3, TS75, DF500, DTS400, OF1400, CT SYS

Offline waho6o9

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Offline VW MICK

  • Posts: 881
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2018, 05:23 PM »
Hi

I think it’s the same as sanders. You can’t have just one

But I would say T18 and a cxs it’s so nice for small jobs

My T18 is my go to drill

Thanks Mick

Offline Birdhunter

  • Posts: 2360
  • Woodworker, Sportsman, Retired
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2018, 05:54 PM »
I have an old CSX, newer TSX, old C12, T18, and a TI (discontinued impact model).

If I had to keep two, I’d choose the TSX and the T18. If I had to keep only one, it would be the T18.

If I was on a budget, I’d buy a Bosch drill.
Birdhunter

Offline Jim_in_PA

  • Posts: 38
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2018, 06:04 PM »
I have both the original 12v T-series D/D and picked up a CXS 10v recently. The combination has been "killer" for me. The smaller unit is a pleasure to use because of its light weight, but it still has some serious guts to it. It gets the majority of my attention, both in the shop and outside of the shop. The older unit does everything I ask it to when I need more power and don't mind the added weight. (I have an even older 14.4v DeWalt for "heavier" work, but if I had to replace it, I'd seriously consider an 18v Festool for that replacement)

I agree that you should make an effort to get to hold the various Festool D/D offerings and find out what feels most comfortable in your hand, considering the type if work you intend to do with it.
----
ETS 150/3, Rotex 150, OF1010, OF1400, Trion PS 300, TDK-12, CT-22, MFT 1080, TS55, Domino XL DF 700, 8' track, (2) 55" tracks

SCM MiniMax S315WS, FS350, MM16, Camaster Stinger II SR-44 CNC

Offline Max Fracas

  • Posts: 90
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2018, 07:06 PM »
I’ll pile on with the comments about the great CXS-T18 duo.  Terrific.  I’ll just add that if I can’t find the CXS it’s because my wife has borrowed it.  She loves it and considers it “her” drill. 

Offline RKA

  • Posts: 1259
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2018, 08:32 PM »
I’ll be original and say CXS first and T18 second.   [tongue]

I’ve had a Makita 18v brushed, a Bosch 12v brushed drill and impact driver, brushless 18v brushless Milwaukee drill and impact and 12v brushless milwaukee drill and impact.

The CXS is in a class of its own, due to its compact size, ability to get into tight spaces and power.  It’s not much, but it’s more than you expect from a “little drill”.  I didn’t like it at first and much preferred the trigger control on all the larger Festool drills, but it’s grown on me.  When I need finesse, this is the drill I want.  The other 12v drills I have are touchy and just want to go go go, which isn’t a good thing.  Also the runout on Festool drills is exceptionally low.  This is the drill I would get first...without question.

Stepping up to the 18v, I find the trigger control is fantastic.  I have a C15, but one day it will be replaced with an 18v version (T or C) so I can get rid of one more battery platform.  It doesn’t have the power of the Milwaukee, but a lot more finesse and much less runout. 
-Raj

Offline HandyDen

  • Posts: 3
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2018, 10:40 PM »
This is my first post - I’ve been lurking for awhile, but I love the CXS so much I had to post.

I recently bought the CXS and stopped using my Milwaukee 12v drill/driver.  It is such a nice, comfortable drill that I’ve used for everything but the most demanding tasks.  I installed a large bay window and had to reach up into the soffit and run 1/4” lag bolts into the rafters...at a right angle.  The CXS did the job handily.  And it really excels at installing hardware, kreg screws, etc.  I find the C grip is so comfortable - like holding a dovetail saw (index finger extended along the side of the drill, middle finger pulling the trigger).  But like others said, you definitely want to fondle one for yourself before choosing C or T grip.  [tongue]

Then I bought the PDC and stopped using my Dewalt “20v” drill/driver set.  As a handyman, I can’t think of any job the PDC couldn’t handle - long lag bolts into hardwood, drilling into masonry...

So I sold the Milwaukees and Dewalts (which are great tools), and I’m very happy with my CXS/PDC lineup.

Offline mattbyington

  • Posts: 146
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2018, 11:52 PM »
Everyone, thanks so much for all the super helpful replies! I really appreciate all of them.

It sounds like the CXS and the T18 definitely take the cake.

That's great information. I would really only use this for light work (I don't do this professionally it's just a weekend hobby with small projects). The biggest project I've made is my sys port. I feel a french cleat wall coming on though. Honestly all of my projects have been pure glue and clamps up until now - I do have a Ryobi drill.

@GoingMyWay it doesn't have to be a drill. Honestly, these 3 products are next on my list:

1) Festool Router
2) Festool Jigsaw
3) Festool drill

I don't own a tool to do curves nor a router... so I might get one of the first two before I get the drill.

It'd be really cool to get a router.. I think that would open my options up a lot in what I can build (I really only own, cutting wise, the track saw and a japanese hand saw.)

Anyways I REALLY appreciate all of the advice in this thread! So much information on here and so many helpful people!!

Matt

Offline Alanbach

  • Posts: 168
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #13 on: July 24, 2018, 12:25 AM »
Sounds like you need to buy another sys port and a sheet of plywood😊!

Offline Birdhunter

  • Posts: 2360
  • Woodworker, Sportsman, Retired
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #14 on: July 24, 2018, 06:14 AM »
You , OP, have a ton of fun ahead of you!

Regarding routers, they are wonderful tools. But, they can be very dangerous. Watch some videos before using one.

I have way too many tools (admitted tool junkie) and a lot of them are Festool. The one Festool product that made a huge change in my woodworking was the Domino. It is a game changer!

This forum is an excellent source of information and an endless source of strong opinions on tools and methods of work.

The one piece of advice I give beginning woodworkers is to think through what could go wrong while using either a hand tool or a power tool. If I am the least bit uncomfortable about a cut, I back off and think of another way to do the operation. The next advice is to put on safety glasses when you enter your shop regardless of what you plan to do even if it’s just to sweep up. You will build in a habit that will protect you well.
Birdhunter

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5271
  • Does Anyone Know What Time It Is?
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #15 on: July 24, 2018, 07:39 PM »
IMO if ya just want to fill space. Id add a drawer to the sys port.

 But If you want a drill I would get the C12. I bought a C 12 bc at the time the CSX werent brushless as the are now. Plus You get all 3 accessory heads with the C 12 off set, jacobs and 90 degree head.With the CSX you only get 2. (this might have changed).

Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #16 on: July 24, 2018, 08:05 PM »
C12 is nice but was phased out a few years back so batteries are "old" and expensive and there is no compatibility with the 18V line. The T18 can use C12 batteries but the C12 can't use 18V batteries.

The C18 is the same size and is both a little stronger and "current" so it comes with a belt clip, the C12 doesn't.

Festool routers are nice, I prefer the OF1010 but if you need more power the 1400 is great. If you need MORE power the OF2200 is a beast. For versatility I prefer the OF1010 - but I have a Felder digital router at the shop...

For Jigsaws most will agree that the Carves series are a Lemon fest in the line up. You would be lucky to find a Carvex that works well. In my experience the Carvex does not cut true to square except "sometimes" in sheet goods. Festool Carvex requires TWO Systainer T-Loc 2 to be "complete". I prefer the older PS300 Trion in a Sys 1 thank you very much. Don't want to haul a jigsaw in a SYS IV equivalent package and then be disappointed with the result on top of that too... I have owned two Carvex jigsaws, ain't gonna be a third...
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline jpmeunier

  • Posts: 65
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #17 on: July 24, 2018, 10:07 PM »
IMO if ya just want to fill space. Id add a drawer to the sys port.

 But If you want a drill I would get the C12. I bought a C 12 bc at the time the CSX werent brushless as the are now. Plus You get all 3 accessory heads with the C 12 off set, jacobs and 90 degree head.With the CSX you only get 2. (this might have changed).

CSX isn't brushless....or did I miss something?

Offline Don T

  • Posts: 1821
  • Phoenix, Az
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #18 on: July 24, 2018, 10:37 PM »
I’ll pile on with the comments about the great CXS-T18 duo.  Terrific.  I’ll just add that if I can’t find the CXS it’s because my wife has borrowed it.  She loves it and considers it “her” drill.
That’s why I have two because my wife likes it so much.
RO150, C12, DF 500 Q, CT33, TS75, MFT3, Kapex 120, MFT3/Kapex, MFK 700, RO 90, ETS150/3, CT22, Centrotec Installers Kit, Parallel Guides & Ext, Carvex, OF1400, LR32 Set, MFS400 w/700 rails, KA UG Set, First Aid Kit, RTS 400 EQ, Vecturo OS400 Set, CT Wings, CT Drill Guide, Pro 5, CXS, C18, HL850, Vac Sys set

Offline ScotF

  • Posts: 2503
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #19 on: July 24, 2018, 11:19 PM »
Good advice so far. A router is a must have tool in my opinion and would be next on my list. A jigsaw is also useful for curved cuts are cuts that are unsafe with a track saw or other means. Drills are awesome and I like them all. PDC is a great choice if you want a good all arounde. C18 and TXS is also a great combo for more finish work, but I would opt for a router firdt.

Offline mattbyington

  • Posts: 146
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #20 on: July 25, 2018, 12:32 PM »
Thanks team. CXS and OF 1400 coming up soon then :)

Matt

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5271
  • Does Anyone Know What Time It Is?
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #21 on: July 25, 2018, 01:06 PM »
IMO if ya just want to fill space. Id add a drawer to the sys port.

 But If you want a drill I would get the C12. I bought a C 12 bc at the time the CSX werent brushless as the are now. Plus You get all 3 accessory heads with the C 12 off set, jacobs and 90 degree head.With the CSX you only get 2. (this might have changed).

CSX isn't brushless....or did I miss something?

Lemme check. I thought the new version was
couldnt find anything that said it brushless or not. so ll go with it not being brushless
« Last Edit: July 25, 2018, 05:48 PM by jobsworth »

Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #22 on: August 22, 2018, 04:36 PM »
CXS and TXS are still not brushless. 

When I pestered a german Festool rep in 2017 about going brushless he said they were not working on it and did not think it needed to be brushless for the intended purpose. He said they thought it would make the CXS bulkier though I replied that Bosch managed to keep their 10.8/12V drills small when they went brushless. He also said it would make it more expensive.
 
I would love a brushless CXS and I would love just a little higher RPM for drilling and a little more torque in second gear. But if it isn't happening I am still happy with my little companion.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Joe Felchlin

  • Posts: 142
  • Just another day in paradise - Livin’ the dream!
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #23 on: August 22, 2018, 10:57 PM »
Great next choices Matt.
You won’t go wrong with either the CSX or the OF1400.
Got ‘em both. They’re a pleasure to use.
Whether you buy ‘em next or later - My bet is you’ll get ‘em both, eventually.
And, you’ll use ‘em a lot - And love both - Every time you pick ‘em up. [smile]

BTW Henrik R:
I still have my old C12 and use it daily. If it would ever “die”, I’d buy something “newer”.
As for its batteries - Here in the U.S., I was able to buy some lower priced, non-Festool, compatible C12 batteries - On Amazon.
I was skeptical - But given the price - Bought and tried one. Works great. Bought another.
C12’s good as new. Drills holes. Drives screws, lag bolts, tightens nuts.
I’ll probably wind up leaving it to one of my grandkids. [wink]
« Last Edit: August 22, 2018, 11:17 PM by Joe Felchlin »
FESTOOL: CT26 and CT33 E HEPA Dust Extractors, MFT 1080, MFT-3, TS 55 REQ-F-Plus USA, TS75 EQ, Guide Rails: 1080's/1400/3000mm, LR 32-SYS/Holey Rail, Parallel Guides and Extensions, OF1400 EQ Plunge Router, OF1010 EQ Plunge Router, HL 850 Planer, RO125 FEQ Rotex Sander, LS 130 EQ Linear Detail Sander, DX93E Detail Sander, C12 Cordless Drill, CXS Cordless Compact Drill Driver, SYS-Centrotec-Set, Domino XL DF 700 EQ Plus Tenon Joiner Set, Domino DF 500 Tenon Joiner | WOODPECKERS: DF 500 Offset Base System | BOSCH: 5412L Compound Miter Saw, 4100-09 10-Inch Table Saw | POWERMATIC: 60HH 8" Jointer, PWBS 14" Bandsaw w/Riser Block | MAKITA: 2012NB Bench Top Planer | JESSEM: Mast-R-Lift XL/Fence/Slide, Rout-R-Plate/Table Stand | RIKON: 50-120 6inX48in Belt-Disc Sander | JET: JBOS-5 Benchtop Oscillating Spindle Sander | PORTER CABLE: 7518 and 690LVRS Routers, 557 Pro Plate Joiner, 16/18/23 Gauge Nailers | LEIGH JIGS: D4R 24 Pro Dovetail Jig, FMT Pro Mortise & Tenon Jig | LIE-NIELSEN: Almost every hand plane | DOWELMAX: 3/8" and 1/4" | KREG: K3 Master System | FEIN: Multimaster FMM 250 Q Kit | TORMEK: Super-Grind 2000 | DUST DEPUTY: Industrial (ALL) Steel Deluxe Cyclone (2)

Offline waho6o9

  • Posts: 1402
    • Garage Door Handyman.com
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #24 on: August 22, 2018, 11:34 PM »
C12s are awesome drills.

Offline mschmidt10k

  • Posts: 7
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #25 on: August 23, 2018, 12:56 PM »
I have a CSX, an older T15, a T18 and a PDC. I use the CSX non-stop, the T18 for larger projects and the T15 is basically sitting around catching dust. Can't go wrong with the CSX + T18 combo!

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #26 on: August 23, 2018, 02:54 PM »
Hi Matt

This might help:



Peter

Online grobkuschelig

  • Posts: 427
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #27 on: August 23, 2018, 03:13 PM »
If you get some of the 18Vs, make sure you also get a 3.2Ah battery. Makes a huge difference.

I run my C18 only on the 3.2Ah and have one for the other drills as well, so the PDC and BHC can be light, if desired...

Compared to the 5.2Ah it is a different world!

Offline mrB

  • Posts: 478
Re: Which Festool Drill?
« Reply #28 on: August 23, 2018, 07:37 PM »
I would love a brushless CXS and I would love just a little higher RPM for drilling and a little more torque in second gear. But if it isn't happening I am still happy with my little companion.

Hey Henrik, I'm sure you know this, but the newer CXS released with the 2,6Ah has a 500 or so faster RPM and it felt like a little more torque. When I used a friends for a bit one day. I only loaded the first two posts initially for some reason. Having now actually seen all the comments I see you had multiple CXSs or is that CXI?  [tongue]


I actually recently sold my CXS.  I'm kind of sad to see it go as it is sooo sweet, but I mostly didn't have it with me because I was loathed to bring the extra systainer, bulk and weight.  If it charged on the normal 18v chargers. . . . :)

Ultimately I ended up with many 18v festools tools and drills because I FELL IN LOVE with the T18 and the compact batteries! It's so freaking small and well balanced and it has more delicacy and precision than anything else I've ever used (18v). And adding Centrotech into it . . . I genuinely think it might be my favourite tool, because I use it for so much of my life, it is a pleasure to have one this lovely to use. I hate having to use anyone else's clumsy arse 18v drill these days  [big grin] I have three T18s now  [eek]

Reason I sold the CXS was because I saw Nut's & Bolts UK Selling the T18 Compact for £260, and with the current free battery promo here in the UK - 3 batteries and the drill, charger, systainer for £260  [eek] Get in my Basket!
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 07:53 PM by mrB »
there's nothing like the right tool for the job