Author Topic: Which Guide Rail Square Should I Buy?  (Read 5966 times)

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Offline Joe Felchlin

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Which Guide Rail Square Should I Buy?
« on: May 03, 2018, 09:25 PM »
I’ve been looking at two Guide Rail Squares -
Both appearing to be excellent, quality products.

Insta-RailSquare Track Saw Square - FOR Festool -
Currently on sale at ToolNut
and
TSO’s GRS-16 Guide Rail Square

Ergo... Currently, the  price is the same for either -
Sans the Insta-Rail product - Which currently comes with a set of dogs -
Which I have a multitude of already.

At first glance, it looks like an “either/or” choice.
So... Am I missing something?
Which one should I buy?
Why?


Thx ahead for your input and expertise.
« Last Edit: June 19, 2018, 06:29 PM by Joe Felchlin »
FESTOOL: CT26 and CT33 E HEPA Dust Extractors, MFT 1080, MFT-3, TS 55 REQ-F-Plus USA, TS75 EQ, Guide Rails: 1080's/1400/3000mm, LR 32-SYS/Holey Rail, Parallel Guides and Extensions, OF1400 EQ Plunge Router, OF1010 EQ Plunge Router, HL 850 Planer, RO125 FEQ Rotex Sander, LS 130 EQ Linear Detail Sander, DX93E Detail Sander, C12 Cordless Drill, CXS Cordless Compact Drill Driver, SYS-Centrotec-Set, Domino XL DF 700 EQ Plus Tenon Joiner Set, Domino DF 500 Tenon Joiner | WOODPECKERS: DF 500 Offset Base System | BOSCH: 5412L Compound Miter Saw, 4100-09 10-Inch Table Saw | POWERMATIC: 60HH 8" Jointer, PWBS 14" Bandsaw w/Riser Block | MAKITA: 2012NB Bench Top Planer | JESSEM: Mast-R-Lift XL/Fence/Slide, Rout-R-Plate/Table Stand | RIKON: 50-120 6inX48in Belt-Disc Sander | JET: JBOS-5 Benchtop Oscillating Spindle Sander | PORTER CABLE: 7518 and 690LVRS Routers, 557 Pro Plate Joiner, 16/18/23 Gauge Nailers | LEIGH JIGS: D4R 24 Pro Dovetail Jig, FMT Pro Mortise & Tenon Jig | LIE-NIELSEN: Almost every hand plane | DOWELMAX: 3/8" and 1/4" | KREG: K3 Master System | FEIN: Multimaster FMM 250 Q Kit | TORMEK: Super-Grind 2000 | DUST DEPUTY: Industrial (ALL) Steel Deluxe Cyclone (2)

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Offline Peter Halle

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Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #1 on: May 03, 2018, 09:31 PM »
Just for clarity, the first square you mentioned is not a Festool product.

Peter

Offline lwoirhaye

  • Posts: 244
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #2 on: May 03, 2018, 09:34 PM »
The Insta-rail is not a Festool product.

TSO was first to market with this general pattern and clamp design.


Offline Joe Felchlin

  • Posts: 149
  • Just another day in paradise - Livin’ the dream!
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #3 on: May 03, 2018, 09:42 PM »
Thx Peter and Guys. Good “catch”. I stand corrected.
ToolNut’s nomenclature reads:
Insta-RailSquare Track Saw Square + Dog Set For Festool
Ergo... As you clarified - NOT a Festool product.

Nonetheless - Same questions:
Which one should I buy?
Why?
« Last Edit: May 03, 2018, 10:10 PM by Joe Felchlin »
FESTOOL: CT26 and CT33 E HEPA Dust Extractors, MFT 1080, MFT-3, TS 55 REQ-F-Plus USA, TS75 EQ, Guide Rails: 1080's/1400/3000mm, LR 32-SYS/Holey Rail, Parallel Guides and Extensions, OF1400 EQ Plunge Router, OF1010 EQ Plunge Router, HL 850 Planer, RO125 FEQ Rotex Sander, LS 130 EQ Linear Detail Sander, DX93E Detail Sander, C12 Cordless Drill, CXS Cordless Compact Drill Driver, SYS-Centrotec-Set, Domino XL DF 700 EQ Plus Tenon Joiner Set, Domino DF 500 Tenon Joiner | WOODPECKERS: DF 500 Offset Base System | BOSCH: 5412L Compound Miter Saw, 4100-09 10-Inch Table Saw | POWERMATIC: 60HH 8" Jointer, PWBS 14" Bandsaw w/Riser Block | MAKITA: 2012NB Bench Top Planer | JESSEM: Mast-R-Lift XL/Fence/Slide, Rout-R-Plate/Table Stand | RIKON: 50-120 6inX48in Belt-Disc Sander | JET: JBOS-5 Benchtop Oscillating Spindle Sander | PORTER CABLE: 7518 and 690LVRS Routers, 557 Pro Plate Joiner, 16/18/23 Gauge Nailers | LEIGH JIGS: D4R 24 Pro Dovetail Jig, FMT Pro Mortise & Tenon Jig | LIE-NIELSEN: Almost every hand plane | DOWELMAX: 3/8" and 1/4" | KREG: K3 Master System | FEIN: Multimaster FMM 250 Q Kit | TORMEK: Super-Grind 2000 | DUST DEPUTY: Industrial (ALL) Steel Deluxe Cyclone (2)

Offline rj_mccall

  • Posts: 11
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #4 on: May 03, 2018, 09:44 PM »
Buy the TSO.

I’ve had nothing but success with it.

If for some reason you did, it’s nice knowing the company owners are members of the FOG and easily accessible.

Offline Corwin

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Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #5 on: May 04, 2018, 12:01 AM »
Buy the TSO.

I’ve had nothing but success with it.

If for some reason you did, it’s nice knowing the company owners are members of the FOG and easily accessible.

+1 for the TSO.

TSO has worked hard to design and develop their product. They have worked closely with several of the members here who have tested and provided input to their product. The TSO team has, and continues to make upgrades based on what they've learned from their customers.

The other company has copied the TSO product. Then they elected to differentiate their product with their second version, but version 2's new feature looks to me to be pointless and not well thought out.

Offline RDMuller

  • Posts: 303
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #6 on: May 04, 2018, 07:11 AM »
I have had the TSO for close to a year. I have never had to readjust it. Very pleased

Offline Neal W

  • Posts: 119
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #7 on: May 04, 2018, 08:30 AM »
Another endorsement for the TSO product.  They are a good company and are active here on the FOG forums.  They are continually looking for ways to improve and innovate as well. 
Turning perfectly good lumber into scrap and sawdust for more than 20 years!

Offline Joe Felchlin

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  • Just another day in paradise - Livin’ the dream!
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #8 on: May 04, 2018, 08:47 AM »
Gentlemen:
Thanks for your input and expertise.
You’ve all unanimously affirmed the conclusion/choice -
That I decided on, as well.
TSO’s GRS-16 Guide Rail Sqare it is.
Thx again for your help.
FESTOOL: CT26 and CT33 E HEPA Dust Extractors, MFT 1080, MFT-3, TS 55 REQ-F-Plus USA, TS75 EQ, Guide Rails: 1080's/1400/3000mm, LR 32-SYS/Holey Rail, Parallel Guides and Extensions, OF1400 EQ Plunge Router, OF1010 EQ Plunge Router, HL 850 Planer, RO125 FEQ Rotex Sander, LS 130 EQ Linear Detail Sander, DX93E Detail Sander, C12 Cordless Drill, CXS Cordless Compact Drill Driver, SYS-Centrotec-Set, Domino XL DF 700 EQ Plus Tenon Joiner Set, Domino DF 500 Tenon Joiner | WOODPECKERS: DF 500 Offset Base System | BOSCH: 5412L Compound Miter Saw, 4100-09 10-Inch Table Saw | POWERMATIC: 60HH 8" Jointer, PWBS 14" Bandsaw w/Riser Block | MAKITA: 2012NB Bench Top Planer | JESSEM: Mast-R-Lift XL/Fence/Slide, Rout-R-Plate/Table Stand | RIKON: 50-120 6inX48in Belt-Disc Sander | JET: JBOS-5 Benchtop Oscillating Spindle Sander | PORTER CABLE: 7518 and 690LVRS Routers, 557 Pro Plate Joiner, 16/18/23 Gauge Nailers | LEIGH JIGS: D4R 24 Pro Dovetail Jig, FMT Pro Mortise & Tenon Jig | LIE-NIELSEN: Almost every hand plane | DOWELMAX: 3/8" and 1/4" | KREG: K3 Master System | FEIN: Multimaster FMM 250 Q Kit | TORMEK: Super-Grind 2000 | DUST DEPUTY: Industrial (ALL) Steel Deluxe Cyclone (2)

Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 688
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #9 on: May 04, 2018, 09:19 AM »
Good choice on the TSO  8)

Just to clarify and avoid distortion, none of those two guides claim to be from Festool. They both are very similar and works as intended. I am not advocating for the insta-rail guide. I bought the insta-rail version because it was 55$ cheaper and the shipping was free. At the end I saved some money. If I knew at the time what kind of implication Hans (TSO) have on the FOG, I would have opted for the TSO guide. Expecially seeing that there is no one from insta-rail guide beside vendors that ever show on the FOG.

P.S. The dogs provided with the insta-rail (at extra $) are specifically for that guide. They fit into a slot under the guide to help align stock.

I hope I do NOT create any confusion here, happy Friday.

Mario
Mario

Offline Billedis

  • Posts: 615
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #10 on: May 04, 2018, 11:04 AM »
Just got my TSO guide rail square and I am simply amazed at how exact it is.  I highly recommend TSO.  Bill

Offline Sanderxpander

  • Posts: 195
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #11 on: May 04, 2018, 02:32 PM »
I only know the TSO too and it's quite pricey over here, but I love it.
Because of the antislip strip on the Festool rails, make sure you push the square to the workpiece edge before laying the rail flat. And especially on long cuts, clamp the rail on the opposite side after squaring up to ensure it stays perfectly square. That's assuming you down always use clamps (which I don't).

Offline rmhinden

  • Posts: 102
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #12 on: May 04, 2018, 03:21 PM »
I have the TSO GRS-16.  Works as advertised, stores in the Systainer.  I also like that it makes it easy to tilt the guide rail to position it where I want.

Bob

Online Cheese

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Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2018, 03:46 PM »
TSO...I’ve had 2 of them since they were first introduced. Excellent product, excellent service, besides the TSO is the real deal the other is just a clone.

Offline Koamolly

  • Posts: 60
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #14 on: May 04, 2018, 08:36 PM »
When joining two rails together would these allow the two rails to be aligned parallel with connectors in place quickly.   It seems they are really close to doing that, maybe with some tweaking.  Nice if they did double duty. Just a thought.

Offline TSO Products

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Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #15 on: May 04, 2018, 09:39 PM »
When joining two rails together would these allow the two rails to be aligned parallel with connectors in place quickly.   It seems they are really close to doing that, maybe with some tweaking.  Nice if they did double duty. Just a thought.
@Koamolly  - we sure like to promote our GRS-16, but it would be a disservice not to caution you against this approach. If you can't use a 1900 rail for crosscutting full sheets then get yourself the best rail alignment tool out there as of today: BETTERLEY's. One less aggravation in your shop will repay the $ 99.00 cost. Tell'em TSO sent you [smile]

Hans
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE Guide Rail Squares -  the MTR-18 Triangle and Work Holding solutions

Offline TSO Products

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Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #16 on: May 04, 2018, 09:50 PM »
TSO...I’ve had 2 of them since they were first introduced. Excellent product, excellent service, besides the TSO is the real deal the other is just a clone.

We just came across this barely two day old thread and am amazed at the many efforts made by our customers to support our brand by taking the time to report their experience with us:
it means a very great deal to us personally and economically as well - so Thank you everyone!

We treat your recognition of our work as an obligation on our part to continue to earn your confidence every day - and we truly enjoy doing that!

Eric, Hans and rest of the growing TSO Team
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE Guide Rail Squares -  the MTR-18 Triangle and Work Holding solutions

Offline jobsworth

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Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #17 on: May 05, 2018, 11:03 AM »
Hey Hans,

That drill guide looks pretty cool and not to bad on the price. There is a thread here about drill guides. Is it durable?

Offline Jmacpherson

  • Posts: 187
Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #18 on: May 07, 2018, 11:37 AM »
Used my GRS-16 for the first time in earnest this weekend. Fantastic product and a joy to use.

Squared up a piece of iroko on all 4 sides - 100% square first time.

Used the fs1080/grs-16 to straight edge some oak pieces and once all glued up, made 4 cuts and all sides and corners were the same measurement.

Only downside to the TSO square is it means I'm going to have buy a fs800 rail now  ;D

Offline tallgrass

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Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #19 on: May 07, 2018, 02:46 PM »
I love the squares. I have one issue. When using the square with long rail I find it a little fiddly. I find there is a little "sping" in the rail, not the square. Is there a technique that I am missing?

Offline TSO Products

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Re: Which Guide Rail Sqare Should I Buy?
« Reply #20 on: December 28, 2018, 08:41 PM »
I love the squares. I have one issue. When using the square with long rail I find it a little fiddly. I find there is a little "sping" in the rail, not the square. Is there a technique that I am missing?
@tallgrass - gosh, I'm embarassed to just now see your post. (I found and hopefully fixed a setting in my FOG profile so I don't msis notifiations)
Perhaps we can get Tom Bader or another similarly qualified heavy FESTOOL track saw user to help out on your "Springy guide rail" question.

Hans
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE Guide Rail Squares -  the MTR-18 Triangle and Work Holding solutions

Offline tallgrass

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Re: Which Guide Rail Square Should I Buy?
« Reply #21 on: December 28, 2018, 09:15 PM »
IT is not a huge deal. It is something I notice with the longer rails. If the rail is in full contact with the cutting surface than applying pressure to the "square" does not necessarily square the rail due to deflection in the extrusion. This is not a design flaw or a difference in the engineering of your square, simply something that I would chalk up to technique. One that I am working to figure out.

Offline Sanderxpander

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Re: Which Guide Rail Square Should I Buy?
« Reply #22 on: December 29, 2018, 06:12 PM »
As I said above, it's best to only lower the rail on the surface after pushing the square against the workpiece. Keep holding the square in place with a little pressure before dropping the rail (and the anti slip strips) down on the workpiece.

Offline travisj

  • Posts: 263
Re: Which Guide Rail Square Should I Buy?
« Reply #23 on: December 29, 2018, 07:13 PM »
IT is not a huge deal. It is something I notice with the longer rails. If the rail is in full contact with the cutting surface than applying pressure to the "square" does not necessarily square the rail due to deflection in the extrusion. This is not a design flaw or a difference in the engineering of your square, simply something that I would chalk up to technique. One that I am working to figure out.

I found that by having the square on the far side of the rail, I can pull the square and rail into position and then gently lay the rail down while applying slight pressure to keep everything tight.  If that makes sense.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Offline tallgrass

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Re: Which Guide Rail Square Should I Buy?
« Reply #24 on: December 30, 2018, 10:21 PM »
Interesting. I will have to give that a try.

Offline tjbnwi

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Re: Which Guide Rail Square Should I Buy?
« Reply #25 on: December 30, 2018, 11:30 PM »
I have found on the long rails if you push down on the entry side of the rail and release it the 3000 rail will relax.

Tom