Author Topic: Portable table saw w/SawStop  (Read 15367 times)

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Offline Benjamin Miner

  • Posts: 43
    • Benjamin Miner Fine Carpentry
Portable table saw w/SawStop
« on: July 18, 2008, 09:24 AM »
This is an opportunity for Festool to lead (in a different way from the usual, that is). If they can get people to pay 3x what anyone else's SCMS costs, it should be a simple matter to get folks to shell out similarly for a truly superior portable table saw. It's criminal that SawStop hasn't been incorporated into the general market. While I appreciate Bosch's re-imagined blade guard (which does seem like it could be usable), I'm willing to bet Festool could see that and raise them.
Yeah, I know sawstop's making a contractor saw, but I've never seen a finish guy schlep one of those to the 2nd floor...

As you may have guessed by now, I "got religion" recently...see photo...
« Last Edit: March 13, 2009, 08:03 AM by Matthew Schenker »
"I always felt like anyone who told me I couldn't live in the past was trying to get me t forget something which, if I remembered, would get them into serious trouble."

 - Utah Phillips

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 2177
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #1 on: July 18, 2008, 10:05 AM »
darn Benjamin!
I can't imagine how much that must hurt.
That looks way worse than any of my close encounters.
Hope it heals quickly.

You are almost right about the reluctance of the industry to adapt SawStop tech.
Unfortunately is was merely immoral to shun it rather than criminal.


Thanks for the quote from Utah Phillips. About 15 years ago I got to spend and afternoon with him.

Offline Benjamin Miner

  • Posts: 43
    • Benjamin Miner Fine Carpentry
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #2 on: July 18, 2008, 11:56 AM »
I'm happy to report that, in spite of it all, pain hasn't been a big feature of this experience. Being royally ticked with myself, on the other hand...as it were...
A simple case of spacing out, really. After 12 years...guess it can happen to anyone. My saw has a splitter and I use featherboards and all that stuff - but they don't protect you from just plain sticking your thumb into the blade. Sutures come out Monday. Skin is doing its damndest to regenerate that missing 1/8 x 1 1/4 kerf...

You're right - let's hope criminal is close at hand. For now, immoral it is.

I'd like to be Utah Phillips when I grow up, though I'd prefer not to graduate Magne Cum Laude from the School of Hard Knocks, as he did. (Though, come to think of it, I'm gaining on him after this last week...) Is he really like that?
"I always felt like anyone who told me I couldn't live in the past was trying to get me t forget something which, if I remembered, would get them into serious trouble."

 - Utah Phillips

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 2177
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #3 on: July 18, 2008, 05:12 PM »
Benjamin, I don't know if you knew this but Utah passed away back in May.

I got called to work on a small documentary film on trains and hoboes and Utah was the expert witness. I'd never heard of him and was busy making steam effects during the shooting of antique trains parked at the train museum in Lancaster PA.

I don't think he was even there for that first day of shooting but he was the main attraction the next day. Most of the time I was helping to push one of those old lever propelled track trolleys while the director and Utah talked (in the company of the DP) on top of the trolly. We simply pushed it instead of making cranking noise so I could hear some of what Utah was saying and occasionally singing about his train tramping days.

He spoke quietly but what I heard was fascinating, as you can imagine. He was the kind of guy anyone would like to spend some time with. He was a national treasure.

As I said, I'd never heard of him until I met him so my appreciation has increased since then.
« Last Edit: July 18, 2008, 07:29 PM by Michael Kellough »

Offline vteknical

  • Posts: 144
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #4 on: July 18, 2008, 06:17 PM »
Sorry to hear about your misfortune. 

Side note: Did you go to a studio to get that picture professionally shot? 
Never argue with an idiot, they will drag down to their level and beat you with experience.

Offline Benjamin Miner

  • Posts: 43
    • Benjamin Miner Fine Carpentry
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2008, 08:55 PM »
I'm flattered, but no - I just used the "Photo Booth" application on my macbook. Works well when your real camera is out for repair...I'm taking 1 a day to document the healing process!
"I always felt like anyone who told me I couldn't live in the past was trying to get me t forget something which, if I remembered, would get them into serious trouble."

 - Utah Phillips

Offline Mr Jones

  • Posts: 53
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #6 on: July 19, 2008, 12:45 PM »
Sorry to see your injury, hope it's healing.

As far as the portable table saw goes, I have the CMS table with TS55 module, I would probably have gone down the 75 route if I had known how many uses I would have for it, so apart from the fiddly setup it is a portable saw table with sawstop. Of course it's not really up to large sizes/quantities, but it is portable.

Offline Steve Jones

  • Posts: 405
  • Austin, TX US
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #7 on: July 19, 2008, 12:58 PM »
Mr. Jones

I think you may have misunderstood the term "SawStop", I'm deducing from the fact that you mention owning a CMS (not available in North America presumably because North Americans would hurt themselves with it) We have a Tablesaw sold here under that brand name, it's claim to fame is that it protects incompetents who can't resist sticking their fingers into the sharp moving bits.

SawStop is a brand of tablesaw designed for folks who shouldn't own a tablesaw.

Steve Jones

AdapTableTool, Inc.
adaptabletool@gmail.com

Offline Mr Jones

  • Posts: 53
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #8 on: July 19, 2008, 01:34 PM »
OK so not the fast brake on the saw that stops it from spinning way after it is turned off. Thanks for the insight, sorry the CMS is not available in the US, but it can lead to wanting two saws, depending on your workflow, it also cuts great mitres, but since the Kapex there has been less need for that. There are several potential problems with the CMS module that you need to be careful not do overlook when setting it up, if you only have one saw that can be a few times some days. As far as North Americans hurting themselves, I think it's more the case that North Americans have more grounds for legal action if they find fault with a product, it would scare me to make a coffee table if I could get sued every time someone knocked their ankle on it.

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 2177
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #9 on: July 19, 2008, 01:39 PM »
Mr. Jones

I think you may have misunderstood the term "SawStop", I'm deducing from the fact that you mention owning a CMS (not available in North America presumably because North Americans would hurt themselves with it) We have a Tablesaw sold here under that brand name, it's claim to fame is that it protects incompetents who can't resist sticking their fingers into the sharp moving bits.

SawStop is a brand of tablesaw designed for folks who shouldn't own a tablesaw.



And seatbelts and airbags are made for people who shouldn't drive?

Offline Steve Jones

  • Posts: 405
  • Austin, TX US
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #10 on: July 19, 2008, 02:02 PM »
Well 80% of the lawyers in the world all live and work here and they all have to find something to do with their time.

CMS does sound handy for the times I'm on site (installation of cabinets) probably much more portable than a tablesaw. I believe it's the fact that it contains a power switch that puts it under the control of the UL (which astonishingly enough is a private organisation) who indirectly control what we're allowed to buy.

I think with the CMS available, I'd probably go for the TS75 (I have the TS55) to use in the CMS and for those odd occasions when I need the extra capacity or power.
Steve Jones

AdapTableTool, Inc.
adaptabletool@gmail.com

Offline Bob Swenson

  • Posts: 184
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #11 on: July 19, 2008, 02:17 PM »
Gee Mr S. Jones

We own one of those jewel like, precision cabinet saws that won't
turn your hand into lunch meat. I didn't know that after 60 years
of using a table saw that I shouldn't upgrade to a safer machine.
Sort of reminds me of the guy that said, "B&W TV is good enough for
me" and the other guy said, " I can't afford Color either.

Ten finger Bob  ::)

Offline Per Swenson

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    • Swenson&Swenson
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #12 on: July 19, 2008, 05:57 PM »
Benjamin,

Flippin ouch!

Pitcha makes me hurt.

I am glad it ain't worse.

As fer Utah, and the fact you have his a quote in your signature......

Well, my Father calls me a Fellow Traveler, so I can't wait to point

out to him when he returns, that there are more of us.

Per

Party like its 1929. It's the American way.


There outta be a law banning sesquipedalianism on

internet forums.

www.swensonz.com

Offline Mr Jones

  • Posts: 53
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #13 on: July 19, 2008, 06:28 PM »
I found the CMS is more useful as a router table, with the 1400 in my case, it's really stable and reassuring, the new CMS for the MFT3 looks great. Great sliding saw table, but the TS55 does so much you would do with a table saw anyway.

Offline Tom Bainbridge

  • Posts: 1009
  • Limey Carpenter
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #14 on: July 20, 2008, 05:40 AM »
to the guy who said sawstop is designed for those who shouldnt use a bench saw



the very first portable circular saws had NO GUARD whatsoever

a modern angle grinder has better guarding


ive seen a photo of one but cant find it now

i DO hope somebody can give us a link to show how dangerous the original saws where




when our friend has seen it

i hope he has either the grace to modify his opinion

or the cahones to ditch his current saw and use the original unguarded one
« Last Edit: July 20, 2008, 05:58 AM by dirtydeeds »
Bromley, Kent. UK

aka dirtydeeds

Offline Eiji Fuller

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Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #15 on: July 21, 2008, 08:21 PM »
Mr. Jones

SawStop is a brand of tablesaw designed for folks who shouldn't own a tablesaw.



I hope I am misunderstanding this. If I am not, that is the most ignorant statement I have read in a long time. And to post it on this thread is just plain mean.


Offline kit camp

  • Posts: 52
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #16 on: July 21, 2008, 09:34 PM »
Eiji,

I'll second that! ?

- Kit

Offline Mirko

  • Posts: 394
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #17 on: July 21, 2008, 10:05 PM »

Mr. Jones

I think you may have misunderstood the term "SawStop", I'm deducing from the fact that you mention owning a CMS (not available in North America presumably because North Americans would hurt themselves with it) We have a Tablesaw sold here under that brand name, it's claim to fame is that it protects incompetents who can't resist sticking their fingers into the sharp moving bits.

SawStop is a brand of tablesaw designed for folks who shouldn't own a tablesaw.





Steve Jones,

By way of your statement, I'm assuming you think people who get caught by a saw blade, to be incompetent?
Accidents happen when mistakes are made... I believe everyone makes mistakes, no?


Mirko

Offline Eiji Fuller

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Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #18 on: July 21, 2008, 10:47 PM »
Another thing:

Pride comes before a ....

Offline Steve Jones

  • Posts: 405
  • Austin, TX US
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #19 on: July 21, 2008, 11:53 PM »
nothing to do with pride, accidents are caused by stupidity, that's not a critism of anyone, it's a simple fact. I've had the odd accident myself in a lifetime of woodworking - in every single case, by definition, I was doing something stupid.

Even those close calls when I got close to being hurt in the shop, I was doing something I should not have been doing (or at least not that way)

If we keep trying to hard-wire safety into every tool, those tools willl get less usefull, you can't make a chisel safe and effective - it's a choice, you can't have both. the point is a chisel is perfectly safe if used correctly, can you imagine the safety features you have to add in order to make it safe against accidentally hurting yourself?

I have the greatest respect for Bob Swenson and his work, and everyone else who have kindly responded to my comments here, I respect your opinions, I just happen to disagree with them. If you manage to stick some part of yourself into a moving blade I'm sorry, I don't see that as anything BUT incompetent. 

As it happens, I find many situations when I remove the safety features from my tablesaw, when I do that I make a decision to accept the responsibilty to provide the extra safety requirements myself (like not sticking my hands where they can possibly enter the area of the sharp spinning bits). Now do ALL of you keep the safety guards on your tablesaws in place at all times, under all conditions, never take them off to cut a dado for example? of course not, you CAN'T cut a dado on a tablesaw with a splitter or riving knife in place, but under the logic of sawstop you should not be allowed to cut dados on a tablesaw (because you can't do it with the safety features in place).

My point is, be carefull what you wish for (and vote for with your dollars) you might end up with safe tools.
Steve Jones

AdapTableTool, Inc.
adaptabletool@gmail.com

Offline b_m_hart

  • Posts: 408
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #20 on: July 22, 2008, 12:18 AM »
nothing to do with pride, accidents are caused by stupidity, that's not a critism of anyone, it's a simple fact. I've had the odd accident myself in a lifetime of woodworking - in every single case, by definition, I was doing something stupid.

Even those close calls when I got close to being hurt in the shop, I was doing something I should not have been doing (or at least not that way)

If we keep trying to hard-wire safety into every tool, those tools willl get less usefull, you can't make a chisel safe and effective - it's a choice, you can't have both. the point is a chisel is perfectly safe if used correctly, can you imagine the safety features you have to add in order to make it safe against accidentally hurting yourself?

I have the greatest respect for Bob Swenson and his work, and everyone else who have kindly responded to my comments here, I respect your opinions, I just happen to disagree with them. If you manage to stick some part of yourself into a moving blade I'm sorry, I don't see that as anything BUT incompetent. 

As it happens, I find many situations when I remove the safety features from my tablesaw, when I do that I make a decision to accept the responsibilty to provide the extra safety requirements myself (like not sticking my hands where they can possibly enter the area of the sharp spinning bits). Now do ALL of you keep the safety guards on your tablesaws in place at all times, under all conditions, never take them off to cut a dado for example? of course not, you CAN'T cut a dado on a tablesaw with a splitter or riving knife in place, but under the logic of sawstop you should not be allowed to cut dados on a tablesaw (because you can't do it with the safety features in place).

My point is, be carefull what you wish for (and vote for with your dollars) you might end up with safe tools.

Heh, I'll remember that the next time someone cuts across two lanes of traffic from my blind spot and runs me into a guard rail.  Fortunately the air bags and seat belt are there to compensate for incompetence on my part.  I can tell you, however, that sliding to a halt from freeway speeds, while upside down, is an interesting experience.

Now, that may not be exactly what you had in mind, but look at it like this: are you incompetent because you can't see a defect in a piece of wood or invisible fault in the machine you're working with that could lead to a dangerous situation that would possibly otherwise be addressed by a piece of innocuous protective gear?  Clearly this is a "black and white" issue to you, which is fine.  I think everyone here respects that, but it is interesting to see that opinion - the notion that a single, flash-of-the-eye type mistake could cost someone a finger, or hand, or eye (or even worse, life), and you call it incompetence.

I don't think too many of the folks in this thread are advocating mandatory protective devices, simply stating that it would be nice if they were a bit more widespread than they are now, as well as being more affordable - so that they COULD vote with their dollars.

Offline turbogeezer

  • Posts: 18
  • frosty Anchorage Alaska
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #21 on: July 22, 2008, 02:00 AM »
I have a friend who does remodel and light construction work. Works solo or with one helper/partner. He uses a Ryobi portable table saw on his sites. (It's quite portable - fold up legs etc. Looks a lot like the Bosch 4000/4100)
We had talked about the SawStop at one point a couple of years ago, but I just recently found out they now have a contractor/jobsite model. I sent him the picture that heads up this thread, along with a link to the relevant SawStop site page.

Here's his interesting reply:

"you know, i had a close call with a close call just a few days ago . . . i was buzzing some boards and though my fingers were not nearly wacked off i realized with a mild start that i had just made a cut without thinking of where my fingers were in relation to the blade . . . . like those moments where you are absorbed in some thought while driving and then you suddenly realize that you are three blocks away from where you had your last recollection of being at the wheel . . . that you'd been driving without thinking of driving . . .

i took a moment to refocus, refocusing specifically on how dangerous that had been . . . and that for the sake of moving the project along i'd have to be sure to keep my head about me always when cutting a board. it did also make me want to know how the blade does react with a finger and how a finger reacts to the blade.

so i did a test that night . . . . with the machine running i created a situation that could give me a nick without doing more than that, and i let myself get nicked.

very informative. the blade makes contact with soft finger with a distinctive bang as if were a piece of wood . . . which makes sense but i didn't expect (in the same way that soft water might as well be concrete if you jump from off a high bridge). as helpful is the fact that it really hurts, far more than a slit with a pocket knife. i always strive to work safely, but the test gave a very tangible appreciation of the blade . . . something i never got in the junior high shop safety lecture.

i think of it like my own smallpox style inoculation for tablesaw disease. it completely changed my mental state when making cuts. if there where some practical way to incorporate it into shop class safety presentations . . . it would be worth more than anything that could possibly be said or shown on the topic . . . my hand instinctively gives a wide berth to the blade, it's not just a theoretical good idea anymore

but . . . why not just get the sawstop?

it is an acceptable saw, but it's not a true modern contractor saw. cut depth is limited (won't cut 4x4 lumber, or 2x4s on edge) which is a non-starter, and at 240 lbs it's 3 times the weight of my saw . . . it can't move easily from site to site or even within the site. however, if i had a stationary wood shop with employees i'd have one.

e "


I'm just tossing this out for the group to comment on.
- turbogeezer
Green: TS55, Rotex 125, Trion, OF1400, CT22, MFT/3. Orange: MultiMaster. Red: V18 hammer-drill & Sawzall. Blue: PS-10, -20, -40.

Offline Eiji Fuller

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Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #22 on: July 22, 2008, 02:39 AM »
nothing to do with pride, accidents are caused by stupidity, that's not a critism of anyone, it's a simple fact. I've had the odd accident myself in a lifetime of woodworking - in every single case, by definition, I was doing something stupid.

Even those close calls when I got close to being hurt in the shop, I was doing something I should not have been doing (or at least not that way)

If we keep trying to hard-wire safety into every tool, those tools willl get less usefull, you can't make a chisel safe and effective - it's a choice, you can't have both. the point is a chisel is perfectly safe if used correctly, can you imagine the safety features you have to add in order to make it safe against accidentally hurting yourself?

I have the greatest respect for Bob Swenson and his work, and everyone else who have kindly responded to my comments here, I respect your opinions, I just happen to disagree with them. If you manage to stick some part of yourself into a moving blade I'm sorry, I don't see that as anything BUT incompetent. 

As it happens, I find many situations when I remove the safety features from my tablesaw, when I do that I make a decision to accept the responsibilty to provide the extra safety requirements myself (like not sticking my hands where they can possibly enter the area of the sharp spinning bits). Now do ALL of you keep the safety guards on your tablesaws in place at all times, under all conditions, never take them off to cut a dado for example? of course not, you CAN'T cut a dado on a tablesaw with a splitter or riving knife in place, but under the logic of sawstop you should not be allowed to cut dados on a tablesaw (because you can't do it with the safety features in place).

My point is, be carefull what you wish for (and vote for with your dollars) you might end up with safe tools.

The US Consumer Product Safety Commission reports that every year table saws are
involved in:

Over 60,000 injuries Over 3,000 amputations $2 billion in injury-related costs
That?s one injury every 9 minutes!


I have a healthy fear of that spinning blade above that cast iron table. Every time I walk up to that saw I understand and am gripped with what that blade could do to me in an instant. One mistep, slip, what have you, could end my career. I love what I do and will do what it takes to be able to continue my career. I am confident in my ability and have never mindlessly used a powertool. I am always in the zone.

I agree that accidents are caused by stupidity. Yet I cast no jugdement. In no way do the woodworkers involved in tablesaw accidents deserve the consequence given.

I have cut myself with a chisel, utility knife, got splinters, and have even hit my thumb with my hammer. It is really hard to cut off your thumb with a chisel. Give me a break with that chisel argument!

Eiji Fuller
« Last Edit: July 22, 2008, 02:41 AM by Eiji Fuller »

Offline Eiji Fuller

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Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #23 on: July 22, 2008, 02:43 AM »
nothing to do with pride, accidents are caused by stupidity, that's not a critism of anyone, it's a simple fact. I've had the odd accident myself in a lifetime of woodworking - in every single case, by definition, I was doing something stupid.

I would wager that if you had cut off your thumb on the table saw during one of those moments you would change your opinion of the saw stop brake.

Offline Justin F.

  • Posts: 311
  • Louisiana, USA
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #24 on: July 22, 2008, 03:58 AM »
I can appreciate both sides of this argument and understand how sometimes (often) safety equipment can seem somewhat obtrusive, but the SawStop doesn't seem to be --- am I wrong?

Justin
" The greatest dangers to liberty lurk in the insidious encroachment by men of zeal, well meaning but without understanding. "

Offline Per Swenson

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Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #25 on: July 22, 2008, 11:44 AM »
Steve,

This part here, "all times, under all conditions, never take them off to cut a dado for example? of course not, you CAN'T cut a dado on a tablesaw with a splitter or riving knife in place, but under the logic of sawstop you should not be allowed to cut dados on a tablesaw (because you can't do it with the safety features in place)."

Well, you have a another cartridge for the sawstop that specifically works as a dado break.

I don't wanna fight.

But I will defend anyone who embraces common sense.

And the common sense is, if the technology works, and it does, and you can afford it....

well, its pretty silly not to take advantage of it.

The inflammatory statement that its for people that don't know how to use a table saw

justs invites controversy. gut reaction controversy.

Go ask the fellas down at Clancys with 8 or 9 fingers who have 20 years on a saw,

just how much they would pay to have those fingers back.

Per
Party like its 1929. It's the American way.


There outta be a law banning sesquipedalianism on

internet forums.

www.swensonz.com

Offline Benjamin Miner

  • Posts: 43
    • Benjamin Miner Fine Carpentry
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #26 on: July 22, 2008, 05:08 PM »
I haven't bothered to defend myself here, as you all have done that for me. Thanks.

You have to be one macho creep to throw words like incompetent around on a forum like this. Does anybody moderate this site?

For now, I'll have to content myself with passing off my incompetent work on unsuspecting - and always delighted! - clients.

What a jerk.
"I always felt like anyone who told me I couldn't live in the past was trying to get me t forget something which, if I remembered, would get them into serious trouble."

 - Utah Phillips

Offline Colo timber

  • Posts: 35
    • qualitycustomcraftsman.com
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #27 on: July 23, 2008, 01:13 AM »
I haven't bothered to defend myself here, as you all have done that for me. Thanks.

You have to be one macho creep to throw words like incompetent around on a forum like this. Does anybody moderate this site?

For now, I'll have to content myself with passing off my incompetent work on unsuspecting - and always delighted! - clients.

What a jerk.

heck Benjamin from the tone of your post, lets just take Steve out and draw and quarter the fool and then feed him through his table saw.  I really don't see that he (or at least I felt) he was insulting me personally.  There are a thousand ways to either maim or kill yourself every day in doing our jobs if you aren't careful, I along with many here have seen dim witted idiots that deserve what they got.   I have two Delta cabinet saws and run them both every day and have about 5 custom made push sticks hanging around the fence.  Yes I have had some close calls and all of them were because of my own stupidity.  If I had the choice between a saw with the capability of the saw stop and one that didn't I would take the one with, but for right now I guess I will just have to be careful.   

It is posts like this from Benjamin that is  the reason that this site has gotten so darn nasty, there is no room for name calling like "what a jerk", speaking of is there a moderator around.  Gee I did that without calling anyone a pompous .
qualitycustomcraftsman.com

Offline Steve Jones

  • Posts: 405
  • Austin, TX US
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #28 on: July 23, 2008, 02:40 AM »
Colo timber:  Thanks for actually reading my words (some came close, but you're the only one who made the effort to understand what I was actually saying before reaching for the pichforks). I respect your courage to go against the flow. (which I admittedly stirred up, but I do love a lively discussion)

Benjamin: I voiced an opinion of a machine, and an opinion of how mistakes happen (my own included) actually in response to a question about the machine I was talking about. I didn't insult anyone in particular and have maintained a civil attitude and shown respect towards everyone in this discussion. for this you've decided to call me a creep and a jerk.

Read my words again, keep reading them until you understand what I was talking about (because it never was you) although I will state here in blunt print that what you did was stupid, it would be just as stupid if I did it. I'm truly sorry you hurt yourself, I apologize here and now if you thought I was insulting you on a public forum.

Now if you wanna keep throwing rocks, go ahead. I think this forum gets childish enough at times without adding to the noise myself.

I do tend to sometimes "stir the pot" because I'm not here to win a popularity contest (or any other kind) I believe that in a lively discussion spiced up with some dissagreements we'll all learn more than if we sit around having conversations like:

Festools great ain't it?
Sure is.
Yeah, but the tools are really neat ain't they?
Sure are.
Expensive though
Yup

Gets kinda old fast - but I swear I've seen this discussion on this board, not in these words (it took way more) but it basically boiled down to the above.
Steve Jones

AdapTableTool, Inc.
adaptabletool@gmail.com

Offline Steve Jones

  • Posts: 405
  • Austin, TX US
Re: Portable table saw w/SawStop
« Reply #29 on: July 23, 2008, 02:52 AM »
Another thought, re-read this thread (I'm dumping more advice because I believe you and some other folks may benefit from a little lesson in how it's done) - there are many folks whose thoughts above totally disagree with me, I respect all these folks, many of them produce some of the finest work I've ever seen, I value their opinions, even if I don't blindly follow their advice I certainly consider their arguments, this is called a discussion, it may get lively, animated, even vociferous.....

But you'll not find anything getting personal until your last comment, it's evident from their thoughts that most of 'em think I should be taken behind the woodshed and "eddicated" with a two by four until i develop some common sense. Dumm and thickheaded as they might think me to be, not one of 'em (bless em) starting calling me names, I take that as a sign of mutual respect, They and I (and now hopefully everyone else reading this drivel) know how the game is played.

It's called respect, if you wish to receive it, you have to invest a little in others first.

Yours respectfully
Steve Jones
Steve Jones

AdapTableTool, Inc.
adaptabletool@gmail.com