Author Topic: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...  (Read 7201 times)

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Offline woodgeek

  • Posts: 161
    • Studio C Woodworks
Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« on: January 04, 2008, 11:58 AM »
looking to tap the creative wisdom of the group here...

I'm setting up an assembly / finishing area with plans to have an area to spray (probably just water based finishes for now).  However, many times I have pieces that are quite large that I will want to spray.  I have seen setups with lazy-susan like tables for spinning the pieces, but how about if the pieces don't stand up well and/or have an underside that has a complicated design.

I was thinking of an overhead system that has some type of attachment devices that I could affix to the piece that would allow me more access to the piece and/or the ability to move it in multiple axis.

I know I might be on the path to creating a monster here, so I thought I'd see if anyone here had tried something like this or had a suggestion.

thanks!

Carl
no matter where you go, there you are...

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Offline Eli

  • Posts: 2501
  • A Yankee in Kangaroo Court
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Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2008, 04:45 PM »
Hospital curtain track with short pieces of light chain and a screw eye in the top of your piece, hung with s-hooks?
Do nothing, stay ahead.

Offline Jerry Work

  • Posts: 307
    • The Dovetail Joint
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2008, 08:53 PM »
I don't want to sound like a smart a** here, but if you use the full capability of your Festool guided rail routing and cutting you can machine all the individual pieces and assemble them into flat components ready for finish BEFORE you assemble them into the finished project.  Finishing flat components is a lot simpler and less error prone than trying to spray/sand/buff into all those corners on the assembled project.  I preach the use of sliding dovetails as they are self squaring, self aligning and self locking.  Using guide rails it is easy to get even complex multi-dimensional sliding dovetail slots perfectly lined up.  Just lay everything flat on a MFT with the front edges aligned just like those components will live in the assembled project.  Lay the guide rail over both components and cut the female dovetail slots.  They cannot help but be perfectly aligned when you assemble after finishing.  The males can be cut on a router table, with two edge guides or via a horizontal router jig like is described in the appendix to the MFS manual.  Don't try to make them too tight and leave your set up in place until you are ready to assemble.  If something bows or twists a bit during finish, just run it back through the set up you used to cut the males and all will fit properly again.  Once I work a bit with the dynamite new "trim" router I think it will be even easier to jig that to fit on the sides of a MFT in a horizontal orientation to cut the male dovetails.  Anyway, once you build your first project and finish it flat you will likely never again need to handle an ungainly assembled project in the finish room.  If you really want to honk around with a bit project in the finish room the easiest way is to use overhead tracks and hang that sucker so you can spin it, get under, over and around it with the spray gun.  Just be prepared for lots of spray back in your face so wear a full body suit, respirator and goggles.  Hope this helps.

Jerry
The Dovetail Joint
Fine furniture designed and hand crafted by Jerry Work
in the 1907 former Masonic Temple building
in historic Kerby, OR. 
26 mi SW of Grants Pass on US 199, The Redwood Highway
Visitors always welcome!
http://jerrywork.com
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Offline John Stevens

  • Posts: 804
  • Ardmore, PA
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2008, 10:23 PM »
..cutting you can machine all the individual pieces and assemble them into flat components ready for finish BEFORE you assemble them into the finished project.  Finishing flat components is a lot simpler and less error prone than trying to spray/sand/buff into all those corners on the assembled project.

Jerry, do you mask the surfaces that will receive adhesive?  Thanks in advance.

Regards,

John
What this world needs is a good retreat.
--Captain Beefheart

Offline woodgeek

  • Posts: 161
    • Studio C Woodworks
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2008, 11:59 AM »
Jerry,

I agree -- I usually always try and prefinish (finish before assembly) but sometimes it's just not possible.  I just finished a platform bed and while I didn't have to assemble the whole bed before finishing, the pieces were still large and cumbersome. 

I'm still putting some thought into all of this and will try to come up with a solution, without making even more of a problem...

carl
no matter where you go, there you are...

Offline Eli

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Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2008, 10:00 PM »
..cutting you can machine all the individual pieces and assemble them into flat components ready for finish BEFORE you assemble them into the finished project.  Finishing flat components is a lot simpler and less error prone than trying to spray/sand/buff into all those corners on the assembled project.

Jerry, do you mask the surfaces that will receive adhesive?  Thanks in advance.

Regards,

John

I'll answer for him. He doesn't use much adhesive, it's all held together with?

Sliding dovetails.
Do nothing, stay ahead.

Offline Tinker

  • Posts: 3619
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #6 on: January 06, 2008, 08:11 AM »
I don't do any spray work.  i try to limit my finishing to a very few finishing materials, mostly oils and/or waterbased and some paste wax.  Mostly what can be applied with a cloth.  That way i can keep the volitles in shop/hose to a minimum. 

That being said, i do sometimes use Jerry's method of sliding dovetails (often tapered).  I like to cut all my pieces to squared and ready to assemble minus the jointing stage.  I finish everything with whatever finish i am using and let it all dry (season) for a few days.  I then cut my DT's or M&T's.  This way, I eliminate the problem of getting any of the finish into the joining surfaces before glueup.

Tinker
Wayne H. Tinker

Offline Dave Ronyak

  • Posts: 2234
  • Flyin' from NE Ohio
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #7 on: January 14, 2008, 10:53 PM »
I have prefinished pieces and masked the areas to be glued, but I like Tinker's idea better.   Sometimes I stain the pieces and apply PART of the finish before assembly, then the final coat(s) after assembly.  Staining before assembly avoids the potential problem of an unstained area to being revealed due to shrinkage due to exposure to lower humidity after assembly.

Dave R.
Friends, family and Festools make for a good retirement.  PCs...I'm not so sure.

Offline SRSemenza

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  • Posts: 8368
  • Finger Lakes Region, NY State , USA
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #8 on: January 14, 2008, 11:24 PM »
Hi,

   I have nothing to add to what the rest have already said. But I too do as much finishing as possible before assembly. 

     Also I have been wondering for quite some time - exactly what do you have on your haed in that avatar pic ???  :)

Seth

Offline Corwin

  • Posts: 2548
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #9 on: January 15, 2008, 12:59 AM »
     Also I have been wondering for quite some time - exactly what do you have on your haed in that avatar pic ???  :)

Seth

That's what many have wanted to know, but were afraid to ask...  Be afraid.  Be very afraid.    ;D
Looks like your rabbit joint is a hare off! ;)

Offline woodgeek

  • Posts: 161
    • Studio C Woodworks
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #10 on: January 15, 2008, 02:23 AM »
what do you mean -- this is my natural look!

actually it's my MAD SCIENTIST halloween costume -- I actually did some pretty funny takes in my shop with the festools all laid out, but they didn't come out when resizing to fit the avatar dimensions...

fyi, on an update for this topic -- I'm picking up a hydraulic cart in a few days upon which I plan to attach a heavy duty lazy susan attached to a torsion box -- we'll see if this gets me closer to what I looking for...

c.
no matter where you go, there you are...

Offline Dave Ronyak

  • Posts: 2234
  • Flyin' from NE Ohio
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #11 on: January 15, 2008, 09:59 PM »
I like that idea, and noticed in a recent flyer from Harbor Freight they have a hydraulic lift cart listed for ~$100.
Let us know how it works out!

Dave R.
Friends, family and Festools make for a good retirement.  PCs...I'm not so sure.

Offline Corwin

  • Posts: 2548
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #12 on: January 15, 2008, 11:01 PM »
Some here have used those lift carts for the base of a cutting table...  You might consider making use-specific (interchangeable) tops for such a cart.
Looks like your rabbit joint is a hare off! ;)

Offline Eli

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  • A Yankee in Kangaroo Court
    • Metafizix
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2008, 08:07 AM »
These could help in some circumstances. They handle 200 lbs. I thought of you Carl.
http://toolmonger.com/2008/01/18/painters-pyramid/
Do nothing, stay ahead.

Offline James Metcalf

  • Posts: 208
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #14 on: January 19, 2008, 11:50 AM »
Eli

 I purchased a pack from Lee Valley. They look gimmicky, but because of the pyramid shape they are quite strong. They have been very handy. My next order I will buy some more.
http://toolmonger.com/2008/01/18/painters-pyramid/




Offline woodgeek

  • Posts: 161
    • Studio C Woodworks
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #15 on: January 22, 2008, 10:38 AM »
I've actually looked at this before, but usually use little Simpson mending plates.  However these are on my list to try out and in both my Woodcraft and Lee Valley wish lists...

c.
no matter where you go, there you are...

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3291
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #16 on: January 22, 2008, 01:24 PM »
Eli

 I purchased a pack from Lee Valley. They look gimmicky, but because of the pyramid shape they are quite strong. They have been very handy. My next order I will buy some more.
http://toolmonger.com/2008/01/18/painters-pyramid/


I'm planning to get some of these to replace the boards with screws sticking through that I've been using  ;)

Offline Dave Ronyak

  • Posts: 2234
  • Flyin' from NE Ohio
Re: Apparatus for holding large pieces while spraying...
« Reply #17 on: January 22, 2008, 01:50 PM »
I typically use bevel cutoff strips to support work while applying a finish.  Their triangular cross section minimizes contact with the work piece but assures support across the width.  Plastic (or metal) jacks that are used in the children's game will work, too, provided the piece isn't so heavy as to cause the points of the jacks to dent the wood. 

Dave R.
Friends, family and Festools make for a good retirement.  PCs...I'm not so sure.