Author Topic: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?  (Read 2173 times)

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Offline Bigadge

  • Posts: 8
Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« on: July 09, 2017, 03:36 PM »
Pretty straight forward. I want to repaint my kitchen cabinets, they are currently standard stained and finished oak cabinets.  I am planning on buying the fuji hvlp semi pro system for the job. I was thinking of going with BM Advance, but have seen that the SW KA+ looks like it would be better to work with for drying and curing time.

Is this possible to use? Or can it only be done on raw wood? Also, wanting to go light Grey, can KA+ be stained any color?

Thank you all, I tried to find the info but can't find anything for certain on this.


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Offline Scorpion

  • Posts: 511
Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #1 on: July 10, 2017, 05:14 AM »
I just used KA+ for the first time a few weeks ago, and having asked the exact same questions down at SW, I happen to know the answers to your questions.  It can be applied over raw wood however SW's info says it gets better adhesion over SW Surfacer (which is essentially a primer/base/filler).  It can be tinted to any color.  You can get it in satin, gloss, and (I believe) flat finish.



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Offline tjbnwi

  • Posts: 5059
  • Cedar Tucky Indiana
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #2 on: July 10, 2017, 09:15 AM »
Wash the cabinets with Krud Cutter, don't waste your time with anything else.

Scuff sand the finish. Dust and wipe down a second time with Krud Cutter.

If you want to get rid of the grain use SW Spray & Fill, if you want to leave some of the grain use Surfacer. 2 coats, sand between coats.

Apply top coats.

DO NOT mix in any way the Kem Aqua line of products with the Kem Aqua Plus line of products.

Surfacer gets shot through a 1.3 air cap set, S&F through a 1.5 air cap set, KA+ pigmented (if KA+ White was the base) a 1.0 air cap set, clears a 0.8 air cap set.

Tom
 

Offline Bigadge

  • Posts: 8
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #3 on: July 10, 2017, 09:17 AM »
I just used KA+ for the first time a few weeks ago, and having asked the exact same questions down at SW, I happen to know the answers to your questions.  It can be applied over raw wood however SW's info says it gets better adhesion over SW Surfacer (which is essentially a primer/base/filler).  It can be tinted to any color.  You can get it in satin, gloss, and (I believe) flat finish.



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Thank you for your reply! The cabinets I am refinishing are not raw wood, I attached a picture of the kitchen to my first post.  So on cabinets that are not raw wood, can you use the KA+ surfacer? Or does it need to be raw unfinished cabinets?  I want to get the best results possible and am looking to see if KA+ surfacer and color can go over previously finished cabinets. I'll attach another picture on this post in case the first isn't visible.

Thanks again, sorry if I wasn't clear enough in my first post. I've seen posts I think answer this, but I can't find for sure if people use KA+ in this type of application. I'm looking for whatever tips I can find!
Andrew

Offline Bigadge

  • Posts: 8
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #4 on: July 10, 2017, 09:24 AM »
Wash the cabinets with Krud Cutter, don't waste your time with anything else.

Scuff sand the finish. Dust and wipe down a second time with Krud Cutter.

If you want to get rid of the grain use SW Spray & Fill, if you want to leave some of the grain use Surfacer. 2 coats, sand between coats.

Apply top coats.

DO NOT mix in any way the Kem Aqua line of products with the Kem Aqua Plus line of products.

Surfacer gets shot through a 1.3 air cap set, S&F through a 1.5 air cap set, KA+ pigmented (if KA+ White was the base) a 1.0 air cap set, clears a 0.8 air cap set.

Tom

Tom thank you for replying.

I've read a ton of your posts and was hoping to see your name.

Quick clarification...
Does KA+ have both a surfacer and a sand and fill? Or would it just be a SW S&F? If not KA+ will there be any adhesive issues, or are they made to be compatible?
Also, when you say clears 0.8 spray air cap set would that just be for if I do a poly? I was thinking if just doing the 2 or 3 top coats of KA+ and nothing on top, is that what you recommend?

Thanks!
Andrew

Offline Scorpion

  • Posts: 511
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #5 on: July 10, 2017, 06:57 PM »
I just used KA+ for the first time a few weeks ago, and having asked the exact same questions down at SW, I happen to know the answers to your questions.  It can be applied over raw wood however SW's info says it gets better adhesion over SW Surfacer (which is essentially a primer/base/filler).  It can be tinted to any color.  You can get it in satin, gloss, and (I believe) flat finish.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Thank you for your reply! The cabinets I am refinishing are not raw wood, I attached a picture of the kitchen to my first post.  So on cabinets that are not raw wood, can you use the KA+ surfacer? Or does it need to be raw unfinished cabinets?  I want to get the best results possible and am looking to see if KA+ surfacer and color can go over previously finished cabinets. I'll attach another picture on this post in case the first isn't visible.

Thanks again, sorry if I wasn't clear enough in my first post. I've seen posts I think answer this, but I can't find for sure if people use KA+ in this type of application. I'm looking for whatever tips I can find!
Andrew

Tom caught an important distinction between Surfacer and Fill.  I used Surfacer because I was painting Maple and didn't need a lot of fill. I wanted to use the other half the can to paint oak and let the grain feature show through.

Your question - you'll have problems with adhesion if you attempt to spray over the existing finish without following the appropriate prep steps first.  What steps those are depends on how they were previously finished.  The pics you showed are of a fairly large kitchen.  Prep time could be most the work though cheaper than building new doors if your not considering your time.

Matt


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Offline tjbnwi

  • Posts: 5059
  • Cedar Tucky Indiana
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #6 on: July 11, 2017, 08:23 AM »
Wash the cabinets with Krud Cutter, don't waste your time with anything else.

Scuff sand the finish. Dust and wipe down a second time with Krud Cutter.

If you want to get rid of the grain use SW Spray & Fill, if you want to leave some of the grain use Surfacer. 2 coats, sand between coats.

Apply top coats.

DO NOT mix in any way the Kem Aqua line of products with the Kem Aqua Plus line of products.

Surfacer gets shot through a 1.3 air cap set, S&F through a 1.5 air cap set, KA+ pigmented (if KA+ White was the base) a 1.0 air cap set, clears a 0.8 air cap set.

Tom

Tom thank you for replying.

I've read a ton of your posts and was hoping to see your name.

Quick clarification...
Does KA+ have both a surfacer and a sand and fill? Or would it just be a SW S&F? If not KA+ will there be any adhesive issues, or are they made to be compatible?
Also, when you say clears 0.8 spray air cap set would that just be for if I do a poly? I was thinking if just doing the 2 or 3 top coats of KA+ and nothing on top, is that what you recommend?

Thanks!
Andrew

SparyFill is currently the Kem Aqua line only. If you use SprayFill use the Kem Aqua line of products, not the KA+ line. SandFillcis used in place of Surfacer.

I use the 0.8 on the Sherwin Williams lines of clear waterborne lacquers. Other brands may need a differ air cap set depending on viscosity and environmental issues.

The pigmented can be left as the top coat. It is not necessary to clear over it.

Tom


Offline Bigadge

  • Posts: 8
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #7 on: July 14, 2017, 02:20 PM »
Thanks Tom, would you recommend the KA over the Ka+?

Offline tjbnwi

  • Posts: 5059
  • Cedar Tucky Indiana
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #8 on: July 14, 2017, 05:01 PM »
Thanks Tom, would you recommend the KA over the Ka+?

No--do not ever mix them.

Tom

Offline Bigadge

  • Posts: 8
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #9 on: July 16, 2017, 09:04 AM »
Thanks Tom, would you recommend the KA over the Ka+?

No--do not ever mix them.

Tom

Sorry Tom, I meant do you prefer ka as a product or ka+? I know you have used both so I was wondering if you think one of them has an advantage over the other? I'll be doing the work in my garage, thinking about having a few fans going in there with the garage door cracked about an inch or two, is that adequate ventilation?

Offline tjbnwi

  • Posts: 5059
  • Cedar Tucky Indiana
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #10 on: July 16, 2017, 09:30 AM »
Thanks Tom, would you recommend the KA over the Ka+?

No--do not ever mix them.

Tom

Sorry Tom, I meant do you prefer ka as a product or ka+? I know you have used both so I was wondering if you think one of them has an advantage over the other? I'll be doing the work in my garage, thinking about having a few fans going in there with the garage door cracked about an inch or two, is that adequate ventilation?

KA + has UV stabilizers.

Make sure you wear a mask.

Tom

Offline Bigadge

  • Posts: 8
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #11 on: September 09, 2017, 04:21 PM »
Just wanted to give an update and say thank you to everyone, especially Tom. I used  a capspray 5 stage turbine HVLP, #3 needle set and my cabinets look great.

Process was:
1. Prep all doors by scrubbing down with Krud Kutter. Then took doors off and wiped boxes down with KK.
2. Sand all doors with orbital sander 200 grit.
3.wipe down with water with a tiny bit of KK in it.
4. Use Zinser Bin primer brushed on fronts.
5. Spray boxes with KA+ surfacer 2 coats and KA+ white low gloss 3 coats. No thinning.
6. Spray backs with 2 coats surfacer and 1 top coat.
7. Spray fronts with 2 surfacers and 3 tops.

I had to spray more top coats on the front to get rid of most grain. There is a bit showing through, but it looks nice. I think a 4th coat would have covered 99% of the grain.

My sw ordered ka+ instead of ka spray fil as requested but I got it for a good price so I decided I was OK with ka+. I'm glad I did, the white is beautiful.

I sanded after both surfacer costs, not between tops.

The Zinser bin I think was necessary because I did a test cabinet and had a lot of tannins coming through yellow. That was with 2 surfacer coats. The cabinet backs don't have bin primer and look fine. Top coat did a good job blocking it too.

Overall I think they turned out great and the wife is ecstatic so it's on to the next project.

Offline tjbnwi

  • Posts: 5059
  • Cedar Tucky Indiana
Re: Can SW KA+ only be used in raw wood?
« Reply #12 on: September 09, 2017, 09:42 PM »
@Bigadge,

I've been a little busy, just noticed/read your post.

Glad it worked out for you. Happy your wife will not be hunting me down [scared]

Thanks for the update.

Tom