Author Topic: Coffee Maker Recommendations  (Read 12685 times)

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Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Coffee Maker Recommendations
« on: July 15, 2018, 07:01 PM »
Our 7 year old Keurig coffee maker appears to have finally bit the dust.  Maybe 5 years ago it started experiencing problems - if I left it on too long it wouldn't brew.  Seemed like it was overheating or something, as a result I started turning off the Keurig immediately after I made a cup of coffee.  Yesterday a new problem arose.  The Keurig wasn't brewing a full cup of coffee any longer.  It appears that the machine is pumping "excess" water back into the tank instead of into the coffee cup.

Before buying the Keurig in 2011 I had a regular old fashioned drip coffee maker.  I actually kinda prefer the drip coffee to the Keurig.  It was nice just being able to brew 4 cups in the morning and then my second refill would be waiting for me instead of needing to brew anything else.  I think it was also cheaper.  I exclusively use The Original Donut Shop K-Cups in my Keurig and I find them to be a little bit strong.  I tried the Dunkin Donuts K-Cups, but didn't find they were that much better to justify the cost.  I don't really mind watered down coffee.  As you can probably tell, I am far from being a coffee snob.  I worked with some people before that were absolutely disgusted with the idea of using some sort of capsule that had coffee that had been ground ages ago and was now sealed inside.

I'm kind of now torn between buying another Keurig, a drip brewer, or something fancy like an automatic Chemix: https://www.williams-sonoma.com/products/chemex-ottomatic-2-coffee-maker/.  We already have a Nespresso maker for making espresso drinks.  I suppose I could also look into getting their fancy VertuoLine coffee maker.

Any recommendations?
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Offline Dogberryjr

  • Posts: 116
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #1 on: July 15, 2018, 07:04 PM »
Technivorm Moccamaster. Or if your wallet isn't quite that deep, the Behmor 5393 Brazen Plus.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #2 on: July 15, 2018, 07:12 PM »
Thanks for those suggestions.  Was there a particular model of Technivorm Moccamaster?  I see several different models on Amazon.  Are you familiar with Chemix?  Is Moccamaster better than Chemix?
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Offline Dogberryjr

  • Posts: 116
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #3 on: July 15, 2018, 07:24 PM »
We currently use the KBGT 741, which is the large insulated steel carafe model. Prior to that, we had the smaller thermal carafe model. They're very good machines.

The only Chemex I'm familiar with is the classic pour-over, so it's kind of an apples to oranges comparison. It's no accident that the Chemex has been around as long as it has, and it has no shortage of fans. I just prefer to flick a switch and wander away for a couple minutes, then come back to a full pot of coffee.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #4 on: July 15, 2018, 07:32 PM »
Thanks for that model number.

Yeah I agree.  You can't beat the convenience of just turning a machine on and walking away.  A manual pour over model seems like way to much work.  That's actually how my parents made their coffee in the 90s - they weren't even coffee snobs.  I think it was just what they happened to buy.  They used a whistling tea kettle to boil the water to pour over coffee grounds that were sitting on top of a carafe.
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Offline RobBob

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #5 on: July 15, 2018, 08:01 PM »
This website is a wealth of information.  I have the Technivorm Moccamaster KB741 and prefer it over the thermal carafe models.  There is no downside to the hotplate if you drink your coffee within about 90 minutes.  On the other hand, the unpolished stainless interior of the thermal carafe models does very slightly change the flavor and the coffee does not stay as hot.  Taste difference is probably only noticeable in a side by side test.

Seatle Coffee Gear
« Last Edit: July 15, 2018, 08:06 PM by RobBob »

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3613
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #6 on: July 15, 2018, 08:48 PM »
I’m on the anti-snob end of the spectrum. I use a little Cusinart 4 cup dripper but I hate weak coffee so I use Bustelo fine ground espresso and paper filters. It makes four small cups but if you were at my house you could just add some water to your cup.

Online Koamolly

  • Posts: 58
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #7 on: July 15, 2018, 09:23 PM »
I also have a Technivorm with the carafe.  I use an AreoPress for single cups.  Lots of good reviews and usually only $25 with one of Bed Bath and Beyond's 20% off coupons.

Offline SouthRider

  • Posts: 149
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #8 on: July 15, 2018, 09:33 PM »
X3 on the Technivorm Moccamaster. We bought one from Seattle Coffee Gear 6 or 7 years ago. It's a fantastic machine. Don't remember the number, but got a fairly basic model with glass carafe. While researching - we didn't need the extra features of the others.

What we learned was that the secret to good coffee is a machine that gets HOT, and this one does.

We highly reccomend it.
« Last Edit: July 16, 2018, 07:57 AM by SouthRider »
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Offline JSlovic

  • Posts: 101
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #9 on: July 15, 2018, 09:35 PM »
Another Technivorm vote
We've got the thermal carafe model and preheating the carafe with boiling water keeps it hot for quite awhile

Offline kevinculle

  • Posts: 237
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #10 on: July 15, 2018, 09:51 PM »
Hamilton Beach 49980A, makes a 12 cup pot or a 16 oz mug, only $60 at amazon.  The downside is it's only $60 at amazon so your friends may not be as impressed but they'll like the coffee just fine.

Offline Dane

  • Posts: 354
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #11 on: July 15, 2018, 10:17 PM »
We’ve been using the Technivorm for a decade.  Thermal carafe is the way to go in my opinion.  The thing I really like about the Technivorm, aside from the great coffee, is that it’s built to be repairable.  I’ve never had anything crap on me with it, but I appreciate knowing that it’s servicable.  So tired of buying throw away Chinese crap...You can get them pretty cheap on EBay and Mercari.

Offline RobBob

  • Posts: 1329
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #12 on: July 15, 2018, 11:03 PM »
Get the glass carafe and then buy an aftermarket glass lined thermal carafe.  No metallic taste.  You get the best of both worlds.  That's what I did.

Glass Lined Carafe
« Last Edit: July 15, 2018, 11:06 PM by RobBob »

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #13 on: July 16, 2018, 08:39 AM »
WOW.  Thanks for all the replies.  I must say I am very surprised how many people all have a Technivorm!

Followup question: what kind of coffee is everyone using in the Technivorm?  I really don't want to have to buy a coffee grinder to grind the beans every morning.  I know that will yield the optimum flavor and taste and all that, but it's not that big of a deal for me.

When we had the drip brewer I just used the big can of ground colombian coffee from Costco.  That was good enough for me.  Would it be sort of foolish to buy such a high end coffee maker if I was going to use pre-ground beans?

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Offline Oldwood

  • Posts: 335
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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #14 on: July 16, 2018, 12:17 PM »
I have had a Bonavita for over a year and I am very happy with it. I agree about getting the one with the glass carafe and buying a glass lined thermal carafe for storage. When I bought mine they only made 8 cup versions I don't know if that is still the case. It makes a pot in about 5 minutes so if I need more I just make another pot after pouring into the thermal carafe.

Mine is the plain version with no programing does not connect to my phone [big grin]
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Offline Lou in DE

  • Posts: 98
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #15 on: July 16, 2018, 12:27 PM »
We have the Technivorm Grand (60oz) and drink all of it every morning (nice being retired). Whole beans ground with a Capresso burr grinder plus Peets Major Dickason blend - weigh the beans - we like 10g for every 6 oz filtered water (so 100g per pot) - the Technivorm maintains the perfect temperature - the best coffee you will ever have.
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Offline Bert Vanderveen

  • Posts: 471
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #16 on: July 16, 2018, 03:25 PM »
Technivorm is a Dutch make. As a matter of fact at a time almost every household in the Netherlands must have had one, because it was attainable for even families with low income (like my parents’) through a savings program of the biggest coffee brand, Douwe Egberts.
One had to save up ‘points’ — cut out coupons from their packaging — and with several thousand points you could ‘buy’ a coffee maker in one of the special shops DE had around the country (I think a significant discount was involved). Going to one of these shops was a special treat for the Dutch housewives in the sixties and seventies.
I remember that coffee maker had place of honour in the kitchen (and no, I never had any, because I only got into coffee later on in life).
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Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #17 on: July 16, 2018, 03:39 PM »
Mine is the plain version with no programing does not connect to my phone [big grin]

I'd prefer a simple model with basically just an on/off switch.  I don't need anything that can be programmed or turned on remotely via Bluetooth or Wifi.

We have the Technivorm Grand (60oz) and drink all of it every morning (nice being retired). Whole beans ground with a Capresso burr grinder plus Peets Major Dickason blend - weigh the beans - we like 10g for every 6 oz filtered water (so 100g per pot) - the Technivorm maintains the perfect temperature - the best coffee you will ever have.

Dang - you drink 60oz of coffee everyday??  I usually drink 2 cups of coffee a day - I think that's about 20 oz.  I used to drink 3 cups, but I cut back.  Is that 10g of ground coffee or do you weigh before grinding?  Actually, when I think about it 10g of ground vs whole beans should be approximately the same thing right?  Does that ratio result in a strong cup of coffee?

Technivorm is a Dutch make. As a matter of fact at a time almost every household in the Netherlands must have had one, because it was attainable for even families with low income (like my parents’) through a savings program of the biggest coffee brand, Douwe Egberts.
One had to save up ‘points’ — cut out coupons from their packaging — and with several thousand points you could ‘buy’ a coffee maker in one of the special shops DE had around the country (I think a significant discount was involved). Going to one of these shops was a special treat for the Dutch housewives in the sixties and seventies.
I remember that coffee maker had place of honour in the kitchen (and no, I never had any, because I only got into coffee later on in life).

Thanks for sharing that little bit of history.  When I hear "Moccamaster" I think of hot chocolate for some reason.
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Offline Dane

  • Posts: 354
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #18 on: July 16, 2018, 11:38 PM »
WOW.  Thanks for all the replies.  I must say I am very surprised how many people all have a Technivorm!

Followup question: what kind of coffee is everyone using in the Technivorm?  I really don't want to have to buy a coffee grinder to grind the beans every morning.  I know that will yield the optimum flavor and taste and all that, but it's not that big of a deal for me.

When we had the drip brewer I just used the big can of ground colombian coffee from Costco.  That was good enough for me.  Would it be sort of foolish to buy such a high end coffee maker if I was going to use pre-ground beans?



I think if you are happy with preground- stick with it.  Something like a Technivorm will definitely improve the quality by virtue of having consistent water temperature, but it’s not going to work any miracles.  Getting really good coffee is really a combination of bean type, grind, freshness and water temperature.  I’d still recommend the Technivorm for the durability and simplicity of the thing.  And if you ever do decide to dabble in brewing a higher end cup, then you’re all set.  Oh- one other super advantage of the Technivorm- it’s fast.  Easily twice as fast to brew a pot as the budget models.  I’m always shocked when I go to a rental house or am visiting someone how long it takes the coffee to brew, it’s like torture.

Offline Bohdan

  • Posts: 890
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #19 on: July 17, 2018, 12:10 AM »
Getting really good coffee is really a combination of bean type, grind, freshness and water temperature.

And the water quality probably has an even greater effect on the taste as the disolved minerals react with the coffee granules to extract specific flavours.

This article may give you more details of the science involved.

This one tells you how to brew your own water.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #20 on: July 17, 2018, 08:56 AM »
I think if you are happy with preground- stick with it.  Something like a Technivorm will definitely improve the quality by virtue of having consistent water temperature, but it’s not going to work any miracles.  Getting really good coffee is really a combination of bean type, grind, freshness and water temperature.  I’d still recommend the Technivorm for the durability and simplicity of the thing.  And if you ever do decide to dabble in brewing a higher end cup, then you’re all set.  Oh- one other super advantage of the Technivorm- it’s fast.  Easily twice as fast to brew a pot as the budget models.  I’m always shocked when I go to a rental house or am visiting someone how long it takes the coffee to brew, it’s like torture.

It sounds like a very good brand, but the price is a little bit steep.  Is this a good model: https://www.amazon.com/Technivorm-Moccamaster-59616-Coffee-Polished/dp/B0055P70MQ/ref=sr_1_5?s=kitchen&ie=UTF8&qid=1531831073&sr=1-5&keywords=technivorm+moccamaster?

And the water quality probably has an even greater effect on the taste as the disolved minerals react with the coffee granules to extract specific flavours.

This article may give you more details of the science involved.

This one tells you how to brew your own water.

Brewing your own water is taking things to a whole different level.

Another followup question: how do most people drink their coffee?  I drink mine only with half and half.  I recently started measuring the half and half for more consistency and it was 3 tablespoons per 10 oz cup of Keurig brewed coffee.  I do enjoy a medium Dunkin Donuts coffee with cream and sugar every now and again.  I like whatever ratios of cream and sugar they use for the medium size.  It's a little bit sweet and so delightfully creamy.
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Offline Dogberryjr

  • Posts: 116
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #21 on: July 17, 2018, 10:18 AM »

Oh- one other super advantage of the Technivorm- it’s fast.  Easily twice as fast to brew a pot as the budget models.  I’m always shocked when I go to a rental house or am visiting someone how long it takes the coffee to brew, it’s like torture.

What he said.

Offline James Biddle

  • Posts: 147
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #22 on: July 17, 2018, 10:43 AM »
In the spirit of German technology, I use the Miele countertop.

Online Koamolly

  • Posts: 58
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #23 on: July 17, 2018, 11:14 AM »
;)


Offline Bob Marino

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #24 on: July 18, 2018, 08:14 AM »
WOW.  Thanks for all the replies.  I must say I am very surprised how many people all have a Technivorm!

Followup question: what kind of coffee is everyone using in the Technivorm?  I really don't want to have to buy a coffee grinder to grind the beans every morning.  I know that will yield the optimum flavor and taste and all that, but it's not that big of a deal for me.

When we had the drip brewer I just used the big can of ground colombian coffee from Costco.  That was good enough for me.  Would it be sort of foolish to buy such a high end coffee maker if I was going to use pre-ground beans?



I think if you are happy with preground- stick with it.  Something like a Technivorm will definitely improve the quality by virtue of having consistent water temperature, but it’s not going to work any miracles.  Getting really good coffee is really a combination of bean type, grind, freshness and water temperature.  I’d still recommend the Technivorm for the durability and simplicity of the thing.  And if you ever do decide to dabble in brewing a higher end cup, then you’re all set.  Oh- one other super advantage of the Technivorm- it’s fast.  Easily twice as fast to brew a pot as the budget models.  I’m always shocked when I go to a rental house or am visiting someone how long it takes the coffee to brew, it’s like torture.

 What Dane - and others said. I asked the same question here a few years ago and bought the Technivorm and am very satisfied with it.
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Offline rmhinden

  • Posts: 89
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #25 on: July 18, 2018, 08:30 AM »
If you like espresso, I have an Andreja Premium by Quick Mill.   It's manual and makes great espresso.  I bought it some years ago and now have in plumbed in.   Wasn't cheap, but I am very pleased with it.  Sort of art in Stainless Steel.

I bought it from Chris Coffee in Albany NY.  See https://www.chriscoffee.com.  They have a broad range of espresso machines, grinders, and accessories.   They shipped it to me in California.

They know their stuff and I have been pleased with support.   When I converted it to plumbed in they were very helpful answering my questions.
Bob

Offline Dogberryjr

  • Posts: 116
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #26 on: July 18, 2018, 09:00 AM »
If you like espresso, I have an Andreja Premium by Quick Mill.   It's manual and makes great espresso.  I bought it some years ago and now have in plumbed in.   Wasn't cheap, but I am very pleased with it.  Sort of art in Stainless Steel.

I bought it from Chris Coffee in Albany NY.  See https://www.chriscoffee.com.  They have a broad range of espresso machines, grinders, and accessories.   They shipped it to me in California.

They know their stuff and I have been pleased with support.   When I converted it to plumbed in they were very helpful answering my questions.
I bought my Andreja from Chris' Coffee as well. It was sight unseen, as it was the first lot delivered to the US. Unfortunately it needs to be overhauled now, but it's a great machine.

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3613
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #27 on: July 18, 2018, 09:24 AM »
This thread seems like a lot of bother for someone who brews the coffee so weakly that he can’t tell the difference between Colombian and Arabica.   [huh]

Online Koamolly

  • Posts: 58
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #28 on: July 18, 2018, 11:13 AM »
This thread seems like a lot of bother for someone who brews the coffee so weakly that he can’t tell the difference between Colombian and Arabica.   [huh]

Region vs bean? Since Columbia grows Arabica coffee, what would the difference be?

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3613
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #29 on: July 18, 2018, 12:29 PM »
This thread seems like a lot of bother for someone who brews the coffee so weakly that he can’t tell the difference between Colombian and Arabica.   [huh]

Region vs bean? Since Columbia grows Arabica coffee, what would the difference be?

I shouldn’t have posted that but now that my ignorance is exposed I’ll explain. Through years of hit or miss tasting of various coffees I prefer French and Italian
roasts. Every time I tried something specifically labeled “Columbian” it had a distinctly different flavor that wasn’t appealing. Even if it is made from the same kind of bean It’s hard to understand why someone would consider it equivalent to “Doughnut store” coffee.

Just it case, I apologize for that post.

Offline serge0n

  • Posts: 63
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #30 on: July 18, 2018, 01:18 PM »
Would it be sort of foolish to buy such a high end coffee maker if I was going to use pre-ground beans?

You bring up a good point. I think it would be foolish. Don't get me wrong, Technivorm makes an awesome cup of coffee, but if you are using pre-ground, a cup from a Bonavita will be just as good for far less.

You sound like a person who likes a good cup of coffee, isn't a coffee snob, and values simplicity. My recommendation is to get the Breville Grind Control. Here is why.

I tried many, many drip coffee machines, including both Technivorm and Bonavita. I decided to return the Technivorm as pre-ground coffee tasted exactly the same from both machines. The only difference was that Technivorm was about 20% faster than Bonavita when brewing a whole pot and it looked way cooler (all those bubbles going up!).

Technivorm really shines when you grind your beans just before making a cup. I love the taste of freshly ground coffee, but I rarely have time to grab my grinder from the drawer, plug it in, add beans for 4 or 8 cups, wait for the grinder to complete it's work, find out that I forgot that I made espresso last night and had to change the setting to a coarser grind, throw away that batch, change the setting, make another batch, then finally add the freshly ground coffee to the filter while carefully measuring it teaspoon by teaspoon... It's a very tedious process. It can be enjoyable, when you have time.

Bonavita is a great machine, but, again, you have to either grind your coffee fresh (and Technivorm is better in this case) or settle with using pre-ground (not an option for me).

The Breville machine was perfect for me. You load it with beans, add water, insert a fresh filter, and then select if you want to brew a cup (you can select cup size from 8 options) or a full carafe, hit a single button and forget about it. The machine will measure the appropriate amount of beans, grind them, steep them in hot water (same temp as Bonavita or Technivorm) and pour the coffee into your cup.

You get a great cup of freshly ground coffee, no fuss, no muss.
There are a ton of settings where you can select coffee strength and aroma, schedule the machine to brew a cup at a certain time, etc., but you don't need to mess with any of it. Just set your preferred coffee strength and forget about it, it becomes a one button affair.

After I purchased the Breville, I had concerns about it's longevity. I've been using it every single day since 2012, still works perfectly fine. You do have to clean the coffee dispensing chute every 2-3 months, but that's not a big deal for me.


Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 221
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #31 on: July 18, 2018, 10:21 PM »
I would give a thumbs up to a Chemex, but just stick with "manual" version.  I had a cup machine for a good while (the Starbucks K-Fee, not the same as Keurig, but similar).  It's sold in Europe under various brands, but exclusive to Starbucks in the US.  It makes good coffee, and espresso and lattes too.  In general folks agree it does a better job than a Keurig, but the downside is you are locked into Starbucks cups, so it gets expensive and support by Starbucks seams to be intermittent.  So I bought a Chemex.  I do miss being able to push a button, keep getting around an then grab cup, verses 10 minutes preparing with the Chemex. I may get a non-manual grinder just to free up some time.   The flip side is hand grinding and doing it all does burn a few more calories in the morning and makes you feel like you are actually "making" something. But when your running late, it's just a pain.

Offline SouthRider

  • Posts: 149
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #32 on: July 19, 2018, 07:50 AM »
That looks like the same model we bought. On/off switch and 2 different hot plate temps (we've never turned it off of high).

We bought the hot candy apple red color and still love it.

Started with 8 O'Clock (the old A&P store brand) French Roast coffee. Dark roast - very flavorful, rich. Made it with 2 extra cups of water to tone it down. It got harder and harder to find. Winn Dixie stopped carrying, then hit or miss at other stores. Last place was Wal Mart grocery.

About the time that ended we both gave up any milk or creamers and sweeteners - so the dark roast was too strong for our taste.

Have finally settled on Community Coffee (a New Orleans brand) Amber Sunrise Blend, advertised as "smooth and vibrant". It delivers as advertised - very smooth to drink black.

We bought our pot from Seattle Coffee, and got as good or better a deal as Amazon. ended up with a couple free bags of their coffee, and didn't care for it much. But that could just be regional tastes, and not knowing the right proportions to brew it. They also sell fantastic coffee pot cleaner and de-scaler packets. Get some (also available on Amazon).

We tried grinding and all that stuff - and for daily use just buy the pre-ground.

Another feature of the Mocca Master that is easy to overlook - the basket has a built-in "hold" of the coffee for a few seconds that allows it to"steep" for want of a better word, making a richer blend than a basic coffee pot. Their advanced model allows the user to tune that hold some.

We didn't want to get into all that, and just bought their basic model. But it does have the built-in hold. We trusted their reputation on setting that timing for us and it has worked out just fine.
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Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #33 on: July 19, 2018, 01:01 PM »
Thanks everyone for the additional feedback.  I realized that I all I had to do was "brainwash" myself by watching some YouTube videos on the Technivorm Moccamaster - now I'm hooked.  I just picked up a 1.25L glass carafe model from the Williams-Sonoma Outlet at the terrific price of $254.36 with tax!

I also looked at the grinders there.  They had the Virtuoso for $183.96 before tax.  I believe that's a pretty good grinder?  They also had a Cuisinart Burr Grinder, The Breville Smart Grinder Pro and an OXO Barista Brain (I had no idea OXO even made kitchen electrics).  I figure I'll try out the Moccamaster with some freshly ground coffee from a store or some prepackaged coffee and see how it goes from there.  I might invest in a grinder soon.

Does anyone have any coffee recommendations that I can pick up locally from like a Starbucks or Peets or grocery store?  I've never bought whole bean coffee before - will Starbucks or Peets grind it for me?  I think grocery stores usually have a grinding machine there that you can use - or is that a bad idea since it's probably never cleaned?
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Offline Dogberryjr

  • Posts: 116
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #34 on: July 19, 2018, 01:17 PM »
Thanks everyone for the additional feedback.  I realized that I all I had to do was "brainwash" myself by watching some YouTube videos on the Technivorm Moccamaster - now I'm hooked.  I just picked up a 1.25L glass carafe model from the Williams-Sonoma Outlet at the terrific price of $254.36 with tax!

I also looked at the grinders there.  They had the Virtuoso for $183.96 before tax.  I believe that's a pretty good grinder?  They also had a Cuisinart Burr Grinder, The Breville Smart Grinder Pro and an OXO Barista Brain (I had no idea OXO even made kitchen electrics).  I figure I'll try out the Moccamaster with some freshly ground coffee from a store or some prepackaged coffee and see how it goes from there.  I might invest in a grinder soon.

Does anyone have any coffee recommendations that I can pick up locally from like a Starbucks or Peets or grocery store?  I've never bought whole bean coffee before - will Starbucks or Peets grind it for me?  I think grocery stores usually have a grinding machine there that you can use - or is that a bad idea since it's probably never cleaned?

You're in. Soon you'll be lazily browsing through home roasting forums.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #35 on: July 19, 2018, 01:19 PM »
Oh no!  That's what I'm kind of afraid of.  I don't want to end being someone who can't drink regular drip coffee in a restaurant because it's not good enough.
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Offline rvieceli

  • Posts: 869
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #36 on: July 19, 2018, 03:14 PM »
This is the grinder you want. Don’t waste your cash on lesser ones. This will outlast you and gives consistent uniform results.

https://www.seattlecoffeegear.com/rancilio-rocky-coffee-grinder

Ron

Online Goz

  • Posts: 91
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #37 on: July 19, 2018, 05:21 PM »
If you're not going to be grinding for espresso, the Baratza Encore is a great coffee grinder for the money.  If you need the extra consistency in the super fine espresso range, the Baratza Virtuoso or Rancilio Rocky would be better choices.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #38 on: July 19, 2018, 06:12 PM »
At this time I have no plans on brewing espresso.  I have my Nespresso for that - yeah I know to true coffee connoisseurs that's not really espresso, but it's easy.

What's suitable for the pour over range in terms of grinder?
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Online Goz

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #39 on: July 19, 2018, 08:22 PM »
I have the Baratza Encore that I use with my French press, Chemex, Aeropress, and Bialetti stovetop espresso maker.  It's been great for all those. 

Oh, and I have a Nespresso, too.  That's my option for when I need caffeine fast.  [emoji6]

Online Koamolly

  • Posts: 58
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #40 on: July 19, 2018, 11:59 PM »
At this time I have no plans on brewing espresso.  I have my Nespresso for that - yeah I know to true coffee connoisseurs that's not really espresso, but it's easy.

What's suitable for the pour over range in terms of grinder?

Really for drip coffee, you can get by with a $20 Krups blade grinder.  Do a medium grind and invert it (holding the top on) a couple of times while grinding.  Not the perfect grind but after spending $250 on the machine, it’s easier on wallet and it will be fine.  You could also use it later to grind spices.  You can use a blender, food processor, or mini food processor if you have one for spices already.  Your Technivorm’s doing the heavy lifting with temp and time.  You can close the brew basket until water has covered the grinds, stir it up so all grinds are infused, then open it.  Later if you get really into coffee more, splurge on the more expensive grinders.  It’s more important to have coffee ground fresh right before brewing even if it’s not perfect.  One drawback is you might have to grind two batches to get enough coffee for a full pot on the technivorm.  I use 2/3 cup of beans before grinding for a full batch with my technivorm (10 cup).  Unless you have extra money you need to get rid of!

Also you could check what Costco has in the way of a cheap burr grinder.  Costco by me was roasting their own beans.  Had a huge automated roaster in the a couple of stores.  But they seem to be scaling back on roasting their own beans now.  Still worth checking if you have a Costco near you.

My exwife is an entomologist working on coffee crops (coffee berry borer). Best coffee I’ve had was a crop she grew for research and processed one year.  We picked the beans,  processed them, roasted them. This was on Oahu.  Better than any Kona or Kau coffee I’ve ever had.  Next year was just ok.  You never know since there are so many variables in the whole chain.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #41 on: July 20, 2018, 10:54 AM »
Oh, and I have a Nespresso, too.  That's my option for when I need caffeine fast.  [emoji6]

You can't beat the Nespresso for speed or convenience.

Really for drip coffee, you can get by with a $20 Krups blade grinder.  Do a medium grind and invert it (holding the top on) a couple of times while grinding.  Not the perfect grind but after spending $250 on the machine, it’s easier on wallet and it will be fine.  You could also use it later to grind spices.  You can use a blender, food processor, or mini food processor if you have one for spices already.  Your Technivorm’s doing the heavy lifting with temp and time.  You can close the brew basket until water has covered the grinds, stir it up so all grinds are infused, then open it.  Later if you get really into coffee more, splurge on the more expensive grinders.  It’s more important to have coffee ground fresh right before brewing even if it’s not perfect.  One drawback is you might have to grind two batches to get enough coffee for a full pot on the technivorm.  I use 2/3 cup of beans before grinding for a full batch with my technivorm (10 cup).  Unless you have extra money you need to get rid of!

I have a Blendtec Blender and a food processor that I could use.  Needing to clean that everyday seems like a pain though.  I don't know if the grounds might get "contaminated" with any flavors or aromas left in the blender carafe or food processor bowl.  I suppose the grind is most important when making espresso as it needs to be a really consistently fine almost powder.

Also you could check what Costco has in the way of a cheap burr grinder.  Costco by me was roasting their own beans.  Had a huge automated roaster in the a couple of stores.  But they seem to be scaling back on roasting their own beans now.  Still worth checking if you have a Costco near you.

I see Costco is selling a Capresso grinder online for $89.99.  That seems like a good price.

My exwife is an entomologist working on coffee crops (coffee berry borer). Best coffee I’ve had was a crop she grew for research and processed one year.  We picked the beans,  processed them, roasted them. This was on Oahu.  Better than any Kona or Kau coffee I’ve ever had.  Next year was just ok.  You never know since there are so many variables in the whole chain.

Wow that's really cool - you got to do the whole coffee life-cycle.  I tried Kona coffee when I was in Hawaii 10 years ago.  That coffee was waaay too strong for me.  I tried the infamous luwak coffee when I was in Bali last year.  That was pretty good, but I seem to recall it being rather bitter.


I took my new Moccamaster on its maiden voyage this morning.  I used LavAzza Classico Medium Roast preground coffee.  It was on sale at the grocery store.  No idea how good or bad this coffee is, but I recognized the LavAzza brand.  I followed the Moccamaster instructions and used 7 scoops for 40 oz of water.  I was able to drink about 2 cups of coffee straight black.  I think this is the first time that I've ever been able to drink a full cup of coffee without milk or cream.  My stomach is hurting a little bit now so I think it's probably not the best idea for me to drink coffee black.  I know my former coworker was telling me that he buys low acid coffee from some coffee roaster online.

I loved the smell of the coffee when I first opened the bag.  I haven't smelled that aroma in a long time.  I was a little disappointed that the air wasn't perfumed from the brewing coffee like I had experienced with my old drip brewer.  All in all it's pretty good.  I suppose my experience would be all the better if I got some better beans and ground them fresh.

My wife took a cup of coffee with her to work.  She added half and half and sugar to hers.  She said it's "not bad."  I guess it didn't wow her socks off.





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Offline RobBob

  • Posts: 1329
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #42 on: July 20, 2018, 11:04 AM »
That is what happens when people overhype something.  I told a friend of mine about a place that had the best hotdogs ever.  His expectations were so high that he was disappointed after trying the hotdogs.

How much better could they be and still be hotdogs?  Same with coffee.  How good can a cup of coffee be and still be coffee (especially after adding cream and sugar)?

Another friend loved sushi.  He always dunked evey piece in a mix of wasabi and soy sauce.  My argument was that every piece of sushi he ate tasted the same because he dunked every piece in the same wasabi/soy sauce mixture.

He later read an article that confirmed the same thing.  That green paste is not even real wasabi.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2018, 11:13 AM by RobBob »

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #43 on: July 20, 2018, 11:13 AM »
Good point.  I always say - lower your expectations and you will never be disappointed.

Mmm, sushi.  I do love me some sushi!
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Offline adcolor

  • Posts: 74
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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #44 on: July 20, 2018, 11:38 AM »
I should have read through to the end. Congrats on your maker. We've used the Bonavita 1800 (replaced by the 1900). One button, nothing else.  Just makes coffee.  Insulated carafe.  The newer model is way cheaper than the old one.  Insulated carafe is ok, but with two different coffees to brew (unleaded vs leaded) we also bought a thermos (vacuum glass) carafe.   

The real issue is that the cone filter seam requires folding it over.  Not a big deal, but an RTFM detail.  Maybe that's an issue for other brands too.  No idea. It is definitely better coffee than the previous Krups we had (wasn't bad -- this was definitely better).

Not connoisseur enough to require the <5% (to me) improvement of bean vs ground (presuming both are fairly fresh). Big cans will not be fresh over the course of using it up, and are usually of only medium quality at best. This coffee maker brings the quality up significantly for anything other than top notch coffee.  Not a knock, but great coffee and an upper quality unit gets harder to tell the difference in the end result (across coffee maker brands; like using a Mafell & Festool track saw -- takes a lot to get a debatable increase in quality).   For me, it's the difference a great maker gives to medium/low upper $ coffee.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 221
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #45 on: July 20, 2018, 11:57 PM »

Does anyone have any coffee recommendations that I can pick up locally from like a Starbucks or Peets or grocery store?  I've never bought whole bean coffee before - will Starbucks or Peets grind it for me?  I think grocery stores usually have a grinding machine there that you can use - or is that a bad idea since it's probably never cleaned?

Just buy a bag at Starbucks.  Don't be fooled by the bags of say Starbucks sold in grocery stores or target that have a cheaper price,  they are smaller than the ones you get at the store,  price per unit the stuff in the stores is the same price to just a little cheaper.   Starbucks will grind it up, it's pretty much their default mode as many people have them grind it.  But their is a catch.  If you tell them "medium grind" they will come back and ask you what filter type you have.  Their machine uses filter symbols, say "fine, medium, course".  Of course those values are not based on an absolute either.  But the problem is if you say own a poor over like a Chemex and say "cone" in response, they then grind it up on cone which is a fine setting, and now basically the bag is worthless.   So yes, they grind coffee no issue, but you might not get the grind you wanted or your machine manufacture tells you to use.  On the other hand they might just nail it just the way your machine needs it and your good to go.

And no, I would never use the grocery store one.  It probably has never been cleaned since the store was opened and who knows what has been thru it.  It's only real purpose it to atomize some coffee into the air to make that area of the store smell really good.

If you haven't brewed coffee, you might want to get small bags of various brands early on till you find what you like.  Keep in mind some stuff is ok when you buy it someplace (say a cup of Duncan Donuts coffee from the store), but when you buy the beans and make it at home it can end up awful.


Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 221
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #46 on: July 21, 2018, 12:02 AM »

I took my new Moccamaster on its maiden voyage this morning.  I used LavAzza Classico Medium Roast preground coffee.  It was on sale at the grocery store.  No idea how good or bad this coffee is, but I recognized the LavAzza brand.  I followed the Moccamaster instructions and used 7 scoops for 40 oz of water.  I was able to drink about 2 cups of coffee straight black.  I think this is the first time that I've ever been able to drink a full cup of coffee without milk or cream.  My stomach is hurting a little bit now so I think it's probably not the best idea for me to drink coffee black.  I know my former coworker was telling me that he buys low acid coffee from some coffee roaster online.

I loved the smell of the coffee when I first opened the bag.  I haven't smelled that aroma in a long time.  I was a little disappointed that the air wasn't perfumed from the brewing coffee like I had experienced with my old drip brewer.  All in all it's pretty good.  I suppose my experience would be all the better if I got some better beans and ground them fresh.


I've tried the Lavazza, wasn't impressed, which to others point, you can get let down. I think between the name, and the packaging and so forth I expected more.  I like black coffee, so I general stick to Starbucks Italian roast.  I also am good with Blondes, but for some reason medium roast just haven't been working for me.   Don't cave to contaminating the sacred liquid yet. Just try other coffee first.  The great thing with sticking to straight black coffee is the lack of nutrition, it's super healthy.

Offline SouthRider

  • Posts: 149
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #47 on: July 21, 2018, 06:31 AM »
Sushi? They call that stuff bait where I'm from..............
"We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible, for the ungrateful. We have done so much, for so long, with so little, that we are now qualified to do almost anything, with nothing at all."

Offline Bert Vanderveen

  • Posts: 471
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #48 on: July 21, 2018, 07:29 AM »
Lavazza, being Italian, is almost always a darker roast — more suitable for espresso. You should check out a real coffee shop where knowledgable people will quiz you on your expectations and preferences; that way you will get to taste stuff that is more to your liking.

That’s the way I discovered my favourite of the last few years (Ethiopian bio, small coöps).
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

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Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #49 on: July 21, 2018, 07:37 AM »
Just buy a bag at Starbucks.  Don't be fooled by the bags of say Starbucks sold in grocery stores or target that have a cheaper price,  they are smaller than the ones you get at the store,  price per unit the stuff in the stores is the same price to just a little cheaper.   Starbucks will grind it up, it's pretty much their default mode as many people have them grind it.  But their is a catch.  If you tell them "medium grind" they will come back and ask you what filter type you have.  Their machine uses filter symbols, say "fine, medium, course".  Of course those values are not based on an absolute either.  But the problem is if you say own a poor over like a Chemex and say "cone" in response, they then grind it up on cone which is a fine setting, and now basically the bag is worthless.   So yes, they grind coffee no issue, but you might not get the grind you wanted or your machine manufacture tells you to use.  On the other hand they might just nail it just the way your machine needs it and your good to go.

And no, I would never use the grocery store one.  It probably has never been cleaned since the store was opened and who knows what has been thru it.  It's only real purpose it to atomize some coffee into the air to make that area of the store smell really good.

If you haven't brewed coffee, you might want to get small bags of various brands early on till you find what you like.  Keep in mind some stuff is ok when you buy it someplace (say a cup of Duncan Donuts coffee from the store), but when you buy the beans and make it at home it can end up awful.

Wow I didn't know specifying the grind could also be so complicated.  I was at a grocery store last night and couldn't even find a coffee grinder - at least it wasn't on the coffee aisle or in the front of the store.  I'll steer clear of ones in store should I find a store that even has one.  How small of a bag are you talking?  I thought the bag I bought was about as small as you can get.  I actually thought about buying a small bag of ground Dunkin Donuts Coffee from the grocery store, but I chose LavAzza instead.  I figured it wouldn't be as good as the actual cup you buy from Dunkin Donuts.  I researched the Dunkin Donuts K Cups a while back and found out they don't use the same coffee at all, I think someone said Maxwell House or someone like that actually makes the K Cups.  I also learned that Dunkin Donuts uses light cream and not half and half.

I've tried the Lavazza, wasn't impressed, which to others point, you can get let down. I think between the name, and the packaging and so forth I expected more.  I like black coffee, so I general stick to Starbucks Italian roast.  I also am good with Blondes, but for some reason medium roast just haven't been working for me.   Don't cave to contaminating the sacred liquid yet. Just try other coffee first.  The great thing with sticking to straight black coffee is the lack of nutrition, it's super healthy.

Fortunately I didn't have super high hopes for the LavAzza.  It just seemed more "premium" than Maxwell House or Folgers.  I am actually a little afraid to buy Starbucks beans.  Their drip coffee really bothers my stomach for whatever reason, but I can drink a Starbuck's latte which is made from espresso no problem.  I know exactly what you mean.  When I first started drinking coffee I used cream and sugar.  I realized that drinking 2 cups+ a day of cream and sugar can't be good for me so I stopped using sugar.  At one point I switched from half and half to milk.  I also tried coconut milk half and half when my cholesterol reading was high one time.  I eventually just went back to regular half and half.  It would be really awesome if I were able to drink my coffee black.  I would never have to worry about running out of half and half again and it would be healthier.  My grandparents always drank their coffee black but my parents always needed cream.  I always get a kick out of watching old tv shows like I Love Lucy or The Andy Griffith Show and seeing them always drink their coffee black.  Maybe just a little sugar, but always black.

Sushi? They call that stuff bait where I'm from..............

LOL!

Lavazza, being Italian, is almost always a darker roast — more suitable for espresso. You should check out a real coffee shop where knowledgable people will quiz you on your expectations and preferences; that way you will get to taste stuff that is more to your liking.

That’s the way I discovered my favourite of the last few years (Ethiopian bio, small coöps).

I did notice it was Italian and questioned how good that would be for drip coffee.  I also saw Illy coffee at the grocery store - is that also more known for espresso?  I've seen the cans and signs ("we proudly serve Illy cofffee" or something like that) at some local bakeries.

I might fail the quiz  [wink].
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Offline RKA

  • Posts: 1289
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #50 on: July 21, 2018, 08:36 AM »
You can get 1/2 lb bags to try in some places.  Below is a link to a guilty pleasure every time I stroll through the village in NYC.  Talk to them and explain the sensitivity to acidity and have them give you a selection of small bags to try.  And if you visit NYC, there is nothing like the smell of 25 or 30 full burlap sacks of coffee out on the floor and something brewing in the background.  It’s heaven!

https://portorico.com/store/
-Raj

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 221
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #51 on: July 21, 2018, 11:51 AM »

Wow I didn't know specifying the grind could also be so complicated.  I was at a grocery store last night and couldn't even find a coffee grinder - at least it wasn't on the coffee aisle or in the front of the store.  I'll steer clear of ones in store should I find a store that even has one.  How small of a bag are you talking?  I thought the bag I bought was about as small as you can get. 

I did notice it was Italian and questioned how good that would be for drip coffee.  I also saw Illy coffee at the grocery store - is that also more known for espresso?  I've seen the cans and signs ("we proudly serve Illy cofffee" or something like that) at some local bakeries.


It probably depends on the machine and filter and or lack of filter.  Pour over wants medium to courser grind, other wise it ends up tasting like "coffee sand".   Fine grinds are more for being packed together and put in an espesso machine (like you see them dumping out from the machines at Starbucks).  Just follow what the machine says and what the bag says for the type of machine you have.

They do make some smaller bags, but most stuff is 8/9oz. some 12oz and then the big Starbucks 16oz bags.   Still, if a big bag is overall cheaper, just buy it.   I have some of the illy tins, the coffee was ok. But I use them to store coffee in verses dealing with the bag every days.   

I stop in a Starbucks almost every day, so it's easy for me to just grab a bag there when I know I'm getting low, so keeps things fresh.  Also try different ones from time to time.

Based on some of your comments, I'd give a Starbucks blonde roast a try.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #52 on: July 22, 2018, 12:03 PM »
Thanks for that recommendation.  I will try that Blonde Roast ("Flat Bottom" grind for drip) from Starbucks when I finish the LavAzza.
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Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1083
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #53 on: July 22, 2018, 04:58 PM »
Late to the party, but: Get a french press.

Inexpensive (both in initial expense and per use), relieable, makes good tasting coffee and works as long as you have access to hot water (whatever source, might be a campfire). Available in different sizes, down to one cup per press in case you're not a heavy coffee addict.

Given no gravity assisted encounter with the floor (for the models made out of glass) it'll likely outlast any electric thingy.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #54 on: July 22, 2018, 05:07 PM »
Good points, but I tried some French press coffee once and I didn't like it. It was very strong and I think there were some grounds in my cup. I might be misremembering the grounds being in my cup though.
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Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1083
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #55 on: July 22, 2018, 05:23 PM »
Good points, but I tried some French press coffee once and I didn't like it. It was very strong and I think there were some grounds in my cup. I might be misremembering the grounds being in my cup though.
Strength of the resulting brew depends on the ratio between amount of ground coffee and water.
Grounds in the cup with a french press stem from pressing too greedy (seal at the wall fails with too much pressure), but should you ever have been exposed to polish style coffee (put ground coffee into cup, add boiling water, stir and wait for the coffee to settle - sounds *bah* but actually tastes good) the few grounds that might escape in a french press shouldn't be an issue ;)

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3613
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #56 on: July 22, 2018, 05:52 PM »
Polish coffee sounds like Texas coffee. The only difference is you drop a few bits of egg shell into the Texas coffee, which is supposed to make the coffee grounds fall out of suspension faster.

Offline Dane

  • Posts: 354
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #57 on: July 23, 2018, 12:29 AM »
GoingmyWay- Glad you landed on the Moccamaster, it's a great machine. Sorry that your first go round didn't blow your mind- but I think the quality of the coffee is to blame.  Just like your Festool track saw isn't going to improve the outcome if you are using Chinese birch plywood from Home Depot, even the best coffee maker can't do a lot with commodity grade beans.  Supermarket coffee is problematic- you have no idea how long it's been sitting around, the major players, Starbucks, Lavazza, etc, long ago shifte to commodity grade beans and now just torch the crap out of the beans to flatted out the flavor and make a consistent, albeit subpar, product.  That's why it's called Charbucks these days.

I, like you, went around the bend with researching and trying out a lot of different iterations of coffee and coffee makers about 10 years ago.  All I really wanted was a decent drip coffee that was on par with what I was getting at the local, high-quality, coffee shop.  All coffee snobs are brewing a medium body, low acid coffee these days that should go easy on your stomach- my wife has similar issues and our coffee is fine with her.  I finally landed on it and thought I would give you what I wish I had- a formula for good coffee.  There are so many differences that grind, ratio of coffee to water and bean type make.

To start off, I strongly disagree that you can get by with a blade grinder- it just doesn't do the job.  Consistent particle size is key- any dust muddies the brew and blades have no ability to dial in the particle size- they just blast it. If you are going to make espresso, then you really need a very high-end machine, but we are talking about a decent drip here.  So, the Barattza Vituoso is the most cost-effective grinder that you can get that will get you great quality medium bodied drip brew.  For convenience, you can grind an entire weeks worth of beans and store the ground coffee in the freezer with minimal loss in quality.  As an alternative, you can go to a local coffee shop that roasts beans daily and have them grind the bag for drip- ask for a medium body brew.  Assuming that you are going to get a grinder- here is what will get you great results with the Moccamaster:

Coffee: Blue Bottle Beta Blend- order it online.  We live in the middle of nowhere and we get bi-weekly deliveries of Beta Blend that makes this whole thing so convenient- they have a subscription service that saves a couple of bucks a bag.

Ratio: Grind 60 Grams of coffee and fill water to #8 on the Moccamaster

Grind: Set the Barattaza Virtuoso to setting #19

Brew and Enjoy.

Once you land on something that works for you you can iterate, but getting to good right off the bat is helpful.  This formula will get you there.  Everyone who drinks our coffee comments on how good it is.

Good luck

Offline NL-mikkla

  • Posts: 276
  • www.m144h.com
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #58 on: July 23, 2018, 06:30 AM »
@Dane, I now want a cup of your coffee :-)

Anywa, I have the Cuisinart DBM8U grinder for over 10 years.
Super machine, still does what it needs to do with (too) little maintenance from my side it just keeps on going.
No opininon on the drippers

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #59 on: July 23, 2018, 08:51 AM »

Strength of the resulting brew depends on the ratio between amount of ground coffee and water.
Grounds in the cup with a french press stem from pressing too greedy (seal at the wall fails with too much pressure), but should you ever have been exposed to polish style coffee (put ground coffee into cup, add boiling water, stir and wait for the coffee to settle - sounds *bah* but actually tastes good) the few grounds that might escape in a french press shouldn't be an issue ;)

That's true - I don't know what ratio or what kind of coffee he even used.  I just know it was too strong for my liking and I didn't like it.  He really liked his french press at the time.  I actually got him a portable french press travel mug for a present once.  He's now upgraded and I think he only uses his Rocky Rancilio espresso maker.

I'm a big baby when it comes to foreign matter in my mouth.  There'd occasionally be a stray coffee ground or 2 from my Keurig brewed cup that would bother me.  I don't eat crab cakes because I always find little bits of shell and I end up spitting out my whole mouth full.

Polish coffee sounds like Texas coffee. The only difference is you drop a few bits of egg shell into the Texas coffee, which is supposed to make the coffee grounds fall out of suspension faster.

I saw a video online of someone from making coffee with just coffee grounds, water, and egg or egg shells.  I think she might have cracked the whole egg in there.  Seemed like an interesting technique.

GoingmyWay- Glad you landed on the Moccamaster, it's a great machine. Sorry that your first go round didn't blow your mind- but I think the quality of the coffee is to blame.  Just like your Festool track saw isn't going to improve the outcome if you are using Chinese birch plywood from Home Depot, even the best coffee maker can't do a lot with commodity grade beans.  Supermarket coffee is problematic- you have no idea how long it's been sitting around, the major players, Starbucks, Lavazza, etc, long ago shifte to commodity grade beans and now just torch the crap out of the beans to flatted out the flavor and make a consistent, albeit subpar, product.  That's why it's called Charbucks these days.

I, like you, went around the bend with researching and trying out a lot of different iterations of coffee and coffee makers about 10 years ago.  All I really wanted was a decent drip coffee that was on par with what I was getting at the local, high-quality, coffee shop.  All coffee snobs are brewing a medium body, low acid coffee these days that should go easy on your stomach- my wife has similar issues and our coffee is fine with her.  I finally landed on it and thought I would give you what I wish I had- a formula for good coffee.  There are so many differences that grind, ratio of coffee to water and bean type make.

To start off, I strongly disagree that you can get by with a blade grinder- it just doesn't do the job.  Consistent particle size is key- any dust muddies the brew and blades have no ability to dial in the particle size- they just blast it. If you are going to make espresso, then you really need a very high-end machine, but we are talking about a decent drip here.  So, the Barattza Vituoso is the most cost-effective grinder that you can get that will get you great quality medium bodied drip brew.  For convenience, you can grind an entire weeks worth of beans and store the ground coffee in the freezer with minimal loss in quality.  As an alternative, you can go to a local coffee shop that roasts beans daily and have them grind the bag for drip- ask for a medium body brew.  Assuming that you are going to get a grinder- here is what will get you great results with the Moccamaster:

Coffee: Blue Bottle Beta Blend- order it online.  We live in the middle of nowhere and we get bi-weekly deliveries of Beta Blend that makes this whole thing so convenient- they have a subscription service that saves a couple of bucks a bag.

Ratio: Grind 60 Grams of coffee and fill water to #8 on the Moccamaster

Grind: Set the Barattaza Virtuoso to setting #19

Brew and Enjoy.

Once you land on something that works for you you can iterate, but getting to good right off the bat is helpful.  This formula will get you there.  Everyone who drinks our coffee comments on how good it is.

Good luck

Thanks for that coffee brand recommendation and your exact formula on how to make it.  I'm leaning toward buying that coffee and the grinder to try it out.

@Dane, I now want a cup of your coffee :-)

Anywa, I have the Cuisinart DBM8U grinder for over 10 years.
Super machine, still does what it needs to do with (too) little maintenance from my side it just keeps on going.
No opininon on the drippers


His description really does make me want to go out and try his recommended coffee using his instructions.  Sounds like a great cup!

The Williams-Sonoma Outlet sells the Cuisinart CBM-18 Grinder for $79.96 after the discount, but before tax.  I'm not sure how that grinder is different from the grinder that you recommended, but it sounds like a good price to me.
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Offline NL-mikkla

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #60 on: July 23, 2018, 08:57 AM »
The Cuisinart CBM-18 looks like an updated version of mine.
And because mine is over 10 years old I can imagine it's updated by now.
Price is somewhat similair to what I paid for it.

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #61 on: July 23, 2018, 09:00 AM »
An updated model would make sense.  I'll have to do some comparison research to see if a more expensive grinder is really worth it.  I wonder if noise is also a consideration or maybe not really?
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Offline NL-mikkla

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #62 on: July 23, 2018, 09:02 AM »
Good point! That certainly is a downside of mine, it makes a fair bit of noise.
here's a compairison vidoe, I have the one on the right.


Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #63 on: July 23, 2018, 09:47 AM »
Thanks for sharing that link.  The CBM-18 looks pretty fancy with the display screen.

I just did a quick google search on Cuisinart Grinders and the main complaint seems to be that the grind isn't super consistent and you end up with a lot of fine grounds that will clog the filter.

It seems like the Baratza Virtuoso might be the way to go even though it's pretty pricey.
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Offline pixelated

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #64 on: July 23, 2018, 06:53 PM »
I have a Baratza Precsio, which is similar to the Virtuoso with a slightly fancier adjustment mechanism, it has worked well for me, and makes a nicely consistent grind. I grind for a French press each day, and most days also brew a small pot of either drip or expresso, so I get a lot of use of the grinder's adjustment range.

Baratza offers good product support on their website, including parts. They also sell refurbished grinders for a good price.

Offline zapdafish

  • Posts: 482
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #65 on: July 23, 2018, 07:42 PM »
haha, glad I saw your post, was getting swayed

been thinking about getting this.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JE36GLQ/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2EPN08Z0FPLG4&psc=1

any other suggestions?



Late to the party, but: Get a french press.

Inexpensive (both in initial expense and per use), relieable, makes good tasting coffee and works as long as you have access to hot water (whatever source, might be a campfire). Available in different sizes, down to one cup per press in case you're not a heavy coffee addict.

Given no gravity assisted encounter with the floor (for the models made out of glass) it'll likely outlast any electric thingy.
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Offline Dane

  • Posts: 354
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #66 on: July 23, 2018, 08:27 PM »
French Press is certainly a cheaper option- but not necessarily any less trouble on the brewing front.  Grind beans, boil water, pour water, wait 4 mins, press, pour into another vessel.  It's the cleanup that really gets me with the French Press- for whatever reason I find it maddening trying to get all those grounds out of the mesh and the canister without resorting to washing them down the sink and ruining my plumbing...

Also- French Press gives you one of the most acidic brews of any of the options, you press all those oils out into the coffee, lots of folks cant take it on the stomach.  Immersion brewing is a good option- I had a Cafe Solo for years and that made some pretty awesome coffee.  Till it cracked.

Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 221
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #67 on: July 23, 2018, 10:13 PM »
I have the coffee grinder from the above video on the right (no LCD).  Its now in a box.  It never worked very well, made a mess, and made lots of fines that just stuck in the container (until the moment some of them did not).  Over time it kept jamming (not feeding beans thru).  Got to where I was shaking the thing.  Finally gave up.   When I boxed it, I took it apart and cleaned it really well. I think the issue was fines where clogging the whole thing up.  It needed a cardiologist.

I now have a Hairo Burr grinder.  Get a quick arm exercise in with it. Just have to grinder faster than the microwave heating up water.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #68 on: July 24, 2018, 07:54 AM »
I have a Baratza Precsio, which is similar to the Virtuoso with a slightly fancier adjustment mechanism, it has worked well for me, and makes a nicely consistent grind. I grind for a French press each day, and most days also brew a small pot of either drip or expresso, so I get a lot of use of the grinder's adjustment range.

Baratza offers good product support on their website, including parts. They also sell refurbished grinders for a good price.

Maybe the Baratza Encore is actually the way to go - it's still $44.96 cheaper than the Virtuoso, even with the 20% discount.  I think the main difference between the Encore and the Virtuoso is the Virtuoso has a timer, which I don't know that I really need.

Also- French Press gives you one of the most acidic brews of any of the options, you press all those oils out into the coffee, lots of folks cant take it on the stomach.

Maybe that's the primary reason why I didn't like the French Press coffee.

I have the coffee grinder from the above video on the right (no LCD).  Its now in a box.  It never worked very well, made a mess, and made lots of fines that just stuck in the container (until the moment some of them did not).  Over time it kept jamming (not feeding beans thru).  Got to where I was shaking the thing.  Finally gave up.   When I boxed it, I took it apart and cleaned it really well. I think the issue was fines where clogging the whole thing up.  It needed a cardiologist.

I now have a Hairo Burr grinder.  Get a quick arm exercise in with it. Just have to grinder faster than the microwave heating up water.

That's good to know about the Cuisinart Grinder.  Does a hand grinder work as well as an electric grinder?  I was looking at pepper mills yesterday and mistakenly started looking at this "grinder" thinking it was a pepper grinder: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00004Y69L?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_p=5707046144712701809&pf_rd_r=543c85a4-33cc-45a3-ac65-4567dd9290f6&pd_rd_wg=Keyi3&pf_rd_s=desktop-huc-carousels&pf_rd_t=40701&pd_rd_i=B00004SPD9&pd_rd_w=jV5TC&pf_rd_i=desktop-huc-carousels&pd_rd_r=543c85a4-33cc-45a3-ac65-4567dd9290f6&ref_=pd_luc_rh_crh_rh_sbs_02_01_t_img_lh&th=1.
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Offline pixelated

  • Posts: 133
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #69 on: July 24, 2018, 10:05 AM »
The timer helps some, but is not essential, grinding for a 8 - 10 cup pot is probably 45 seconds +or-, for some that may be a long time to keep your thumb pressed on the button. It takes a bit of trial and error to flip the timer knob to just the right place to get the desired volume of ground beans. I weigh the grind, but that's probably much too anal for most folks.

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #70 on: July 24, 2018, 10:10 AM »
I actually have a kitchen scale so I was planning on weighing the beans.  That's one of the reasons why I was thinking the timer wouldn't be very useful for me.  Oh you actually need to hold the button down?  I was thinking it was like an on/off button - in that case, maybe the timer would be better than holding the button.
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Offline Gregor

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #71 on: July 24, 2018, 10:15 AM »
haha, glad I saw your post, was getting swayed

been thinking about getting this.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00JE36GLQ/ref=ox_sc_act_title_1?smid=A2EPN08Z0FPLG4&psc=1

any other suggestions?
I have one from bodum. Upsides: cheaper than the full metal knockoff (new 1L one is <20US$ after a quick look on amazon.com - last year when I had to replace my old one after ~15 years of use as it performed a gravity assisted suicide, I got a new one for 10€ from a sale in a local shop), dosn't rust (so you can dishwash it without problems) and all parts are available as spares (though when sourcing these through amazon it's usually cheaper to get a new complete one).

It's the cleanup that really gets me with the French Press- for whatever reason I find it maddening trying to get all those grounds out of the mesh and the canister without resorting to washing them down the sink and ruining my plumbing...
I have washed mine down the kitchen sink drain for >10 years on a daily basis (takes <30 seconds), no problems at all. Every second week or so I throw it (disassembled) into the dishwasher to get rid of what simply rinsing it dosn't get rid off.

Quote
Also- French Press gives you one of the most acidic brews of any of the options, you press all those oils out into the coffee, lots of folks cant take it on the stomach.
You can't press out oils from the grounds with a french press (unless you massively overfilled it with grounds in the first place and then attach it to a hydraulic press - which will likely kill the vessel - else you couldn't get the pressure you need to 'press out' stuff).

It's more of a forced filtering, the sieve impacts quickly (increasing flow resistance) and retains even the small parts (some might slip through at the beginning though, especially when you don't take it slow).

Offline Dane

  • Posts: 354
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #72 on: July 24, 2018, 11:35 PM »
FWIW, I think the timer on the grinder is key.  I can get the rest of the operation almost totally done while the beans are grinding.  Rinsing out the machine, filling the reservoir etc.  maybe my morning are more hectic than most with three kids to get fed, packed and out the door, but that 45 seconds seems to be an eternity if I’m standing there holding a button.

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #73 on: July 25, 2018, 08:01 AM »
My mornings aren't really hectic, but I am lazy so being able to set the timer and walk away sounds better.
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Offline Bert Vanderveen

  • Posts: 471
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #74 on: July 25, 2018, 08:23 AM »
I used to buy ground coffee (mind you: freshly ground in the shop), but a couple of years ago Esken (who owns that shop) suggested I try the Nemox Lux grinder. And it has served me well. It costs around € 140 over here.

My method is quite simple: after I have set up for the correct coarseness of the grind (mostly around the same mark, but it depends on the batch of beans), I weigh the correct amount of beans, put that in the empty grinder, start the grind and count till all beans have been processed. After that I never weigh, but just count out (twenty seconds…).

I always make two cups of espresso at the same time, because I prefer flat whites… " )

There are a lot of grinders that seem to be just variations on the basic design of the Nemox Lux. I wonder whether they all use the same grinding wheels. The price differences appear to be unjustified by added features (is a added timer worth a hundred bucks?), but I have not done extensive research, so, who knows?
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

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Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #75 on: July 26, 2018, 03:02 PM »
Thanks again everyone for the coffee grinder recommendations.

I picked up the Baratza Virtuoso Grinder from the Williams-Sonoma Outlet today.  It came out to $195 even with tax.  I'm just about out of the LavAzza coffee so I ordered a half bag of the Blue Bottle Beta Blend whole beans.  I also ordered a bag of Dark Sumatra from Coffee Bean Direct.   That is the low acid coffee that my former coworker drinks.  Neither of those beans are going to arrive before next week so I plan on stopping by a Starbucks to pickup a bag of the Blonde Roast.

Now the question is - should I have them grind it or should I grind the Starbucks at home?  Maybe that's a no brainer since I just bought a grinder but my only concern is, do I need to "clean" out the grinder when switching between beans?  I don't want to cross contaminate the grinder with 3 different beans.  Maybe it's not that serious...
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Offline Lou in DE

  • Posts: 98
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #76 on: July 26, 2018, 03:37 PM »
Congrats on the new grinder -  once you develop a system it is a pleasure in the morning.

My system takes only a few minutes from bean to brewed coffee with the Moccamaster:

1. Pour filtered water into the machine (I use a Brita pitcher that I set up the night before)
2. Weigh out the beans (my preference is 10 g per 6 oz water)
3. Grind the beans while you set up the filter (I pre-wet the filter) - my grinder (Capresso) takes about 1.5 minutes for 100 g beans
4. The Moccamaster will have your brewed coffee very quickly (as you already know)

We have tried about a dozen different beans so far and I would suggest trying Peets Major Dickason Blend - it has become a real favorite of ours. Others we enjoy are Lavazza Grand Filtro and Dunkin Donuts House Blend. For the occasional decaf the try Don Pablo (Amazon).

As for cleaning your grinder, I don't bother except about once a week - I take it down to the shop and use my CT26 and a small dedicated bristle brush - works great. As an added benefit the shop smells like fresh coffee every time you use the vac  [big grin]

Lou
In theory, theory and reality are the same. In reality, theory and reality are different - especially in woodworking!

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #77 on: July 26, 2018, 04:11 PM »
Thanks!

I've just been using the filtered water from our LG Fridge.  Your ratio is very close to the ratio that @Dane recommended.  I guess most ratios are generally going to be pretty close to the so called SCAA "Golden Ratio."

I've heard/seen about pre-wetting the filter, but I didn't really want to get into too many extra steps - same with folding the #4 cone filter at the seam?  I just opened the filter up and pushed it down into the basket.

I had seen Peet's Major Dickason Blend when I was searching for different coffees at Peet's.  I'll have to check that out.

Aren't there also some oils from the beans that can collect on the burrs that need to be cleaned out?  I think I had heard about running some kind of cleaner through the grinder to absorb those oils?

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Offline pixelated

  • Posts: 133
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #78 on: July 26, 2018, 10:35 PM »
Good choice on the grinder, I like mine quite a lot.

I rarely use anything but French Roast, but on the odd occasions where I may have something else, I don't clean the grinder between types (aside from possibly emptying it from the previous roast).
However, the Baratza grinders are very easy to empty if you need to, and brushing any remaining dust off the burrs is easy too. If you want to purge it, just grind a tablespoon or so of the new beans and discard, you'll be good to go.


Offline Dane

  • Posts: 354
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #79 on: July 26, 2018, 11:08 PM »
Hm.  As geeky as I can be about coffee- I’ve never cleaned my grinder.  I figure the next round of beans basically pushes the old grounds through and it’s not enough to impact the flavor.  Be worth experimenting, I suppose.  Honestly, I’d just have Starbucks grind the blonde.  Throw it in the freezer for the week.  Probably won’t see a perceptible difference.

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3613
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #80 on: July 27, 2018, 08:26 AM »
Hm.  As geeky as I can be about coffee- I’ve never cleaned my grinder.  I figure the next round of beans basically pushes the old grounds through and it’s not enough to impact the flavor.  Be worth experimenting, I suppose.  Honestly, I’d just have Starbucks grind the blonde.  Throw it in the freezer for the week.  Probably won’t see a perceptible difference.

That’s funny  [big grin]

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #81 on: July 27, 2018, 08:56 AM »
Good choice on the grinder, I like mine quite a lot.

I rarely use anything but French Roast, but on the odd occasions where I may have something else, I don't clean the grinder between types (aside from possibly emptying it from the previous roast).
However, the Baratza grinders are very easy to empty if you need to, and brushing any remaining dust off the burrs is easy too. If you want to purge it, just grind a tablespoon or so of the new beans and discard, you'll be good to go.

Cool! That's good to know.  Did you wash grinder parts before you ground your first beans?

Hm.  As geeky as I can be about coffee- I’ve never cleaned my grinder.  I figure the next round of beans basically pushes the old grounds through and it’s not enough to impact the flavor.  Be worth experimenting, I suppose.  Honestly, I’d just have Starbucks grind the blonde.  Throw it in the freezer for the week.  Probably won’t see a perceptible difference.

Sounds like it would be a good test to compare.  I'll just have it ground at Starbucks then and see how I like that.

That’s funny  [big grin]

LOL!
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Offline Bert Vanderveen

  • Posts: 471
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #82 on: July 28, 2018, 10:55 AM »
If you are concerned about *nasty* things happening with the partially ground beans left behind, you could just weigh out the amount needed for every serving, grind that till the grinder is empty of beans and go to sleep at night with a sound mind.
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

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Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #83 on: July 28, 2018, 05:17 PM »
Won't there still be some residual grounds left even if I grind exactly 60 grams of whole beans or am I worrying about a minuscule amount of grinds?

My Dark Sumatra Beans arrived today instead of the estimated delivery date of Monday.  I'm going to grind those beans fresh tomorrow morning.

Last night I saw an ad on Facebook for Henry's House of Coffee.  Anyone familiar with their Bella Finca?  It sounds really yummy.

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Offline Dane

  • Posts: 354
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #84 on: July 28, 2018, 06:19 PM »
I'm pretty picky- and i have never noticed any negative repercussions from not cleaning my grinder.  I grind exactly the amount that I am using every morning and, as I mentioned, I am pretty sure the next morning's beans clear out any minuscule residual dust.  That said, I do use roughly the same roast every day, so maybe if you were putting a really oily roast through there, it might affect the flavor of the next grinding- but I seriously doubt it.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #85 on: July 28, 2018, 06:31 PM »
I've definitely gone from one end of the spectrum to the other.  I didn't care at all before and now I've become obsessed with the smallest details that probably don't even really matter.

Is there a general rule how to tell what is an oily roast?  Is that usually a lighter roast?

It's still kinda counter intuitive to me that the dark roasts actually have less caffeine than the lighter roasts.
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Offline DeformedTree

  • Posts: 221
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #86 on: July 28, 2018, 10:12 PM »

It's still kinda counter intuitive to me that the dark roasts actually have less caffeine than the lighter roasts.

Why,  what would make you think one way or the other, or that there is any spectrum.

It would be like thinking folks dressed in Black are always the bad guys and folks dressed in White are always the good guys.   There is just no reason to think one way or the other looking at them.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #87 on: July 28, 2018, 10:26 PM »
It's not just the color of the roast.  It's also the descriptors that are associated with Dark Roasts: full bodied, bold, deep, rich, etc.  Those terms make it sound (at least to me) like Dark Roast is going to be stronger, ergo more caffeine.

Is it just a myth that darker roasts have less caffeine than lighter roasts? 
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Offline Bohdan

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #88 on: July 28, 2018, 10:43 PM »
like Dark Roast is going to be stronger, ergo more caffeine.

Is it just a myth that darker roasts have less caffeine than lighter roasts?

The roasting process slowly destroys the caffeine in the raw bean, so more roast (darker bean) less caffeine.

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 673
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #89 on: July 28, 2018, 11:07 PM »
That was also my understanding, which is why I said it's counter intuitive that the darker roasts actually have less caffeine.

Normally I'd think strong flavor = more caffeine.
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Offline pixelated

  • Posts: 133
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #90 on: July 29, 2018, 11:02 AM »
The longer roasting times that darker roasts get brings oils to the surface of the bean. That's what gives dark roasted beans a shiny surface sheen. That oil does accumulate on the burrs and in the hopper, but I've not found it to be a particular problem, I wash the hopper occasionally, and clean the burrs if the beans are not feeding well through the grinder.
I believe the manual does recommend washing the removable burr before the first use to get rid of any possible manufacturing residue, and the hopper as well.
I weigh the ground beans. When I first got the grinder I weighed what I put into the hopper so that I had an idea of where to set the timer. But after I figured out that, I fill the hopper, and for grinding, set the timer to the approximate position, then weigh the bin with the ground beans, and fine tune with the pulse button. For the times I grind too much, I put the excess into a small glass jar, and dump that into the bin the next time I brew (which is either "tomorrow" or in a few hours).

As for caffeine, my understand is as stated, that the extended roasting destroys some of the caffeine, so darker roasts have less. But I've never seen any analysis that proves it one way or the other.


Offline Bert Vanderveen

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #91 on: July 29, 2018, 11:44 AM »
Amount of cafeïne — As far as I know the time that the ground coffee steeps determines the cafeïne-content, eg a French press cup of coffee contains more than an espresso (made with the same beans).

I shudder when imagining what the stuff the cowboys drank in the John Ford movies of the forties and fifties contained; must have been almost pure cafeïne after brewing for a night on the camp fire. : )
« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 01:55 PM by Bert Vanderveen »
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Offline DeformedTree

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #92 on: July 29, 2018, 11:52 AM »
That was also my understanding, which is why I said it's counter intuitive that the darker roasts actually have less caffeine.

Normally I'd think strong flavor = more caffeine.

Caffeine is flavor-less..  So I got that wrong, apparently it is bitter.  But in most stuff it is in such small amounts few people can notice it.  I had just always thought of it as flavorless simply because caffeinated water taste the same as water, thus a lot of folks don't notice some of their favorite bottled water has caffeine in it.
« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 12:03 PM by DeformedTree »

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #93 on: July 29, 2018, 12:22 PM »
I ground 60 grams of the Dark Sumatra coffee on setting 19 this morning.  I was sadly underwhelmed by the aromas when I opened the bag of beans.  The grinder was actually pretty quiet and pretty quick to grind.

I used the 60 grams of whole beans to 32 oz of water.  I tried the coffee straight black and it was still a little too bitter/acidic for me.  My wife also tried and she said it was less acidic, but more bitter.  I have trouble differentiating between acidic and bitter.  They seem to be the same to me.

I had to add half and half, but only 2 tablespoons instead of my usual 3.  I'm not too impressed with these beans.  Luckily the Blue Bottle Blend is still coming, I'm still going to try the blonde roast from Starbucks, and I want to try Henry's House of Coffee.
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Offline guitarchitect

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #94 on: July 29, 2018, 03:00 PM »
Not sure if you've made a decision yet but the Bunn MyCafe is a happy medium between a keurig and a pot coffee maker... if you're only making coffee for one. If it's for two, forget about it.

Basically it's like a keurig (and you can use k-cups) but you can also put tea leaves or coffee grinds in the filter pod. So when I wake up, I grind my beans, load them in the cup, and walk away. clean them out when you're done and it's ready for the next coffee. There's also a thing to just put out hot water, or to put teabags into.

https://www.amazon.com/BUNN-MCU-Single-Multi-Use-Coffee/dp/B009PLQ5H2

The only downfall is that there's no water reservoir, so you have to fill it for every use. So if you regularly make coffee for 2+ people, forget it. If you're the solo coffee drinking and you drink 1-2 coffees/day, it might be perfect for you. I still own (and prefer) pourover but this thing is ready to go, and gets reasonably close to pourover taste without being as bad as regular drip. YMMV, of course...

Online Koamolly

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #95 on: July 29, 2018, 03:22 PM »
I ground 60 grams of the Dark Sumatra coffee on setting 19 this morning.  I was sadly underwhelmed by the aromas when I opened the bag of beans.  The grinder was actually pretty quiet and pretty quick to grind.

I used the 60 grams of whole beans to 32 oz of water.  I tried the coffee straight black and it was still a little too bitter/acidic for me.  My wife also tried and she said it was less acidic, but more bitter.  I have trouble differentiating between acidic and bitter.  They seem to be the same to me.

I had to add half and half, but only 2 tablespoons instead of my usual 3.  I'm not too impressed with these beans.  Luckily the Blue Bottle Blend is still coming, I'm still going to try the blonde roast from Starbucks, and I want to try Henry's House of Coffee.

Try a little bit courser grind and a little less coffee.

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #96 on: July 29, 2018, 03:48 PM »
Not sure if you've made a decision yet but the Bunn MyCafe is a happy medium between a keurig and a pot coffee maker... if you're only making coffee for one. If it's for two, forget about it.

Basically it's like a keurig (and you can use k-cups) but you can also put tea leaves or coffee grinds in the filter pod. So when I wake up, I grind my beans, load them in the cup, and walk away. clean them out when you're done and it's ready for the next coffee. There's also a thing to just put out hot water, or to put teabags into.

https://www.amazon.com/BUNN-MCU-Single-Multi-Use-Coffee/dp/B009PLQ5H2

The only downfall is that there's no water reservoir, so you have to fill it for every use. So if you regularly make coffee for 2+ people, forget it. If you're the solo coffee drinking and you drink 1-2 coffees/day, it might be perfect for you. I still own (and prefer) pourover but this thing is ready to go, and gets reasonably close to pourover taste without being as bad as regular drip. YMMV, of course...

Thanks for that suggestion.  I already bought the Moccamaster (but it could still be returned, though I hate returning stuff).  On the weekends I might need to brew enough coffee for 2 people.

I ground 60 grams of the Dark Sumatra coffee on setting 19 this morning.  I was sadly underwhelmed by the aromas when I opened the bag of beans.  The grinder was actually pretty quiet and pretty quick to grind.

I used the 60 grams of whole beans to 32 oz of water.  I tried the coffee straight black and it was still a little too bitter/acidic for me.  My wife also tried and she said it was less acidic, but more bitter.  I have trouble differentiating between acidic and bitter.  They seem to be the same to me.

I had to add half and half, but only 2 tablespoons instead of my usual 3.  I'm not too impressed with these beans.  Luckily the Blue Bottle Blend is still coming, I'm still going to try the blonde roast from Starbucks, and I want to try Henry's House of Coffee.

Try a little bit courser grind and a little less coffee.

Maybe like 55 grams of coffee and 20 or 21 on the grind setting?
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Offline Dane

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #97 on: July 29, 2018, 05:05 PM »
I wouldn’t lose hope.  I can’t stand dark roast, in fact,when my mom visits,
who insists on a French Roast, I have her use a completely different coffee maker as the burnt taste lingers - the Beta might be your thing.  Also- different roasts require different fibers, so 19 might not be right.
 

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #98 on: July 29, 2018, 05:32 PM »
I haven't lost hope yet ;).  I'm hoping I like the Blue Bottle Beta.

I also had high hopes for the Bella Finca from Henry's House of Coffee, but I believe that's also a dark roast so I likely won't like it.

I selected the 19 grind setting because that's what you said you were using for the Blue Bottle Beta. The grinder instructions suggest 20. Is there that much of a difference between 19 and 20?  I'd think the difference would be negligible since they're only 1 tick apart.
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Offline mrFinpgh

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #99 on: July 29, 2018, 05:58 PM »
I've been using a bodum burr grinder for about five years now.  Usually with my aeropress and  I'm partial to Counter Culture beans.  There is a local roaster (Commonplace Coffee) which is also very good.   




Online Koamolly

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #100 on: July 29, 2018, 06:32 PM »
I didn’t catch this before your recent post.  Are you trying to brew just 1-2 cups of coffee with your Moccamaster?  Not a full pot?  I think it might take more experimenting with grind size and amount for these smaller amounts.  If so, if you haven’t brewed a full pot yet, try 2/3 cup of beans, run through the grinder to get a size about the size of Kosher rock salt or a bit smaller.  Close the drip container and wait until it’s about 3/4 full, stir the grinds, open it, walk away and let it finish brewing.  If you’re only doing one cup at a time the AreoPress is hard to beat for $25.

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #101 on: July 29, 2018, 08:40 PM »
I've been using a bodum burr grinder for about five years now.  Usually with my aeropress and  I'm partial to Counter Culture beans.  There is a local roaster (Commonplace Coffee) which is also very good.

Thanks for that data point.  I will check into Counter Culture Beans.

I didn’t catch this before your recent post.  Are you trying to brew just 1-2 cups of coffee with your Moccamaster?  Not a full pot?  I think it might take more experimenting with grind size and amount for these smaller amounts.  If so, if you haven’t brewed a full pot yet, try 2/3 cup of beans, run through the grinder to get a size about the size of Kosher rock salt or a bit smaller.  Close the drip container and wait until it’s about 3/4 full, stir the grinds, open it, walk away and let it finish brewing.  If you’re only doing one cup at a time the AreoPress is hard to beat for $25.

In the most recent scenario I was trying to brew about 4 cups of coffee.  It was more than a single cup, but far from a full pot.  I had noticed that the ratios seemed to be off when I was comparing 2 cups to 4+ cups (full pot), but I assumed that was still the correct ratio.
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Offline guitarchitect

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #102 on: July 29, 2018, 08:42 PM »
I haven't lost hope yet ;).  I'm hoping I like the Blue Bottle Beta.

I also had high hopes for the Bella Finca from Henry's House of Coffee, but I believe that's also a dark roast so I likely won't like it.

I selected the 19 grind setting because that's what you said you were using for the Blue Bottle Beta. The grinder instructions suggest 20. Is there that much of a difference between 19 and 20?  I'd think the difference would be negligible since they're only 1 tick apart.

You would be amazed! When I first started doing pourover I played with my grind size... three different grinds made 3 different cups of coffee. It was the difference between watery, perfect, and bitter. Remember that your grind size determines how long the water takes to extract from the beans - too large and there's no flavour, too small and you over-extract.

I haven't kept up with the entire thread but if your Moccamaster uses a paper filter, you should always rinse it under hot / boiling water before using it to make coffee. My pourover gets accolades from all my friends (even the espresso snobs), and most are in disbelief that it's paper-filtered coffee... it's much cleaner-tasting than anything through a metal filter, which can let too much of the oils through into your cup. I'm not sure how the moccamaster works, exactly, but i zeroed in on my grind size by targeting a 1:30 - 2:00 extraction time for a 12oz cup. From there you can tweak the ratio of beans:water you use - general rule is 1g:20g water but I like 1g:16g - so a 25g grinding of beans gets 400g water. Your manual may trump that though - the aeropress uses double that amount of grinds for a cup which is part of the reason I never got one... but since the moccamaster is pourover-like I'd say that should be a good place to start.

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #103 on: July 29, 2018, 08:59 PM »
Thank you for your considerate response.

From the sound of that - it sounds like a 19 to a 20 grind size could make a difference - I thought the 1 point difference wouldn't matter.

I am using a paper filter in my Moccamaster, but I don't pre-soak or rinse the filter.  I felt like that was a lot of extra effort for not a lot of return.  I did make sure to buy the white filters and not the brown paper filters.
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Offline SouthRider

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #104 on: July 29, 2018, 10:15 PM »
I have found that most coffee scoops that come with pots are measuring relatively the same amount (haven't bothered to see what that amount is).

The scoop that came with the Moccamaster is for "2 cups". We have found that for most coffee and our tastes when making a small pot we use 2 scoops (4 cups) of ground coffee and fill with filtered cold water to 7 cups (between the 6 and 8 lines on the machine).

This method makes about 3 1/2 actual cups of coffee to a strength that we like using most medium roast coffee (drinking it black). It also works well for darker roast coffee if you use some type of creamer and/or sweetener.

For a full pot we use 4 scoops, and fill the machine just shy of overflowing.
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Offline Gregor

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #105 on: July 30, 2018, 02:32 AM »
One thing to keep in mind: the finer you grind the coffee the more surface area is created. Finer grounds and a finer filter is needed. Surface area, temperature and time determine how much of the contents you'll extract.

In case you want to taste something interesting: take a french press, fill with normal amount of ground coffee and cold water, put on a lid and store in the fridge for 10h, then press. Cold extraction, some like it, some don't.

Offline Mario Turcot

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #106 on: July 30, 2018, 07:36 AM »
Amazing that that thread is still going strong (pun intended)

While we are at it, any one have experience with the Breville Barista Express

I'm looking for that type of coffee brewer and I'm wondering if the grinder in that machine is of the same quality of that grinder since both are from the same brand.
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Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #107 on: July 30, 2018, 09:06 AM »
I have found that most coffee scoops that come with pots are measuring relatively the same amount (haven't bothered to see what that amount is).

The scoop that came with the Moccamaster is for "2 cups". We have found that for most coffee and our tastes when making a small pot we use 2 scoops (4 cups) of ground coffee and fill with filtered cold water to 7 cups (between the 6 and 8 lines on the machine).

This method makes about 3 1/2 actual cups of coffee to a strength that we like using most medium roast coffee (drinking it black). It also works well for darker roast coffee if you use some type of creamer and/or sweetener.

For a full pot we use 4 scoops, and fill the machine just shy of overflowing.

Really?  I was going off the amount of scoops in the Moccamaster manual.  For 4 cups of water I was using 3 scoops and for a full 10 cups I was using 7 scoops.  The 7 scoops of grounds was just about full.  Maybe your scoop is bigger than mine?  My scoop is equivalent to 2 TBSP.

One thing to keep in mind: the finer you grind the coffee the more surface area is created. Finer grounds and a finer filter is needed. Surface area, temperature and time determine how much of the contents you'll extract.

In case you want to taste something interesting: take a french press, fill with normal amount of ground coffee and cold water, put on a lid and store in the fridge for 10h, then press. Cold extraction, some like it, some don't.

I think I tried a cold brewed coffee at Starbucks before - seemed like regular iced coffee to me.  Nothing really that special, but it seems like cold brew is all the rage lately.

This morning I made 4 cups of coffee and used 25 grams of whole beans ground on 19.  I meant to change it to 20 but only remembered when the grinding was just about done.  Today's cup tastes much better!  I don't taste the acid or bitterness so I'm going to try to drink it black.
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Offline SouthRider

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #108 on: July 30, 2018, 10:27 PM »
Mine came with the Technivorm. 2 tbsp sounds right from memory. I bet we have the same scoop.

We used to drink French Roast (pretty dark) with cream and/or sweetener. When we switched to black we had to cut way back on the amount of coffee to be able to drink it.

When we could no longer get 8 O'Clock French Roast we switched to Community Med Roast (several similar flavors) and just stayed with those proportions.
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Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #109 on: July 31, 2018, 09:39 AM »
Oh yeah we most likely have the same scoop then.

My Blue Bottle Beta Blend came in the mail yesterday.  That's fast delivery considering it's coming all the way from Oakland, CA and I ordered last Thursday.

I followed @Dane ratio of 60 grams of Blue Bottle Beans ground on setting 19 and 8 cups on the Moccamaster.  I'm able to drink this coffee straight black as is, but I'm not crazy about the taste.  I think it tastes too "citrusy."  I think I prefer the Dark Sumatra with a 25 grams to 4 cups ratio, at least in terms of drinking it black.  I should try adding some half and half to the Blue Bottle Beta Blend.  That might be good and probably won't require that much half and half.

I was surprised how much lighter in color the Blue Bottle Beta Blend beans were compared to the Dark Sumatra.  The Blue Bottle Beans also seem a lot drier than the Dark Sumatra.
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Offline zapdafish

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #110 on: July 31, 2018, 10:28 AM »

I ended up with the Clever Coffee Dripper. An immersion based system. Ordered a sampler from Black Rifle Coffee and it should be delivered some time today.

Can't wait.
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Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #111 on: July 31, 2018, 10:32 AM »
I had forgotten about Black Rifle Coffee.  Not too long ago I was seeing a lot of press about them.  Please let me know what you think of their coffee.
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Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #112 on: August 01, 2018, 01:54 PM »
I just came across this cool Moccamaster Factory Tour video on YouTube: .

It was interesting to see how it was made and assembled.
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Offline zapdafish

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #113 on: August 02, 2018, 09:46 AM »

Made a mug of the Just Black yesterday and followed directions of 2TBSP per 6 oz and it had me bouncing off the walls and was way to strong. I halved the amount that I ground today and it's pretty awesome stuff.

I went from communal office pot of seattles best to this and it's the first time I actually like coffee as is without sugar/cream.


I had forgotten about Black Rifle Coffee.  Not too long ago I was seeing a lot of press about them.  Please let me know what you think of their coffee.
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Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #114 on: August 02, 2018, 10:14 AM »
Cool.  Thanks for following up. Good to know it's strong stuff but you can drink it black.

I ordered a bag of Bella Finca from Henry's House of Coffee yesterday. I'm looking forward to trying that.
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Offline zapdafish

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #115 on: August 03, 2018, 09:46 AM »

I gotta say I really like manually grinding. about 50 revs is a TBSP so I am dialing in to exactly how I like it by changing how many revs each day so grind only what I need for a wonderful cup
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Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #116 on: August 05, 2018, 09:11 PM »
Good deal.  Sounds like you're getting a little mini arm workout in the process too.

My Bella Finca came from Henry's House of the Coffee on Friday.  I eagerly tried it out on Saturday morning and it was just ok.  Nothing earth shattering.  I think I might like the Dark Sumatra more. 

Last night I started steeping a cold brew with the Bella Finca - 4 cups of water to 1 cup of whole beans ground on setting 20.  This morning I strained the coffee and made my wife and myself a Cold Brew Latte.  It was pretty good.  Then I made myself a cup of cold brew with just ice and a little bit of sugar.  I think I liked the black cold brew with sugar more than the Cold Brew Latte.
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Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #117 on: October 12, 2018, 12:23 PM »
I finally got around to buying a bag of the Veranda Blend of Blonde roast from Starbucks.  Unfortunately I immediately didn't like how fruity or florally the taste was.

I just got my latest delivery from Henry's House of Coffee (Parker wants some coffee too).



I'm trying out my first cup of Conquistador coffee now.  It's good - as the bag says, more cocoa-y than chocolatey like the Bella Finca.  I have to change my opinion of what I said before.  I think Bella Finca is my favorite.  I had previously said that I thought I liked the Dark Sumatra better, but actually the Bella Finca is better than the Dark Sumatra.

I think the ranking is:

  • Bella Finca
  • Conquistador
  • Dark Sumatra

I also bought their "Hello Darkness" sampler pack so I can try out of a few more of their dark roast varieties.

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Offline jpmeunier

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #118 on: October 12, 2018, 12:30 PM »
I have been buying my coffee from West Coast Roasting. I drink almost exclusively espresso and I have not found beans that I can approach the taste and depth of flavor I get with their beans. They are a tiny company in California, but they ship beans the morning after they are roasted, I always have them 2 days after roast. Oddly enough found out about them (by meeting the owner) on a car forum....sometimes the internet is a wonderful place....sometimes.

Offline jobsworth

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #119 on: November 23, 2018, 11:53 AM »
 We had a simular problem with our Keurig Wednesday. It wouldnt give us a full cup either. We bought a new filter for it and it solved the problem. But we had a lot of grounds in the coffee. i called Keurig and told them what the problem was, they told me to clean the needle with a paper clip which i did, still had a little bit of the grounds in the coffee. So Keurig rep said the will send us a new cup assy free of charge including free shipping.
I figure we had this machine for about 5 years and they still supported us. Wow thats a great company. I remember when i was deployed in Iraq (I did 5 tours 3 in Iraq, 2 in Afg) We would write Keurig a email and they would send us a free machine for us to use with a large supply of coffee.
Great company with great company values.

Online Koamolly

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #120 on: November 29, 2018, 07:34 AM »

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #121 on: November 30, 2018, 09:57 AM »
That is a good price!  I'll have to tell my coworker.  I was telling him about the Moccamaster, but he thought the regular price was too expensive.  This is still probably too expensive.
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Offline Jim Kirkpatrick

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #122 on: December 01, 2018, 10:44 AM »
No Taster's Choice drinkers here?  I love it with 3 scoops of Cremora.

Offline SRSemenza

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Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #123 on: December 01, 2018, 10:52 AM »
No Taster's Choice drinkers here?  I love it with 3 scoops of Cremora.

Have you ever had your Tasters Choice secretly replaced with Folgers crystals?   [big grin]


Seth

Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 607
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #124 on: December 07, 2018, 10:13 AM »
We had a simular problem with our Keurig Wednesday. It wouldnt give us a full cup either. We bought a new filter for it and it solved the problem. But we had a lot of grounds in the coffee. i called Keurig and told them what the problem was, they told me to clean the needle with a paper clip which i did, still had a little bit of the grounds in the coffee. So Keurig rep said the will send us a new cup assy free of charge including free shipping.
I figure we had this machine for about 5 years and they still supported us. Wow thats a great company. I remember when i was deployed in Iraq (I did 5 tours 3 in Iraq, 2 in Afg) We would write Keurig a email and they would send us a free machine for us to use with a large supply of coffee.
Great company with great company values.

I concur with you, Keurig is a great company when it comes to customer care. I bought a Keurig 2.0 when they came out and the machine worked for two months. Stop working after, placed a call and they sent a brand new machine. When I asked what to do with the non working one, they said keep it for the parts if you like :)

I'm a big fan of espresso and latté so I went all out with a Breville Barista Express. I am fortunate enough to have two roasters within 10 minutes from my place. I can get beans that have been roasted the same day  [eek]

Have it for a few months and love it. It took only a few tries to set it at my taste and now I am experimenting the art of latté  [big grin]
« Last Edit: December 07, 2018, 10:18 AM by Mario Turcot »
Mario

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1083
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #125 on: December 07, 2018, 01:14 PM »
I concur with you, Keurig is a great company when it comes to customer care. I bought a Keurig 2.0 when they came out and the machine worked for two months. Stop working after, placed a call and they sent a brand new machine. When I asked what to do with the non working one, they said keep it for the parts if you like :)
Which I read as an indication of these machines having a quite high markup...

Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 607
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #126 on: December 07, 2018, 01:19 PM »
I concur with you, Keurig is a great company when it comes to customer care. I bought a Keurig 2.0 when they came out and the machine worked for two months. Stop working after, placed a call and they sent a brand new machine. When I asked what to do with the non working one, they said keep it for the parts if you like :)
Which I read as an indication of these machines having a quite high markup...

When they released them you couldn't use the old K-cups w/o hacking the machine. I believe the reading/sensor they implemented was at fault and since they released a new version of the same machine. We use a newer machine at work, physically identical but with more options from the touch screen. With the latest model you can use any K-cup.
Mario

Offline SRSemenza

  • Global Moderator
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  • Posts: 8647
  • Finger Lakes Region, NY State , USA
Re: Coffee Maker Recommendations
« Reply #127 on: December 07, 2018, 03:45 PM »
I concur with you, Keurig is a great company when it comes to customer care. I bought a Keurig 2.0 when they came out and the machine worked for two months. Stop working after, placed a call and they sent a brand new machine. When I asked what to do with the non working one, they said keep it for the parts if you like :)
Which I read as an indication of these machines having a quite high markup...


Or not worth the repair time, parts and shipping.

I have had a couple items in the last few years that arrived defective and the retailer did not want it back.

Seth