I don't think this post should be in Way Off Topic.

The original post was made by Eli in Nov. of 07
and Gino pops up in July of 08.

Eli should have  posted in tools and things.

Don't you people know this is a Raisin & Gin area.

Subjects like drinking linseed oil for your health, and

the virtuous  of using Worcestershire sauce, or

the advantage of passive solar hot water systems,

Or should Limeys  be using limes in their Larger,
 
are appropriate for The Way Off Topic discussions.

But not EZ what-you-call-its.

Bob

Hi Bob,

Try an ice filled glass of 1/2 lemonade and top it off with iced tea, aka an Arnold Palmer. Much more refreshing on a hot summer day than drinking linseed oil.

Woodenfish,

Linseed oil is made from flax seeds

Cold pressed flax seed oil is very high in omega 3

I take it in hopes that I will reach 84

I like it with a cold beer chaser but I take it in

the morning and the Frau says nix on that.

Will Gin go well with that tea drink, I can drain the raisins.

Bob

Hey kids!

Hey Dino, whats up?

Let me help everybody out here, for the new people,

there is a long running internet jousting match that occurs whenever

EZ and Festool meet on the tubes. Think the latest nonsense around here

is fun to watch? Well, this gets going you ain't seen nothing yet.

Never mind my Old Geezer confusing linseed oil and sterno,

this is exactly where this topic belongs.

Now.  Because I am sucked in again, and before my daddy sez something silly,

I give you (for what its worth) the official opinion of Swenson & Swenson.

Dino is a genuine nice guy who means well and manufactures a product that works as advertised.

I have met Dino, and he is from New Jersey and he did not give me a free rail for that endorsement.

We are Americans dang it and believe every body has the right and obligation to make a buck.

With that in mind, we here at Swenson and Swenson, sometimes ridicule Dinos marketing methods.

Privately of course. Sometimes mistaking his pitch for "Girls Gone Wild" and "Head On" advertising campaigns,

or 7pm telemarketers. But as they say in the Sopranos, "with all due respect, we mean that in a nice way"

See, I have to give Dino a lot of credit, if I was bashed unfairly as much as Dino and his product is on the intertoobs.

I don't think I could continue with the same resiliency.

Lets review.  Dino is a nice guy. Dino makes a similar product, and Dino needs to make a buck.

The off topic forum is perfect to avoid controversy.

Does the Festool community as a whole wish to be imaged as some kind of Talibanical movement.?

Heck no.  I am all for detente.

Per

Bob S.,
Back in the 40's, i had a neighbor who swore by vinegar and molasses with a spot o' lemon and well fortified with scotch. Heated up and it did wonders for just about anything.  As a matter of fact, the concoction has pulled me thru many a malady of my own. 

i do admit that linseed oil, altho i have never tried, does smell almost good enuff to drink.  do you like it hot or cold?
Tinker

Thanks for the historical overview Per.

...Waiting for Dino's reply...
 
How about a link to F VS Dino histoty?
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=20522

david

Per,   That thread's from 2005, and the thing that kinda cracked me up, was all the "transparency" in your reply.  (ie; no-one gave me this, or paid me to say that) Seems the same old stuff just goes around and around, huh?

Thanks for your thoughts, here and elsewhere. 

Dan

I had no idea this was as serious as all of that ------- and in general don't understand how things can become as serious (my personality I suppose) .    Excuse the sparring jest on my part -----


Justin

IMHO, it would be best for all concerned if those old F vs EZ wars were left in the archives.  Speaking from personal experience, nobody will benefit from reviving any of that stuff.  The sooner this thread dies, the better.

d.epstein,
You could probably find it if you did a search on Fine Woodworking's forum.  A lot of those "EZ Smart Versus Festool" discussions were deleted by the moderators, and I have not been on that forum for quite some time.


I'm not sure why you're taken aback by my response.  I'm just making sure people know the history here.  Who has been "publicly humiliated and thrown under the bus by the Forum Administrator"?

The term "witch hunt" might be a little strong for this.  It's more of a difference of opinion between two opposing camps.  I think a lot of people stumble into it innocently, as I did back in the early days.  Unfortunately, because of the history, Eli's original post is relevant to the fight, even though Eli himself was innocent of the history.

Thanks,
Matthew

Yes, that's the one.
Matthew

Dino,
I'm not going to respond to your posts, but I do have to say one part really made me laugh.  That part when you say people here are "my troops."  That hilarious.  Everyone here is very independent, which is just the way we all like it.  Believe me, they are not my troops!

Thanks for a laugh, though, I can really use one lately.

Another point you made, something about Taunton making money from Festool... Doesn't Taunton make money from a lot of tool manufacturers?  And in any case, how does that have anything to do with this forum?

Thanks,
Matthew

Thank you Dino for providing a perfect example of why I said, "it would be best for all concerned if those old F vs EZ wars were left in the archives".

Matthew. Here is  some of your  anti-ez history.





Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Schenker

Not true...

I am not, and have never been, interested in a war between Festool and EZ. In fact, I have always been excited about the possibility for new and better ideas, whoever develops them.

Anyone who wants to confirm what I just wrote just need to follow this link: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FestoolOwnersGroup/


Matt.
Read this before my last post on this thread.

YOU WROTE:

From the FOG.
Re: Debate between a table saw and Festool saw and guide.

Scott,
....I agree that the Festool system is not as good for ripping narrow
stock. When I rip narrow stock, I use a band saw. I never felt
comfortable using a table saw for this operation


....If Festool could devise a method for handling narrow stock under the
guide rail, and improve the bevel function of the plunge saws, then
they would have a perfect product. Right now, I'd say it is about 95%
there.....


Stay in touch,
Matthew
----------------------------------------------------------------------
PaulB,
I don't remember when you and I discussed this on another forum. Which forum was that?

To sum up, I do think that Festool comes out less expensive in the end. But my point is that to make the argument completely would be very involved, and it would rely on how you interpret what something is worth (like longevity and materials, etc.). That's why it's dificult, but I stand by my statement that in the end going the Festool route is cheaper.

I will admit that cutting thin strips using a Festool guide rail is not easy to do. You can do it, but it is the weakness of the Festool system. However, I think that EZ SmartGuide's claim that their system makes this easy is inaccurate. Have you tried lining up those thin pieces with the stop on the EZ SmartGuide? Yes, the piece you cut is thin, but certainly not straight enough. The fact is, cutting thin strips is something that all guide systems are working on improving.
If you look up and down the Festool line, you cannot help but come away with a general impression of superior engineering. EZ SmartGuide is claiming to have a better guide rail. Well, it's obviously debatable. Even if you give EZ SmartGuide the edge with their guide rail (which I don't), you can't match that up against an entire lineup of tools.

Festool has released a new version of their saw that has the anti-chip feature on both sides, as well as some other features. It's not available in the USA yet. I wouldn't say that this as any "admission" on Festool's part. The company, having excellent design and engineering, is always making improvements on an already superior product.


Edited 7/15/2005 8:55 am ET by Matthew Schenker
-------------------------------------------------------------------Re: You guys seen this (FOG)
Lonnie,
I've already checked out a demo of the EZ Smart Guide. As you can
imagine, it caught my eye! After watching it, I walked away saying,
"I like my Festool system better." I'd like to take them up on the
challenge. They will have a big headache if people really do
challenge them, and they will be giving away vacations, unless there
is some very fine print in the deal!

The set-up is much more cumbersome and more time-consuming than it is
with the Festool system. There are several more parts you have to
assemble and adjust to use the EZ Smart Guide. That takes care of
"faster and easier."

The finished cut depends on the saw you are using. With a good enough
saw, you could probably get a cut as straight as the Festool, but it
would not be as smooth, and you would not have the dust collection you
get with a Festool. That should take care of "better."

In short, there is no possible way that this system is "Better,
faster, AND easier" than the Festool system.

I'm wondering how they decide what constitutes "Better, Faster, and
Easier." Do they put you up against another woodworker using the EZ
Smart Guide? Do they hire a judge?

I'm going to contact the comany to find out more about this. I'll let
you know soon what I hear!

Thanks,
Matthew

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Glaucon,
I agree with most of what you say. But I just want to comment on your statement about the Bosch and the Festool jigsaw.

Let me be blunt. There is no comparison! The new Bosch is often touted as a great jigsaw, and it is probably better than 95% of other machines on the market. I owned one for a while, before I got the Trion.

Let me tell you that the Festool jigsaw is as far ahead of the Bosch as the Bosch is ahead of any other jigsaw on the market.

Try cutting 3" or 4" thick wood with the Bosch and watch as that blade bends and twists. Cut the same wood with the Festool and observe how the blade remains stiff and straight.

There are other features that put the Festool way ahead of the Bosch. For example, with the guide-rail adapter, you could use the Festool jigsaw for perfectly straight cuts, abslutely clean, as good as a table saw -- no exaggeration.

In general, there are no tools available for the American market that come close to a Festool tool of the same category. Period.


Edited 7/13/2005 1:51 pm ET by Matthew Schenker

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


Matthew.

You can say you like the festool and nothing else, that's passionate opinion. But do not defame the merits of other tools or the efforts of others to invent new tools just to justify your affection.
This country still has some brilliant inventive minds. One of the obstacles they face in bringing a tool to market is the attitude that says 'there can be nothing better'.
The attitude Matthew, the 'superior' attitude.

Chris.



Thanks Chris.
__________________
YCF Dino
Matthews
You never called the company. You just spread misinformation and lies.
Here is the ez deal.
Before I post my new Festool vs Eurekazone videos at youtube,
come and take the ez challenge.
If not you, anyone.
In order to finish the war that was started by you and other Festoolians,
 I think it's only fair to have a video comparison. 
Square a panel, clean cuts, narrow cuts,  large cross cuts, repeatable cuts, dust collection etc. etc.
This is a limited time invitation as I have better things to do.
Waiting for your call.
After all, you told your members that you're going to call the company... few years ago.
Enjoy your weekend.
Dino.