Author Topic: Where did the traffic compliance go?  (Read 1182 times)

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Offline Bob Marino

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Where did the traffic compliance go?
« on: November 28, 2017, 08:00 AM »
 Anyone living in the NY/NJ area will attest to the increase in volume of traffic and ensuing delays  - morning noon and night. Accidents, road work,  detours, increase in bike lanes in NYC (not saying good or bad idea), issues with mass transit, etc. has made a bad situation worse. But added to that is the lack of compliance with so many rules of the road that were once rarely violated. So many drivers ignore the solid white lines and (even worse when done in the NY/NJ tunnels) and switch lanes. Where are the police when ya need em'?

 As an aside, when at Connect in Indy a few months ago as well as last year, driving there was a whole nuther experience - positive at that. No horns honking, roads were well paved and when in Zionsville, people parked their convertibles with top left down. Try that in NY/NJ!
 
 Anyhow, maybe the lack of compliance is more of a regional thing than of a general sign of the times?

 
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Offline antss

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #1 on: November 28, 2017, 08:24 AM »
I think it is a sign of the times.  A drivers license and a car are more easily accessible today than they were a few generations ago.  People just take it for granted.

I'm not sure it's a regional thing as much as it is a "big city" thing.  We have the same behavior here in the ATL.  I was in Miami last week and they love their horns , though they do maintain lane discipline.  San Francisco traffic behavior this summer was just as bad as ATL.

Online Sparktrician

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #2 on: November 28, 2017, 08:31 AM »
If you think the NY/NJ traffic is obnoxious, you'd better stay out of Boston.  Those folks get in the left lane to turn right.   [scared]
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Offline Michael Kellough

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #3 on: November 28, 2017, 08:54 AM »
If you think the NY/NJ traffic is obnoxious, you'd better stay out of Boston.  Those folks get in the left lane to turn right.   [scared]

They have to, they'll never make the turn with the steering wheel turned only 1/4 turn unless they start way left. A lot of people drive like they're afraid they'll break something off if they turn the wheel more than a half turn.

Offline jobsworth

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #4 on: November 28, 2017, 09:04 AM »
You should try Orange County Calif and LA traffic, I elieve we set the standard in rude, agressive and non compliant drivers.

Stop signs and lights are merely a suggestion here. When I stop at a light I have to count to 10 to insure that everyone who was running the light has gone through but even then yer taking a chance. Right turns from the left lane common, U turns from the right lane pretty common to these are just examples of common non comliance believe me lots more happening.
Loving the Calif sun....

Offline RobBob

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #5 on: November 28, 2017, 09:04 AM »
If you think the NY/NJ traffic is obnoxious, you'd better stay out of Boston.  Those folks get in the left lane to turn right.   [scared]

They have to, they'll never make the turn with the steering wheel turned only 1/4 turn unless they start way left. A lot of people drive like they're afraid they'll break something off if they turn the wheel more than a half turn.

You've touched on one of my pet peeves.  Why do some people drift into my lane so that they can make a turn?  Turn the wheel and you won't have to do that!!

Offline Steve1

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #6 on: November 28, 2017, 10:42 AM »
Makes me think about the time, when I was a kid, that my buddy and I decided, on a whim, to drive to New York City.

First thing we noticed is everybody always honking their horn.   So we figured "when in Rome, do as the Romans do".   Light turns red, we honk our horn.   Light turns green, we honk our horn.   Changing lane, honk our horn.   Just keep honking the horn.   I am sure we fit right in.


Offline HarveyWildes

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #7 on: November 28, 2017, 10:45 AM »
Or you could be driving on one lane roads with old farmers :).

Offline Richard/RMW

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #8 on: November 28, 2017, 11:21 AM »
I travel a lot on business and mostly spend my time in commercial/industrial areas scouting out sites to acquire. Generally I don't visit the nice areas except in passing. Only states I have yet to visit are the Dakota's and Minnesota. My [2cents]:

I thought PA/NJ were bad until I visited Boston
I thought Boston was the worst until I experienced the "Rhode Island Slide"
Manhattan is just another planet but no surprise there
The west coast is tops for traffic volume but everyone just deals
The middle of the country is mostly okay
Texas is cake even considering the massive road construction around D/FW
The most dangerous place I have ever been is the parking lot of a Walmart in South Florida
Florida in general gets my vote for worst drivers ever on any planet

Whelp, that oughta light up some comments... [poke]

RMW

As of 10/17 I am out of the Dog business and pursuing other distractions. Thanks for a fun ride!

Offline ChuckM

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #9 on: November 28, 2017, 11:30 AM »
Could this be a chicken and egg situation?

If traffic weren't that bad, would people be more traffic compliant?

Lack of compliance can also be due to lack of enforcement, or the penalty is inconsequential. My province has distraction laws in place but if I were a cop and paid by the number of citations or tickets issued for offending drivers yakking on the phone or whatnot, I would be a very very rich man. When was the last time you did NOT find someone either texting or talking at a traffic light intersection? The enforcement people had to be blind not to find them.

« Last Edit: November 28, 2017, 12:00 PM by ChuckM »

Offline promark747

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #10 on: November 28, 2017, 12:18 PM »
If you think the NY/NJ traffic is obnoxious, you'd better stay out of Boston.  Those folks get in the left lane to turn right.   [scared]

Also home of the "Boston Left," where after a red light, a car will turn left in front of oncoming cars going straight.

Offline ear3

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #11 on: December 01, 2017, 08:37 AM »
New York traffic has become noticeably worse over the past decade.  Many factors, like the ones that @Bob Marino already mentioned, but I'd like to focus on one.

Bicycle lanes: Starting under Bloomberg and continuing apace under Di Blasio, NYC has become a bike friendly city, with dedicated bicycle lanes and traffic signals.  Overall this is a good move, given how concentrated a city New York is and therefore easily accessible on two wheels.  The problem is that these bike lanes have resulted in reduced lane-age on many streets.  On Queens Boulevard (affectionately known for years as the "Boulevard of Death" due to the relatively high mortality rate among pedestrian crossers), for example, there used to be two lanes along the local/service road, but now there is just one to accommodate a dedicated bike lane.  This means that when any driver decides to double park to let out a passenger, or grab take-out food, or whatever, it stops the whole line of cars behind them, whereas previously you used to be able to go around them to the left.  This is just one example, but multiply this by several hundred across the city.

My larger issue with bikes, though, is that bicycle culture has not yet caught up with the new reality of a bike-friendly city.  In the 90s and early 2000s, city-biking had kind of an outlaw culture (I remember, because I worked as a bike messenger for a while).  It was driven as much by a need for self-preservation -- swerving into and out of traffic at full speed to avoid crazy cabbies and the hundreds of pedestrians crossing at any one time; riding hard through the intersection to beat or blow the red light -- as it was by the youthful vigor of many bicyclists.

Now that biking has become respectable, you would think that the culture would naturally adapt to round over the sharp edges and stay between the lines, so to speak.  And to a certain degree I guess it has -- those who use the city bike program, for example, generally follow the rules.  But a significant number of bicyclists still ride like it's the Wild West, gunning through intersections and red lights, riding in and out of vehicle lanes to gain an advantage, and generally being a public menace.  The social contract should be that now that we've made the accommodations, bicyclists should stick to those and follow the rules of the road.  But too many of them don't, which is why you see a lot more white bicycles (put up as a memorial to a bicyclist killed by a car) locked to signposts throughout the city these days.

When I lived in Munich in the early 2000s -- which was my first experience with a bike-friendly city -- I remember in the first week of riding in the city, I was given a ticket by a cop who had observed me blowing through the red light on the dedicated bicycle traffic signal.  Being used to the anything-goes bicycling culture of NYC, I was shocked, but let me tell you, I followed the rules after that.

I've thought about having bumper stickers printed up that show a stick figure of a bicyclist sailing over the hood of a car, and saying something like: "When bicyclists start obeying traffic laws, I'll stop running them over."  But I'd also better budget for some new tail lights if I do.

And finally, can I just say that if I had a nickel for every time I got stuck behind a car at an intersection when the light had turned green, but where the driver's gaze was still fixated on their phone screen, I'd have a shop full of Mafell...
« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 08:50 AM by ear3 »
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Offline Bob Marino

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #12 on: December 01, 2017, 09:29 AM »
New York traffic has become noticeably worse over the past decade.  Many factors, like the ones that @Bob Marino already mentioned, but I'd like to focus on one.

Bicycle lanes: Starting under Bloomberg and continuing apace under Di Blasio, NYC has become a bike friendly city, with dedicated bicycle lanes and traffic signals.  Overall this is a good move, given how concentrated a city New York is and therefore easily accessible on two wheels.  The problem is that these bike lanes have resulted in reduced lane-age on many streets.  On Queens Boulevard (affectionately known for years as the "Boulevard of Death" due to the relatively high mortality rate among pedestrian crossers), for example, there used to be two lanes along the local/service road, but now there is just one to accommodate a dedicated bike lane.  This means that when any driver decides to double park to let out a passenger, or grab take-out food, or whatever, it stops the whole line of cars behind them, whereas previously you used to be able to go around them to the left.  This is just one example, but multiply this by several hundred across the city.

My larger issue with bikes, though, is that bicycle culture has not yet caught up with the new reality of a bike-friendly city.  In the 90s and early 2000s, city-biking had kind of an outlaw culture (I remember, because I worked as a bike messenger for a while).  It was driven as much by a need for self-preservation -- swerving into and out of traffic at full speed to avoid crazy cabbies and the hundreds of pedestrians crossing at any one time; riding hard through the intersection to beat or blow the red light -- as it was by the youthful vigor of many bicyclists.

Now that biking has become respectable, you would think that the culture would naturally adapt to round over the sharp edges and stay between the lines, so to speak.  And to a certain degree I guess it has -- those who use the city bike program, for example, generally follow the rules.  But a significant number of bicyclists still ride like it's the Wild West, gunning through intersections and red lights, riding in and out of vehicle lanes to gain an advantage, and generally being a public menace.  The social contract should be that now that we've made the accommodations, bicyclists should stick to those and follow the rules of the road.  But too many of them don't, which is why you see a lot more white bicycles (put up as a memorial to a bicyclist killed by a car) locked to signposts throughout the city these days.

When I lived in Munich in the early 2000s -- which was my first experience with a bike-friendly city -- I remember in the first week of riding in the city, I was given a ticket by a cop who had observed me blowing through the red light on the dedicated bicycle traffic signal.  Being used to the anything-goes bicycling culture of NYC, I was shocked, but let me tell you, I followed the rules after that.

I've thought about having bumper stickers printed up that show a stick figure of a bicyclist sailing over the hood of a car, and saying something like: "When bicyclists start obeying traffic laws, I'll stop running them over."  But I'd also better budget for some new tail lights if I do.

And finally, can I just say that if I had a nickel for every time I got stuck behind a car at an intersection when the light had turned green, but where the driver's gaze was still fixated on their phone screen, I'd have a shop full of Mafell...

  Well said and agree with you, but regarding the bicycle memorials for riders killed at that spot, I'm not so sure it was because they all did not observe traffic regs or that the (car) drivers aren't paying proper attention. I suppose it's a mix of both reasons.
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Offline ear3

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Re: Where did the traffic compliance go?
« Reply #13 on: December 01, 2017, 05:07 PM »

  Well said and agree with you, but regarding the bicycle memorials for riders killed at that spot, I'm not so sure it was because they all did not observe traffic regs or that the (car) drivers aren't paying proper attention. I suppose it's a mix of both reasons.

That's fair.
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