Author Topic: Donkey's ear shooting board styles  (Read 5661 times)

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Offline ear3

  • Posts: 3402
Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« on: June 02, 2017, 08:28 AM »
I was going to make a donkey's ear assembly for shooting carcasses miters -- I'm planning on making some small drawers for a hand tool cabinet I'm designing and so figure the thin pieces would be best prepared this way.

I see that there are two basic styles: one where the plane sits on its side, and the material is presented at 45 degrees to the blade; the other where the material lies flat and the track for the plane is angled at 45 degrees.  I was wondering what people prefer?  I don't have a dedicated shooting plane, and so would likely build it for my LA jack, since there will be a lot of end grain shooting.
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Offline derekcohen

  • Posts: 145
    • In The Woodshop
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2017, 09:23 AM »
Hi Edward

This is the one I built and use ...



Front and rear ...



In use ...







Regards from Perth

Derek

Offline RobBob

  • Posts: 1185
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2017, 09:35 AM »
Wow, Derek!  I would love to see more of your work, please.   [big grin]

Offline ear3

  • Posts: 3402
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2017, 04:01 PM »
Thanks @derekcohen -- beautiful as well as functional.  Is the donkey's ear ramp secured in any way, or do you just butt it up against the fence of the flat shooting board and hold it tight?
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • RS 2 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Offline Holmz

  • Posts: 4010
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #4 on: June 02, 2017, 07:19 PM »
@derekcohen what plane is that called?
@iamnothim also had some shooting board, but I am seeing this as solving a 45 degree mitre having a gap.

Offline iamnothim

  • Posts: 1423
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2017, 07:56 PM »
That is a Lie Lielsen No. 51 Shoot Board Plane and it is magnificent!
And what a beautiful Shooting board to use with it
Lie Nielsen No 51
My reputation pre-deceases me.

Offline iamnothim

  • Posts: 1423
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #6 on: June 02, 2017, 08:07 PM »
@derekcohen
What species did you use to make your shooting board. 
I can sense that your post just enticed me into a 51' of my own. 
I'll just have to use my no.5 jack plane for ...."jack planing"

My board is very pedestrian Except I put Delrin strips down for gliding

Yours is exceptional and should be in Fine Woodworking
My reputation pre-deceases me.

Offline Holmz

  • Posts: 4010
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #7 on: June 02, 2017, 08:18 PM »
....
My board is very pedestrian Except I put Delrin strips down for gliding
...

Well it made the most memorable impression on me of the day.

Pedestrian or not, your board and the Donkey's ear, are headed in the right direction on the animal compared to my JA approach. Which is something between Mr. Ed and Francis

Offline derekcohen

  • Posts: 145
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Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #8 on: June 02, 2017, 08:55 PM »
Thanks @derekcohen -- beautiful as well as functional.  Is the donkey's ear ramp secured in any way, or do you just butt it up against the fence of the flat shooting board and hold it tight?

I have built many shooting boards over the years. Some were simply because I was ironing out design features, and some because they were for sale (I generally do not sell the tools and furniture I build - this is just a hobby). The point is, the design evolved, and settled on a pivoting front fence. The fence has micro-adjustability built into it. All other fences are attached to this fence - which gives them micro-adjustability as well.

Below is an example of this for a board I built with a mitre fence and a donkey's ear as add-ons. The bolt on the fence connects either accessory.



Link:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/ShootingforPerfection.html

Regards from Perth

Derek

Offline derekcohen

  • Posts: 145
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Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #9 on: June 02, 2017, 09:05 PM »
That is a Lie Lielsen No. 51 Shoot Board Plane and it is magnificent!
And what a beautiful Shooting board to use with it
Lie Nielsen No 51

Thank you. As I mentioned above, I have designed and built many shooting boards over the years. These have been copied by others. The original Super Chute by Tico Vogt was based on one of my boards. He has since altered his fixtures, but the basic design remans.

Here is a general article I wrote many years back: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/Setting%20Up%20and%20Using%20a%20Shooting%20Board4.html

This article has an earlier design but details the micro-adjustable fence:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/Advances%20in%20a%20ramped%20shooting%20board.html

The side fence on shooting boards is a significant aid, and a must if using a #51 type plane. The original shooting board with this feature was the Stanley #52. I began posting about it several years ago. Many now incorporate it into their boards:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/RunningFencefortheShootingBoard.html

More later.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Offline derekcohen

  • Posts: 145
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Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #10 on: June 02, 2017, 09:29 PM »
@derekcohen
What species did you use to make your shooting board. 
I can sense that your post just enticed me into a 51' of my own. 
I'll just have to use my no.5 jack plane for ...."jack planing"

My board is very pedestrian Except I put Delrin strips down for gliding

Yours is exceptional and should be in Fine Woodworking

Thanks. The board above was built from Jarrah, which is from Western Australia.

The choice of shooting board design comes down to flat vs ramped. There are pros and cons for each.

Please keep in mind that a shooting board does not have to be fancy to work. Cheap and cheerful is fine ..... however saying this on the FOG does not fly! :)

A ramped board is best when using a plane with a straight blade, such as a LA Jack. The 5 degree ramp introduces a enough angle to cause the plane to enter the wood progressively as opposed to flat on. This reduces the impact, which increases control when used. I started out using a HNT Gordon Trying Plane, which is a woodie. This benefitted from a ramped board.

A plane with a skewed blade, such as a #51, does not require a ramp as the skew does the work. The skew additionally slices the wood, which the straight blade in a ramped board does not do.

There are three different #51 type shooting planes. I happen to own them all!

The first is the Stanley #51/52 Chute plane and board, which is the King of them all. I was lucky enough to find one cheaply on eBay many years ago (as the frog of the plane was busted), fixed it up and restored it.



Several years later, LN brought out their #51 plane, and my wife purchased this for me for a birthday. it looks right at home here ..



I wrote a review here:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ToolReviews/LN51ShootingPlane.html

A couple of years went by. I have been fortunate to have been one of the testers of tools for Lee Valley/Veritas for the past decade. I get to test most of the planes, chisels, and some of the saws. Often this goes from early drawings of concepts through to pre-production versions. My involvement with their shooting plane was to use it and determine if it worked in all department before it went to production. This led to my acquiring the Veritas shooting plane ...



The review is here:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ToolReviews/LVShootingPlane.html

While I love the classic looks of the LN, the Veritas is a much better plane, and its BU configuration blows away the opposition with edge holding. It is the Veritas that lives on my shooting board.

Heh .. with regards Fine Woodworking magazine, I have had some of my tools featured there :)  This bridle plough plane in Sheoak was one ...



Build it here: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/BridlePloughBuild.html

Regards from Perth

Derek
« Last Edit: June 03, 2017, 12:19 AM by derekcohen »

Offline derekcohen

  • Posts: 145
    • In The Woodshop
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #11 on: June 02, 2017, 10:13 PM »
Wow, Derek!  I would love to see more of your work, please.   [big grin]

Thanks Rob

There is furniture here:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/index.html

.. and tools I built here:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/index.html

Regards from Perth

Derek

Offline iamnothim

  • Posts: 1423
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #12 on: June 02, 2017, 10:47 PM »
This great news.   I can cancel my subscription to Fine Woodworking and read your articles.
You are the Srinivasa Ramanujan of wood and I'm checking airfare to Perth.   
My reputation pre-deceases me.

Offline Holmz

  • Posts: 4010
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #13 on: June 03, 2017, 07:05 AM »
This great news.   I can cancel my subscription to Fine Woodworking and read your articles.
You are the Srinivasa Ramanujan of wood and I'm checking airfare to Perth.

Mate - just fly here, and then we can go there by car visiting Uluru
(aka Ayres Rock since it is the 25th anniversary of Mabo we will use Uluru. The Paul Kelly song, "from little things big things grow", immortalises it for those who prefer music over history.)

Some other notable WA woods, in addition to Jarrah, are Karri and Tingle. Tasmania has some very nice woods too.

Offline iamnothim

  • Posts: 1423
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #14 on: June 03, 2017, 10:06 AM »
Hi Derek,

I wonder if there is a specific use for the donkey eared board vs. a flat one.  it seems to me that when you are nibbling away the material down to the apex of the jig you are fighting gravity.   I guess that could be a benefit.  It also seems that the flat design can handle larger stock.
 
Luke

@Edward A Reno
So sorry for hijacking your thread.  Truly.  But this is very valuable information.
 
My reputation pre-deceases me.

Offline Tim Raleigh

  • Posts: 3483
    • Oakville Cabinetry
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #15 on: June 03, 2017, 10:28 AM »
While I love the classic looks of the LN, the Veritas is a much better plane, and its BU configuration blows away the opposition with edge holding. It is the Veritas that lives on my shooting board.

Derek
Thanks for your continuing support and participation on this forum. Very useful first hand knowledge and information.
Tim

Offline TSO Products

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    • TSO Products
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #16 on: June 03, 2017, 01:40 PM »
@RENO  - thanks Ed for luring Derek out on this thread! - what a treat.
and thank you Derek for sharing your inspiring work involving "cordless" tools  [tongue]

Hans
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE Guide Rail Squares -  the MTR-18 Triangle and Work Holding solutions

Offline Rusty Miller

  • Posts: 235
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #17 on: June 03, 2017, 04:17 PM »
Speaking of Fine Woodworking, there is an article in issue 261 May/June 2017 by Todd Crenshaw "A shooting board for case miters" that may fit the bill.  It seems to make it easier to hold the material that a regular style "donkey ear".

Rusty
Rusty Miller
I'd rather be woodworking!

Offline Tim Raleigh

  • Posts: 3483
    • Oakville Cabinetry
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2017, 11:17 AM »
I was wondering what people prefer?

I would prefer miter jack but I haven't built one yet. I have a piece of  with a piece of hard maple set at 45 degrees and screwed into 3/4" mdf all mounted to 1/4" ply as a quick and dirty . I did buy a Lion style miter trimmer which I should have used on my last project as I had quite a few miters that could have used some fine tuning.
Tim

Offline LDBecker

  • Posts: 83
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #19 on: September 17, 2017, 02:59 AM »
@derekcohen

A couple of years went by. I have been fortunate to have been one of the testers of tools for Lee Valley/Veritas for the past decade. I get to test most of the planes, chisels, and some of the saws. Often this goes from early drawings of concepts through to pre-production versions. My involvement with their shooting plane was to use it and determine if it worked in all department before it went to production. This led to my acquiring the Veritas shooting plane ...



The review is here:  http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ToolReviews/LVShootingPlane.html

While I love the classic looks of the LN, the Veritas is a much better plane, and its BU configuration blows away the opposition with edge holding. It is the Veritas that lives on my shooting board.


I found your review of the Veritas Shooting Plane and that was part of what sold me on it. Paring it with a Vogt ramped shooting board and Donkey's Ear...

Thanks for the article - it was well-done and helpful!

Larry Becker

Offline Bob D.

  • Posts: 711
Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #20 on: September 17, 2017, 08:26 AM »
Might be a little off track, but since you brought them up Derek, why and when would a LH shooting plane be advantageous over a RH plane. I read through your reviews of the Stanley, LV, and LN planes and didn't see where you spoke about this. Other than aligning with a person's preference to use their left over the right (I'm a lefty but do many things right-handed), is there a reason from the perspective of working the wood that one might be preferred over the other and if you have only one does it really matter which one? I can't think of an application where left would serve better than right other than to better suit the user.
-----
It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?

Offline derekcohen

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Re: Donkey's ear shooting board styles
« Reply #21 on: September 18, 2017, 02:22 AM »
Hi Bob

Shooting both sides enables mouldings to have a complimentary fit ...



You need a plane that can be flipped over. The one above is a low angle (bevel down) strike block plane I built. One could also use a plane such as the LA Jack.

Regards from Perth

Derek