Author Topic: (Yet another) 80/20 MFT/SYS Cart (Read 81706 times)

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #90 on:** January 02, 2017, 05:50 PM »

Joe, I use a dedicated metal cutting chop saw with an AL blade. As Bryan stated I think you can make the same cut with most any SCMS using the right blade. For reference my 14" Milwaukee dry-cut saw is 1,500 RPM, and the Oshlun blade cuts thru it like butter. I've never used any lube, & again as Bryan stated just cut slowly and let the blade do it's job.

RMW

PS - love your designs/creations.

deepcreek · « **Reply #91 on:** January 03, 2017, 12:21 AM »

Quote from: Richard/RMW on January 02, 2017, 05:50 PM

Joe, I use a dedicated metal cutting chop saw with an AL blade. As Bryan stated I think you can make the same cut with most any SCMS using the right blade. For reference my 14" Milwaukee dry-cut saw is 1,500 RPM, and the Oshlun blade cuts thru it like butter. I've never used any lube, & again as Bryan stated just cut slowly and let the blade do it's job.

I have a 14" Dewalt metal chop saw and found that Olshun blade on Amazon along with a 12" version that will fit my old reliable Dewalt 705 miter saw. (I kept it for cuts I don't want to make on my Kapex.) Now I just have to decide which one will work better!!??

One last question (I think) - What tool did you use to trim the excess profile of the corner brackets?

Quote from: Richard/RMW on January 02, 2017, 05:50 PM

PS - love your designs/creations.

Thanks for the kind words. I love your designs/creations!

deepcreek · « **Reply #92 on:** January 03, 2017, 12:22 AM »

Quote from: Wooden Skye on January 02, 2017, 04:55 PM

Richard will be able to provide a lot more advise, but I have cut 80/20 using my sliding miter saw. I use high tooth blade, lock slide and cut very slow.

Thanks, Bryan!

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #93 on:** January 03, 2017, 01:33 AM »

Portaband mounted in table top setup and a Foredom with carbide burr for cleanup. Those brackets are cast so you can probably get away with a hacksaw and files if need be.

Post pics when you get it done.

RMW

Quote from: deepcreek on January 03, 2017, 12:21 AM

Quote from: Richard/RMW on January 02, 2017, 05:50 PM
Joe, I use a dedicated metal cutting chop saw with an AL blade. As Bryan stated I think you can make the same cut with most any SCMS using the right blade. For reference my 14" Milwaukee dry-cut saw is 1,500 RPM, and the Oshlun blade cuts thru it like butter. I've never used any lube, & again as Bryan stated just cut slowly and let the blade do it's job.

I have a 14" Dewalt metal chop saw and found that Olshun blade on Amazon along with a 12" version that will fit my old reliable Dewalt 705 miter saw. (I kept it for cuts I don't want to make on my Kapex.) Now I just have to decide which one will work better!!??

One last question (I think) - What tool did you use to trim the excess profile of the corner brackets?

Quote from: Richard/RMW on January 02, 2017, 05:50 PM
PS - love your designs/creations.

Thanks for the kind words. I love your designs/creations!

mindbend · « **Reply #94 on:** March 07, 2017, 11:35 AM »

Great projet and thread! Any tips/pointers on the best place to purchase these extrusions and connectors?
Thanks,.

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #95 on:** March 10, 2017, 09:03 AM »

Howdy @mindbend

to the FOG.

I get my stuff from 80/20's eBay store.

RMW

Quote from: mindbend on March 07, 2017, 11:35 AM

Great projet and thread! Any tips/pointers on the best place to purchase these extrusions and connectors?
Thanks,.

mindbend · « **Reply #96 on:** March 10, 2017, 09:14 AM »

Got it! Thanks.

p.s. I've made some corner connectors via my 3D printer that don't need to be hacked/cut. May be advantageous for builders here.

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #97 on:** March 10, 2017, 09:48 AM »

Quote from: mindbend on March 10, 2017, 09:14 AM

Got it! Thanks.

p.s. I've made some corner connectors via my 3D printer that don't need to be hacked/cut. May be advantageous for builders here.

Great idea. Have you shared the file anywhere?

RMW

ryanjg117 · « **Reply #98 on:** March 12, 2017, 04:08 PM »

Quote from: Richard/RMW on March 10, 2017, 09:48 AM

Quote from: mindbend on March 10, 2017, 09:14 AM
Got it! Thanks.

p.s. I've made some corner connectors via my 3D printer that don't need to be hacked/cut. May be advantageous for builders here.

Great idea. Have you shared the file anywhere?

RMW

And what material did you use for 3D printing it? My experience with 3D printing is that all of the available polymers are quite weak, especially for any kind of structural use. I did a 3D printing project awhile back using glass reinforced nylon and have found them to still have far too much flex to be suitable for anything like this.

Fuji22 · « **Reply #99 on:** August 24, 2017, 12:08 AM »

@ryanjg117 - What modeling program did you use to create your renders?

deepcreek · « **Reply #100 on:** November 26, 2017, 01:27 PM »

I've been planning to build an 80/20 based MFT table for a long long time. The idea was inspired by Richard's excellent designs that he has so generously shared here. Thank you @Richard/RMW

The reason I finally pulled the trigger is that 80/20.net is offering rare 15% off sitewide for a Black Friday deal that extends through Cyber Monday.
www.8020.net

I ordered all the components I will need to build a 3' x 6' table with an MFT top with an extra 2' fold up wing on one end. The table will serve as the outfeed table for my Unisaw with adjustable casters for leveling. It will have easy reach storage for my Festool sanders, routers, clamps, accessories, Leigh jig and more.

I also ordered 80/20 parts for a router sled and rails that will attach to the table rails to give me 3' x 8' capacity for flattening slabs.

I'm super excited and will post updates when I start the build.

dupe · « **Reply #101 on:** January 11, 2018, 09:21 AM »

Sorry to dig into an old topic, but first thanks @Richard/RMW this has been an invaluable resource - over 66,000 reads!

I've likewise been working on plans for a (safer) more reliable router sled based on your tectonic wizardry [ seen here ]

This will be my 3rd and final* - no details on Sled#1 as it makes hairs on the back of my neck stand up. Sled #2 was based on Nick Offerman's version - while it felt much safer and provided a better finish, the limitations on wide pieces and ability to make consistent, uniform passes got me planning again.

I've been pricing profiles from 8020's Garage Sale and using https://openbuilds.com/ as a starting point for how I'd like this sled to function - conceptually a gantry system with adjustable widths and locking router plate. The idea is, rather than stretching across a width of the table back and forth (typically across grain), I'd include incremental-locking stops on the router plate with the primary motion being the length of the work piece, with the grain. Buildlog hopeful...

I've gathered the 15 series best suited for bench projects based on adaptability - the majority OpenBuilds Store platforms are based on the 20 mm profiles, I was shocked at how much more expensive the 15 mm profile is in comparison to the larger 20??? So this is the route I'll be taking for the sled application. 8020 Garage Sale is better than wholesale I suppose, but the shipping is still brutal. I'm now looking at Grainger who distributes 8020, shipped to store in 7 days for pickup, pay just TAX! Has anyone used Grainger as a supplier? I may be missing something but this seems like the most economical route, anyone?

@deepcreek keep me in the loop on your build

rst · « **Reply #102 on:** January 11, 2018, 10:41 AM »

Hntdpl, years ago when I first started using 8020, I contacted them via their website for a catalog. They sent me one but also contacted their closest distributor, who then contacted me. It may be that 8020 has a distributor close enough to you that will save you shipping. Grainger sells practically everything under the sun, but they are expensive.

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #103 on:** January 11, 2018, 01:04 PM »

Quote from: hntdpl on January 11, 2018, 09:21 AM

I've gathered the 15 series best suited for bench projects based on adaptability - the majority OpenBuilds Store platforms are based on the 20 mm profiles, I was shocked at how much more expensive the 15 mm profile is in comparison to the larger 20??? So this is the route I'll be taking for the sled application. 8020 Garage Sale is better than wholesale I suppose, but the shipping is still brutal. I'm now looking at Grainger who distributes 8020, shipped to store in 7 days for pickup, pay just TAX! Has anyone used Grainger as a supplier? I may be missing something but this seems like the most economical route, anyone?

Hey @htndpl - to clarify the 80/20 "15" series is 1.5"/38mm not 15mm, which probably accounts for the cost difference with openbuilds 20mm profiles.

I buy all my 80/20 from their eBay store

8' sticks of 1515 ULS are around $40 and when you combine stuff in your cart then ask them for a final price w/ shipping the shipping cost is less than what the eBay app calculates. To do this add everything to your cart then select "Request total from seller".

They will send you an eBay invoice including shipping then you pay it if the total is acceptable to you.

Hope this helps.

RMW

Cheese · « **Reply #104 on:** January 11, 2018, 01:38 PM »

Quote from: hntdpl on January 11, 2018, 09:21 AM

I was shocked at how much more expensive the 15 mm profile is in comparison to the larger 20???

As Richard noted, the 15 series is imperial dimensioned and measures 1.50"

The metric equivalent is the 40 series and measures 1.57"

Be careful of Graingers, watch their prices. I was looking for a Milwaukee impact wrench and Graingers was $150 higher than anyone else.

Michael Kellough · « **Reply #105 on:** January 11, 2018, 02:52 PM »

Did a project that required many thousands of dollar worth of 80/20 stuff.
Thought it would be helpful to go through a distributor in case there were problems.
Turns out the distributors (Knotts in this case) don't actually stock the stuff.
They just pass the order on to 80/20.

When I needed more stuff I ordered through the 80/20 website, worked fine.
When I needed something really fast I ordered from McMaster.com

When the budget was exhausted and I needed something I checked out the 80/20 ebay store first.

dupe · « **Reply #106 on:** January 11, 2018, 03:04 PM »

Jesus, talk about an oversight

, I knew I was missing something...Thanks for the correction Richard and thanks @rst for the tip, I'm going to look into local distribution. Back to the drawing board...

Bugsysiegals · « **Reply #107 on:** January 24, 2018, 08:14 PM »

Hey Richard, thanks for sharing the awesome build!! I’m building a cart also but have some variation to it and have questions on how to fasten the extrusion together.

I decided not to go with thicker top extrusion as I have supports underneath so there’s not much deflection with 4040 and I’ll notch out the inner t channel in a few spots so I can slip clamps inside when needed.

That said, how do you mount corners? With end fasteners it seems drilling in both directions would blow out the center core of the extrusion and substantially weaken it. Does it weaken it even in regular butt joints? It doesn’t seem possible to use this fastening method for butt joints which are opposite each other like the short vertical pieces on the upper level of my cart design. I’m thinking I’d need to use anchor fasteners for these instead?

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #108 on:** January 25, 2018, 08:06 PM »

Hey Bugsy - couple thoughts:

As mentioned in PM, I used the end fastener method of all the connections except the top rails. This was to (1) keep cost down (the brackets are what kills you w/ 80/20) and (2) to get access to the end of the top extrusions for clamps. This method involves drilling an access hole in one extrusion (call it extrusion "A") and tapping the end hole of the corresponding one. In practice you need to have access to the opposite side of extrusion A so you can use a hex key to tighten the fastener. Because of this you can only use end fasteners on corner joints or T-joints. These images may help in understanding this - the arrows show where you need access to tighten the fastener:

In the second image you would not have access to be able to tighten the fastener for both the top and bottom extrusions.

My general thought on your design is that those small sections between the top and center rails are not necessary. Unless you are expecting to stand on top of your cart I doubt you would do anything to bend or flex the top rail in normal use.

I would also recommend you check the mounting holes on the drawer slides you plan to use. I had looked at having intermediate extrusions between each bank of drawers but the holes in the slides are not close enough to the end to mount into the t-slot. This is largely why I used plywood dividers between my drawer banks.

In case it helps anyone here there are 2 videos that depict what you have to do at home to use the end fasteners with 80/20. My power tapping video:

And 80/20's video on the fasteners themselves:

Hope this helps.

RMW

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #109 on:** January 25, 2018, 08:40 PM »

Quote from: Bugsysiegals on January 24, 2018, 08:14 PM

That said, how do you mount corners? With end fasteners it seems drilling in both directions would blow out the center core of the extrusion and substantially weaken it. Does it weaken it even in regular butt joints?

Sorry - to respond to your question drilling access holes in 2 directions does not weaken the extrusion. On the corners however I used these 3-way corner brackets:

RMW

Bugsysiegals · « **Reply #110 on:** January 27, 2018, 11:38 PM »

Thanks Richard. I may do some cabinet assembly and glue ups on top of the cabinet but the short extrusions are also so I can put drawers up top for rules, squares, sandpaper, clamps, etc.

I’m considering 28” KV8450FM Soft Close Slides which I can get for somewhere between $10-15 per set which should mount similar to this cart, "MarxIng MFTM Multifunktionstisch Bausatz mit Anwendungsbeispielen" it's an MFT, as seen here ...

Bugsysiegals · « **Reply #111 on:** January 28, 2018, 04:26 PM »

How did you mount the top to the cart? I’ve found several brackets, etc., but am not certain what’s best or if there’s a cheaper alternative.

Top fastening kit

Panel mount bracket

Corner bracket

Panel Bracket

Dusty.House · « **Reply #112 on:** January 28, 2018, 08:24 PM »

Quote from: Bugsysiegals on January 28, 2018, 04:26 PM

How did you mount the top to the cart? I’ve found several brackets, etc., but am not certain what’s best or if there’s a cheaper alternative.

Top fastening kit

Panel mount bracket

Corner bracket

Panel Bracket

Richard made his own using a CNC machine.

I was going to ask a similar question, which is, what's a suitable alternative? I like how the top is recessed but slightly above the frame. I want to build a CNC machine, but my benches need to come first

I like the idea of the 80/20 Inc Aluminum 1.50" Roll-In Panel Mount Bracket 15 Series #2488 N (the 15 series version of the 40 series you posted). They don't require framing hardware, just a screw into the top. That screw should then hold the bracket in and load the weight on to the frame.

On a related note, has anyone tried Faztek? I'm in the process of finalizing an order with them for the first of four benches I want to build. They are about 25% cheaper than 80/20.

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #113 on:** January 29, 2018, 09:22 AM »

Great find on the drawer glides. The cheapo ones I used didn't have the holes close to both ends so weren't usable without the plywood panel. These glides also let you position the drawer at any height easily.

RMW

Quote from: Bugsysiegals on January 27, 2018, 11:38 PM

Thanks Richard. I may do some cabinet assembly and glue ups on top of the cabinet but the short extrusions are also so I can put drawers up top for rules, squares, sandpaper, clamps, etc.

I’m considering 28” KV8450FM Soft Close Slides which I can get for somewhere between $10-15 per set which should mount similar to this cart, "MarxIng MFTM Multifunktionstisch Bausatz mit Anwendungsbeispielen" it's an MFT, as seen here ...

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #114 on:** January 29, 2018, 09:28 AM »

Bugsy as @Dusty.House stated I made my own 1-piece top connectors shown midway thru this post.

An easier way would be to use a small piece of 5/16 AL or ply as a tab in the inside slot and then another small piece whatever thickness needed to raise your top to the height you want. Drill a hole in both and screw up from below into the top.

RMW

Dusty.House · « **Reply #115 on:** January 29, 2018, 01:54 PM »

Quote from: Richard/RMW on January 29, 2018, 09:28 AM

Bugsy as @Dusty.House stated I made my own 1-piece top connectors shown midway thru this post.

An easier way would be to use a small piece of 5/16 AL or ply as a tab in the inside slot and then another small piece whatever thickness needed to raise your top to the height you want. Drill a hole in both and screw up from below into the top.

RMW

@RMW - What thickness did you end up with? Looking at your connectors it looks like they could easily be made from a block of HDPE with a rabbet to 5/16.

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #116 on:** January 29, 2018, 04:23 PM »

Quote from: Dusty.House on January 29, 2018, 01:54 PM

Quote from: Richard/RMW on January 29, 2018, 09:28 AM
Bugsy as @Dusty.House stated I made my own 1-piece top connectors shown midway thru this post.

An easier way would be to use a small piece of 5/16 AL or ply as a tab in the inside slot and then another small piece whatever thickness needed to raise your top to the height you want. Drill a hole in both and screw up from below into the top.

RMW

@RMW - What thickness did you end up with? Looking at your connectors it looks like they could easily be made from a block of HDPE with a rabbet to 5/16.

That's basically all they are. You will need to measure your extrusion and the top material to figure out what you need.

In my case I wanted my top to be exactly 12.7mm (1/2") proud of the extrusion and I was using nominal 3/4" ply that measured 18mm. The 5/16" slot = 8mm. The extrusion is 38.1mm & either side of the slot is 15mm (I dropped the .05mm) so my math worked out to be:

18mm - 12.7mm = 5.3mm
15MM - 5.3mm = 9.7mm
9.7mm + 8mm = 17.7mm

So I used full 3/4" (19.1mm) plastic and knocked 1.3mm off the top and then rabbeted 9.7mm to get the 8mm tongue.

Clear as mud...?

RMW

Dusty.House · « **Reply #117 on:** January 29, 2018, 08:23 PM »

Quote from: Richard/RMW on January 29, 2018, 04:23 PM

Quote from: Dusty.House on January 29, 2018, 01:54 PM
Quote from: Richard/RMW on January 29, 2018, 09:28 AM
Bugsy as @Dusty.House stated I made my own 1-piece top connectors shown midway thru this post.

An easier way would be to use a small piece of 5/16 AL or ply as a tab in the inside slot and then another small piece whatever thickness needed to raise your top to the height you want. Drill a hole in both and screw up from below into the top.

RMW

@RMW - What thickness did you end up with? Looking at your connectors it looks like they could easily be made from a block of HDPE with a rabbet to 5/16.

That's basically all they are. You will need to measure your extrusion and the top material to figure out what you need.

In my case I wanted my top to be exactly 12.7mm (1/2") proud of the extrusion and I was using nominal 3/4" ply that measured 18mm. The 5/16" slot = 8mm. The extrusion is 38.1mm & either side of the slot is 15mm (I dropped the .05mm) so my math worked out to be:

18mm - 12.7mm = 5.3mm
15MM - 5.3mm = 9.7mm
9.7mm + 8mm = 17.7mm

So I used full 3/4" (19.1mm) plastic and knocked 1.3mm off the top and then rabbeted 9.7mm to get the 8mm tongue.

Clear as mud...?

RMW

Clear to me!

Thank you, this'll save me a ton of money in fasteners! Plus I think I can use the same principle on the sides to add strength to the peg board I plan to install. I have a bunch of 24" to use but my frame is 25". I can slot it into the top\bottom and use these to stabalise the sides.

Cheers

Ben

Dusty.House · « **Reply #118 on:** January 29, 2018, 08:50 PM »

Quote from: Richard/RMW on September 20, 2015, 01:36 PM

Seems like the past few weeks have been consumed by WORK and the boss insisting we have FUN on the weekends. We have a friendly disagreement as to whether playing in the shop qualifies as FUN, recently her position has prevailed. This weekend I put my foot down and refused to participate in FUN, so there was progress on the router table project which has been percolating for a while.

The table is 600MM square & designed to fit Woodpecker/Kreg inserts (am I the only person who didn't realize they were interchangeable until last week?):

Richard - How does the router table attach? Am I right in saying that you've used a joining strip that's permanently attached to the extension. You then slide t-nut in the other 1/2 of the extension plate into the main table from the left\right and tighten the bolt?

Richard/RMW · « **Reply #119 on:** January 30, 2018, 12:48 AM »

Quote from: Dusty.House on January 29, 2018, 08:50 PM

Quote from: Richard/RMW on September 20, 2015, 01:36 PM
Seems like the past few weeks have been consumed by WORK and the boss insisting we have FUN on the weekends. We have a friendly disagreement as to whether playing in the shop qualifies as FUN, recently her position has prevailed. This weekend I put my foot down and refused to participate in FUN, so there was progress on the router table project which has been percolating for a while.

The table is 600MM square & designed to fit Woodpecker/Kreg inserts (am I the only person who didn't realize they were interchangeable until last week?):

Richard - How does the router table attach? Am I right in saying that you've used a joining strip that's permanently attached to the extension. You then slide t-nut in the other 1/2 of the extension plate into the main table from the left\right and tighten the bolt?

Yes. In the 3rd photo in that post you can see (2) 1.5" by 3" 80/20 joining plates attached to the table. There is a second hole/fastener that fits into the slot on the top extrusion of the cart. The 90 degree legs rest against the intermediate extrusion.

RMW