Author Topic: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?  (Read 1076 times)

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Online threesixright

  • Posts: 252
Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« on: June 27, 2019, 02:56 AM »
Hi,

We are looking for a floating staircase, and our eyes caught this beautiful oak staircase version.  But for ~ 9000 USD  [blink], its a "bit" hefty for my wallet.

Does anybody know (here in the EU preferable) a place where you can but the just wall brackets? I have seen a few solutions where you can buy it as a kit, but I'm only after the brackets. Just to be clear, a fully hidden bracket that goes into the stair tread. The stair tread self are not 'linked'.

Should I have them tailor-made at a blacksmith? In that case I have not a clue how long and which diameter the rods should be (seen 4 rods per thread), any ideas?

Thanks!

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Offline tallgrass

  • Posts: 860
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #1 on: June 27, 2019, 02:59 AM »
Is it so amazing that there is no picture of it?

Offline Peter_C

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Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #2 on: June 27, 2019, 03:19 AM »
For $9,000 you could buy an awesome welder, lots of steel to practice on, the materials for the job, and take the family on a very nice vacation.

It will take a powerful and expensive welder though, but not $9K worth.

Online threesixright

  • Posts: 252
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #3 on: June 27, 2019, 03:28 AM »
Is it so amazing that there is no picture of it?

Something like this: http://www.scrapality.com/2017/06/what-are-the-advantages-of-cantilevered-stairs.html

Yet, here they use on the outside glass, and I would prefer without.

Offline Bob D.

  • Posts: 1134
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #4 on: June 27, 2019, 05:36 AM »
I guess the biggest question I would have is does the necessary structure exist in the building to support these and if not can it be retrofitted into the structure. Which leads to evaluating if the cost of adding the supporting structure buried in the wall is justified.

I would bet there is a stringer of 10 or 12 inch C channel buried in that wall or something similar with 3 or 4 supporting columns comprised of a small H beam or Tube Steel.

-----
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Online threesixright

  • Posts: 252
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2019, 06:50 AM »
I guess the biggest question I would have is does the necessary structure exist in the building to support these and if not can it be retrofitted into the structure. Which leads to evaluating if the cost of adding the supporting structure buried in the wall is justified.

I would bet there is a stringer of 10 or 12 inch C channel buried in that wall or something similar with 3 or 4 supporting columns comprised of a small H beam or Tube Steel.
Ha. Well there is a hole (where the wall should come) at the moment. So a new wall needs to be made anyway. We are building up a second floor. So all is new [emoji3]


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Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 6099
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #6 on: June 27, 2019, 11:53 AM »
If you can compromise and live with a semi-cantilevered look, the middle stringer version is available in kit form with prices starting around $1800.






Online Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 572
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #7 on: June 27, 2019, 01:55 PM »
@threesixright Monolith do kits which I think means you can buy everything separate. The landind and stage frames, the tread brackets, and any coverings, although, it would be nice to make your own finish covers.

https://m.facebook.com/pages/category/Company/Monolith-Floating-STAIR-KIT-1130507020329356/.

We’ve done a couple of these for customers who sourced all the parts, and IIRC the last one was from Monolith.

As Bob D mentioned, the structural capability that everything is hung on is critical.
The first one we ever did, the wall was stripped of plaster and concrete panels were fitted, and we chem fixed the treads to them, and it was probably OTT.
Another place we did which featured on Grand Designs, had more or less a 10mm steel plate as a wall. This was bolted to steel goal posts, and RSJ’s.
We marked all the fixing points, drilled them, and tapped them at M12 IIRC, and then the treads were bolted to the steel wall. This was the possibly the strongest we’ve experienced but, definitely the easiest.
A company came in, erected all the steelwork, welded and bolted it, so our part was relatively easy.
Looked amazing when finished too.

Online threesixright

  • Posts: 252
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2019, 04:58 PM »
@Cheese
Thanks, sorry, not exactly what I'm after. Its nice, but the floating style brings just that bit of extra  [tongue]

@Jiggy Joiner
Thanks, I have a look! I was indeed planning to make the treads myself, Oak (100x350) or so.  Just curious, I don't fully understand how you connected your treads. You used M12 rods, those treads where wood?

Offline Pnw painter

  • Posts: 209
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2019, 05:39 PM »
Before you get too far into this process you may want to research your local building code requirements. Hopefully they don’t interfere with your design.


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Online Jiggy Joiner

  • Posts: 572
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2019, 05:48 PM »
@Cheese
Thanks, sorry, not exactly what I'm after. Its nice, but the floating style brings just that bit of extra  [tongue]

@Jiggy Joiner
Thanks, I have a look! I was indeed planning to make the treads myself, Oak (100x350) or so.  Just curious, I don't fully understand how you connected your treads. You used M12 rods, those treads where wood?

No, the tread frames (skeletons), were galvanised steel reinforced box section, with drilled flat plates for mounting. We bolted these to the steel panelled wall with M12 bolts. A bit of care and planning is needed to mark our the fixings, after we’d lined up and temporarily fixed two skeletons, we knocked up a jig. This made sure the height and spacing was correct.
We did have to shim the odd one or two, to get them horizontally level across the width and depth.

We made the treads (walnut) like sleeves, that fitted fairly snug over the skeletons.
Each one was checked for level both width and depth like the skeletons, and then bonded with an adhesive, polymer I think.

So the main thing is to get the tread frames/skeletons fixed in the right place, level and as firm as possible.
The metal tread frames, did come pre drilled with I think 8mm holes, and as there were six holes on each plate, I thought that was more than adequate but, the architect and structural engineer insisted on 12mm.

If you are fixing into concrete, I would say concrete screws would be fine but, a belt and braces option is chem fix.

We did a stainless steel version too, which I really liked.

Online threesixright

  • Posts: 252
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2019, 06:38 PM »
@Cheese
Thanks, sorry, not exactly what I'm after. Its nice, but the floating style brings just that bit of extra  [tongue]

@Jiggy Joiner
Thanks, I have a look! I was indeed planning to make the treads myself, Oak (100x350) or so.  Just curious, I don't fully understand how you connected your treads. You used M12 rods, those treads where wood?

No, the tread frames (skeletons), were galvanised steel reinforced box section, with drilled flat plates for mounting. We bolted these to the steel panelled wall with M12 bolts. A bit of care and planning is needed to mark our the fixings, after we’d lined up and temporarily fixed two skeletons, we knocked up a jig. This made sure the height and spacing was correct.
We did have to shim the odd one or two, to get them horizontally level across the width and depth.

We made the treads (walnut) like sleeves, that fitted fairly snug over the skeletons.
Each one was checked for level both width and depth like the skeletons, and then bonded with an adhesive, polymer I think.

So the main thing is to get the tread frames/skeletons fixed in the right place, level and as firm as possible.
The metal tread frames, did come pre drilled with I think 8mm holes, and as there were six holes on each plate, I thought that was more than adequate but, the architect and structural engineer insisted on 12mm.

If you are fixing into concrete, I would say concrete screws would be fine but, a belt and braces option is chem fix.

We did a stainless steel version too, which I really liked.
Thanks, got it. No photos [unsure]?

Online Jiggy Joiner

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Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2019, 06:43 PM »
I may have some photos, of the steel one, I’ll have a search. Some properties we work in, are strictly no photos, and sometimes we have to sign legal documents to basically say we can keep a secret.
Some clients, we asked and they often take it as a compliment. Others will have none of it though.

Online threesixright

  • Posts: 252
Re: Cantilevered Staircases (floating), wall brackets?
« Reply #13 on: June 28, 2019, 01:26 AM »
I may have some photos, of the steel one, I’ll have a search. Some properties we work in, are strictly no photos, and sometimes we have to sign legal documents to basically say we can keep a secret.
Some clients, we asked and they often take it as a compliment. Others will have none of it though.
Yeah, as a craftsman it's a pity, of course you're proud and would be nice to be able to show it. On the other side I do understand some people simple don't want or like it (to have pictures taken of their home).

Anyway, if you have some, a awesome if not also good. Thanks fo explaining!