Author Topic: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)  (Read 4835 times)

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Offline ilovesunshine

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Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« on: July 22, 2018, 10:07 AM »
282446-0Hello All,

New here. Hope you're having an awesome weekend.

I bought a HKC55 cordless circular saw with a 1400mm guide rail and the angled guide rail too at the Festool roadshow last year in Twickenham.

Ashamed to say it sat brand new in it's box for quite some months as I'm not a carpenter or builder just a girl who likes woodworking as and when the mood takes me - but now it has been very well used and is the best thing I've ever bought and am now looking at other Festool products.

Have imposed myself on my parents in Cornwall to make use of Dad's Big Man Shed (!) so that I can finish these - they are a bespoke size (approx 80cm deep x 210cm tall at the tallest point and 180cm long) and each one is slightly different but very nearly the same size.

Just making the doors today and been wondering what the best roof material is - will probably just do felt but don't want it to rip on the corners and don't want to use the gas torch thing. Would gratefully take any recommendations for this.

Anyway everything was cut with the circular saw even the small angles - it's probably sturdier than it needs to be but I like that :-) Bit of inherited Dad Engineering (you can see how he built his shed / workshop in the background!!)

If anyone has any recommendations on what to use on the wood to treat it, would be gratefully received. Don't want to paint it as would like to preserve the grain of the wood if possible. So thinking some kind of oil or stain.

Thanks for any replies. If anyone's interested I can post finished photos :-) Enjoy the sunshine :-)

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Offline neilc

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #1 on: July 22, 2018, 10:21 AM »
Welcome to FOG and great first post.  Are you planning to move those to the final location?  They look nice but hope they aren’t too heavy.


A simple roof would be corrugated metal here in the US and very inexpensive and easy to install.


Look forward to seeing progress.


Neil

« Last Edit: July 22, 2018, 10:25 AM by neilc »

Offline Michael Kellough

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #2 on: July 22, 2018, 01:05 PM »
Nice job! The wood does look too nice to cover with paint.

Nice to see the little corner blocks at the bottom. They’re rarely included in projects like this but they do add a surprising amount of resistance to racking.

Another benefit of the metal roofing Neil suggested is that it will weigh less than anything else that offers comparable durability.

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #3 on: July 22, 2018, 02:47 PM »
Hey thanks for the replies :-)

Yes - I had considered a metal roof but the problem with that is, these are going back to London and will be in a garden that

1) the 2nd floor people above us might drop the odd cigarette butt on (not an issue for metal roofs but was considering EPDM and then dismissed it when I thought of that)

2) faces into the middle of a square which comprises 185 flats - and it is surprisingly VERY quiet at night so when it rains which it does a lot here in the UK, I am concerned it might be too noisy with a metal roof.

So I have marine ply that was going to be cut to size tomorrow or whenever I'm ready and then screwed onto the roof frame that's already attached to the tops of the wall pieces to give them stability while I put the cladding on and then was going to put whatever roof covering on top of that.

Felt seems to (reluctantly as I don't like it and especially don't like the corners as I am worried they will tear in not that long at all) be the best option considering the noise and cigarette butt possibility!!

I did however spy these at our local shop (attached) - I like the idea of them because if they get knackered you can just unscrew them and put a new one one, plus they seem to be the exact right size for my boxes quite randomly!

282467-0

So I'd put them on top of the marine ply. Thoughts?? Should I treat the marine ply first? I have this Zinsser all coat exterior paint which I had originally planned to paint the whole box with but it's black and garden faces west so not so sure about that now - don't really want to buy *more* of it in a tinted colour- but if I painted the marine ply black and then put black or green roof stuff on - would that be good??

The guy at the shop said its fibre board coated with some sort of tar stuff - so I guess really a little bit inferior to felt just easier to put on and change over and no corner detailing headaches!! I bought this stuff to stick the felt on with which is great when you first put it on but I built these super sturdy to last so don't want to be messing around with trying to scrape that off in 10 years time or whatever!!

Like the idea I could just switch those corrugated wavy type things over - but, are they rubbish?? If they are then maybe I won't bother!

Would love some advice on what to use on the outside though - good brands of stain or oil and how many coats and how often to reapply.

Thank you so much :-)

Oh and, hahahahahaha - yes weight is a problem, hahaha, the original plan was to make them here, then take them apart in panels with the cladding on, and squish them into my trusty Volvo estate and take them one at a time back to London. I did this with my previous Big Box that measured 3.2m long x 85 ish cm deep x 1.1m tall approx - another bespoke creation haha! Amazingly that all fitted in my car in it's pieces, obviously the 3.2 was in half - if you look at this shed the back is in 2 pieces for that reason. Plus if I have to assemble it myself the other end I couldn't carry the whole back piece in one bit I don't think.

Anyway I'll have to measure the exact pieces and my car but I am doubtful it will fit in, I think each piece is 5-10cm too big so will probably hire a van. A nice, sturdy van, suitable for really chunky heavy wood shed things. hahaha!

Thank you so much for your replies - checked out someone else's project here and seems a lot more professional!! Still you have to start somewhere :-)

Offline RustE

  • Posts: 342
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #4 on: July 22, 2018, 11:34 PM »
Look into an automotive type noise-deadening or undercoating products.  Typically comes as an adhesive mat or in a spray can.

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1019
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #5 on: July 23, 2018, 02:35 AM »
The stuff in the picture looks like a tar based material and can still burn, not as fast as EPDM (which is thinner so it needs less energy to ignite) but once it's going it'll continue. Also still somewhat noisy.
Look into an automotive type noise-deadening or undercoating products.  Typically comes as an adhesive mat or in a spray can.
The spray/paint on variety could be used as glue (onto the lower ply sheets) for flat aluminium sheets to make a cigarette proof and reasonably quiet roof, by removing the ability of the aluminium to vibrate freely it'll remove the drum effect.

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #6 on: July 23, 2018, 03:24 AM »
Hi Clare

You might like to consider Onduvilla which is an easy to lay tile system:



I have found it easier to use the screws to fix it rather than nails as a tile can then be reset or removed if needed.

Peter

Offline Master Carpenter

  • Posts: 90
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #7 on: July 23, 2018, 07:31 AM »
Two part epoxy will waterproof wood and still be transparent to see it. You'll have to work fast to get it spread on a large surface before it kicks, and it's smelly stuff. People around here use it on plywood kyacks, it will definitely waterproof it.
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Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #8 on: July 23, 2018, 07:13 PM »
Look into an automotive type noise-deadening or undercoating products.  Typically comes as an adhesive mat or in a spray can.

Thanks RustE - sorry if this is a silly question - feel silly asking this as you guys are all super carpenters and builders on here - do you mean use only that or in a combination of it with something else? Would you mind sending some links of what you recommend in entirety (ie if its an underneath thing what to put over it?)

My partner is a building surveyor so has been helping tell me what's good and what isn't (LOL and told me just use felt) but is super busy and about 250 miles away back in London!! Plus then that messes up the door open cladding that I've not put on yet - :-)

Im sure I'm massively overthinking this as it's only a couple of garden sheds, just keen to learn and see what options are out there :-) Thank you :-)

Oh and, thought about just painting the wood - he suggested I think it was chlorinated rubber paint that seems pretty cheap to buy on ebay but it's all for underwater so when I told him that he said no that'll crack in the sun - so not sure if there are other types as from reading it seems that same stuff is road paint too but has to go on hot?

LOL, so many options :-)

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #9 on: July 23, 2018, 07:23 PM »
The stuff in the picture looks like a tar based material and can still burn, not as fast as EPDM (which is thinner so it needs less energy to ignite) but once it's going it'll continue. Also still somewhat noisy.

Hmmm.... really?? It's definitely tar based - would it burn or just char or melt a bit? I'll ask the other half ;-) Would EDPM ignite?  I thought it would just melt a hole. That's interesting. I'll ask him about that too :-) It's sort of soft and sticky to the touch - a little bit - strange stuff. It's called Coroline. (news to me, you guys probably know all about it!)
282499-0

Looks really like the stuff Peter posted in the video, will reply to that shortly :-) Thanks so much :-)

Look into an automotive type noise-deadening or undercoating products.  Typically comes as an adhesive mat or in a spray can.
The spray/paint on variety could be used as glue (onto the lower ply sheets) for flat aluminium sheets to make a cigarette proof and reasonably quiet roof, by removing the ability of the aluminium to vibrate freely it'll remove the drum effect.
[/quote]

HMMMMMMMMM interesting... like I didn't have enough options to think about. I like this idea.... they are all good ideas and thank you all - this sounds interesting and probably quite expensive.... if you could possibly spare the time might you be able to expand on this so I could understand how this would look and what I would do to make this?? Part of the consideration is I need to get everything ordered, here, assembled, stained, disassembled, and hopefully driving back up to London by next Monday or Tuesday :-)

Thank you so much :-)

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #10 on: July 23, 2018, 07:37 PM »
Hi Clare

You might like to consider Onduvilla which is an easy to lay tile system:

I have found it easier to use the screws to fix it rather than nails as a tile can then be reset or removed if needed.

Peter

Hey Peter,

Thank you SO MUCH for the reply and posting such an informative and helpful video. You know, they had something that looks EXACTLY like that in the shop I bought the big things from. Driving home with them bouncing around the car I did chuckle watching your video thinking how much easier the smaller ones woudl have been!!

So a few thoughts if it's OK:

- Is Onduvilla made from a 'bituminous sheet' like the Coroline?? If you know Coroline is it the same, better or worse quality? Is there a life expectancy? I collared a random dude looking at the same stuff in the shop who looked like he had made a roof or 2 and he said it should last around 5-10 years which if I can replace easily I'll be happy with :-)

- Good call with the screws not the nails - but - what do you cover the tops of the screws with to stop water getting in? I bought the nails with the plastic caps on but totally agree with you screws are AWESOME and nails are a bit too permanent!!

Do you think I could use either Coroline or Onduvilla on my sheds at the pitch is definitely less than 10 degrees. Highest point is around 206cm and lowest around 200. Let me work that out... http://www.pagetutor.com/trigcalc/trig.html
Hmm well that reckons less than 2 degrees as sheds are only around 180cm long -

Would it still work, would the water still run off OK?? Can't really build them higher and don't want to make the short bit shorter!!

 - Do you need damp proof stuff between the ply and this stuff on top or is it optional?? Question for the other half too !

- Interesting and good to see you screwed your panels on on EACH high ridge bit - I had thought that but the Parents ( I suspect they are slightly more concerned with me finishing this and giving them their workshop back than me building the best shed ever, hahaha) told me don't bother. (I don't listen to them all the time though haha!)

- TOTALLY AGREE with you about the battery on the Festools - I am presuming but don't know that the battery on your drill that you said in the video did the whole roof is the same battery in my circular saw - I have changed my battery once in this whole project so far and it wasn't fully charged when I came down here and it's not dead now. Very VERY impressed with that - have cut lots of things twice as all the cladding I cut a slight angle on which sometimes I did the first time and other times I cut a 90 and then trimmed another sliver off which is SO EASY with the circular saw - one of many reasons why I absolutely love it :-)

AND I got my second 1400 guide rail today with the joining together thing so when I cut the roof ply it will be EXCELLENT and SUPER EASY :-) Happy :)

- Last question!! Would you mind sharing what the plastic type stuff you used on the edges was?? That looks great - I hadn't quite thought of what to do there and that seems a nice option if I stick with this tar stuff :-)

Thank you SO MUCH for the replies everyone, it's a bit rough but I'll post some photos I took earlier.

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #11 on: July 23, 2018, 07:43 PM »
Two part epoxy will waterproof wood and still be transparent to see it. You'll have to work fast to get it spread on a large surface before it kicks, and it's smelly stuff. People around here use it on plywood kyacks, it will definitely waterproof it.

Hey thank you this is another AWESOME idea - like the weird underwater paint but better :-) Awesome!! I've only ever used the 2 part epoxy as glue and I hate using it - it dries super fast in a tiny area and is quite lumpy and didn't squish out when I stuck the 2 things together - clearly, the issue was probably with me rather than the glue -

Might you be so kind as to share a link to a suitable product (ideally one available here in the UK if you know the type of stuff that works)

I really like the idea of just putting something on the ply as I'd like my door cladding to go as close to the marine ply roof as possible (bar maybe 10mm or something so it has clearance to open OK) as then it'll cover where the roof frame is screwed to the top of the door frame and look nicer IMHO.


Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2018, 07:58 PM »
Hey so here's some progress from today, was out all morning buying bits and it takes ages in Cornwall so only managed about 5 hours work today!



That's my not very professional work area - liked the shadow at the end of the day haha!



Here's me trying to cut out a hinge - having 3 per door as I'm worried they will warp. Not sure whether to put the angled things on or not - would welcome any suggestions for this :-) I cheated as I'm not very good with a chisel yet and used my Fein tool multicutter with a wood blade (sorry am I allowed to say that on a Festool forum, lol) to cut around the outside of what I had drawn in pencil around my hinges...



Here's one I cut out of the frame - managed to do all 12 on the doors and 3 on one frame but needed help to locate where exactly the doors needed to hang which Dad very helpfully produced a car jack to rest them on while pontificating on this :-) Need to do the other 9 of these tomorrow :-)



Here's one of the hinges in place - unfortunately I got a bit impatient - I did the 3 on the frame with a chisel and it looks pretty decent - hinge looks flush, seems a decent depth uniformly - phew ...

However trying to chisel it out with the doors, I did partly by chisel (being honest about 10% and partly with the multi cutter again (90%!!) so unsurpisingly in hindsight I have ended up with the cut out for the hinges in the doors being great in places and too deep in others..... DOH and ooops - So I guess I'll need to look at putting some sort of packers in tomorrow - I knew this part would be difficult. I will do all the door frames with a chisel.

If anyone reads this - how do you cut out hinge insets professionally - do you use a router with some sort of jig?? (other than just being awesome and learning carpentry properly which I would love to do ASAP if I can find a suitable course!!)



Anyway doors are hung - the frame hinges are screwed on in only 2 places not flush with the frame so I need to draw round them tomorrow and take them off so i can cut them out as carefully as patiently as I can!! The Fein multicutter is good for the edge bit at least! (I think so anyway!)

I might once I put the doors back on after the hinges are all sorted out tomorrow - make the door frames a little smaller so there is more of a gap between them and the top and bottom of their frame - I'll see what I end up with :-)



A slightly better one of the closest shed! :-)

Cheers for your replies awesome Festool people :-) Will update tomorrow :-)

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #13 on: July 23, 2018, 08:02 PM »
Sorry no idea why the photos came out not correctly orientated!!

Offline neilc

  • Posts: 2514
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #14 on: July 23, 2018, 09:11 PM »
Nice progress.  Your mortises and overall work look good.  By the time you've built a few of these and friends commission you for their work, you'll be an expert!

For cutting hinge mortises, I use  trim router.  Variable speed ones are ideal if you have that option.  A Dremel tool with a router base is even smaller and works well too.

I first place the hinge on the door or frame, optionally screw in one screw to hold it and and use a knife to mark the edge on the outside.  Remove the hinge and set the router to the hinge leaf depth and then remove the bulk of the material with a 1/4 or 3/8" router bit.  You can then use a chisel to clean up the remainder using the flat bottom as a reference for light easy strokes.  Consistent, fast, and with a little care they turn out great.
« Last Edit: July 23, 2018, 09:13 PM by neilc »

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #15 on: July 24, 2018, 12:24 AM »
Hi @ilovesunshine

Yes, the Onduvilla is made from the same bituminous material as Onduline and Coroline. I used Onduline on my current shed when I built it 31 years ago. It lasted 26 years and survived the 1987 hurricane.

Your pitch is a bit low but with a damp proof membrane under the roofing material it might be okay. I use the thick plastic used for over site work (under concrete etc). I know that it is too late now but the next time you make a shed use this or a similar damp proof membrane over the framing before you put the T&G or shiplap on. It only needs to be held in place with staples as the T&G will hold I well.

The edging was also an Onduline product - check out their web site.

Peter


Offline Gregor

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #16 on: July 24, 2018, 10:55 AM »
The stuff in the picture looks like a tar based material and can still burn, not as fast as EPDM (which is thinner so it needs less energy to ignite) but once it's going it'll continue. Also still somewhat noisy.

Hmmm.... really?? It's definitely tar based - would it burn or just char or melt a bit? I'll ask the other half ;-) Would EDPM ignite?
Sorry, confused EPDM with the thin transparent PVC stuff (which is way thinner, thus can't absorb as much concentrated heat).
Nevertheless, fun with EPDM and fire:


Quote
Quote
Look into an automotive type noise-deadening or undercoating products.  Typically comes as an adhesive mat or in a spray can.
The spray/paint on variety could be used as glue (onto the lower ply sheets) for flat aluminium sheets to make a cigarette proof and reasonably quiet roof, by removing the ability of the aluminium to vibrate freely it'll remove the drum effect.

HMMMMMMMMM interesting... like I didn't have enough options to think about. I like this idea.... they are all good ideas and thank you all - this sounds interesting and probably quite expensive.... if you could possibly spare the time might you be able to expand on this so I could understand how this would look and what I would do to make this??

In case you have a flat roof (with slope or not) the idea is to use the automotive type noise-deadening or undercoating products as glue for aluminium sheets (they don't need to be that thick, 1mm would already be plenty) directly onto the ply of the rood. Just miter them onto each other, no need for overlap, the black undercoating stuff below will do the waterproofing.

As the total roof size isn't that big you won't get big problems with thermal expansion, but should anything hot fall onto the roof (cigarettes, fireworks, ...) the aluminium will spread the out heat (so bringing the stuff under it to the respective ignition point would need way hotter stuff). Also the aluminium is inert to UV (which might get to be a problem with the epoxy idea).

A TS 55 will cut aluminium sheets without problems (with the #496306 blade), plus you can use it with a rail to easily create fold lines (45° bevel and 1/2 - 3/4 of material depth, on the inside of the corner, to create a weak line along the sheet will bend straightly), so in case you would want to pull the roof over the corners it wouldn't be that big of an issue.

This corner fume hood for my kitchen was created like that, cut to size and bend lines created with a TS55 (first picture prototype assembly wrongly oriented, second picture installed with filter and front bezel removed - seams sealed with sikaflex and some wooden supports for the corners):
« Last Edit: July 24, 2018, 11:10 AM by Gregor »

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #17 on: July 24, 2018, 11:32 AM »
Hey All
Thanks for replies. Will respond properly later! Went and bought a dremel tool but thought cordless would be good...
which it is but now my battery has died and shop didn’t have spares so having a break!!

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #18 on: July 24, 2018, 02:11 PM »
Hey so I can officially announce as you all probably already knew that the dremel 10.5v battery is p**s poor although to be fair I think routing is quite power intensive which is why festool don’t make cordless routers ... I think Axminster tools told me that ... all good info to learn! Hinges still in progress! Update later 🙂

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #19 on: July 24, 2018, 03:23 PM »
Dog groomers evidently use dremels to grind dog's nails.  They say it works well and they're cheaper and better than ones made specifically for dogs.

I don't believe anyone really makes "real" cordless routers (yet) aside from small trim routers since they do require so much power.
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Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #20 on: July 24, 2018, 07:08 PM »
Nice progress.  Your mortises and overall work look good.  By the time you've built a few of these and friends commission you for their work, you'll be an expert!

For cutting hinge mortises, I use  trim router.  Variable speed ones are ideal if you have that option.  A Dremel tool with a router base is even smaller and works well too.

I first place the hinge on the door or frame, optionally screw in one screw to hold it and and use a knife to mark the edge on the outside.  Remove the hinge and set the router to the hinge leaf depth and then remove the bulk of the material with a 1/4 or 3/8" router bit.  You can then use a chisel to clean up the remainder using the flat bottom as a reference for light easy strokes.  Consistent, fast, and with a little care they turn out great.

Hi Neil,

Thanks so much for reading and for taking the time to reply. Haha, yes the more you practice the better you get - that's what I'm hoping anyway! Just buying a house with my partner and will have My Own Workshop there - can't wait!! So excited!!! :-)

I too your advice and went and bought a Dremel - had seen them for years but always thought they were for more hobby type stuff or small models - and I guess they are really - I went for the cordless model in my ignorance and couldn't have picked a more gutless machine to chunk out the door hinges - plus am finding a few issues with holding the base totally square to the work as the 'work' is vertical - and the router base when I am cutting near the top or bottom, can slip off into the already cut bit from the other end of the hinge - and then if I hold the router base on the wood that is still the full height - some of this is the next bit of frame which isn't totally flush with the bit I am cutting - so my nice depth on my practice bit turns out to
not be totally what I had hoped - still this is all good experience - I am still glad I went for the cordless one as it's so easy not having cables - I just need at least 1 more battery ideally!!

In the meantime there is plenty to keep me out of trouble (!) - trying to rescue the hinge mortises I cut out of the doors yesterday for one!! Partner suggested good quality 2 part wood filler as some bits are perfect, others are to deep.

Anyway this is all likely elementary stuff for all you master carpenters, haha, I'll post some photos when I have something more impressive to post and more progress!! Hopefully with the doors all hanging nicely with a nice uniform gap around them all by end of tomorrow so I can commence the door cladding - thank you so much for the help and encouragement :-)

Offline neilc

  • Posts: 2514
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #21 on: July 24, 2018, 08:31 PM »
Cut some pieces of cardboard to raise the hinges up.  A cereal box, for example can yield multiple thin pieces to backfill behind a hinge that has a mortise cut too deep.

I actually use a cordless Dremel in a router base and it works fine as long as you are not too aggressive.  Apologize if you bought the wrong one for your needs.   I happen to have an 'uptick' from the standard Dremel router base however - https://microfence.com/product/micro-plunge-base-w-light-ring-kit/

That base is WAY overkill for what you are doing and EXPENSIVE.  I use with the router for inlay work as well as for clearing out dovetails after making the main cuts.  I like the size, take my time and it gives a nice cut.  Plus cordless is nice.

Your better choice would be a simple trim router like the Bosch colt.  Useful for simple routing, edge treatment, etc.

You'll get the feel with hand tools.  Our first mortises are frequently a challenge but in time you'll get the technique.  The knife blade around the edge is a good idea even if you are using chisels.  And try the cardboard trick to raise the hinge.

I'd bet there are plenty of homes around the world with hinges that may have a piece of cardboard behind hinges to bring them into alignment.

neil

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #22 on: July 25, 2018, 01:19 PM »
Hey everyone 🙂

I’m winning with the hinges 😀😀

Will update later, learned loads 😀

I’m just cutting my door frames to size now they’re hung - hinges are all flush albeit some with lots of (waterproof!) packers!!

Just had a question:

What would anyone reading this recommend to best stop th doors from racking?

I’m putting bolts top and bottom of the left door of each cupboard and the cladding will help loads but not sure what to do?

I used more diagonal 2x2 on my Big Box and doors were half the height of these and even with that and cladding they still have warped a little.

I have 2 x 6, 2 x 4 and 2 x 3, but thinking weight - would some metal long strips be better or more like 8 x 1??

Help would be massively and gratefully appreciated!!

Thank you 😀😀
282558-0

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #23 on: July 25, 2018, 03:49 PM »
The stuff in the picture looks like a tar based material and can still burn, not as fast as EPDM (which is thinner so it needs less energy to ignite) but once it's going it'll continue. Also still somewhat noisy.

Sorry, confused EPDM with the thin transparent PVC stuff (which is way thinner, thus can't absorb as much concentrated heat).
Nevertheless, fun with EPDM and fire:

In case you have a flat roof (with slope or not) the idea is to use the automotive type noise-deadening or undercoating products as glue for aluminium sheets (they don't need to be that thick, 1mm would already be plenty) directly onto the ply of the rood. Just miter them onto each other, no need for overlap, the black undercoating stuff below will do the waterproofing.

As the total roof size isn't that big you won't get big problems with thermal expansion, but should anything hot fall onto the roof (cigarettes, fireworks, ...) the aluminium will spread the out heat (so bringing the stuff under it to the respective ignition point would need way hotter stuff). Also the aluminium is inert to UV (which might get to be a problem with the epoxy idea).

A TS 55 will cut aluminium sheets without problems (with the #496306 blade), plus you can use it with a rail to easily create fold lines (45° bevel and 1/2 - 3/4 of material depth, on the inside of the corner, to create a weak line along the sheet will bend straightly), so in case you would want to pull the roof over the corners it wouldn't be that big of an issue.

This corner fume hood for my kitchen was created like that, cut to size and bend lines created with a TS55 (first picture prototype assembly wrongly oriented, second picture installed with filter and front bezel removed - seams sealed with sikaflex and some wooden supports for the corners):

Hey Gregor - thanks for the reply sorry for the delay - the hinges got the better of me yesterday but I think I equalised today  [wink]

Wow thats mad seeing the EPDM burn like that - to be fair it's quite an intense flame on it - would a cigarette butt do that?? Either way, won't be using EPDM that's good and most interesting to see :-)

Thanks for the photos - that looks great :-) And thank you so much for the tips on how to nicely cut a bending line - will save that for a time I might need it - I think just due to time and getting things here I will stick with the coroline for now...

Although just went back to the Trigonometry calculator as I had thought about raising the high end just with some extra wood - it told me I needed it to be 33cm higher to get the 10 degree pitch - that would be silly so I think I will take my chances with how it is or when I get round to the roof - which hopefully should be either tomorrow or Friday now, I might still go for felt!! :-)

Thank you so much for your input :-)

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1019
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #24 on: July 26, 2018, 04:03 AM »
Wow thats mad seeing the EPDM burn like that - to be fair it's quite an intense flame on it - would a cigarette butt do that?? Either way, won't be using EPDM that's good and most interesting to see :-)
A cigarette butt likely won't be enough to light it, a bengal fire/flare might.
Quote
And thank you so much for the tips on how to nicely cut a bending line - will save that for a time I might need it
In case you want to do the aluminium sheet bending: Keep in mind that you'll cold form it at the bend line, cut too deep and it'll break, too shallow and it won't cleanly bend (or also break as too thick material isn't that flexible). Better do some tests with cutoffs first.
Quote
Although just went back to the Trigonometry calculator ... told me I needed it to be 33cm higher to get the 10 degree pitch
10° pitch is 18% elevation, given 33cm for the raise would mean the roof is ~180cm long, which means that the pitch goes along the long side of the roof (given the pictures you posted). IMHO it makes more sense to pitch a roof along the short side (front/back in your build).

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #25 on: July 26, 2018, 08:05 PM »
Hi Gregor,

Thank you so much for the reply. I’m going to use either the coroline or the felt for the roof just as I have it here and it’s easy. 99% definitely the Coroline.

Worked until around 10.30pm today - didn’t start until just before lunch though.

Definitely need to be precise with the cutting depth. I found out a lot more today about what this saw does! I’ve only ever needed to cut straight things so far and the most I’ve done is a straight cut at maybe 45 degrees.

I found out how to cut a 45 along the length of my cladding (for where the doors open) and also how to adjust the depth of the cut. And that there’s a little Allen key for changing the blade in the handle, clever and nice! Thank you new brit workshop and Peter parfitt - great helpful videos with great info on how to actually change the settings and what every single bit does!

So I’ve learned loads today. I’ve taken lots of in progress photos but as it’s late I’ll just post the last one!

Sorry anybody I’ve not replied to yet, when I have more time to sit down I will do 🙂
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Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #26 on: July 26, 2018, 08:13 PM »
Hey Gregor just to add - thanks so much for helping and commenting on the roof slope - that’s super helpful thank you 🙂 yes the sheds are both around 180 long.

Totally agree it would’ve been better to put the pitch the other way round - I just did it this way because

1. The old crappy sheds that were there before were this way round! Not really a valid reason, haha, but I quite liked them like that! But hence the low slope! So there’s more space inside!

2. On one side if the roof slopes back any water would end up in the neighbours garden and on the other side there’s a really dense hedge and fence and it’s right bang uk against that too so I just thought it might rot the base faster.

Would’ve been loads easier to make the doors your way though!

The next shed I build I’m doing it you way! 🙂

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #27 on: July 26, 2018, 08:41 PM »
Dog groomers evidently use dremels to grind dog's nails.  They say it works well and they're cheaper and better than ones made specifically for dogs.

I don't believe anyone really makes "real" cordless routers (yet) aside from small trim routers since they do require so much power.

Hahaha!!! Whether you’re joking or not, either way it’s funny!!

Yes everything in the box of attachments that came with it is so teeny!!

I love the router though! It’s a nice girl sized easy to handle thing - I’m very impressed with it. Except the battery life but I gave it a long overnight full charge and it was a lot better. So much better than chiselling!! This was the first day using it when battery died!

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Had never used a router before and that’s actually how my festool thing started - builder let me down on a project and needed to cut a groove behind skirting for internet cable - looked into routers - festool were coming up as best

Ended up hiring a carpenter and putting cable just above skirting! Then was looking awhile later and at the roadshow last year and that’s how I found Peter parfitt as he does great comprehensive reviews that’s perfect for people who would use all the settings and super helpful for people still learning like me so I can find out new things!!

Thank you so much for reading and commenting on my amateur post 🙂

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1019
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #28 on: July 27, 2018, 11:23 AM »
Would’ve been loads easier to make the doors your way though!
I hadn't noticed from the photos that the sheds are not square but have a slope over the long side (if I understood it correctly). I'm impressed that you pulled that off, it's way easier to create the slope for the roof with a triangular section above rectangular gates/doors.

Nice work!

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #29 on: July 27, 2018, 11:38 AM »
Hey Gregor,

Thank you! 😀 yes it’s a bit of a shallow slope so hope the coroline is ok. I think I’m going to screw the marine ply in from the inside so it’s easy to take off if needed.

Just took a photo - nearly finish cladding around the first shed doors. Going left to right and had to take the door off (taking great care not to disturb the carefully cut hinge packers lol) to fit the last bit of cladding around the hinges.

One more piece and I’ll move on to shed 2! 😀😀

Then it’s just locks, (she says flippantly, like the hinges were “just” the hinges, lol!) and roof and staining!

I’ve measured and I think there’s an outside chance the pieces of one shed will fit in the Volvo estate so really hoping that’ll work! 😀😀

Hope this shows the slope - it’s about 6cm lower on the low end - tried to get left side of camera image vertical 🙂 and the handles are level - I checked with a spirit level ! Just the doors open a bit. Clamped the doors hugely while putting cladding on so haven’t further reinforced them - hoping bolts inside the top and bottom of left door and outside top and bottom of the right door (putting on last!) will help 🙂

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« Last Edit: July 27, 2018, 08:05 PM by ilovesunshine »

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #30 on: July 27, 2018, 11:39 AM »
Proud of this! My new 45 degree cutting skills, and it fits quite neatly around the hinge 🙂 had to fiddle with the first ones to minimise the gap 🙂

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Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 649
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #31 on: July 27, 2018, 11:53 AM »
Dog groomers evidently use dremels to grind dog's nails.  They say it works well and they're cheaper and better than ones made specifically for dogs.

I don't believe anyone really makes "real" cordless routers (yet) aside from small trim routers since they do require so much power.

Hahaha!!! Whether you’re joking or not, either way it’s funny!!

Yes everything in the box of attachments that came with it is so teeny!!

LOL I was being serious.  2 different pet stores suggested that we go to a hardware store to buy a Dremel instead of a dog nail grinder.  I thought it was "safer" to get one with a guard and ended up buying the Oster Gentle Paws, which is broken after half of 1 use.  I guess I need to buy a cordless Dremel now  [big grin] or maybe we'll just keep taking our dog to the store to have the pros do it.
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Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #32 on: July 27, 2018, 07:26 PM »
Dog groomers evidently use dremels to grind dog's nails.  They say it works well and they're cheaper and better than ones made specifically for dogs.

I don't believe anyone really makes "real" cordless routers (yet) aside from small trim routers since they do require so much power.

Hahaha!!! Whether you’re joking or not, either way it’s funny!!

Yes everything in the box of attachments that came with it is so teeny!!

LOL I was being serious.  2 different pet stores suggested that we go to a hardware store to buy a Dremel instead of a dog nail grinder.  I thought it was "safer" to get one with a guard and ended up buying the Oster Gentle Paws, which is broken after half of 1 use.  I guess I need to buy a cordless Dremel now  [big grin] or maybe we'll just keep taking our dog to the store to have the pros do it.

Haha wow - never realised !! What sort of dog or dogs do you have? 🙂

We got a clipper for removing our Maine coon cats fur balls - they aren’t thrilled about the noise it makes but will allow a short bit so you have to be very strategic about it!! Lol maybe the dremel has a clipper attachment!!

Wasn’t impressed that the router bit I bought was too wide to fit in the hole it needed to and on calling them they said “oh. you need a special collet” well ffs why not just make the router bit with a thinner shank to fit in the tool to begin with?!! Luckily I’d bought another thing which did fit and worked and Dad had some mini router bits too which was excellent!

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #33 on: July 27, 2018, 07:37 PM »
Today’s progress😀

Finished all door cladding except the last bit on the right side of the far door - the one I’ll have to take the door off to fit. It was getting late and the bit of cladding I’d cut had a huge knot in it and was quite warped when I halved its width so I’ll use a new bit tomorrow.



So tomorrow I’m planning to:

Get up super early and go buy some sadolin classic wood stain as recommended by Peter Parfitt (thanks Peter if you’re still reading this thread)

Will have to take my chances with the colour as sadolins samples still haven’t come and I ordered them Monday 🙁

After a dark green ideally or mellow lighter green. Nothing too bright.

If any of you have used any of these and have photos that’d be great! Please Share! Total long shot but you never know!

Then come home, do last bit of cladding, start the locks!

I did them before for my Big Box (the 3.2 long x 1.1m tall x 85cm deep thing) and they’re still ok so I’ll take it slowly and carefully! 🙂

Hopefully I’ll have time still to cut the roof ply and attach and do one coat of stain at some point.

I also need to cut the corner pieces and put on the front 2 Bolts on each door and the far cupboards handles.

I also thought using my new router and new router basic skills (?!) I could repurpose 2 bits of cladding to make a double rounded edge thing to attach to the right hand door of each cupboard to cover the join between the 2 doors. There’s probably a name for it - weatherproofing strip?

🙂 will update tmrw 🙂


Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #34 on: July 27, 2018, 07:51 PM »
Here’s photos of my big box 🙂

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Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #35 on: July 27, 2018, 07:53 PM »
This all went in my Volvo in pieces. 😉 just 😅

Took a few tries!!

Ready to go...


Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #36 on: July 27, 2018, 07:58 PM »
Where it still lives now 😀 locks are still good nearly 2 years later. It’s pretty covered and dry in its new home though 🙂 its been and still is, MOST Useful 🙂 learnt loads doing it. 🙂



Offline neilc

  • Posts: 2514
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #37 on: July 27, 2018, 08:33 PM »
Those look nice.  And the earlier low units have stayed looking nice as well.

I have visions of these on top of your car going down the road to the new home.  Good luck with that next step!

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 649
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #38 on: July 28, 2018, 05:44 PM »
Haha wow - never realised !! What sort of dog or dogs do you have? 🙂

We got a clipper for removing our Maine coon cats fur balls - they aren’t thrilled about the noise it makes but will allow a short bit so you have to be very strategic about it!! Lol maybe the dremel has a clipper attachment!!

Wasn’t impressed that the router bit I bought was too wide to fit in the hole it needed to and on calling them they said “oh. you need a special collet” well ffs why not just make the router bit with a thinner shank to fit in the tool to begin with?!! Luckily I’d bought another thing which did fit and worked and Dad had some mini router bits too which was excellent!

We have a 7 1/2 month old Mini Labradoodle named Parker.  I actually made a post back in January asking about getting a dog.  There's a picture of Parker the day we brought him home in this specific post.

We tried to get him exposed to the sound and vibration of clippers and grinders at a young age so he doesn't seem to mind too much when a professional does it.  He doesn't like to sit still at home when we try.  One of the groomers said it's common for dogs to behave like that when they're at home in their own territory.  We also tried using just regular dog nail clippers, but it was hard because we were scared of cutting too deeply and the nails we did manage to cut were rather sharp, hence grinding seems better!

I've been planning on making a new post to update everyone on how much Parker has grown.
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Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #39 on: July 28, 2018, 08:05 PM »
Funny you should mention that. Bought a roof rack today. Just in case 😉

The black box all fitted inside the car - nothing on the roof at all 😀 in pieces obviously!

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #40 on: July 28, 2018, 08:14 PM »
This is the first coat of the green stain.

Adjusted the doors just cutting the cladding so there’s a wider gap in the middle as the wood cladding is very dry now and don’t want the doors to swell when it rains and not close!

Managed to persuade Dad to get his bigger pretty old router out to repurpose some cladding into the weatherproof pieces to go over the doors in the middle attached to the right hand door.

Cut the corner pieces.

Have located 2 locks on the right hand door which was hard enough - using a combo of the dinky dremel router, a 16mm wide long wood drill bit to get rid of a lot of the wood, the multicutter with a long rectangular wood blade and a chisel and hammer.

It’s not perfect but it’s flush with the door frame. Although as these are only the 3rd and 4th lochs I’ve ever fitted in my whole life, I just remembered now I’m about to sleep there’s a nice silver rectangular plate that goes over the bit I’m all proud I got fairly flush. Lol so might have to cut this deeper tomorrow!

And the small, minor, easy matter of ensuring the lock bolt actually fits into the stay... wish me luck! Have a great weekend everyone 🙂😀


Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #41 on: July 28, 2018, 08:55 PM »
Annoyingly, I got up v early today to go to get the wood stain tinted - took pot luck with the colour - thought go lighter so I still have the option to make it darker - soon as I got back the sadolin samples arrived! Typical! Seems to dry a different colour than it seems.

@GoingMyWay Parker is gorgeous!!! Beautiful dog! Thanks for sharing 🙂

Online Cheese

  • Posts: 5064
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #42 on: July 28, 2018, 09:57 PM »
This all went in my Volvo in pieces. 😉 just 😅
Took a few tries.

I read this and thought that’s impossible until I ran across this photo. Now I know how you did it.

Great job by the way. Love the additional triangulation you add to the project. Nice touch.
   
« Last Edit: July 28, 2018, 10:26 PM by Cheese »

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 649
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #43 on: July 28, 2018, 10:13 PM »
@GoingMyWay Parker is gorgeous!!! Beautiful dog! Thanks for sharing 🙂

Thanks!  He's very photogenic and looks super cute in pictures, but don't be fooled - he's a monster!!  Boundless energy, still likes to bite me, and he loves to destroy his stuffed toys.  We still love him though. 
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Offline Alanbach

  • Posts: 168
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #44 on: July 28, 2018, 11:17 PM »
@ilovesunshine - were you able to find a solution for racking in the door frames? Did the careful application of the cladding take care of it? If not you might think about mounting heavy screw eyes on opposing corners inside the doors and then rigging a cable and turnbuckle between them. Based on the way you constructed the door frames you would have to cut some groves in the cross pieces but this would provide a method that could be easily adjusted over time as required. If you go down this road simply measure the diagonals on the inside of the door and mount the cable on the longer diagonal.

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #45 on: July 29, 2018, 04:55 AM »
Those doors should have had some cross bracing going downwards towards the hinges.



Peter

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 1019
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #46 on: July 29, 2018, 05:51 AM »
Those doors should have had some cross bracing going downwards towards the hinges.
Should be possible to retroactively add them.

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #47 on: July 29, 2018, 06:24 AM »
This all went in my Volvo in pieces. 😉 just 😅
Took a few tries.

I read this and thought that’s impossible until I ran across this photo. Now I know how you did it.

Great job by the way. Love the additional triangulation you add to the project. Nice touch.
    (Attachment Link)


HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Indeed! Could really use something like that!! Althhough I don't think it would get down the Cornish lanes to collect the sheds!! Haha!!!!

Thanks about the triangulation - I only did it because I wanted as wide an opening as possible - in hindsight I think the metal corner flat pieces might've been better, but it's all good learning - plus thanks to the Festool guide rail the top 2 aren't 45's - they are more like a 43 and a 47 (approx - I'm not that good yet!)


Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #48 on: July 29, 2018, 06:26 AM »
@GoingMyWay Parker is gorgeous!!! Beautiful dog! Thanks for sharing 🙂

Thanks!  He's very photogenic and looks super cute in pictures, but don't be fooled - he's a monster!!  Boundless energy, still likes to bite me, and he loves to destroy his stuffed toys.  We still love him though.

I was totally fooled - he looks super sweet and calm and mellow LOL - that's great you encourage him ;-) We are hoping to get a dog when we move house in a couple of months. Hadn't even heard about miniature labradoodles!! What do they weigh when fully grown? As normal labradoodles are quite big arent' they! Anyway I digress!

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #49 on: July 29, 2018, 06:36 AM »
@ilovesunshine - were you able to find a solution for racking in the door frames? Did the careful application of the cladding take care of it? If not you might think about mounting heavy screw eyes on opposing corners inside the doors and then rigging a cable and turnbuckle between them. Based on the way you constructed the door frames you would have to cut some groves in the cross pieces but this would provide a method that could be easily adjusted over time as required. If you go down this road simply measure the diagonals on the inside of the door and mount the cable on the longer diagonal.

Hi @Alanbach thank you for your comments - no nobody replied to me about the doors so all I did was to clamp the doors flush with the bottom and top of the frames as I was screwing on the cladding and I made sure to have one extra horizontal piece of framing on each door frame than I'd put on the back and side panels so more places to screw it - I didn't add the diagonal wood pieces like I did for the small doors of my black short long box - as those still warped a little bit and are pretty dry where they are - so i thought it would just add weight to the doors and not solve the problem!!

I thought about some sort of metal construction strap but the didn't think that would work - Peter's shed below is excellent and I had bought those type of hinges before and fully intended to use them (will reply to that properly in a minute)

What I Do have that you can't see yet - as I haven't added photos of it here yet - the left hand door of each box has a vertical bolt inside top and bottom, and it goes into not just a hole in the wood but I cut a small length of copper plumbing pipe (Dad's idea when I asked him for help and suggestions to stop the hole in the wood getting burred easily!)  and drilled a big hole in the wood and glued that copper pipe in with epoxy glue to protect the wood from if the bolts are undone and done up a few times a day.

Then on the right hand door I was planning to add horizontal bolts on the top and bottom of the outside. Plus there will be the lock in the middle as well (all being well later today!)

I couldn't think of a better option working with what I have made. Hindsight is a wonderful thing LOL

You idea of the cables inside is EXCELLENT. DO you mean with a metal cable? Ill have to look up what a turnbuckle is sorry I am quite a novice at all this. Is it sort of like a rachet strap but with metal cable?? That sounds light and excellent - I will ask about this. And did you mean to put it on EVERY diagonal (or just say the main 2 per door? As I have 4 possible mini diagonals on each door as I added the extra framing so I'd have more places to screw the cladding.

From experience with the other shed the cladding will warp to the wood rather than stop the other wood warping - it's only 15mm thick but I really like the way it looks :-) Thank you so much for your great suggestion :-)
« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 06:57 AM by ilovesunshine »

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #50 on: July 29, 2018, 06:48 AM »
Those doors should have had some cross bracing going downwards towards the hinges.

(Attachment Link)

Peter

Hi Peter,

Thank you so much for your input. Those doors are doors of EXCELLENCE - they look lovely :) Is that one of your sheds?

Yes there are many things I've learnt from this:

1) those long gate type hinges you have to put on the outside - ie on top of the cladding - I did buy some ages ago when I made the frames (In April) but hadn't thought how to do to the doors then.

Yes next time I make a shed I will look at making it differently as those doors look loads better.

2) Does the cross bracing work super well? AS My 2x2 stuff warped just like everything else. I had put a post about what to use as was thinking of something like 8 x 1 or some sort of thing - I had thought about using more cladding to cross brace it like in your photo but thought it would just warp like the rest of it so need something thicker.

To be honest when I made my big box (the black wide short one) I had no idea about construction so we went to a local timber yard and peeked at how they had done their  framing - plus I had to make it so I could flatpack it and easily and fast reassemble it which was a factor.

I had watched your onduline roofing video for your shed and your shed doors even though you weren't talking about them, didn't go unnoticed. I think I will need to practice making some doors like you pictured.

I had in my head I had to make the frames, hang them and then clad them. But I guess if you make the whole doors first in the way in your photo, they are probably lighter than mine, and then you hang them later.

Still, I am hoping the bolts will hold it for now. Learnt so much - both about how to do things better and what not to do LOL :-)

So, today I have to :

1. Cut the marine ply roof x 2

2. Cut out the stay part of the locks x 2 and figure out whether I need to cut out more from what I cut out yesterday so the plate that goes over the lock bit is flush. AND make sure the hole for the key is in a very accurate place.

If any of you have any master tips to help me not mess this up - that would be great! Presently the lock is nestled in the 2 x 2 frame - so the key hole looking from the inside of the door - is half on half off the edge of the 2 x 2!! There are nice eschutcheons supplied with the lock :-) Could I drill through the top round bit of the lock / keyhole with a suitable sized drill bit so it comes out the front in the right place? That was my idea but as luck would have it the hole is right on the edge of my 2 x 2 - was planning to add extra wood there inside to protect the rest of the lock but just want something functional for now - can add that in London if I don't have time here.

3. Make a planed pine small double bed frame (totally irrelevant to this thread!) - but rather than just screw it all together if I have time I will attempt to router and wood glue some small non structural joints like extra struts in the head board just to stop the pillows falling out!

4. It took me around 2.5 hours to paint all this last night. Still not sure about the colour - it seems to go on quite turqouisey but then mellows a bit - will see how it looks today. Was after a dark green ideally but at least it shows the grain of the wood.

Hope it's dry - paint shop guys said 16hours between coats - ideally would like to have 3 coats but only have enough wood stain for 2 - although maybe I won't use so much today if the wood absorbed more yesterday as it was the first coat. So I have one more coat of stain to do but will do after I've done all my cutting! Plus need to give it time to dry as didn't finish until gone midnight last night!!

So I'll see how long everything else takes me and go from there :-)

Have a lovely day and will check in from time to time to see if anyone has any Lock Helpful Advice :-)  Thank you so much for your comments and help :-)
« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 07:02 AM by ilovesunshine »

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #51 on: July 29, 2018, 06:53 AM »
Those doors should have had some cross bracing going downwards towards the hinges.
Should be possible to retroactively add them.

YES!! Will consider - what size of wood would you recommend?? :-)

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #52 on: July 29, 2018, 08:14 AM »
FYI one shed has to fit here
Built bottom bits to fit around join of drainpipes - welcome suggestions for ply and coroline roof - there’s a balcony 2 floors above so should be fairly dry but still want to avoid water getting in it if Poss!

« Last Edit: July 29, 2018, 10:24 AM by ilovesunshine »

Offline ilovesunshine

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #53 on: July 29, 2018, 08:15 AM »


Shed cut to fit - needed to keep length as there’s railway sleeper garden raised beds the other end so a fixed space!

Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #54 on: July 29, 2018, 09:17 AM »
I was totally fooled - he looks super sweet and calm and mellow LOL - that's great you encourage him ;-) We are hoping to get a dog when we move house in a couple of months. Hadn't even heard about miniature labradoodles!! What do they weigh when fully grown? As normal labradoodles are quite big arent' they! Anyway I digress!

Sorry for getting your post way off track.

Whenever someone meets Parker in person they usually comment about how much energy he has.

The breeder we got him from estimated that he wouldn't weigh anymore than 30-35lbs.  The breeder was basing that estimate off the fact that his mother only weighed 35lbs and his father was a mini red poodle, which I believe is quite small - like 15-20lbs.  I guess the offspring *usually* won't be bigger than the parents.

We haven't weighed him lately, but we think he's close to 30lbs right now.  My wife's cousin also has a "mini" labradoodle, but something happened because he weighs like 50 lbs and is quite large.  I think I'd have preferred if Parker was a little bit bigger, but I suppose it's better to have a slightly smaller dog than a larger dog.

We've been taking him for swimming lessons the last 5 weeks.  We thought the exercise would be good to try to tire him out, unfortunately he seems to have only gotten stronger.  The first 2 lessons he needed a life jacket.  Now he can swim unassisted and tread water for a fair amount of time.

Here's a picture from last week of Parker.


Sometimes I feel like he's got some cat mixed in with him.
Inquiring Minds Want to Know

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Offline ilovesunshine

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #55 on: July 29, 2018, 10:29 AM »
I was totally fooled - he looks super sweet and calm and mellow LOL - that's great you encourage him ;-) We are hoping to get a dog when we move house in a couple of months. Hadn't even heard about miniature labradoodles!! What do they weigh when fully grown? As normal labradoodles are quite big arent' they! Anyway I digress!

Sorry for getting your post way off track.

Whenever someone meets Parker in person they usually comment about how much energy he has.

The breeder we got him from estimated that he wouldn't weigh anymore than 30-35lbs.  The breeder was basing that estimate off the fact that his mother only weighed 35lbs and his father was a mini red poodle, which I believe is quite small - like 15-20lbs.  I guess the offspring *usually* won't be bigger than the parents.

We haven't weighed him lately, but we think he's close to 30lbs right now.  My wife's cousin also has a "mini" labradoodle, but something happened because he weighs like 50 lbs and is quite large.  I think I'd have preferred if Parker was a little bit bigger, but I suppose it's better to have a slightly smaller dog than a larger dog.

We've been taking him for swimming lessons the last 5 weeks.  We thought the exercise would be good to try to tire him out, unfortunately he seems to have only gotten stronger.  The first 2 lessons he needed a life jacket.  Now he can swim unassisted and tread water for a fair amount of time.

Here's a picture from last week of Parker.
(Attachment Link)

Sometimes I feel like he's got some cat mixed in with him.

lol that’s great! Wow he’s grown since the othe photos! He’s lovely!! Stopped for lunch! We had a jack Russell terrier growing up called Pip, she was amazing! She used to play with our cat for hours! So funny! Cat always had the upper hand lol! I love how loyal and inquisitive dogs are! My parents neighbours here have a lovely black Labrador called Freddie - he came in to inspect the sheds the other night! Soon as we move and get ourselves sorted will consider a dog! Great he’s swimming! We have Maine coon cats! Your post made me chuckle and think of this:


Offline ilovesunshine

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #56 on: July 29, 2018, 10:31 AM »
In shed news, phew...

Dad helped me avert a near disaster (don’t ask!) so the lock progress inches forwards... 😀😅😅😀

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #57 on: July 29, 2018, 11:07 AM »
This isn’t too bad is it??! For my third lifetime attempt?! It’s not deep enough yet 😢 and not seen if the lock actually fits in it... (minor details..,!)

But it’s not too bad for a girl is it?! 😀😀


Offline ilovesunshine

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #58 on: July 29, 2018, 11:27 AM »
Hurrah!!!! I’m about 60% relieved 40% very pleased!!

One down... One to go!!


Offline GoingMyWay

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #59 on: July 29, 2018, 11:58 AM »
lol that’s great! Wow he’s grown since the othe photos! He’s lovely!! Stopped for lunch! We had a jack Russell terrier growing up called Pip, she was amazing! She used to play with our cat for hours! So funny! Cat always had the upper hand lol! I love how loyal and inquisitive dogs are! My parents neighbours here have a lovely black Labrador called Freddie - he came in to inspect the sheds the other night! Soon as we move and get ourselves sorted will consider a dog! Great he’s swimming! We have Maine coon cats! Your post made me chuckle and think of this:



Wow I always thought cats hate the water, a swimming cat is awesome.  We weren't sure how Parker would even react to the water - we just knew he didn't like taking a bath in the bath tub.

Here's a video from last week of Parker at the pool trying to be patient and wait: .

Inquiring Minds Want to Know

TS55, CT26, RO150, CXS, ETS 150/3, ETS EC 150/5, MFT/3, TS75, DF500, DTS400, OF1400, CT SYS

Offline Alanbach

  • Posts: 168
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #60 on: July 29, 2018, 12:00 PM »
Here is a link to a simple of drawing I found on Pinterest of the cable turnbuckle concept.  https://pin.it/jpn323neutrbl4


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Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #61 on: July 29, 2018, 12:37 PM »
Hi @ilovesunshine

First of all you need to be proud of your efforts because you have not only had a go at something quite new to you but you have set out to learn from the experience. On top of that you have had the courage to have your work scrutinised by your fellow FOGgers.

My 'shed' in my recent picture is nearly 5 m tall. The opening is about 3 m wide and I had to go for a bi-fold approach as the doors had to open outwards and the ground there was sloping upwards. You will see the 3 strap hinges on each side and then the inner doors are each on 6 ball bearing 4" butt hinges.

282782-0

Yes, the cross bracing works well and is a must for shed doors and gates. If the field of a door is made of (say) MDF or plywood then no cross bracing will be needed.

Peter

Offline Alanbach

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #62 on: July 29, 2018, 12:47 PM »
Just in case you cannot open that link I found another one just so you can see examples of cable turnbuckles.   https://www.s3i.co.uk/turnbuckles.php

The turnbuckle and cables would be considerably more expensive in stainless steel but given the very wet nature of the climate in England if you went this route you would probably be well advised to go with Stainless.

Offline RustE

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #63 on: July 29, 2018, 01:08 PM »
Look into an automotive type noise-deadening or undercoating products.  Typically comes as an adhesive mat or in a spray can.

Thanks RustE - sorry if this is a silly question - feel silly asking this as you guys are all super carpenters and builders on here - do you mean use only that or in a combination of it with something else? Would you mind sending some links of what you recommend in entirety (ie if its an underneath thing what to put over it?)
 ...

Sorry, the past weeks turned a bit hectic.

The products that I mentioned would be applied to the under-side of the metal roofing material.

Here is an example of a spray-on product:
http://designengineering.com/boom-mat-spray-on/

Here is an example of a mat from a regional source:
https://www.deadening.co.uk/products/dodo-barrier-mlv-2-5m-roll

Note:  I have no affiliation with the manufacturers or the retailers.

Offline Alanbach

  • Posts: 168
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #64 on: July 29, 2018, 01:42 PM »


Hi @Alanbach

You idea of the cables inside is EXCELLENT. DO you mean with a metal cable? Ill have to look up what a turnbuckle is sorry I am quite a novice at all this. Is it sort of like a rachet strap but with metal cable?? That sounds light and excellent - I will ask about this. And did you mean to put it on EVERY diagonal (or just say the main 2 per door? As I have 4 possible mini diagonals on each door as I added the extra framing so I'd have more places to screw the cladding.

Yes, so ultimately it would be two pieces of cable attached diagonally from the top corner on the non hinge side to the bottom corner on the hinge side. The two pieces of cable are then joined to each other in the middle with a turnbuckle. The turnbuckle can then be tightened as the door sags.

You probably already know this but the best way to check a door frame like this for square is to measure opposing diagonals. If they are the same the door is square if they are not square then using a method like this to shorten the long diagonal with square up the door.

I chose to start with the cable high on the non hinge side because this is where gravity is most likely to pull the door down. This choice assumes that the door starts out square. Be sure to measure the diagonals to determine which dimension needs to be shortened. You can cross cross two cables if needed but it just raises the cost of the hardware.

You don’t need cables on each of your diagonals within each door. Only over the entire span of each door.

If your doors are square (or even if they are not) and they open and close properly then you probably don’t need this for now. If they start to sag and hang up in the future then this is a fairly easy fix and then allows for ongoing adjustment as needed. Door starts to sag, you measure, diagonals out of equal you tighten the cable, measure again, wallah!

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #65 on: July 29, 2018, 04:53 PM »
Hey thanks for the replies everyone! This is my last night in Cornwall and my optimistic not just screws bed frame design needs more thought and time and now doesn’t have either of those so need to crack on finish the basic tried and tested positive design 😉 and wood stain the sheds one last time all before crashing out so it’s dry in time by around 6pm tomorrow (it’s 21.50 now!) to take apart and see what will fit in the trusty Volvo for the long trek back to london...!

Hi @ilovesunshine

My 'shed' in my recent picture is nearly 5 m tall. The opening is about 3 m wide and I had to go for a bi-fold approach as the doors had to open outwards and the ground there was sloping upwards. You will see the 3 strap hinges on each side and then the inner doors are each on 6 ball bearing 4" butt hinges.

Peter

Thanks for the nice words - holy s**t it’s that big??!! I’ll reply properly later - was hard to get a scale... that’s MASSIVE!!! And awesome!! 😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀

Even more impressed!! You could have 2 storeys in there!!!

Will update when I have time. Still totally chuffed my locks work - lol😀😀

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #66 on: July 29, 2018, 04:54 PM »
lol and the weird turquoisey green is somehow growing on me!!

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #67 on: July 30, 2018, 06:05 AM »
Hi @ilovesunshine

First of all you need to be proud of your efforts because you have not only had a go at something quite new to you but you have set out to learn from the experience. On top of that you have had the courage to have your work scrutinised by your fellow FOGgers.

My 'shed' in my recent picture is nearly 5 m tall. The opening is about 3 m wide and I had to go for a bi-fold approach as the doors had to open outwards and the ground there was sloping upwards. You will see the 3 strap hinges on each side and then the inner doors are each on 6 ball bearing 4" butt hinges.

(Attachment Link)

Yes, the cross bracing works well and is a must for shed doors and gates. If the field of a door is made of (say) MDF or plywood then no cross bracing will be needed.

Peter

Hi Peter,

How do you lock your shed?

And on the one with the open doors - is it the same shed? It looks like they are a different colour but I'm in a bit of a hurry - on the one with the open doors it looked like you have these metal things running all the way to the top and bottom of each door - but some sort of a latch - curious how you secure it and what you used?

The green closed doors look brilliant - would love to learn how you made those.:-)

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #68 on: July 30, 2018, 06:14 AM »
Here is a link to a simple of drawing I found on Pinterest of the cable turnbuckle concept.  https://pin.it/jpn323neutrbl4

Hi Alan,

Thanks - that's interesting - don't you need one going each way? What's to stop the wood warping in the opposite direction after you put it under tension?? Or do you just keep a close eye on it? And how would you get one going each way?? Im still wondering is there a neat way to tension the wire as if it's wire that's not the easiest to pull taught in your hands - there must be some mechanical advantage thing with it - I'll check the other posts :-) Thank you so much for your input - great to learn new things :-)

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #69 on: July 30, 2018, 06:22 AM »
Just in case you cannot open that link I found another one just so you can see examples of cable turnbuckles.   https://www.s3i.co.uk/turnbuckles.php

The turnbuckle and cables would be considerably more expensive in stainless steel but given the very wet nature of the climate in England if you went this route you would probably be well advised to go with Stainless.

Hi @Alanbach thanks for this - that's informative - I notice they didn't show how you squish the awkward unwieldy metal cable into the thing i the first place - haha - those product videos always make it look so effortless and easy - haha!!

I think I will stick with what I have for now - next shed - and oh yes, there will be more :-) I will make Peter's type of doors if I can figure out how to make them :-) and Gregors easy sloping back roof - and maybe try the aluminium roof with the automotive stuff under it - need to check those links again when I get back to London which all being well - with or without the full shed in the car - will be a lot later tonight!

LOL - I will take a photo of what fits in - I MUST take the roll of vinyl flooring that is in there - and I MUST take the single bed frame - LOL - so that doesn't leave as much room as I'd like for shed - but either way I'll fit as much as I can - roof rack still TBC as it's a long way to go with that sort of stuff on top!!

and I dont' have a spare articulated lorry to take it all, haha...

Just today I am cutting the marine ply for the roof (finally - it was too nice and flat asn assembly / work table platform when I was used to the sterling board all this time haha) and figuring out how to get the coroline on :-)

And then taking it all apart and seeing what will fit :-)

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #70 on: July 30, 2018, 06:40 AM »

Hi Peter,

How do you lock your shed?

And on the one with the open doors - is it the same shed? It looks like they are a different colour but I'm in a bit of a hurry - on the one with the open doors it looked like you have these metal things running all the way to the top and bottom of each door - but some sort of a latch - curious how you secure it and what you used?

The green closed doors look brilliant - would love to learn how you made those.:-)

Hi Clare

Those large doors are secured from the inside with bolts at the top and the bottom. As the doors are about 3.5 m high I made up some long bolts from 12 mm (I think) reinforcing steel that runs in oak blocks inside of which I put some 1/2" copper pipe as a bearing. I welded on some handles which may show in the picture. So a total of 8 bolts keep those big doors secure.

When the doors are open I use a combination of another pair of home made bolts which go into 1" diameter copper tubing set in the ground and a pair of stays attached about chest height on either side.

The side door is like any normal door and has both a Yale latch and a mortice lock. The space inside was originally designed for a caravan but provides a useful large space when I build other sheds. I have lighting and power in there.

I never keep anything valuable in a normal shed but I still use a mortice lock.

Peter

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #71 on: August 02, 2018, 08:14 AM »
Hello All

Hope you’re well! So I got the whole of one shed minus the largest half of the back panel in the Volvo estate 😀😀 plus the 3 m long roll of vinyl flooring, plus the double bed frame - managed to mitre one corner but the bolts idea didn’t quite work haha - when I’ve come up with a better design I’ll post it here 😀

So shed 1 is ready to go - turned out my biggest underestimation was how to do the roof - no clue - so that’s one for my partner - I’ve brought the pieces back and I think we have a plan - namely just how edge the long slope nicely and so it’s watertight and so the doors still open!

I’ll post the finished sheds when they are up! The floor is quite a tight fit around the drainpipe but I think it’ll be ok 🙂

So I just had a couple of unrelated but wood themed questions if any of you could be so kind to share your excellent knowledge 🙂 didn’t think it was worth making a whole new thread just about this! Thanks in advance if you can and I’ll post the final shed pics in a week or so 🙂

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #72 on: August 02, 2018, 08:20 AM »


So question 1 @Peter Parfitt @Gregor @GoingMyWay  and anyone else 😀

What do you suggest putting on this decking? It’s been down around 18 months with no treatment at all thanks to my partner not bothering - I was thinking to clear it (obviously!) pressure wash it, let it dry, and then use the Osmo UV Oil that Peter Parfitt recommended for some tables I made - will share in next post - 2 coats - is this ok? We have some wood treatment stuff https://www.screwfix.com/p/sika-wood-preserver-clear-5ltr/47030

What would you recommend? Thank you so much 🙂🙂

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #73 on: August 02, 2018, 08:28 AM »


And Question 2 to anyone everyone else 🙂

I came by a LOAD of tannelised mostly 2 x 4, already cut to various lengths- plus lots of 1 x 4 type kind of cladding but not really - so this was my first table design!

Was kind of going for something like this http://www.ana-white.com/2010/04/plans-simple-outdoor-dining-table.html

The one by eWood I really liked - but obviously mine is chunkier! And heavier 😉

Anyway might you guys have any better design ideas for the legs - Ana always uses a pocket hole jig to hide the screws on internal corners - are they good? Would they be strong enough for something this chunky??

I really like not having anything lower down as it gets in the way but obviously then it’s harder to make the legs stable - would love some suggestions for future tables!

I’ll make a new thread with photos if all the wood ive got and see what I can make from it! 😀

Thanks and have a great week! Clare 🙂🙂

Offline Peter Parfitt

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #74 on: August 02, 2018, 12:46 PM »
Hi Clare

I assume that Osmo will have a decking oil in their lineup. If not you could try other makers.

Do not worry about tables being "chunky" as it stops them blowing around the garden in a gale.

Peter

Offline ilovesunshine

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Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #75 on: August 21, 2018, 05:35 PM »
Hey so the sheds are up in their final spot minus the roofs that my partner needs to help me with probably next week. They have a temporary roof on until then! Relieved they fitted ok in their spot!! Was a little tight in places but they did fit, phew!!

284056-0

Offline ilovesunshine

  • Posts: 78
Re: Garden Sheds - In Progress :)
« Reply #76 on: August 21, 2018, 05:41 PM »
Like a glove... haha!! Didn’t notice the extra wide connecting the rainwater drain pipe to the wall bit and that it was wider than the drainpipe joining bit!! Luckily I’d allowed a small margin for such things!!