Festool Owners Group

GENERAL DISCUSSIONS => Member Projects => Topic started by: Steve Rowe on July 08, 2016, 06:47 PM

Title: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Steve Rowe on July 08, 2016, 06:47 PM
... to attach a breadboard end to a table top.  (Gotcha  [big grin])

I used the Domino 500 and Lamello Zeta P2 to attach breadboard ends to a table top.  I used 8x50mm Dominos combined with the Lamello Tenso connectors to attach the breadboard.  All 5 Dominos are glued into the top core and the center 3 are also glued into the breadboard end.  The Dominos closest to the core ends are allowed to float in the medium domino slot milled in the breadboard.  The Tenso fastener allows lateral movement but most importantly, provides a constant clamping force to keep the breadboard end snuggly attached to the top core with 35 lbs of clamping pressure at the outer areas.  No clamps were used or harmed during this process.

[attachimg=1]

[attachimg=2]

[attachimg=3]

[attachimg=4]
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Krkww on July 08, 2016, 07:18 PM
Very creative! I'm not familiar with the Tenso fastener so this is good to see. I especially like the three dominoes glued both sides in the center. How does the Tenso fastener provide clamping force and how will you finish the end (edge) of the breadboard end?

Thanks for sharing,
Kevin
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Steve Rowe on July 09, 2016, 08:33 AM
Very creative! I'm not familiar with the Tenso fastener so this is good to see. I especially like the three dominoes glued both sides in the center. How does the Tenso fastener provide clamping force and how will you finish the end (edge) of the breadboard end?

Thanks for sharing,
Kevin

The clamping force is provided by the flexible fingers on the male side of the connector.  The female side is inserted in the core and the two pieces just snap together.  The mortises on the outside of the edge will be plugged with Gaboon Ebony consistent with the Greene & Greene style.
Steve
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Krkww on July 09, 2016, 08:57 AM
I thought that is how you would finish the end detail. I'd love to see it when you complete it.

[attachimg=1]

I went to the Lamello web site to take a closer look. It apprears there are two outboard tabs on the male side that align with recesses on the female side. If I'm seeing this correctly, it apprears this would prevent expansion and contraction without binding. How does this joint allow your top to float?

Thanks,
Kevin
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Kev on July 09, 2016, 08:59 AM
Talk about topic bait  [eek] [eek] [eek] [eek]
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Cheese on July 09, 2016, 09:33 AM
I like this, a real clever solution.  A lot cleaner than the traditional hardware, clamp, screws, slot & whatever on the underside of the table.  [thumbs up]

If I'm seeing this correctly, it appears the tabs would prevent expansion and contraction without binding. How does this joint allow your top to float?

If the male tabs do restrict movement, I'd just bandsaw them off and clean up with a file.
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Knight Woodworks on July 09, 2016, 09:52 AM
Steve, that's clever. Thanks for sharing. Would love to see some pics of the finished product.

John
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Steve Rowe on July 09, 2016, 11:37 AM
I thought that is how you would finish the end detail. I'd love to see it when you complete it.

(Attachment Link)

I went to the Lamello web site to take a closer look. It apprears there are two outboard tabs on the male side that align with recesses on the female side. If I'm seeing this correctly, it apprears this would prevent expansion and contraction without binding. How does this joint allow your top to float?

Thanks,
Kevin

Ahh!  The tabs prevent twisting but do allow for axial play.  The plastic Tenso is also flexible along the axis of movement and can move slightly even if the tab is hard against the stop.  The amount of play present determined the positioning of the Tenso fastener which centered 90mm from the closest fixed position in the top.  For quartersawn Kahya, I expect the movement at this location to be less than 0.5mm which is within the movement permitted by the tabs.  Had I positioned the Tenso at the outer extreme, I would have trimmed off the tabs.
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Steve Rowe on July 09, 2016, 11:37 AM
Steve, that's clever. Thanks for sharing. Would love to see some pics of the finished product.

John

Will do.
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Krkww on July 09, 2016, 01:00 PM

Sweet, I've learned some new things today! I thought the Lamello was simply a well made biscuit jointer. I see there is much more to it. Thanks for sharing your unique application Steve!

Kevin
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: GhostFist on July 09, 2016, 01:54 PM
Tension are for use with the lamello zeta p2, and I love them to death. Click your piece together without clamps. Fantastic machine great product with the tension. Alternatively, you could have opted for a few bisco p2 biscuits and skipped the domino's just to maintain consistent machine set up and reduce the number of machines used
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Dundee99 on October 08, 2016, 03:45 AM
I have used both machines, and i have to say, dominoes do provide a much stronger join than the plastic biscuits that are used with zeta p2. Dont get me wrong, i love the clamex joiners, and the tenso, but i have snapped the clamex cam fittings, and i have pried the tenso apart. How was the join after the breadboard was together? Do you think it would be better if the tenso were spread out wider? Educate me people!
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: tom46 on October 18, 2016, 04:26 PM
I have used both machines, and i have to say, dominoes do provide a much stronger join than the plastic biscuits that are used with zeta p2. Dont get me wrong, i love the clamex joiners, and the tenso, but i have snapped the clamex cam fittings, and i have pried the tenso apart. How was the join after the breadboard was together? Do you think it would be better if the tenso were spread out wider? Educate me people!

Hi Dundee99

Very interesting to hear you find dominos a stronger joint than the tenso. Read about these a while back and thought they would be the best melamine jointing method. Have considered investing in the zeta p2 however this may push me to invest in a domino when I next have a melamine cabinet job.

Thanks Tom
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Holmz on October 18, 2016, 05:34 PM
I have used both machines, and i have to say, dominoes do provide a much stronger join than the plastic biscuits that are used with zeta p2. Dont get me wrong, i love the clamex joiners, and the tenso, but i have snapped the clamex cam fittings, and i have pried the tenso apart. How was the join after the breadboard was together? Do you think it would be better if the tenso were spread out wider? Educate me people!

Hi Dundee99

Very interesting to hear you find dominos a stronger joint than the tenso. Read about these a while back and thought they would be the best melamine jointing method. Have considered investing in the zeta p2 however this may push me to invest in a domino when I next have a melamine cabinet job.

Thanks Tom

^That^ makes no sense.
They are probably stronger than the base material (melamine) and are perfect for sheets.
(Like me hoping to make a large table or barn door, so I can get a Zeta)

For a "wood" project, I would be sticking to Dominos or dowels.
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Steve Rowe on October 30, 2016, 02:41 PM
The project is complete (finally) and here are the pictures as promised. 

The finish is Darrel Peart's formula of General Finishes dye 4 parts medium brown with 7 parts orange.  Two coats of the dye were sprayed on followed by a seal coat of dewaxed garnet shellac (1# cut) sprayed on.  The base, drawer, and shelf were then sprayed with three coats of 2# cut of garnet shellac.  The top was finished with 4 coats of General Finishes gel topcoat wiped on. 

[attach=1]

[attach=2] [attach=3] [attach=4] [attach=5] [attach=6]

I have also included several videos made during the process.

Routing/shaping small pieces (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIF6MC0638c)

Pinning a M&T joint (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M9xF7826L0)

Squaring a routed mortise (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gTwOq6dWjvg)

Making a shop built drawer pull (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TbpmNUKgcQ8)

Applying General Finishes gel topcoat (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OheRoiIae5Y)
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: Lemwise on October 30, 2016, 03:22 PM
I love the Lamello Tenso system. It's so incredibly easy to work with. Put some glue on the work piece, snap it together and you're done. No more fooling around with clamps.
Title: Re: Lamello and Festool join forces ...
Post by: JakobProgsch on November 02, 2016, 02:41 AM
Nice to see this. I was wondering about this recently since I currently have a DF500 and as it is with festool I started to eye a DF700 since the connectors came out. But I'm unsure about them being based on the 14mm domino size. Following the rule of using dominos that are about one third of the material thickness they would make sense to join like 4cm materials? This Lamello hybrid method looks a lot more appropriate for furniture.