Author Topic: Sysport build  (Read 3862 times)

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Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Sysport build
« on: July 31, 2018, 11:32 AM »
Long time lurker here. I'm on round 2 of my sysport build. The first one shown below was made out of imported one side prefinished plywood from China that is so badly warped I can't use it for this purpose. I figured I could force it square with some back panels strategically placed but it's several mm out from one spot to the next. .

Round 2 is using Melamine panels from Lowe's that just happen to be the exact width I designed to accommodate Sys-Az drawers (400mm). The material is 19mm thick and the panels from Lowe's measure actual ~2460mm x 399mm. This allows for a back panel using the same material (19mm) with 380mm left which is exactly the spacing required for a Sys-Az drawer. It's like Tanos designed the drawers to work with this material. This is my first real project with all my cool tools before I move on to doing things that will go inside the house. I still have to finish routing holes, then edgebanding again, then domino and dry fit. On to the pictures:





Setting the 13mm depth for the 5mm holes


Edgebanding


Kreg setup


Version 2 starting over






Really digging the LR32





Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Dick Mahany

  • Posts: 396
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #1 on: July 31, 2018, 11:45 AM »
Great pics and cool project.  Looks like you are having too much fun.  I'm looking forward to progress pics.  It looks like you are getting nice sharp cuts on the melamine.  Which blade are you using?

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #2 on: July 31, 2018, 12:15 PM »
Great pics and cool project.  Looks like you are having too much fun.  I'm looking forward to progress pics.  It looks like you are getting nice sharp cuts on the melamine.  Which blade are you using?

Yes I am. I wish I could just knock it out but I have to do a bit at a time with family and work obligations. I bought the 496309 Solid surface blade before starting the project. I found that using this blade and the splinter guard green plastic doohickey gives nice cuts and eliminates the material sprayout. I forgot to put the green doohickey down on a cut and had a huge mess. I was surprised as I've not used it before.

At the advice of others I'm doing the holes on 16mm centers by repeating with the end stops flipped. The side panels are 1024mm long (divisible by 32. .32 times) so I don't have to keep track of which end to put the rail on when boring my holes.

I'm thinking two stretchers per sysport to keep everything square and then attaching a 1/4" back. I've cut enough parts to make two sysports. My first design was one double wide sysport with a center divider. It was too fussy getting the center panel perfect and if you're off a mm it messes with the Sys-Az drawers.



I'm new to woodworking in general and am slowly wrapping my head around all of this 32mm stuff.
« Last Edit: July 31, 2018, 12:19 PM by DynaGlide »

Offline Sparktrician

  • Posts: 3674
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2018, 01:06 PM »
Way to go, Matt!!!   [big grin]
- Willy -

 "Remember, a chip on the shoulder is a sure sign of wood higher up." - Brigham Young

Offline jimbo51

  • Posts: 437
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #4 on: July 31, 2018, 01:35 PM »
I will post a picture of my completed Sysport soon I hope. It is about 6 ft long, 4 ft tall and 2 ft deep. It is designed to fit into a large steel shelving unit. The Systainers will sit sideways, 4 to a row and back to back using offset 14" drawer slides. When I recover from this adventure, I will make another one about 30 inches tall to go into the same steel shelving unit.

I do not mean to brag, but I am reasonably confident that I have made most of the possible mistakes one can make when using plywood and the LR 32 system; a whole column of misaligned holes, through holes not bored to full depth, blind holes bored through, some scars on a surface from a truly mindless mistake, solid wood trim getting chewed up from various causes, etc. I decided to just patch and continue rather than dumping any of the pieces and starting over. I have used a considerable amount of wood putty and spent a fair mount of time with the RO 90 doing repairs. In the end, it will be functional if not exactly aesthetically pleasing.

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2018, 08:59 PM »
Here's how I do a spot check that my parallel stops for the LR32 are even and touching before clamping down:



Panels are done, awaiting dominos:



Took a break to re-square my rail using a tip I picked up here:


Offline papester

  • Posts: 4
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2018, 10:15 PM »
DynaGlide,

Would you happen to have the item numbers of the panels you bought from Lowes?

Offline TSO_Products

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Re: Sysport build
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2018, 10:23 PM »
@DynaGlide -congratulations for jumping in with a picture story of your SYSPORT build and including your “lessons learned” for others to benefit from (i.e. the difficulties involved when trying to build multiple sections as one unit).

Your efforts and the interest of others over time convinced us to bring out fully engineered and tested SysPort plans and other designs in our new line of TSO Plans. As I write this,  the validation build based on our new Plans is in process. It will be used to develop instructions. The idea is to provide some very affordable but solid documentation a customer can duplicate or use as a starting point to modify to suit.

Look for more on this in a TSO INSIDER  by Labor Day.
Matt, meanwhile Keep on posting as you progress in that spiffy shop space of yours [smile]

Hans

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2018, 09:07 AM »
DynaGlide,

Would you happen to have the item numbers of the panels you bought from Lowes?

@papester Here are the ones you want: https://www.lowes.com/pd/Thermally-Fused-Laminate-0-75-in-D-x-97-in-L-x-15-75-in-W-White-Shelf-Board/50386832 They're perfect width for this application. All you have to do is cross cut them square to desired length. One shelf will net you 2 sides, or 4 tops/bottoms, with the sides 1024mmx400mm and tops/bottoms 465mmx400mm.

@DynaGlide -congratulations for jumping in with a picture story of your SYSPORT build and including your “lessons learned” for others to benefit from (i.e. the difficulties involved when trying to build multiple sections as one unit).

Your efforts and the interest of others over time convinced us to bring out fully engineered and tested SysPort plans and other designs in our new line of TSO Plans. As I write this,  the validation build based on our new Plans is in process. It will be used to develop instructions. The idea is to provide some very affordable but solid documentation a customer can duplicate or use as a starting point to modify to suit.

Look for more on this in a TSO INSIDER  by Labor Day.
Matt, meanwhile Keep on posting as you progress in that spiffy shop space of yours [smile]

Hans


@TSO Products Hans, I may be in touch with you to send my guide rail square in for machining to attach to the hinge. I am thinking about picking up a third MFT to have as my "TSO rail" station. I look forward to your new products. .especially the Domino box jig you keep teasing.

Offline TSO_Products

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Re: Sysport build
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2018, 10:51 AM »
Off topic –
@TSO Products Hans, I may be in touch with you to send my guide rail square in for machining to attach to the hinge. I am thinking about picking up a third MFT to have as my "TSO rail" station. I look forward to your new products. .especially the Domino box jig you keep teasing.
Matt

REPLY for All:
updating existing GRS-16 PE Guide Rail Squares to add (2) tapped holes for connecting to MFT/3 hinge bracket:
free download template and instructions for drilling and tapping.

https://tsoproducts.com/plans-drawings/grs-16-pe-template-for-adding-tapped-m6-holes/

Hans


Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2018, 01:55 PM »
You know the darnedest things happen when you leave two MFT's together. . .



This one came with the MFT connectors and a spare fence securing clamp doohickey. I got this one and the Basic table on the left for a song. . combined they were less than a brand new MFT/3.

Offline Dick Mahany

  • Posts: 396
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2018, 02:09 PM »
You know the darnedest things happen when you leave two MFT's together. . .

This one came with the MFT connectors and a spare fence securing clamp doohickey. I got this one and the Basic table on the left for a song. . combined they were less than a brand new MFT/3.

I don't even see a saw kerf on that one !

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2018, 02:39 PM »


Ahh that's better. I'm thinking using the second fence as off cut with tape applied a la Half-Inch Shy, and squeezing in the @TSO Products guide rail square mounted to the MFT hinge on the right table for when I cut materials different heights.

@Dick Mahany There isn't one  [wink]
« Last Edit: August 02, 2018, 02:44 PM by DynaGlide »

Offline pettyconstruction

  • Posts: 451
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #13 on: August 02, 2018, 03:42 PM »
Man I can’t seem to pull the trigger on one ,let alone 3.
Nice setup you have there.
Charlie


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #14 on: August 02, 2018, 04:21 PM »
My inexperience with the Domino is showing through now.









I accidentally referenced off the wrong face on the left side panel top portion so went and re-did it on the proper face. .extra slop to those mortises. My little Sys-AZ spacers seem to fit pretty well, a bit snug in some spots but I think it'll do. I tried putting the whole Sys-AZ assembly in and it fits. Now the question is what to do to square everything up. I made some 19mm 100mm x 427mm stretchers out of off cuts of the melamine but they don't seem to fit too well. I'm questioning if I made them square enough. I suppose I could run a groove to drop in a 1/4" back panel on the top/bottom/sides and cut the panel with the TSO square to make sure it is dead on. I'm leaning that direction.
« Last Edit: August 02, 2018, 04:26 PM by DynaGlide »

Offline Dick Mahany

  • Posts: 396
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #15 on: August 02, 2018, 04:31 PM »
Now the question is what to do to square everything up. I made some 19mm 100mm x 427mm stretchers out of off cuts of the melamine but they don't seem to fit too well. I'm questioning if I made them square enough. I suppose I could run a groove to drop in a 1/4" back panel on the top/bottom/sides and cut the panel with the TSO square to make sure it is dead on. I'm leaning that direction.

A well fitting square panel will go a long way to square it up and add rigidity.  If you have enough room behind the rear of the panel you could use stretches or glue and pin a few small fastening blocks to anchor the rear of the panel to the sides.  Those methods have worked well for me. 

That project is turning out nice.

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #16 on: August 02, 2018, 05:12 PM »
How about this solution. .? I can drill in from the sides to secure with those Confirmat screws I've read about. I had picked up some wider pieces of Melamine with no plans for them when at the store and was able to get 1024 x 427 out of it using the @TSO Products square.


I knew there was a reason I needed a 3rd MFT






Can I do the Confirmat route with a hand drill? Special bits required etc? Or just use Melamine glue and parallel clamps?

Offline TSO_Products

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Re: Sysport build
« Reply #17 on: August 02, 2018, 05:21 PM »
Matt,
try the Confirmat drilling and  installation on some scrap melamine panels to learn what to look out for. More than just a couple of screws.
Hans

Offline Dick Mahany

  • Posts: 396
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #18 on: August 02, 2018, 05:35 PM »
How about this solution. .? I can drill in from the sides to secure with those Confirmat screws I've read about.
Can I do the Confirmat route with a hand drill? Special bits required etc? Or just use Melamine glue and parallel clamps?

I think the confirmat screws would work fine.  There is a special combo drill bit and countersink (maybe Snappy?).  Mine is labelled 5x40 and has a brad point, but I think one could make do with other bits.  A hand drill would be okay IMHO as that's what I have done in the past.  No matter what method I use to square cabinet boxes up, there is just nothing like the simple cross checking across diagonals to be sure.


Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #19 on: August 02, 2018, 06:30 PM »
@TSO Products @Dick Mahany Got it. I'll get those and clamp it square before driving them in.

While this approach is working... What should I have done differently? I feel like this is the dumb method.

Offline TSO_Products

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Re: Sysport build
« Reply #20 on: August 02, 2018, 07:16 PM »
@DynaGlide - have you considered Pocket Screws from the inside rather than having the exposed Confirmat heads on the outside? I thought I saw pocket screw holes in one of your images? Are your cases for fixed installation or carts with wheelos?
One source for Confimrat screws and drills is 
www.mcfeelys.com

the 5x10 EURO Mounting screws for drawer slides go well with LR-32 drilled hole patterns.
Use only CONFIRMAT special purpose drill bits and holders. There are enough challenges without intentionally creatin additional ones by using something that "works OK" but is not specifically made for these engineered fastener systems.

Hans

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #21 on: August 02, 2018, 07:23 PM »
@DynaGlide - have you considered Pocket Screws from the inside rather than having the exposed Confirmat heads on the outside? I thought I saw pocket screw holes in one of your images? Are your cases for fixed installation or carts with wheelos?
One source for Confimrat screws and drills is 
www.mcfeelys.com

the 5x10 EURO Mounting screws for drawer slides go well with LR-32 drilled hole patterns.
Use only CONFIRMAT special purpose drill bits and holders. There are enough challenges without intentionally creatin additional ones by using something that "works OK" but is not specifically made for these engineered fastener systems.

Hans

Hans,

I can certainly use pocket holes. I was concerned about their holding power in particle board. If I use Confirmat I will get those plugs or covers. This will be on wheels, but not moved often.

Offline Sparktrician

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Re: Sysport build
« Reply #22 on: August 02, 2018, 08:04 PM »
Quote
Hans,

I can certainly use pocket holes. I was concerned about their holding power in particle board. If I use Confirmat I will get those plugs or covers. This will be on wheels, but not moved often.

Speaking only for myself, I prefer dominoes for alignment and joint strength, but use pocket screws to hold things together (clamping) as the glue dries.  I look at Confirmat screws as something to be used in assemblies that will eventually be broken down for transport or storage. 
- Willy -

 "Remember, a chip on the shoulder is a sure sign of wood higher up." - Brigham Young

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #23 on: August 03, 2018, 10:33 AM »
I'm probably just going to use coarse pocket screws on the back and gorilla glue on the joints. .because it's what I have here and it'll be hidden. Still need to do some edge banding.

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #24 on: August 03, 2018, 02:43 PM »
I was avoiding doing the edgebanding because it was the exact width 0.75" as the Melamine. .but it turned out as best as I could hope. Just took my time and used some edge banding clamps.





Used the kreg jig again on the back panel. I like this setup on the MFT. I clamp the jig down to the table and have two support blocks with 3/4" dowels to sit in the 20mm holes. The Bluetooth remote for the CT vac is great here. Turn it on, drill, turn it off, move the board and re-clamp and repeat. No muss no fuss and no mess to clean up, either.


It's all clamped up now. I need to improve my workflow a bit but most of it is that all my stuff is in boxes still. I think I'll be building a few more cabinets after this. I also only have the one Sys-AZ drawer. I need about 10 more. @Festool USA want to donate to a good cause?  ::)
« Last Edit: August 03, 2018, 02:46 PM by DynaGlide »

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #25 on: August 04, 2018, 10:18 PM »
Time to wrap this up with some closing thoughts.

Using pocket holes on particle board is really fussy. Everything has to be clamped just so and the settings perfect or the parts shift and screws exit through the mating piece. Which happened to me and ruined the edge banding on the back.

The full size back is really overkill here so I redid it with my original stretchers plan which are about 100mm x 427mm each. Used parallel clamps to hold the stretchers flush during the pocket screw driving which seemed to work out a lot better.

I'm pretty satisfied with the result:



The back of the sides and top/bottom got messed up from the first go around driving the pocket screws, probably tack a 1/4" panel to clean it up. Just need to decide on some casters and finish building the second sysport.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2018, 10:28 PM by DynaGlide »

Offline Dick Mahany

  • Posts: 396
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2018, 09:06 AM »
Turned out excellent. Stretchers look solid.  Now we need pics of it filled up  [smile]

Offline TSO_Products

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Re: Sysport build
« Reply #27 on: August 05, 2018, 03:00 PM »
@DynaGlide  - nice looking cabinet and thanks for sharing your comments/experience with particle board and Pocket Screws.

For the caster source, look on the preview DRAFT of the new TSO SYSTAINER Cart Plans I emailed you Saturday. Email us back your feedback on our plans. We have all the pieces cut and dry-fit to validate our design and will install hardware and casters this week along with a SYS-AZ.

Hans


Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #28 on: August 05, 2018, 03:47 PM »
Turned out excellent. Stretchers look solid.  Now we need pics of it filled up  [smile]

@Dick Mahany I spent all my money on tools so I can't afford to buy the drawers to store them  [big grin]

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #29 on: August 05, 2018, 03:48 PM »
@DynaGlide  - nice looking cabinet and thanks for sharing your comments/experience with particle board and Pocket Screws.

For the caster source, look on the preview DRAFT of the new TSO SYSTAINER Cart Plans I emailed you Saturday. Email us back your feedback on our plans. We have all the pieces cut and dry-fit to validate our design and will install hardware and casters this week along with a SYS-AZ.

Hans

@TSO Products You've got mail!

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #30 on: August 06, 2018, 01:07 PM »
I finished up #2 and it was smooth sailing this time now that I knew what to look out for. I ran through all the same domino operations at once for the sides and top/bottom to reduce error, clamped the stretchers up flush before driving pocket screws. It went together lickity split compared to the first and it's dead on square measured corner to corner.

I want to attach a 1/4" melamine back panel to each to hide the exposed particle board and add some rigidity. I can't seem to find any locally at least from the box stores. Any tips?


Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Dick Mahany

  • Posts: 396
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #31 on: August 06, 2018, 01:22 PM »
Kreg makes white pocket hole plugs so that may be one option.

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #32 on: August 06, 2018, 01:31 PM »
Kreg makes white pocket hole plugs so that may be one option.

I meant to the back of each carcass. The pocket holes will be hidden by the systainers

Offline GoingMyWay

  • Posts: 670
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #33 on: August 06, 2018, 01:34 PM »
Inquiring Minds Want to Know

TS55, CT26, RO150, CXS, ETS 150/3, ETS EC 150/5, MFT/3, TS75, DF500, DTS400, OF1400, CT SYS

Offline DynaGlide

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Re: Sysport build
« Reply #34 on: August 06, 2018, 01:43 PM »

Offline Bob D.

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Re: Sysport build
« Reply #35 on: August 07, 2018, 11:32 AM »
Kreg makes a plug cutter so you can make your own matching plugs from scrap of the same material.

-----
It's a table saw, do you know where your fingers are?

Offline DynaGlide

  • Posts: 248
Re: Sysport build
« Reply #36 on: August 10, 2018, 11:42 AM »
Welp thanks (or no thanks?) to eBay and their sales they keep running. .the shop got a little more organized. Here's the current state:

The ports received 1/8" tempered hardboard backs and are attached to studs for stability. Casters just didn't work out even with threaded inserts designed for the task. The left one accommodates (1) Sys4, (3) Sys2, and (1) Sys1. Right is (1) Sys4, (1) Sys2, (2) Sys1, and a drawer on top that's currently holding all my dog accessories, but it will fit a Sys2 and possibly a Sys3.


Here you can see my first failed attempted at the sysport using China-ply, now repurposed as a shelf, and pegboard that I hung. The worktable is a Multifunctionslab I built using the pegboard jig a while back that a member here sells to create the grid. The bottom shelf was made later using the LR32 and those holes are on 96mm centers and perfectly square. Should I ever need to bang out another top I'll use it and a flush trim bit:


And finally the triple MFT setup. I'm going to use the second fence for precise offcuts. Just waiting on some Starrett tape from Amazon:

« Last Edit: August 10, 2018, 11:47 AM by DynaGlide »