Author Topic: The My Shop Cart (Read 9398 times)

Mario Turcot · « **on:** October 02, 2018, 01:22 PM »

I have a small shop 20' x 20' where pretty much all machinery is ready layout. The only machinery to come will be a Hammer A3-31, probably next summer. I'm still in need of several carts & benches but room is a premium unless I expand my floor surface. I have been brainstorming about a multi purpose rolling cart and I would like your input on the subject.

The base cart will be 36" x 60", made of 18mm BB. It will serve first as a outfeed table for the hybrid table saw. It will also serve as a sanding and assembly table. And more. I want the cart to hold the VAC SYS system like Jericho cart . In addition the top will accept an interchangeable custom MFT top to be used with the TS55. Ideally the MFT top should be stored on the side opposite to the VAC pump or else.

Feel free to feed me with your thought & ideas.

Thanks, Mario

egmiii · « **Reply #1 on:** October 02, 2018, 03:02 PM »

Check out the Felder FAT 300 or 500. It doesn't ship with a top, so you can fabricate and customize the hole pattern in whatever material you prefer. It can roll around and height adjust for outfeed/sanding/assembly. You didn't specify a budget, so I'll forewarn it's not cheap, but is quite versatile. The biggest downside is the inability to store material below the table. This might be a deal breaker for a small shop lacking storage space.

TrackTubesGuy · « **Reply #2 on:** October 02, 2018, 03:46 PM »

Mario ... sounds similar to my situation .. I was looking at the A3-31 earlier in the year and ended up getting the FAT300 lifting table. It WAS VERY HARD for me to pay the price for the FAT300, but I have to say, I don't regret it at all. I haven't purchased the A3 yet, but saving space for it also. I plan on starting to build out the lifting table as my main shop cart/track saw/assembly station in the next couple weeks and have been toying with ideas and looking around the internet. Thinking of a modular system so I can adapt different worktops, and having a telescoping arms for work support and cutting down sheet goods. Also a platform at one end for my CT36. I'll post photos as I move along. Good luck with yours.

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #3 on:** October 02, 2018, 04:11 PM »

Quote from: egmiii on October 02, 2018, 03:02 PM

Check out the Felder FAT 300 or 500. It doesn't ship with a top, so you can fabricate and customize the hole pattern in whatever material you prefer. It can roll around and height adjust for outfeed/sanding/assembly. You didn't specify a budget, so I'll forewarn it's not cheap, but is quite versatile. The biggest downside is the inability to store material below the table. This might be a deal breaker for a small shop lacking storage space.

I agree that the FAT 300 is a viable option, last month I requested a quote from Felder Canada, The FAT 300 quote was 2,700$. Well this is only a mobile base and no where to store anything.

Alanbach · « **Reply #4 on:** October 02, 2018, 04:35 PM »

I just happened upon this one and although it does not have some of the things that you want it may serve as decent inspiration???

http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/my-custom-built-expandable-mft-on-rolling-cart/

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #5 on:** October 02, 2018, 05:20 PM »

Quote from: Alanbach on October 02, 2018, 04:35 PM

I just happened upon this one and although it does not have some of the things that you want it may serve as decent inspiration???

http://festoolownersgroup.com/festool-jigs-tool-enhancements/my-custom-built-expandable-mft-on-rolling-cart/

@Alanbach Inspiration is exactly what I am looking for. Thanks for the link

gunnyr · « **Reply #6 on:** October 06, 2018, 10:24 PM »

The Marcon Easy Lift Assembly table might be of interest. I saw it demonstrated at IWF in Atlanta in August. Very impressive, it provides electrical and air outlets, as well as pneumatic clamping.

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #7 on:** October 08, 2018, 09:16 AM »

This is an interesting lift Jeff. I haven't found any website that sale those

gunnyr · « **Reply #8 on:** October 08, 2018, 09:25 PM »

Quote from: Mario Turcot on October 08, 2018, 09:16 AM

This is an interesting lift Jeff. I haven't found any website that sale those

I found the brochure I picked up at IWF. As I recall they are sold pretty old school; you have to call! Here's the phone#/email info from the brochure: 707.292.6289 conradrey@comcast.net

I spoke with Conrad for a few minutes, he is very passionate about his product! Seemed to be very well built, aimed at the furniture industry rather than an adaptation from metal fabrication.

Claimdude · « **Reply #9 on:** October 09, 2018, 08:36 AM »

Jeff,

Any idea what the price is for this lift?

Jack

Quote from: gunnyr on October 08, 2018, 09:25 PM

Quote from: Mario Turcot on October 08, 2018, 09:16 AM
This is an interesting lift Jeff. I haven't found any website that sale those

I found the brochure I picked up at IWF. As I recall they are sold pretty old school; you have to call! Here's the phone#/email info from the brochure: 707.292.6289 conradrey@comcast.net

I spoke with Conrad for a few minutes, he is very passionate about his product! Seemed to be very well built, aimed at the furniture industry rather than an adaptation from metal fabrication.

TrackTubesGuy · « **Reply #10 on:** October 09, 2018, 09:45 AM »

Quote from: Claimdude on October 09, 2018, 08:36 AM

Any idea what the price is for this lift?

I checked into these last year, after seeing them at the IWF in Vegas. Very well built and very pricey $$$. From memory, I believe they started at around $3 grand. I even had one of Conrads assistants take a look at the Felder FAT300 to see if they could build a similar lift. After some back and forth, I realized it was more economical to buy the FAT300, which was easier on the wallet for me and has worked out great.

nvalinski · « **Reply #11 on:** October 09, 2018, 11:42 AM »

If you are looking for storage below, a lifting table, integrated vacuum clamping, and have zero regard for budget, you may want to take a look at the Barth VakuuCar as well. It's at least nice inspiration.

http://www.martin-usa.com/products/vakuucar-vakuucar-xl/

gunnyr · « **Reply #12 on:** October 09, 2018, 09:19 PM »

Quote from: Claimdude on October 09, 2018, 08:36 AM

Jeff,

Any idea what the price is for this lift?

Jack

I seem to remember around $4000 when you added wheels. Not cheap at all, but if it prevents ONE lost time injury it will have paid for itself. If it saved one project from getting dropped, saves a few hours per year.... YMMV of course.

tallgrass · « **Reply #13 on:** October 10, 2018, 01:12 AM »

are these substantially better than motorcycle lifts? When ever I see these they always look like motorcycle lifts.

GarryMartin · « **Reply #14 on:** October 10, 2018, 05:49 AM »

I've seen quite a few people use second-hand hospital beds (or more accurately, the hospital bed frame) as the undercarriage for large scale MFT layouts. In the UK, you can pick them up relatively cheaply on eBay.

WillAdams · « **Reply #15 on:** October 10, 2018, 09:45 AM »

For folks in the U.S., the hardware company Harry Epstein has a

Swedish Military Stainless Steel Medic Table

in their clearance area for $285 --- rated to old 385 lbs.

DynaGlide · « **Reply #16 on:** October 10, 2018, 11:01 AM »

Also space constrained Mario and also looking to make a mobile Vac Sys cart. I didn't know I needed something called a "Vakuucar" in my life until now.

egmiii · « **Reply #17 on:** October 10, 2018, 11:36 AM »

If you don't absolutely need the space under the cart, I'd suggest the 500V instead. With the optional cam locks and feet, it's almost on par with a roubo for stability. It also offers a wider range of height adjustment.

https://rangate.com/products/barth-lift-table-500v-vakuulift

If your seriously considering the Festool pods and building a cart, at least evaluate the Barth pod unit (Vakuusyst) which integrates into an existing workbench. It offers rock solid construction, drops below the table when not in use, and has more adjustment flexibility (especially if you add extension tubes).

https://rangate.com/products/barth-vakuusyst-315

gunnyr · « **Reply #18 on:** October 10, 2018, 08:30 PM »

Quote from: tallgrass on October 10, 2018, 01:12 AM

are these substantially better than motorcycle lifts? When ever I see these they always look like motorcycle lifts.

The Marcon Easy Lift Table is absolutely substantially better than a motorcycle lift, kinda like the TS55 is substantially better than a PC circular saw. The operation is very smooth, it includes onboard electric and air outlets as well as a pneumatic clamp. The optional wheel assembly is also pneumatically operated. As I recall there are at least two sizes of the table available; seems like a 3x5 and a 4x8.

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #19 on:** November 01, 2018, 08:28 AM »

After reading a ton of FOG posts I finally start with the cart project.

Here a dry fit of the torsion box. The strips are 15mm (~1/2") thick by 80mm (~3") high with half lap joint. I Made the "groves" using a dado blade on the table saw. The worst part was to get a very snug fit for the half lap joint. On the picture you can see that the strips have to be cut in length. I put the grid together to make sure everything was perfect before I remove the dado blade

and here after the cuts. Used the Kapex to have all the strips the same length on both axis. I am very happy with the result. I will add a frame 18mm strip around the grid to close it.

On that picture you can see more closely how snug are the joints. They seems to be not flush but it's because the ply used to sit the grid is not leveled yet. That's the next part I have to work on before glue up.

Now on the assembly? My plan is to put together the frame and then square it on a flat surface. Once it's perfectly flat and square add the grids. The grid will be sandwiched between two BB ply, not sure yet if it's going to be 12mm, 15mm or 18mm.

Any advice and do I need to glue up the grid strips to keep from warping?

That surface will be my table saw outfeed table and assembly table.
Plan A: Make a custom MFT holes pattern to fit between the grid. The grid is 200mm (~7 3/4") square.
Plan B: Add a sliding MFT top that will sit on the top of the torsion box raising the working surface some 100mm (~4")

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #20 on:** November 15, 2018, 12:33 PM »

UPDATE

I have the torsion box done. I used 12mm BB ply on both sides.

[Pict coming tonight]

I am now at adding two t-track at the front

to hold the SYS-VAC system. I will add another layer of 18mm BB ply on the top only. That way the t-tracks will be shy of 1/16. the first t-track will be flush to the edge to add vertical clamping capability. The torsion box will sit on a rolling cabinet similar to Guy's cart

Since it's a rolling assembly table and I made it specifically flat, I want to be able to micro adjust the top for when I move it. So far I found those

To adjust from the top. I was also thinking about a threaded rod and knobs mechanism.

Any idea what I could use? It need to be able to support ~400lbs

neilc · « **Reply #21 on:** November 15, 2018, 08:10 PM »

You could just use a hacksaw and cut a slit in the top of those bolts for adjustment ease with a screwdriver. Or get separate feet with long rods to give you a knob closer to the top of the table. My concern there might be removing the flush sides that are great if you have T-slot around the perimeter.

Check with McMaster.com for possible feet. Not sure if they ship to Canada or not. You could fashion your own out of some blocks of wood, T-nuts and feet from McMaster, Home Depot, or similar.

https://www.mcmaster.com/adjustable-feet

Curious where you found that T-track. I really like the 90 degree clamping options it offers.

neil

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #22 on:** November 15, 2018, 09:04 PM »

those t-tracks are exclusive to LeeValley and the feets are from LV too. They do have a ~~slot~~ I mean allen head on top for adjustment

jobsworth · « **Reply #23 on:** November 16, 2018, 11:02 AM »

Now you guys went and did it.....

You gave me a idea.

You have no idea how dangerous that is

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #24 on:** November 16, 2018, 11:12 AM »

Quote from: jobsworth on November 16, 2018, 11:02 AM

Now you guys went and did it.....

You gave me a idea.

You have no idea how dangerous that is

Wait! What?

grrrrrr, I forgot about taking a pict last night.

neilc · « **Reply #25 on:** November 16, 2018, 04:12 PM »

Mario -

Does that T-track from LV work with Festool clamps? It looks to be too large in the photos on their website.

Thanks -

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #26 on:** November 16, 2018, 04:38 PM »

@neilc

Quote from: neilc on November 16, 2018, 04:12 PM

Mario -

Does that T-track from LV work with Festool clamps? It looks to be too large in the photos on their website.

Thanks -

They do fit on the thin sides

but not on the large sides

unfortunately... however my plan is to use the top slot (large sides) with t-bolts to hold the SYS-VAC and with festool like clamps on the thin sides for vertical clamping. So it sort out pretty good for my purpose

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #27 on:** November 19, 2018, 11:44 AM »

I have been idle on the weekend because I was not happy with the glide feet. The idea of boring 4 holes on the top to adjust the height was defeating the idea of having a perfect flat top, solely to be used for assembly. I discovered those (model A)

today

. This is exactly what I was looking for, they support 385lb each

. They will be fixed on the cabinet part and a reses hole will be bored from under the torsion box top, to keep the top aligned with the cabinet. I will also be able to sit a dedicated MFT top on it. Those levelers have a ~5/8 travel.

Michael Kellough · « **Reply #28 on:** November 19, 2018, 12:26 PM »

Quote from: Mario Turcot on November 19, 2018, 11:44 AM

I have been idle on the weekend because I was not happy with the glide feet. The idea of boring 4 holes on the top to adjust the height was defeating the idea of having a perfect flat top, solely to be used for assembly. I discovered those (model A)

today . This is exactly what I was looking for, they support 385lb each . They will be fixed on the cabinet part and a reses hole will be bored from under the torsion box top, to keep the top aligned with the cabinet. I will also be able to sit a dedicated MFT top on it. Those levelers have a ~5/8 travel.

Just be aware that the thread pitch on these is pretty coarse. Depending on how precise your level is and whether it matters you might find it difficult to turn one of these little enough.

Mario Turcot · « **Reply #29 on:** November 19, 2018, 12:30 PM »

@Micheal Kellough Thanks for the heads up, I totally agree with you. The 5/8 travel works on only 5 full turns. Is it enough? perhaps on a large surface it is. Do you have any experience with those?