Author Topic: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.  (Read 28658 times)

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Offline RKA

  • Posts: 1288
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #30 on: May 03, 2017, 10:49 AM »
-Raj

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Offline copcarcollector

  • Posts: 1437
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #31 on: May 03, 2017, 02:20 PM »
What is the workbench being used in the video?

The black bench with dog holes is the Kreg Mobile Project Center

http://www.toolnut.com/kreg-kws1000-mobile-project-center.html


Offline supimeister

  • Posts: 78
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #32 on: May 03, 2017, 10:17 PM »
@TSO Products can you divulge additional details on the GRS16 accessories that you are working on - what additional functionality are you hoping to provide via the accessory?

Offline TSO Products

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Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #33 on: May 03, 2017, 11:22 PM »

@supimeister  - see reply  # 296 on the Thread about the original GRS-16 Post.
We will introduce an accessory for the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE GUide Rail Squares which wwill permit you th not only square up the rail to the workpiece but simultaneously set the edge distance from the left side (call it a parallel guide accessory).

It will be designed to be usable at each end of a longer cut using the GRS-16 PE to which this accessory will also  fit (designed to face in the opposite direction as well).

Putting the adapter holes in the production GRS-16 series "leaked" this piece of marketing information  but "we cannot tell a lie" - so we patiently hear the question and answer it too.  Too bad we're still using "old technology" where have to complete a design, prototype, Beta test it, go back and improve what comes up short, test some more,... finally get ready to launch production and eventually start shipping. That's why it will ship after Labor Day as far as we can see right now.

With the MTR-18 and PTR-18  Triangles in production and shipping now, we can turn our full attention to completing this GRS-16 accessory.
Hans
info@tsoproducts.com
 
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE Guide Rail Squares -  the MTR-18 Triangle and Work Holding solutions

Offline supimeister

  • Posts: 78
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #34 on: May 03, 2017, 11:26 PM »
Ah, I totally missed that post - thanks for your gracious and speedy response!

Offline SS Teach

  • Posts: 285
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #35 on: May 04, 2017, 06:32 PM »
After seeing the video mine is in the mail as I post this.
RTS 400, LS 130, Sandpaper Systainer, Profile Systainer. ETS 125, Sandpaper Systainer, Ro 90, Sandpaper Systainer,  Ro 150, Sandpaper Systainer, OF 1400, TS 55 REQ, CT36, CXS Li 1.5 Set, Centrotec Wood-Drill-Set/8pcs, CT Wings, Surfix Set. Domino 500, Domino Systainer, Parallel Guide

Offline ben_r_

  • Posts: 1140
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #36 on: May 05, 2017, 11:14 AM »
Did you guys see the custom made green versions?


Apparently the guy just ordered them pre-anodized and had them done green somewhere else.


I think Id prefer to have one done clear (silver). I think it would match the rail nicely.
If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

Offline tazprime38

  • Posts: 247
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #37 on: July 12, 2017, 05:37 PM »

@supimeister  - see reply  # 296 on the Thread about the original GRS-16 Post.
We will introduce an accessory for the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE GUide Rail Squares which wwill permit you th not only square up the rail to the workpiece but simultaneously set the edge distance from the left side (call it a parallel guide accessory).

It will be designed to be usable at each end of a longer cut using the GRS-16 PE to which this accessory will also  fit (designed to face in the opposite direction as well).

Putting the adapter holes in the production GRS-16 series "leaked" this piece of marketing information  but "we cannot tell a lie" - so we patiently hear the question and answer it too.  Too bad we're still using "old technology" where have to complete a design, prototype, Beta test it, go back and improve what comes up short, test some more,... finally get ready to launch production and eventually start shipping. That's why it will ship after Labor Day as far as we can see right now.

With the MTR-18 and PTR-18  Triangles in production and shipping now, we can turn our full attention to completing this GRS-16 accessory.
Hans
info@tsoproducts.com

Hi Hans, hope you are welĺ.

Regarding your pending parallel guide attachment , will this make my festool parallel guides obselete enabling me to sell them off?

Tariq

@TSO Products

<<EDIT:  inserted mention so that it would be more visible to TSO - Peter Halle - Moderator>>
« Last Edit: July 12, 2017, 06:03 PM by Peter Halle »

Offline TSO Products

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Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #38 on: July 31, 2017, 04:53 PM »
@tazprime38  - good question Tariq. You'll have to make that judgment when you see what the accessory we are working on  can do for you. Our accessory product is still in the development phase. We are more anxious even than you may be. Thank you for your continuing interest. For some reason did not see your post until just now.

Hans
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE Guide Rail Squares -  the MTR-18 Triangle and Work Holding solutions

Offline SoZo

  • Posts: 1
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #39 on: August 07, 2017, 11:36 PM »

@supimeister  - see reply  # 296 on the Thread about the original GRS-16 Post.
We will introduce an accessory for the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE GUide Rail Squares which wwill permit you th not only square up the rail to the workpiece but simultaneously set the edge distance from the left side (call it a parallel guide accessory).

It will be designed to be usable at each end of a longer cut using the GRS-16 PE to which this accessory will also  fit (designed to face in the opposite direction as well).

Putting the adapter holes in the production GRS-16 series "leaked" this piece of marketing information  but "we cannot tell a lie" - so we patiently hear the question and answer it too.  Too bad we're still using "old technology" where have to complete a design, prototype, Beta test it, go back and improve what comes up short, test some more,... finally get ready to launch production and eventually start shipping. That's why it will ship after Labor Day as far as we can see right now.

With the MTR-18 and PTR-18  Triangles in production and shipping now, we can turn our full attention to completing this GRS-16 accessory.
Hans
info@tsoproducts.com

Was this new parallel guide idea binned? I don't see it on your site?  Sorry. Just got to the bit about releasing after Labor Day. Looking forward to seeing what you come up with  [smile]
« Last Edit: August 07, 2017, 11:40 PM by SoZo »

Offline Lemwise

  • Posts: 262
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #40 on: August 08, 2017, 07:37 PM »
Years ago I made a big 75x100cm speed square out of birch plywood. I lay the track against it and I have a perfect square cut every time. It took me 10 minutes to make if I recall correctly.

Offline tazprime38

  • Posts: 247
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #41 on: August 10, 2017, 06:42 AM »
@tazprime38  - good question Tariq. You'll have to make that judgment when you see what the accessory we are working on  can do for you. Our accessory product is still in the development phase. We are more anxious even than you may be. Thank you for your continuing interest. For some reason did not see your post until just now.

Hans

Hi Hans

Another question comes to mind, will the psrallel guide attachment allow for narrow rips, ie thin strips smaller in width to the guide rail?
Tariq

@TSO Products

Offline wpz

  • Posts: 15
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #42 on: April 29, 2018, 08:15 PM »

@supimeister  - see reply  # 296 on the Thread about the original GRS-16 Post.
We will introduce an accessory for the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE GUide Rail Squares which wwill permit you th not only square up the rail to the workpiece but simultaneously set the edge distance from the left side (call it a parallel guide accessory).

It will be designed to be usable at each end of a longer cut using the GRS-16 PE to which this accessory will also  fit (designed to face in the opposite direction as well).

Putting the adapter holes in the production GRS-16 series "leaked" this piece of marketing information  but "we cannot tell a lie" - so we patiently hear the question and answer it too.  Too bad we're still using "old technology" where have to complete a design, prototype, Beta test it, go back and improve what comes up short, test some more,... finally get ready to launch production and eventually start shipping. That's why it will ship after Labor Day as far as we can see right now.

With the MTR-18 and PTR-18  Triangles in production and shipping now, we can turn our full attention to completing this GRS-16 accessory.
Hans
info@tsoproducts.com

Decided to try and make my own GRS-16 and GRS-16PE parallel guides today with some Incra track, the Seneca parallel guides and some Festool knobs.
It works pretty well, only drawback I found so far is that the smallest width you can set is 410mm.
The tracks are also a bit long now, I think I will shorten them to about 1250mm as the standard width of plywood panels is 1220mm here in Europe.

here are the pictures:
278970-0278972-1278974-2278976-3278978-4278980-5278982-6278984-7278986-8278988-9278990-10278992-11278994-12278996-13278998-14

Offline tomp

  • Posts: 48
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #43 on: April 29, 2018, 08:30 PM »
Just a thought - with the GRS-16 setting the rail perpendicular to the edge, why are two parallel guides needed?  This is my adaptation of a different brand, same basic principle.

Offline wpz

  • Posts: 15
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #44 on: April 29, 2018, 08:36 PM »
For a short rail it is probably not necessary, but I also have a 3m rail and with such long cuts I think it might increase the accuracy.

P

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 681
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #45 on: April 29, 2018, 08:54 PM »
For a short rail it is probably not necessary, but I also have a 3m rail and with such long cuts I think it might increase the accuracy.

P

I am under the impression that you can clamp the guide rail on the other end once the square is set in the place on one end. Shouldn't that clamping keep the accuracy as well as maintain a square setting on a long board?

My intention is to use the guard rail square (if I decide to buy it) for long boards (anything under 4' can  be handled with ease on my tablesaw), but if two squares are indeed required, I don't think I would give any further thought to this method.

Offline TSO Products

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Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #46 on: April 29, 2018, 09:20 PM »
@wpz - you have the right concept in mind. Our production tool is designed to cover the entire range from the narrowest stock  all the way across the width of a full sheet and handle material thicknesses down to 12mm in a narrow strip underneath the guide rail.

@tomp – good point you make.
 @wpz points out, that will probably work on shorter length cuts. We expect customers will want all the repeatability and accuracy they can achieve. A pair of flip-stop rails will make that possible. We’ll see what customers report.
Your two posts will probably net us some fresh inquiries: “. . . are we there yet? “ with the new product?
We’re going into BETA Testing with our parallel guide as I write this. Subscribers to our TSO INSIDER newsletter will be the first to hear when it becomes available.

@ChuckM – you’re correct that clamping in the guide rail t-slot will lock down the far end of the guide rail once it’s positioned. But if you have a sliding table saw supporting the long workpiece throughout the cutting operation, we won’t surpass that.

To stay aabreast of our developments, you can subscribe to YOUR TSO INSIDER on the bottom of our web page using this link:
https://tsoproducts.com/

We appreciate the dialog with you here on the FOG.
Thank you for posting the pictures
Hans
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE Guide Rail Squares -  the MTR-18 Triangle and Work Holding solutions

Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #47 on: May 01, 2018, 04:37 AM »
The TSO squares look like great products but every video I've watched demonstrating their use shows the initial cut being referenced from an already square edge. How does it work if there is no square edge to reference off?

Offline neilc

  • Posts: 2524
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #48 on: May 01, 2018, 07:16 AM »
Just lay your rail down and cut a straight edge if you don't have one.  Then index the square off of a known straight edge, whether factory or one you cut.


And welcome to FOG!


Hope this answers your question.


neil

Offline tomp

  • Posts: 48
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #49 on: May 01, 2018, 11:05 AM »
Just a thought - with the GRS-16 setting the rail perpendicular to the edge, why are two parallel guides needed?  This is my adaptation of a different brand, same basic principle.

I've had the set-up shown in the photo for a while, and it works well, giving excellent repeatability when making multiple parts. However, particularly in my small shop, it is very cumbersome due to the length of the arm and moving it on and off the cutting table is a hassle. I've recently been thinking that a better (or perhaps more practical would be a better expression) design would be an adjustable stop arm which locates on the end of the part, extends towards the cut line and acts as a stop for the back edge of the rail. The distance from the cut line to the back of the rail is a fixed dimension (for the specific saw anyway), and the scale on the stop could be calibrated so that the zero point is the actual cut line so that no math would be required.

Without getting too fancy, the stop could be butted against the LH edge of the part, quickly fixed in place with a spring clamp and the rail butted against the end. After making the cut, the rail & square can easily be lifted off, the stop moved and the wood moved down to make the next cut. It is one more part (maybe two if you count the spring clamp) but it would seem to be more practical than the rail with a long stop attached when working in a small space.

Offline fshanno

  • Posts: 961
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #50 on: May 09, 2018, 01:20 AM »
My problem with these T-square things is that the friction tape is fighting me the whole time.

I guess nobody else has that problem.  Everybody else just lays it down and bumps it to the mark and cuts. 

Or is there a trick I'm missing.

The one thing we learn from history is that we never learn from history.

Offline koenbro

  • Posts: 61
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #51 on: May 09, 2018, 02:31 AM »
My problem with these T-square things is that the friction tape is fighting me the whole time.

I guess nobody else has that problem.  Everybody else just lays it down and bumps it to the mark and cuts. 

Or is there a trick I'm missing.

You are not alone: I have the same problem.


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Offline tomp

  • Posts: 48
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #52 on: May 09, 2018, 07:47 AM »
When using the rail with the TSO square, temporarily put a few inches of blue painters tape over the anti-slip strips next to the square. This will allow the rail to slide easily over the material if it is tilted slightly so that the edge can be easily aligned with your cutting mark. I also put a moveable handle on the edge of the rail so I can apply pressure along the axis of the rail as well as downward while I'm cutting. The handle is used in your left hand to keep the outer end of the rail up off the surface while your right hand moves the other end to get aligned with the mark. It can also be used to apply pressure to the stops on your parallel guides to keep them tight to the edge.

Offline Sanderxpander

  • Posts: 173
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #53 on: May 15, 2018, 02:41 PM »
I guess the MTR-18 is out now, for my personal use I found it underwhelming but that's because I don't have/use an MFT. Very excited about the parallel guide option though! By the way I noticed that they are advertised as fitting in a systainer (a SYS-1 I guess) and you can get an insert that fits two. I can't be the only one who noticed that it fits almost like a glove behind my TS55 in its SYS-4. I totally assumed it was made to be that way until I saw the sales pitch about the systainer insert. It only fits one way (with the clamp to the box side, not the saw) and it's pretty stable. Good way to store it for those who hadn't noticed.

Offline TSO Products

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Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #54 on: May 15, 2018, 07:48 PM »
I guess the MTR-18 is out now, for my personal use I found it underwhelming but that's because I don't have/use an MFT. Very excited about the parallel guide option though! By the way I noticed that they are advertised as fitting in a systainer (a SYS-1 I guess) and you can get an insert that fits two. I can't be the only one who noticed that it fits almost like a glove behind my TS55 in its SYS-4. I totally assumed it was made to be that way until I saw the sales pitch about the systainer insert. It only fits one way (with the clamp to the box side, not the saw) and it's pretty stable. Good way to store it for those who hadn't noticed.

@Sanderxpander – your point about the GRS-16 fitting well behind the TS55 in its SYSTAINER has been well known for several years. However, when I looked on our website I discovered that the pictures we took quite some time ago demonstrating this storage option are not on our product page (anymore). So thanks for commenting and we’ll put an illustration up there.
Since October 2017 we have been shipping a version of our GRS-16 series which features a tough but flexible coating on the Latch hook which engages the guide rail. This, along with other geometric refinements, makes it possible to have that hook engage and lock on the reference edge of the square when not in use. This makes it more convenient to store the GRS-16 when that hook portion is not sticking up. The Black coating prevents scratching the blue anodized aluminum.
Our Dual FoamPac for Sys 1 serves woodworkers who have a set of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE. For them we offer the Dual Foam Pac as a storage option.
Hans
TSOproducts.com

Home of the GRS-16 and GRS-16 PE Guide Rail Squares -  the MTR-18 Triangle and Work Holding solutions

Offline Sanderxpander

  • Posts: 173
Re: TSO Products GRS-16 Guide Rail Square video.
« Reply #55 on: May 16, 2018, 02:51 AM »
It didn't seem accidental indeed, everything about it is too well designed!
I actually think I have that version (or at least there's a coating on the hook) but I haven't tried locking it without the rail.

Looking forward to the parallel guides thing!