Author Topic: Ehoma (a.k.a. Yost, Juuma) clamps ARE compatible w/Bessey K-body accessories  (Read 3421 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline TinyShop

  • Posts: 179
I ran across the following thread from 2015:

http://festoolownersgroup.com/other-tools-accessories/good-deal-on-clamp-set-from-lee-valley/msg387905/#msg387905

...which, excluding this post, comprises one of only two mentions by name of Ehoma parallel clamps on this entire forum. That said, there are several posts that discuss "Lee Valley parallel clamps" which, although not directly declared, are in fact Ehoma clamps.

Anyways, the aforementioned thread raises the possibility that Bessey K-body clamps (like the currently available Revo and soon-to-be released updated version known as the "Revolution") might in fact be manufactured by Ehoma (they share identical throat lengths, clamping forces and incremental clamping capacities).

So...here's my US$10M question: does anyone know if Ehoma parallel clamps are compatible with Bessey K-body accessories and, in particular, the Bessey K-Body Extenders? I don't yet own an example of either but, at least from photos and videos, the important bits do look remarkably similar:

The Revo

The forthcoming "Revolution"

The Ehoma

If they are compatible (even the hourglass rails look remarkably similar), I'm considering a purchase of a selection of Ehoma clamps, but only if I can use them with the Bessey K-body accessories (the major advantage of Bessey's offerings). However, I am also considering waiting around for the March release of the Bessey Revolution (particularly the Vario version) but only if they are still being made in Germany or being assembled here in the U.S. from German components (I've requested country of origin info from Bessey but its been four days and still no word). If all of the above are in fact "Made-in-Taiwan" than I'll pass over the Revolutions in favor of Ehoma's less expensive offerings. After all, who wouldn't like to be able to benefit from Ehoma's innovative high-torque pivoting handle?



Thanks, in advance, for the help.
« Last Edit: February 20, 2018, 02:10 AM by TinyShop »

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 351
@TinyShop I have 20 of those clamps. Four of each size and I love them. I do not own any Bessey but to me they are very similar. I don't know about Bessey but the handle of those are swivel to add more tork.

I also like to know if the Bessey accessories are compatible because I did not found any accessories specific to the Ehoma like clamp extenders.

Mario
« Last Edit: February 19, 2018, 10:16 PM by Mario Turcot »
Mario

Offline yetihunter

  • Posts: 535
The ehoma's are knockoffs in the general term. 
They come in many a brand name and color, none of which say "Bessey".
They are not the quality of the K-Body Revo.      That said, they
are not junky like the K-Body Revo Jr.

I don't own the ehomas, but I have access to them.  The earliest I can check out the compatibility
is Sunday, I'm afraid.

Offline TinyShop

  • Posts: 179
@yetihunter - I look forward to the results of your compatibility investigation. :)

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 461
My Ehoma clamps from LV have never failed me and I have a bunch (39.5" & 48 3/4") like Mario (but not as many as he). I also have Bessey, but without a second thought I would choose Ehoma over Bessey for the extra features such as the anti slip and the tool-less extra handle leverage.

The anti slip feature is a godsend for dry fitting as you don't to have waste precious time readjusting the clamps when the real glue-up is done.

The 1500 lb force is more than enough for any glue-ups imaginable under the sky. I don't consider Ehoma a knock-off of any other brand as such bar clamps all look similar. If it were a knockoff, then I'd say it was a better version of the original in both function and price.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2018, 12:39 PM by ChuckM »

Offline yetihunter

  • Posts: 535
@yetihunter - I look forward to the results of your compatibility investigation. :)

I have failed you.  Work is work, as of late. 
Perhaps Mario or Chuck can chime in on that aspect.

Meanwhile, instead of me beating a dead horse on where they get their inspiration from, here's a link to their catalog for informational purposes.  :)

http://www.ehoma.tw/download.htm
« Last Edit: February 19, 2018, 12:44 PM by yetihunter »

Offline TinyShop

  • Posts: 179
@ChuckM - Thanks for the vote of confidence in the Ehoma offerings! Now, since you happen to be in possession of both brands of clamps, are you to able to perform a quick test to answer the unanswered question regarding their real or assumed compatibility? IOW can you see if the Ehoma clamping head slides on and works in conjunction with the Bessey rail? Also, can you see if the Bessey clamping head and/or any of the Bessey K-body accessories fit and work in conjunction with the Ehoma rail? If you are able to do so, it would be most appreciated. :)   

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 461
I will look into those aspects and shall have something back by tomorrow afternoon or so.

EDIT: Just remembered I have an appointment tomorrow and had to do the investigation tonight (0 degree C in shop; real feel -22C outside!).

My findings:

1) Both moveable jaws could work on each other's rail
2) The Ehoma jaw retains its anti slip feature even on the Bessey rail
3) The Ehoma has protective pads on the rail, my Bessey does not
4) The Ehoma handle offers much better grip in addition to the pivot feature.

SEe attached photos for details. I hope this is what you want.
« Last Edit: February 19, 2018, 11:04 PM by ChuckM »

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 461
The findings are posted above.

Offline TinyShop

  • Posts: 179
@ChuckM  - I knew it!! :) So, it's official, the Bessey K-Body clamp accessories (and clamp heads, etc.) are fully compatible with Ehoma parallel clamps. Now, if only Bessey would answer my numerous contact attempts (it has now been five days of total radio silence) I would be able to add their side of the story. Stay tuned....

Thanks so much! 

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 796
3) The Ehoma has protective pads on the rail, my Bessey does not

@ChuckM: You seem to have an old version of the kbody. The REVO (predecessor to revolution) ones I bought 2-3 years ago had the protective pads, both on the rail and the jaws, as shown here.

The protective pads for the rail are available as spare parts, should you need some.

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 461
Thanks for your info. on the pads. I have been trying to get the extra pads for my Ehoma clamps without success.

If anyone knows the best deal for getting those Bessey pads in Canada, please share the source.

Offline TinyShop

  • Posts: 179
@ChuckM - What? Lee Valley isn't willing/able to supply spare parts for the Ehoma clamps, a product they have likely sold a veritable boat load of? If not, that's pretty poor service. I wonder if japanwoodworker/woodcraft is providing any support for the Ehoma clamps that they sell? I would think that unavailability of spare parts would be a major issue for anyone considering these clamps. And I'm not saying anything bad about you - after all, it may not have crossed your mind. Do your Bessey pads fit your Ehoma clamps? If so, I suppose buying Bessey pads would be an easy workaround. You can perform a search for Bessey distributors in your area here. Perhaps someone else can comment on whether the readily available Bessey KR-JP replacement pads fit their older model K-body clamps. Since it would likely help others, if able, please post the outcome of you search for these spare parts.

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 461
The problem appears not to lie with Lee Valley, but the manufacturer, as far as I know. After looking into my request (with the supplier?), Lee Valley has advised me the protection pads are sold with the clamps, and not separately as accessory. I am not aware of any other places that sell those pads alone.

Offline Gregor

  • Posts: 796
There exists a #3101411 (bessey number) set that contains all the black plastic parts (1 end, 4 rail, 3 jaw) for the KR/KRV ones (should be compatible with the new revolution, but I didn't check as I don't have revolution ones yet), retails here for ~7.5€ (incl. VAT).

US an Canda should be able to get the rail pads individually (in 24 pcs. packs: https://www.besseytools.com/en/product_details.php?ASIMOID=000000010003364000040023), a quick mail to bessey US/CA should yield the contact information of a retailer that carries (or at least will order) them.

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 461
There exists a #3101411 (bessey number) set that contains all the black plastic parts (1 end, 4 rail, 3 jaw) for the KR/KRV ones (should be compatible with the new revolution, but I didn't check as I don't have revolution ones yet), retails here for ~7.5€ (incl. VAT).


I have been doing some searches since knowing about the protection pieces. The price you quoted for the set sounds very reasonable (about $11 Cdn) as compared to a pack of 2 rail pieces at $6 Cdn or more, not including shipping, quoted by some online vendors in Canada.

Offline TinyShop

  • Posts: 179
@ChuckM  - I knew it!! :) So, it's official, the Bessey K-Body clamp accessories (and clamp heads, etc.) are fully compatible with Ehoma parallel clamps. Now, if only Bessey would answer my numerous contact attempts (it has now been five days of total radio silence) I would be able to add their side of the story. Stay tuned....

Thanks so much!

Well, after exactly a week of numerous digital correspondences with three different people at Bessey (some of which, I have to admit, were highly frustrating), I finally received a definitive response regarding Ehoma's relationship to Bessey and where Bessey clamps are manufactured. According to Bessey's VP of Marketing:
Quote
"EHOMA does not produce clamps or sub-assemblies or supply anything to BESSEY. Both the "Revo" and new "REVOlution" clamp offerings are assembled in the USA of imported components. The largest percentage value of these imported components come from Germany. The balance of the parts come from PRC, mainland China."

What I was not able to elicit, however - and this was even after I pointed out to Bessey that their various clamps' component parts are interchangeable with Ehoma's - was an official response concerning the issue of Ehoma having copied Bessey's designs.

But, as far as I am concerned, now that I know that Ehoma is producing what amounts to a whole raft of unlicensed knock-offs, I will be avoiding their offerings in favor of loyalty to Bessey's. I'm not a fan of copycats, even if the offending producer happens to be located in one of the freest places in Asia (which, Taiwan R.O.C., happens to be) and does business in a place that ranks higher than the U.S.A. in terms of its EPI (Environmental Performance Index) and its labor protections.

So, for my part, I will be purchasing a healthy compliment of Bessey Vario clamps, both to take advantage of the added flexibility of the variable jaw design and to facilitate an improved storage scenario (based, as it will be, on storing the rails separately from all of the various non-rail components, the latter of which will fit nicely in a dedicated systainer). I don't have a dedicated shop so, to me, multi-purpose versatility, small footprint and efficient storage are all paramount.

Edit: Based on the advice offered by @Gregor here and here I also plan to purchase two 60" Varios (and the necessary optional jaws, etc.) expressly for the purposes of cutting them down and machining holes in the resulting rails to arrive at four 24" long Vario clamps (or maybe two 24's and two 30's), the short sizes of which the manufacturer, for some reason, doesn't offer. This way I'll be able to avoid having to "settle" on non-Vario clamps. I really wish that Bessey would offer their rails separately so that consumers wouldn't have to go through the hassle of modifying stock clamps like this. Apparently, at least according to @GregBradley this flexibility was once offered, at least by one retailer. I'd love to see that option return.   
« Last Edit: February 28, 2018, 04:40 PM by TinyShop »

Offline yetihunter

  • Posts: 535
@ChuckM  - I knew it!! :) So, it's official, the Bessey K-Body clamp accessories (and clamp heads, etc.) are fully compatible with Ehoma parallel clamps. Now, if only Bessey would answer my numerous contact attempts (it has now been five days of total radio silence) I would be able to add their side of the story. Stay tuned....

Thanks so much!

Well, after exactly a week of numerous digital correspondences with three different people at Bessey (some of which, I have to admit, were highly frustrating), I finally received a definitive response regarding Ehoma's relationship to Bessey and where Bessey clamps are manufactured. According to Bessey's VP of Marketing:
Quote
"EHOMA does not produce clamps or sub-assemblies or supply anything to BESSEY. Both the "Revo" and new "REVOlution" clamp offerings are assembled in the USA of imported components. The largest percentage value of these imported components come from Germany. The balance of the parts come from PRC, mainland China."

What I was not able to elicit, however - and this was even after I pointed out to Bessey that their various clamps' component parts are interchangeable with Ehoma's - was an official response concerning the issue of Ehoma having copied Bessey's designs.

But, as far as I am concerned, now that I know that Ehoma is producing what amounts to a whole raft of unlicensed knock-offs, I will be avoiding their offerings in favor of loyalty to Bessey's. I'm not a fan of copycats, even if the offending producer happens to be located in one of the freest places in Asia (which, Taiwan R.O.C., happens to be) and does business in a place that ranks higher than the U.S.A. in terms of its EPI (Environmental Performance Index) and its labor protections.

So, for my part, I will be purchasing a healthy compliment of Bessey Vario clamps, both to take advantage of the added flexibility of the variable jaw design and to facilitate an improved storage scenario (based, as it will be, on storing the rails separately from all of the various non-rail components, the latter of which will fit nicely in a dedicated systainer). I don't have a dedicated shop so, to me, multi-purpose versatility, small footprint and efficient storage are all paramount.

Edit: Based on the advice offered by @Gregor here and here I also plan to purchase two 60" Varios (and the necessary optional jaws, etc.) expressly for the purposes of cutting them down and machining holes in the resulting rails to arrive at four 24" long Vario clamps (or maybe two 24's and two 30's), the short sizes of which the manufacturer, for some reason, doesn't offer. This way I'll be able to avoid having to "settle" on non-Vario clamps. I really wish that Bessey would offer their rails separately so that consumers wouldn't have to go through the hassle of modifying stock clamps like this. Apparently, at least according to @GregBradley this flexibility was once offered, at least by one retailer. I'd love to see that option return.


As I said. ;)

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 461

What I was not able to elicit, however - and this was even after I pointed out to Bessey that their various clamps' component parts are interchangeable with Ehoma's - was an official response concerning the issue of Ehoma having copied Bessey's designs.



I suppose if Bessey feels that its patents or designs have been illegally infringed or copied, it has the legal avenue to protect its interests, just as SawStop (now part of the Festool family) did when it took Bosch to court.

Whether Bessey feels that way, or if it does, why it has chosen not to take any action may never be made public.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2018, 10:17 AM by ChuckM »