Author Topic: Dust extractor 1hp or 2?  (Read 3415 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline Acrobat

  • Posts: 465
Dust extractor 1hp or 2?
« on: November 05, 2013, 10:35 PM »
Excuse me if this has been asked before, I did a search and couldn't find this particular question.....
After becoming covered in fine dust quite often, I've decided to get a dust extractor capable of taking away those larger chips that the thicknesser/planer and one day a jointer throw out. I have quotes on a 1hp model that sucks 850m3 per hour 1hp single phase 10 amps, or do I go 2hp and get a bit more suction 2530 m3 per hour?

Also I would like to have it placed outside at the back of the garage to try eliminate noise in the workshop. If the ducting pipe is long enough I am thinking of running some ducting to a couple of machines inside like the thicknesser or a jointer or planer. I guess I would box it in in plywood or something cheap.
Any thoughts appreciated. If  can't place it out the back I'll just put it on wheels and roll it from place to place and hook up as required. Just thought it would eliminate finding a corner for it and having it outside I would get double the benefit of no wasted space and a quieter workshop garage. If this is over kill and perhaps theres another way I would be interested also. I am just a hobbyist/DIY but sick of the mess. I have a Festool midi for the finer sanding but its useless for bigger chips of course.

thanks

Don't wake me, I'm livin' the dream!

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline Slappy

  • Posts: 567
Re: Dust extractor 1hp or 2?
« Reply #1 on: November 05, 2013, 10:47 PM »
I plan the same thing outside of garage/shop , I'm looking at a 2HP
 best part of outside is all the really small fines are outside & blown to the wind instead of into a filter bag ,
I'll have a cyclone to collect the chips
less back pressure means more suction I figure .
  BUT I'd love some feedback as well  [embarassed]
Mike

Offline leakyroof

  • Posts: 2198
Re: Dust extractor 1hp or 2?
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2013, 12:30 PM »
The most common mistake when sizing and buying a Central DC unit is to buy based on price and also belief in the performance figures quoted about a particular unit. Way too many of we woodworkers have been burned or frustrated, and end up playing the 'upgrade' game with fairly continous purchases of larger and larger DC collectors... [embarassed]
 So, buy the largest unit you can afford and run safely with the electrical system you have, or plan to have with a minimal upgrade of adding a breaker or running a new circuit.
 The better the Micron Rating of the filter in your unit that you're looking at, then hopefully the least amount of dust being exited from it.[ If you're mounting the DC unit out of the shop, then this is a different equation for you, as most people can't easily do that. [cool]]
 Ducting ,and the materials chosen to run it are key to a successful install, or a source of frustration. Lots of people use plastic piping, but Metal is preferred for all but the last few feet if possible when you could switch over to a flex pipe to tie to a machine or blast gate.
 Lots of info out there, we've all been there. Single Stage is not as good as a Cyclone or 2 stage system, but it's where we all tend to start.. [smile]
 So, I vote for the 2 HP unit.. [wink]
Not as many Sanders as PA Floor guy.....

Offline Acrobat

  • Posts: 465
Re: Dust extractor 1hp or 2?
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2013, 04:03 PM »
Excellent. Helpful and straightforward advice. I'll take it and get a 2hp model then. I'll start with the flex plastic piping for now and wheel it around the shop, eventually if money and time permits, I hope to install a in-place metal ducting system and have it outside with a cyclone thing attached. I assume they can be retro-fitted or added somewhere inline?

Thanks
Don't wake me, I'm livin' the dream!

Offline leakyroof

  • Posts: 2198
Re: Dust extractor 1hp or 2?
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2013, 04:23 PM »
Excellent. Helpful and straightforward advice. I'll take it and get a 2hp model then. I'll start with the flex plastic piping for now and wheel it around the shop, eventually if money and time permits, I hope to install a in-place metal ducting system and have it outside with a cyclone thing attached. I assume they can be retro-fitted or added somewhere inline?

Thanks

The ductwork can always be played with, and with future shop purchases of something that needs DC in its new location, and no ductwork running near it...you tend to play catch up with machines that you buy once you've layed out what you 'thought' was the last update to your system that it would 'ever' need... [embarassed]
 The cyclone should actually be bought BEFORE major redo's of ductwork since the increase in suction and duct length runs can really change how you once had your set-up layed out. Single stage machines force us to stick close to one or two machines, cyclones can allow multiple machines to be hooked up at the same time, with just a blast gate being opened to allow suction to that needed machine.  Your duct work runs can really change enough to open up possibilities about present and future needs when you're not tied to low performance from having too long of a pipe run like with an underpowered system.
 I'm no different than anyone else. Still have a single stage unit, with a 2 micron canister filter assembly. Still looking at 3 hp or 5 hp cyclone two stage systems and drooling with wishful thinking... [big grin]
 BUT, I no longer have fine dust sitting on everything either in my shop since I've long ago ditched the tiny 1HP unit with a THIRTY micron bag that popped dust everywhere each time the DC collector was turned on as the filter bag filled with air.... [eek] [eek]
 I knew it was a problem, but was better than nothing for the large chips and sawdust that until that point, had NO where to go when I had ZERO DC collection starting out.  [mad]

 So, read up on-line, there are also great books on the subject out there. There are also some interesting mod's that people do to their single stage collectors to help keep the finer dust out of the filter bags or canisters and down into the collection bag instead.
Not as many Sanders as PA Floor guy.....

Offline Acrobat

  • Posts: 465
Re: Dust extractor 1hp or 2?
« Reply #5 on: November 06, 2013, 07:19 PM »
Ha, ha, I hear ya. Plenty of times I've said no more purchases, it'll do for now, then wham, a "I gotta have it" comes along. [wink]
Thanks for your advice, gotta love this forum.
Don't wake me, I'm livin' the dream!

Offline Slappy

  • Posts: 567
Re: Dust extractor 1hp or 2?
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2013, 12:00 AM »
So with DC more really is better   ?   ?

I've got a outside wall that I can place the unit on the other side of just have to build a small enclosure to keep the weather off it .
 I see large wood producers that have the cyclones up high , is there a reason for the why for having them up above the building or at least near the roof   ?   ?
Mike

Offline leakyroof

  • Posts: 2198
Re: Dust extractor 1hp or 2?
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2013, 01:39 PM »
So with DC more really is better   ?   ?

I've got a outside wall that I can place the unit on the other side of just have to build a small enclosure to keep the weather off it .
 I see large wood producers that have the cyclones up high , is there a reason for the why for having them up above the building or at least near the roof   ?   ?
  It isn't so much bigger is better, it's more along the lines of 'adding a longer run of ductwork' now means your old unit doesn't work that well with pulling dust and chips from that longer distance. Larger impellars or fan sizes mean larger motors to turn them under a load. At some point, we get tired of cleaning the filter bag or canister, so we finally opt for a 2 stage unit to prevent alot of crud from reaching whatever our filter is in the first place.
  If you can mount your unit outside, then you're not worrying about the level of air quality or cleanliness coming out of the filter side of the DC collector since it isn't inside your shop or workspace anymore. This means you could opt for a generally much cheaper filter bag that isn't a low Micron count since it's not having to do much in the way of filtering with being mounted outside.  The downside is that you're sucking air out of your shop that might be heated or air conditioned, through the DC system, and vented outside. That can get pricey... [eek]   That's why many of us stay with an indoor unit and work on the lowest level of Micron output of the filter that we can live with. We keep our conditioned air inside the shop...
 As for the industrial units, I don't know for sure why they are mounted on a roof, or near a roof level other than a couple of guesses. [1] Noise level, Cyclones can be fairly high in noise levels, so mounting it on a roof keeps it away.
[2] Space. If a building footprint takes up the main part of a lot, then mounting the Cyclone on your roof means you don't use up precious space along a wall or the building.[3] Collector Box size. Since Cyclones can be pretty tall as an assembly, the collection box or barrel below them could suffer if you're always limited to keeping one inside a standard ceiling height spec.
 if the unit is roof mounted, I could see how a much larger collection box or barrel system could now be built to a taller,larger spec so you didn't have to change it or empty it as often. These are all guesses on my part, maybe someone can chime in with real world knowledge.. [embarassed]
 
Not as many Sanders as PA Floor guy.....

Offline Slappy

  • Posts: 567
Re: Dust extractor 1hp or 2?
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2013, 01:58 PM »
I'm near the San Francisco bay so weather extremes are not that harsh at all , so keeping the room cool or warm is not a big concern to me .
 In room air quality is a prime concern to me & to have all the fines exhausted outta the room in a Big Thing to myself .
 But a added benefit of a outside exhaust is as you state less back pressure from a fine filter bag meaning the system's suction is greater . 
Mike