Author Topic: Makitas new 18V trim router  (Read 6540 times)

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Makitas new 18V trim router
« on: October 09, 2017, 01:33 PM »
It is the DRT50 in Europe and the XTR01 in the US. Anyone here has one?  Spill yer beans if you do...

I have used the corded model that shares base accessories with the new model. The corded was not a favorite of mine personally, but a decent machine - and very affordable.

I did take a look at the 18V model and it feels very solid and the idea of not having a cord on a light duty router is very appealing to me. I sometimes hinge mortise on site and similar tasks apart from a regular edge trimming so a 18V plunge base and edge base router is very appealing to me.

I would be more happy to see one from Festool, Mafell or Metabo but I do have the odd Makita 18V tool.

I think the current generation of 18V battery systems open up a lot of possibilities.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

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Offline T. Ernsberger

  • Posts: 832
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2017, 01:59 PM »
I used the new Matkita cordless trim router and it’s pretty impressive.  It felt like it had the same power and feel as my Bosch Colt.  Overall I was impressed.  I was impressed with the cordless Tracksaw too!

Offline PatR

  • Posts: 183
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2017, 02:45 PM »
I bought one last week. It is the basic tool as I already have the 110v corded version with all the base. The full set, which has the offset base included but no battery or charger is not available until early November (in the UK).

It is a cracking bit of kit and is as powerful as the corded version. The brushed motor is not only quieter but the soft start is far more controlled and... err soft. I initially thought that it would be a bit top heavy with the bulk and weight of the battery but it isn't and it is just as easy to use as the corded one without the embuggerance of the cable which can, and does, get in the way at times.

I like both versions but I do like the freedom of the cordless one. It seems to last forever on a fully charged battery albeit I am not using it constantly and only as a DIYer. Being able to use my existing RC0700 Makita bases and the side fence and bars off my beloved Elu MOF96e is a real bonus.

If you already have the Makita battery platform then it is an excellent addition to your tool fleet. If you don't, then the total price of the cordless version and a battery and charger makes it a considered purchase. Unless of course, freedom from the mains is an essential. If it is then this lovely little trimmer is just the job.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2017, 04:04 PM »
Thanks Tyler and PatR for the replies.

The comparisons are much appreciated. I did have a Bosch Colt for a number of years and a colleague has the corded Makita, well three of them...

I have a Virutex edge router with plunge base and add ons and I like the simplicity and low weight of the tool. The Makita is quite similar and having a cordless one would help out a lot in the workshop too. For some routing I don't bother with a vac and this year there has been plenty of on site small router tasks that I didn't bring a router for - just because the hassle of a cord.

I have a Festool OF1010 with a lot of bells and whistles but I hardly ever use it. I use the OFK500 for edge routing, Bosch for larger work and the Virutex for small tasks. The Makita would replace the OF1010 (!!!) and the Virutex. I can't get rid of the OFK500, like it too much and have a lot of bits for it.

Going Makita I would see a few years good use out of it and then perhaps Mafell, Metabo or Festool has an 18V'r out on the market too. :)

Will take a long hard look at the kit.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline glass1

  • Posts: 345
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2017, 07:38 PM »
I have corded and cordless. Both are good routers. The cordless is awesome in that it’s as powerful as corded and just rocks. All the bases are cool. One disapointmented in each, the corded has no light and the plunge base has play in plunge, I have yet to try to address this with a mod. Note, that the Makita guide rail attachment works with this router, even has the little leveling foot like on the festool routers.

Offline DB10

  • Posts: 899
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2017, 08:05 PM »
Hi @Henrik R / Pingvinlakrits  I have both the corded and cordless Makita trimmer / router, I picked the cordless version up about six months ago and it is now my go to small router. All the bases from the corded model fit the cordless model and as others have mentioned the soft start brushless motor is great but the best part of the cordless router is the inclusion of LED lights that the corded model doesn't have.

 One of the most frustrating things with the corded model was the very short length of cable that came with the router, a right pain when routing door jambs up high as the extension lead was just another obstacle to get in the way but with the 18v trimmer door jambs and other hinge work is fast and simple, I haven't cut a door butt by hand since I got the 18v trimmer.
 As for batteries I use the 5ah batteries as they weigh almost the same as the 3ah batteries and the trimmer does not feel top heavy in any way,  in fact it feels the same as the corded version, the only down side to the 18v trimmer I've noticed is when the battery dies half way through a long cut but in saying that a more methodical planning strategy and this could be avoided.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #6 on: October 10, 2017, 05:06 PM »
Thanks again, I have all the info I need now.

Good to know about the weight of the 5 Ah battery, the only battery I have is the 3 Ah one, for a Pin Nailer, so I was thinking I would get two 5Ah batteries to the router and if they are roughly the same weight that is just a bonus. The Pin Nailer is a very good little unit and it seems it has gotten an upgrade too - pity it is so expensive!

Makita has several attractive 18V offerings - though some really awkward ones too (cough cough, nail gun). I am not looking to expand the Makita outfit that much but the router will work as a self contained unit regardless of my other line ups so I am quite sure I will bite - the responses in this thread has confirmed my expectations of the router.

What DB10 posted about working door jambs is one of the tasks I was thinking about that cordless is way nicer to lug around. I modified some 60 or more hinges on a house a week ago and had to run around the scaffolding and in and out through the windows. I was going to use a router but the whole prospect of running around with a cable put me off so hammer and chisel it was for a full day and a half. I would honestly not have saved much time running a corded router.

Cheers guys, great feedback!

/ Henrik
 
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline DB10

  • Posts: 899
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #7 on: October 10, 2017, 10:42 PM »
  Your welcome let us know how you get on with it.
That 23g pin nailer you mentioned that has been upgraded is next on my Makita list, just waiting for them to release it down here. The problem with Makita is, some tools like the cordless router we got first in Aus, other tools we can be left waiting a year or more for a release date, might have to import one from Europe if it's as good as the reviews are saying.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #8 on: October 11, 2017, 02:16 AM »
  Your welcome let us know how you get on with it.
That 23g pin nailer you mentioned that has been upgraded is next on my Makita list, just waiting for them to release it down here. The problem with Makita is, some tools like the cordless router we got first in Aus, other tools we can be left waiting a year or more for a release date, might have to import one from Europe if it's as good as the reviews are saying.

I am curious to see how they improved the 23ga pin nailer - I use mine every now and then and it is a handy machine. I could look into the new nailer and see what the fuzz is all about. Not sure that I would upgrade as we have pin nailers in the work shop but you never know.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #9 on: October 14, 2017, 03:33 PM »
Ok, got me the router the other day. It is very nicely built and after trying the plunge base I bought the router and ordered the plunge base. It was not expensive but it also turns out I can get the corded router plus four bases for only twice as much as just the plunge base... I could actually use the tiltable base so might snag the corded kit too - could probably just hand the corded machine to my colleague and keep the bases.

Was supposed to give the machine a work out but batteries needed charging - got me the 5Ah batt's. Machine runs smoothly and the LED and soft start is a plus.

Sold of my big Festool OF1010 kit with LR32 and MFS400 and rails as I practically never use it. That will pay for the Makita and some  change left after the add ons - most would make that out to be a very poor trade but I'd rather have a machine I actually use more often than having one that sort of never gets any playtime.  I don't even feel sad about it - the buyer seems thrilled and I am glad to see it off my shelf.

Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline DB10

  • Posts: 899
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2017, 10:34 PM »
  I hear you, both of my Corded and cordless Makita's plus my big Triton which is installed in my router table get used a lot more than my OF 1400, I have a job Next week rebating a couple of French doors that OF 1400 will get used for so it does come in handy from time to time but the spaces between time can be quite long,
 it's just so handy to grab the cordless Makita, but that's just the nature of my work I guess.

 Just a word of caution regarding the Makita plunge base, mine worked flawlessly for a couple of years on the corded trimmer but it managed somehow to get a small burr on the inside of the plunge base, it seemed that a very small piece of the casting just came away and raised slightly, this was un noticed by me but caused the plunge base to become stuck on the body of my cordless trimmer, it also made a groove into the soft aluminium body of the trimmer, once I discovered the burr and removed it all was good a again but I had to use wet and dry to get the smoothness back on the trimmer body and inside of the plunge base. I just pay extra attention now when attaching the plunge base to either of the trimmer bodies.

Offline J0hn

  • Posts: 103
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2017, 04:59 PM »
Woodhaven makes a decent 'offset' plate that is a direct replacement

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01DFF9J5I/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1




Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #12 on: October 18, 2017, 04:31 PM »
That offset base looks sweet.

It is possible to do the very same thing with the offset attachment though, I can take a knob off the plunge base (or buy a generic one) and take off the offset base and fit it with the knob where the off set bit goes. Someone showed this on a YT video. That made me buy the off set base. 

Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Laminator

  • Posts: 299
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #13 on: October 18, 2017, 10:33 PM »
I got the router and offset base delivered yesterday and put it to use on a job today.  I am very happy to report that it works very well fabricating laminate.   I will cut the base plate off where it sticks out on the back side (its a nuisance) but other than that it is a very solid machine.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #14 on: October 20, 2017, 08:04 AM »
I got the router and offset base delivered yesterday and put it to use on a job today.  I am very happy to report that it works very well fabricating laminate.   I will cut the base plate off where it sticks out on the back side (its a nuisance) but other than that it is a very solid machine.

It was the Makita offset base - not the one from the previous post by J0hn? 

The shape is a little bit odd, I haven't had time to fiddle with the bits and pieces yet.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #15 on: October 20, 2017, 08:28 AM »
I have corded and cordless. Both are good routers. The cordless is awesome in that it’s as powerful as corded and just rocks. All the bases are cool. One disapointmented in each, the corded has no light and the plunge base has play in plunge, I have yet to try to address this with a mod. Note, that the Makita guide rail attachment works with this router, even has the little leveling foot like on the festool routers.

You’ll find most of the cordless tools from Makita are superior to their corded counterparts.  Makita’s been investing more R&D into updating and refining their cordless tools over their corded counter parts.   

Makita fixes a lot of issues with the XP6000 corded track saw in the new cordless XPS01PTJ track saw.  A lot of the Makita corded models in their tool line-up haven’t seen a model refresh in 6-10 years.

Makita is really trying hard to push people onto their cordless platform. 

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #16 on: October 20, 2017, 08:42 AM »
Steve: I really like that, instead of resting on old laurels they are refreshing the line up. I agree that many of the new tools feel really good.

They need to discontinue that fugly cordless nail gun and get one out that is smaller, better and more ergonomic.

As a side note I passed a larger dealership and - as I often do - stopped and checked out the news. Hitachi tools feel great in hand. I do think Milwaukee are way too heavy and according to a repair shop I know of they fail just as much as other brands. I have never been keen on DeWalt but they are turning in the right direction too. They have a new-ish nail gun out that looked and felt good in hand. About the same size as Ryobi and the battery is really small.

These are exciting times for cordless tools.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline J0hn

  • Posts: 103
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #17 on: October 20, 2017, 10:57 AM »
I got the router and offset base delivered yesterday and put it to use on a job today.  I am very happy to report that it works very well fabricating laminate.   I will cut the base plate off where it sticks out on the back side (its a nuisance) but other than that it is a very solid machine.

It was the Makita offset base - not the one from the previous post by J0hn? 

The shape is a little bit odd, I haven't had time to fiddle with the bits and pieces yet.

I posted a pic of an offset 'plate' which a lot of people would call a base.  I believe they are talking about the true offset base which is commonly used to trim laminate  (it actually moves the spindle over to the corner with a small belt)


Offline Laminator

  • Posts: 299
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #18 on: October 20, 2017, 11:44 AM »
Henrik, the base I got is the one pictured by JOhn.  The base plate is designed to serve as an extended base when used in lieu of the standard round base.   This round part is partially visible at the back of JOhn's pic and is what I will be removing.   

I'm sure this trimmer will replace the Porter Cable offsett base trimmer(s) that Have been my workhorse trimmers for the last 20 years.   Time will tell about the lifespan of the belt and bearings in the new makita which seem quiet and smooth and noticeably less heat build up.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #19 on: October 20, 2017, 01:41 PM »
Steve: I really like that, instead of resting on old laurels they are refreshing the line up. I agree that many of the new tools feel really good.

They need to discontinue that fugly cordless nail gun and get one out that is smaller, better and more ergonomic.

As a side note I passed a larger dealership and - as I often do - stopped and checked out the news. Hitachi tools feel great in hand. I do think Milwaukee are way too heavy and according to a repair shop I know of they fail just as much as other brands. I have never been keen on DeWalt but they are turning in the right direction too. They have a new-ish nail gun out that looked and felt good in hand. About the same size as Ryobi and the battery is really small.

These are exciting times for cordless tools.

The tool companies investing more R&D on cordless tools because they have a better reoccurring revenue with replacement batteries vs. the cordeded tools.  Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.

There’s a lot of incentive for Makita and other companies to invest more in cordless tools.  I can imagine the feature disparity between corded and cordless tools is only going to increase with time.

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 2956
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #20 on: October 20, 2017, 03:20 PM »
Steven said,

"I can imagine the feature disparity between corded and cordless tools is only going to increase with time."

I sometimes do special effects for commercials (tabletop scale). About 25 years ago I was operating a motorized rig that used a cordless drill as the driver. When the battery died I substituted an old school Milwaukee corded drill. Even though the load was negligible the speed was very erratic simply from fluctuations (I assume) from the grid. We had to wait for the battery to charge to get the steady rpm the speed control in the cordless drill provided.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #21 on: October 21, 2017, 04:06 PM »
Laminator: ok, that offset base looks nice. I am thinking of making my own in acrylic or plexi. We don't really get those after market bases here, if we did I would probably get one. Not that big deal making my own but if there is a working solution, complete with knob I wouldn't mind.

Michael Kellough: interesting.

Did my first routing today, edge chamfering Staron and Oak. It is a smooth operating machine indeed. It feels on par with the Virutex (750W) corded unit it is replacing and it is a little more stable and a little better balanced for edge routing. Love the LED, soft start and so far I am very happy with the purchase.

Haven't done any plunge routing yet, maybe tomorrow.

One nitpick is that the plunge base locking lever is a bit fiddly and hard to reach comfortably with the fingertips. It is also very sensitive going back, a little too much effort to lock positively and too "easy" to release.  I don't like how much effort is needed to  plunge and lock. I will add something to the lever to give me a little more leverage for the fingers.

I am trying to keep battery platforms to a bare minimum but the Makita is such a niece and useful piece of kit so I don't mind it being the odd one out in the line up. It will probably be used 90% in the workshop and should Festool or Metabo release a similar machine in the future I would still be happy using the h*ck out of the Makita until I can consolidate battery platforms.

I did sell off my two least used routers to get the Makita - and it also enabled me to sell one of my two OFK500 routers so at this point I made a good deal out of the trade. Less machines that see more use. Awesome. 
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #22 on: October 21, 2017, 09:14 PM »
Laminator: ok, that offset base looks nice. I am thinking of making my own in acrylic or plexi. We don't really get those after market bases here, if we did I would probably get one. Not that big deal making my own but if there is a working solution, complete with knob I wouldn't mind.

Michael Kellough: interesting.

Did my first routing today, edge chamfering Staron and Oak. It is a smooth operating machine indeed. It feels on par with the Virutex (750W) corded unit it is replacing and it is a little more stable and a little better balanced for edge routing. Love the LED, soft start and so far I am very happy with the purchase.

Haven't done any plunge routing yet, maybe tomorrow.

One nitpick is that the plunge base locking lever is a bit fiddly and hard to reach comfortably with the fingertips. It is also very sensitive going back, a little too much effort to lock positively and too "easy" to release.  I don't like how much effort is needed to  plunge and lock. I will add something to the lever to give me a little more leverage for the fingers.

I am trying to keep battery platforms to a bare minimum but the Makita is such a niece and useful piece of kit so I don't mind it being the odd one out in the line up. It will probably be used 90% in the workshop and should Festool or Metabo release a similar machine in the future I would still be happy using the h*ck out of the Makita until I can consolidate battery platforms.

I did sell off my two least used routers to get the Makita - and it also enabled me to sell one of my two OFK500 routers so at this point I made a good deal out of the trade. Less machines that see more use. Awesome.

How do you feel it stacks up against Festool’s trim Router? 

Offline glass1

  • Posts: 345
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #23 on: October 21, 2017, 11:24 PM »
Stephen Owen:name one issue that Makita fixed on their track saw from corded to cordless. For the record I own both.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #24 on: October 22, 2017, 03:34 PM »
Stephen Owen:name one issue that Makita fixed on their track saw from corded to cordless. For the record I own both.

The changes or refinements are minor.  They changed the dust collection port.  The new cordless saw is going to support a wider range of blades design for use specifically for cordless brushless motors.  The handle ergonomics changed slightly too.   I think they had to change the handle to make room for the two batteries.

I wish they would have used a true 36 Volt platform like Dewalt so you wouldn’t have to stick 2 batteries in the saw.  Overtime the two batteries could wear out at different rates impacting performance.


Offline WastedP

  • Posts: 342
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #25 on: October 22, 2017, 10:40 PM »
Stephen Owen:name one issue that Makita fixed on their track saw from corded to cordless. For the record I own both.
I wish they would have used a true 36 Volt platform like Dewalt so you wouldn’t have to stick 2 batteries in the saw.  Overtime the two batteries could wear out at different rates impacting performance.

I have the 18Vx2 string trimmer and blower, with a pair of 5.0 Ah batteries for each, that I have used since July.  The blower runs through batteries pretty fast, so I have mixed and matched and used different chargers at different rates.  I have noticed no issues or changes in performance since new.

I wish I had read this thread earlier this week; I bought a corded Makita router that replaced a Bosch Colt with a bad lower bearing.  I looked at the cordless router and balked at the $70 premium over the corded model (with no batteries or charger).  The biggest issue with the corded router is the arcane placement of the power cord, coming straight up out of the top.  The memory in a coiled cord seems to swing the cord into the router's path.  If that cordless router is as great as everyone here says, I might still go get one.  One thing I noticed when I as looking at the cordless model was that the power switch is a single membrane switch in a weird location.  It seems like it would be hard to single-handedly turn it on and off.  Any thoughts on that?

Offline J0hn

  • Posts: 103
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #26 on: October 22, 2017, 11:36 PM »
Keep in mind that a lot of woodworkers follow the guideline to 'always unplug your router when changing bits'

With that being said, Makita rightfully made it a little difficult to turn the router on.  There is an 'unlock' button that you first have to press which also turns on the led light.  Directly adjacent to that is the actual on/off switch.  It may seem a little awkward at first, but at least for me, once I used it for a while, it is very easy to reach up with your thumb, feel the buttons and turn it on/off.  On my Colt, and Dewalt pony router, you definitely have to take a hand off the router to get to the switch

I have the 36v blower (probably my most used cordless tool) along with the 18v blower.  The other day I saw Acme Tools had the 36v blower with (4) 5.0 batteries and a dual charger for $339 (basically the cost of the batteries) and I ended up buying it - my wife likes using my 36v blower so now she will have her own  :)

« Last Edit: October 22, 2017, 11:41 PM by J0hn »

Offline DB10

  • Posts: 899
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #27 on: October 23, 2017, 04:26 AM »
Stephen Owen:name one issue that Makita fixed on their track saw from corded to cordless. For the record I own both.
I wish they would have used a true 36 Volt platform like Dewalt so you wouldn’t have to stick 2 batteries in the saw.  Overtime the two batteries could wear out at different rates impacting performance.

I have the 18Vx2 string trimmer and blower, with a pair of 5.0 Ah batteries for each, that I have used since July.  The blower runs through batteries pretty fast, so I have mixed and matched and used different chargers at different rates.  I have noticed no issues or changes in performance since new.

I wish I had read this thread earlier this week; I bought a corded Makita router that replaced a Bosch Colt with a bad lower bearing.  I looked at the cordless router and balked at the $70 premium over the corded model (with no batteries or charger).  The biggest issue with the corded router is the arcane placement of the power cord, coming straight up out of the top.  The memory in a coiled cord seems to swing the cord into the router's path.  If that cordless router is as great as everyone here says, I might still go get one.  One thing I noticed when I as looking at the cordless model was that the power switch is a single membrane switch in a weird location.  It seems like it would be hard to single-handedly turn it on and off.  Any thoughts on that?
It's also frustrating that the power cable is so short on the corded Makita model. Soft start and LED lights on the cordless model plus no cable getting in the way probably make it worth the premium imo.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #28 on: October 23, 2017, 10:50 AM »
Stephen Owen:name one issue that Makita fixed on their track saw from corded to cordless. For the record I own both.
I wish they would have used a true 36 Volt platform like Dewalt so you wouldn’t have to stick 2 batteries in the saw.  Overtime the two batteries could wear out at different rates impacting performance.

I have the 18Vx2 string trimmer and blower, with a pair of 5.0 Ah batteries for each, that I have used since July.  The blower runs through batteries pretty fast, so I have mixed and matched and used different chargers at different rates.  I have noticed no issues or changes in performance since new.

I wish I had read this thread earlier this week; I bought a corded Makita router that replaced a Bosch Colt with a bad lower bearing.  I looked at the cordless router and balked at the $70 premium over the corded model (with no batteries or charger).  The biggest issue with the corded router is the arcane placement of the power cord, coming straight up out of the top.  The memory in a coiled cord seems to swing the cord into the router's path.  If that cordless router is as great as everyone here says, I might still go get one.  One thing I noticed when I as looking at the cordless model was that the power switch is a single membrane switch in a weird location.  It seems like it would be hard to single-handedly turn it on and off.  Any thoughts on that?
It's also frustrating that the power cable is so short on the corded Makita model. Soft start and LED lights on the cordless model plus no cable getting in the way probably make it worth the premium imo.

I’m rarher turned off by the fact Makita has done nothing to update their SP6000  track saw since 2008.  It’s long overdue for a model refresh.  You shouldn’t need an extension cord for a 8ft cut. 

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #29 on: October 23, 2017, 04:16 PM »
StevenOwen:

The OFK500 is still the best balanced edge router I have used to date. It would be super if they churned out an 18V'er - that would be the edge routers dream machine for me, if the balance was as good. 

Still, the Makita is surprisingly well balanced as an edge router with a battery on top.
If I had to let one go or just keep one edge router I would keep the Makita  - the slight difference in user ergonomics  is offset by the lack of a cord.

It is better balanced than the Virutex that the Makita replaced. The Virutex is a nice machine with soft start and runs quiet. The Makita has that too, has lower center of gravity  and adds the LED - awesome.

Is it a game changer? Dunno, but Makita shows the competition that it is possible to make a great little 18V router that does not feel weaker than a small corded one. All the "cheap" add ons are just gravy on top. Will make good use of the tilting base tomorrow after thinking of what could be done with it.   

I haven't pushed the machine or made any strenous routing with it but so far I am very impressed.

I picked up the correct collet for it today and will continue the first project with it tomorrow morning; two bedside tables in massive Oak with Staron/Corian tops. Commissioned by the missus and made by "left-overs" from a side board I built years ago that we don't need any longer. 

Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 1115
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #30 on: October 23, 2017, 04:27 PM »
Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.
If that was true they would also be cheaper.

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Offline antss

  • Posts: 1373
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #31 on: October 23, 2017, 04:37 PM »
Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.
If that was true they would also be cheaper.

Perhaps cheaper to make.

But that sometimes has no correlation to the selling price of a widget or motor.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #32 on: October 23, 2017, 04:51 PM »
Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.
If that was true they would also be cheaper.

Perhaps cheaper to make.

But that sometimes has no correlation to the selling price of a widget or motor.

Demand usually determines price more than anything else.  Brushless tools are in high demand ergo higher prices. 

Offline Svar

  • Posts: 1115
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #33 on: October 23, 2017, 04:59 PM »
Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.
If that was true they would also be cheaper.
Perhaps cheaper to make.
But that sometimes has no correlation to the selling price of a widget or motor.
Demand usually determines price more than anything else.  Brushless tools are in high demand ergo higher prices.
From what I've read, brushless are more difficult to manufacture. Hence my initial response.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #34 on: October 23, 2017, 06:34 PM »
Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.
If that was true they would also be cheaper.
Perhaps cheaper to make.
But that sometimes has no correlation to the selling price of a widget or motor.
Demand usually determines price more than anything else.  Brushless tools are in high demand ergo higher prices.
From what I've read, brushless are more difficult to manufacture. Hence my initial response.

The answer is complicated.  Larger/higher HP brushless motors and cordled brushless motors running on tools that convert AC to DC are more expensive than brushed AC motors.

I’m taking about smaller brusheless motors in smaller battery powered tools.  You don’t see as huge of a cost difference in many brands brushless battery operate tools anymore.  (In the non-Festool brands)

The motor is only one part of the tool.  There’s plenty of tools that have the same motor yet one will cost twice as much as the other tool.  The price of a tool is a sum of all of it’s parts. 
 
« Last Edit: October 23, 2017, 11:03 PM by Steven Owen »

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 2956
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #35 on: October 23, 2017, 07:34 PM »
StevenOwen:

The OFK500 is still the best balanced edge router I have used to date. It would be super if they churned out an 18V'er - that would be the edge routers dream machine for me, if the balance was as good. 

Still, the Makita is surprisingly well balanced as an edge router with a battery on top.
If I had to let one go or just keep one edge router I would keep the Makita  - the slight difference in user ergonomics  is offset by the lack of a cord.

It is better balanced than the Virutex that the Makita replaced. The Virutex is a nice machine with soft start and runs quiet. The Makita has that too, has lower center of gravity  and adds the LED - awesome.

Is it a game changer? Dunno, but Makita shows the competition that it is possible to make a great little 18V router that does not feel weaker than a small corded one. All the "cheap" add ons are just gravy on top. Will make good use of the tilting base tomorrow after thinking of what could be done with it.   

I haven't pushed the machine or made any strenous routing with it but so far I am very impressed.

I picked up the correct collet for it today and will continue the first project with it tomorrow morning; two bedside tables in massive Oak with Staron/Corian tops. Commissioned by the missus and made by "left-overs" from a side board I built years ago that we don't need any longer.

Did it not come with a collet?

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #36 on: October 24, 2017, 03:47 AM »
Michael: it came with just the 6 or 6.35mm collet - something that is not standard over here, most routers are sold with a 8mm collet. Feels kind of cheap I didn't get one "most common standard size" included.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline WastedP

  • Posts: 342
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #37 on: October 24, 2017, 10:19 PM »
The feedback in this thread convinced me to go get one of these routers this morning.  Comparing it to the corded laminate trimmer, for roughly the same price (bare tool), it is no contest.  The cordless is metal instead of plastic, the adjustment rack and pinion is metal, the collet can be worked with one wrench.  The cordless router is heavier, naturally, but the weight is centered and the balance is good.  Right out of the box I thought I'd test it by flush trimming 1x cedar.  I figured it would choke, but it handles it better than the Porter Cable 1-3/4 HP router I usually use.  At lunch time I went back to the dealer and he agreed to take the corded version back in exchange for a second cordless model.

The switch I was concerned about is not really a big deal.  Not needing to drag a 25 foot cord reel around a 12'x20' MFT table is a big deal.  I saw the future today.

The US models I bought came with both 1/4" and 3/8" collets.  It also came with a dust collection attachment.  I put it on and hooked it up to the CT and it was a joke.  The router itself is no joke, though.  If it holds up to laminate trimmer abuse, then it is awesome.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #38 on: October 24, 2017, 10:23 PM »
The feedback in this thread convinced me to go get one of these routers this morning.  Comparing it to the corded laminate trimmer, for roughly the same price (bare tool), it is no contest.  The cordless is metal instead of plastic, the adjustment rack and pinion is metal, the collet can be worked with one wrench.  The cordless router is heavier, naturally, but the weight is centered and the balance is good.  Right out of the box I thought I'd test it by flush trimming 1x cedar.  I figured it would choke, but it handles it better than the Porter Cable 1-3/4 HP router I usually use.  At lunch time I went back to the dealer and he agreed to take the corded version back in exchange for a second cordless model.

The switch I was concerned about is not really a big deal.  Not needing to drag a 25 foot cord reel around a 12'x20' MFT table is a big deal.  I saw the future today.

The US models I bought came with both 1/4" and 3/8" collets.  It also came with a dust collection attachment.  I put it on and hooked it up to the CT and it was a joke.  The router itself is no joke, though.  If it holds up to laminate trimmer abuse, then it is awesome.

It’s been getting very stellar reviews so far.  I’d be surprised if it didn’t perform with laminate.   

Offline lawhoo

  • Posts: 171
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #39 on: October 24, 2017, 11:49 PM »
How can someone in the US get the 8mm collet?

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #40 on: October 25, 2017, 05:01 PM »
How can someone in the US get the 8mm collet?

I can get you the part number tomorrow, I have the little plastic bag for it at the work shop. You should be able to get one from a local dealership.

WastedP: glad you like it!
I have used it a couple of days now - still no heavy use - but so far it is a great piece of kit. I will do some small ad hoc routing this week for some minor custom edge profile work in hard material (Staron/Corian) but I am sure it can handle it.

I was going to try hooking it up to the vac with the shroud but I have no great hopes for Festool-ish DC.

I still don't think it will "replace" the OFK500 - the OFK is "just" an edge router which I am happy to have. But, again, if I had to choose just the one small router it would be the Makita for sure.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2017, 05:06 PM by Henrik R / Pingvinlakrits »
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #41 on: October 25, 2017, 05:09 PM »
Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.
If that was true they would also be cheaper.

From what I have heard the "trouble" with brushless motors used to be that they would not stand up to abuse / knocks very well.
I don't know how they have evolved to find their way in to handtools that are abused on a daily basis.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #42 on: October 25, 2017, 05:23 PM »
Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.
If that was true they would also be cheaper.
 

From what I have heard the "trouble" with brushless motors used to be that they would not stand up to abuse / knocks very well.
I don't know how they have evolved to find their way in to handtools that are abused on a daily basis.

Most tools use a solid aluminum cage with shock absorption to protect the motors.  I’ve never had any issues with knocks or drop impacting hand tools.  The case on the tool gets damaged before the motor ever does. 

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #43 on: October 26, 2017, 02:35 PM »
How can someone in the US get the 8mm collet?

Makita part number is 763618-5

 
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #44 on: October 26, 2017, 02:41 PM »
Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.
If that was true they would also be cheaper.
 

From what I have heard the "trouble" with brushless motors used to be that they would not stand up to abuse / knocks very well.
I don't know how they have evolved to find their way in to handtools that are abused on a daily basis.

Most tools use a solid aluminum cage with shock absorption to protect the motors.  I’ve never had any issues with knocks or drop impacting hand tools.  The case on the tool gets damaged before the motor ever does.

Yes, I am sure you are right but I am just reporting what I read in an article a few years back on the topic. I am not saying that was necessarily true or correct and things have certainly evolved since then. I honestly haven't had a single tool motor give up after a fall over the years as far as I can remember, neither brushed nor brushless. I have burnt out a brushless Festool drill - not even pushing it very hard - but I don't think it was the actual motor catching fire.

Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #45 on: October 26, 2017, 04:56 PM »
Most Brushless direct drive motors are simpler to make and quicker to mass produce than their brushed counterparts.
If that was true they would also be cheaper.
 

From what I have heard the "trouble" with brushless motors used to be that they would not stand up to abuse / knocks very well.
I don't know how they have evolved to find their way in to handtools that are abused on a daily basis.

Most tools use a solid aluminum cage with shock absorption to protect the motors.  I’ve never had any issues with knocks or drop impacting hand tools.  The case on the tool gets damaged before the motor ever does.

Yes, I am sure you are right but I am just reporting what I read in an article a few years back on the topic. I am not saying that was necessarily true or correct and things have certainly evolved since then. I honestly haven't had a single tool motor give up after a fall over the years as far as I can remember, neither brushed nor brushless. I have burnt out a brushless Festool drill - not even pushing it very hard - but I don't think it was the actual motor catching fire.

Stuff like that will always depend on the quality of tool you’re buying.  Sadly the market is full of this made to spec junk from China to fill spots in flyers for Lowe’s and Home Depot.

If you’re buying Festool, Milwaukee, Dewalt, Mafell, Bosch, and Makita brushless.  You usually don’t have to worry about fragility. 

There’s no shortage of poorly designed tools jumping on the brushless bandwagon to make a quick buck.


Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #46 on: October 27, 2017, 04:21 PM »
All data depends on who you ask. I dropped by my Mafell dealer / tool repair center the other day. There is no shortage of broken/faulty brushless drills/machines...  ...the idea that they would hold up better than brushed units seem to bear no weight with the repair guys.

They service all brands in one city and currently have 200 repairs in house, all brands. Milwaukee and Makita are there in droves. New Milwaukee drills by the basketful! He even asked me to keep an eye out for a service tech - they are so busy and need to hire more staff. As we spoke for ten minutes three more repairs were walking in... 

He has been in the game quite a few years and is very knowledgeable. He knows which machines last and which don't. Festool stirrers/mixers are very frequent visitors to the repairshop. They stopped selling them because they got so many returns to the service center. And he is a high volume seller of mixers.  We spoke about different tools and different brands and the conclusion was that there is not one brand that has significantly fewer repairs than any other. Possibly Hitachi, in his view, but not all tools of course.

As a whole Festool ranks well, not as good as Mafell or Hitachi and a few other brands but going by percentage of sold units and repair orders they are a bit above average - in a good way. It is nice to have someone to ask "do you get any in for service out of these tools" and he can actually answer it in detail.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #47 on: October 27, 2017, 04:58 PM »
All data depends on who you ask. I dropped by my Mafell dealer / tool repair center the other day. There is no shortage of broken/faulty brushless drills/machines...  ...the idea that they would hold up better than brushed units seem to bear no weight with the repair guys.

They service all brands in one city and currently have 200 repairs in house, all brands. Milwaukee and Makita are there in droves. New Milwaukee drills by the basketful! He even asked me to keep an eye out for a service tech - they are so busy and need to hire more staff. As we spoke for ten minutes three more repairs were walking in... 

He has been in the game quite a few years and is very knowledgeable. He knows which machines last and which don't. Festool stirrers/mixers are very frequent visitors to the repairshop. They stopped selling them because they got so many returns to the service center. And he is a high volume seller of mixers.  We spoke about different tools and different brands and the conclusion was that there is not one brand that has significantly fewer repairs than any other. Possibly Hitachi, in his view, but not all tools of course.

As a whole Festool ranks well, not as good as Mafell or Hitachi and a few other brands but going by percentage of sold units and repair orders they are a bit above average - in a good way. It is nice to have someone to ask "do you get any in for service out of these tools" and he can actually answer it in detail.

Is there actually enough Mafell sales data to make a fair comparison between Festool and Mafell?  I would think Festool is selling a 1000x more tools in North America vs Mafell.

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 2956
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #48 on: October 27, 2017, 06:08 PM »
"Is there actually enough Mafell sales data to make a fair comparison between Festool and Mafell?  I would think Festool is selling a 1000x more tools in North America vs Mafell. "

Henrik and the repair guy he spoke with live in Sweden.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #49 on: October 29, 2017, 06:09 AM »
Steve; I have enough data to divvy up all Festool offerings in reliable vs sketchy columns. That data is from the three largest vendors in Sweden - with which I have a personal report with the head of staff on a first name basis. All are high volume sellers and one is an official Festool service center.

Mafell? Info is more scarce - that is for sure given the lower volumes of machines shipping. However the data is there as two of the above are Mafell dealers and at least one is in direct contact with Mafell on a weekly basis. One can always extrapolate those numbers but so far all I can say is that Mafell service returns are extremely low no matter how you work the numbers.

I have added to those numbers myself - on that occasion we did not agree on the problem though - and I still have good reason to think I was right in that matter.  I got a replacement for that machine anyway.

I am not sure I hold Mafell significantly higher in terms of build quality over Festool - but they do have fewer lemons in the line up - and their line up is still quite extensive within their field. I trust all brands on a "per-machine-basis" but I admit I expect more from Festool and Mafell - and sometimes you just don't get that.
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #50 on: October 29, 2017, 11:06 AM »
Steve; I have enough data to divvy up all Festool offerings in reliable vs sketchy columns. That data is from the three largest vendors in Sweden - with which I have a personal report with the head of staff on a first name basis. All are high volume sellers and one is an official Festool service center.

Mafell? Info is more scarce - that is for sure given the lower volumes of machines shipping. However the data is there as two of the above are Mafell dealers and at least one is in direct contact with Mafell on a weekly basis. One can always extrapolate those numbers but so far all I can say is that Mafell service returns are extremely low no matter how you work the numbers.

I have added to those numbers myself - on that occasion we did not agree on the problem though - and I still have good reason to think I was right in that matter.  I got a replacement for that machine anyway.

I am not sure I hold Mafell significantly higher in terms of build quality over Festool - but they do have fewer lemons in the line up - and their line up is still quite extensive within their field. I trust all brands on a "per-machine-basis" but I admit I expect more from Festool and Mafell - and sometimes you just don't get that.

At the price people expect a lot from Mafell and Festool without a doubt.  We really do need a 3rd competitor in the high end tool market with kind of thinking to put more pressure on Festool and Mafell. 

I’d love to see Bosch, Dewalt or Makita step up with pro-lines that offer a higher standard of tool manufacturing.  That would be asking a lot from 3 shareholder culture companies. 

Offline glass1

  • Posts: 345
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #51 on: October 30, 2017, 06:55 PM »
I think brushless and brushed motors can handle abuse in different ways. On brushed motors the brushes are sacrificial and take the abuse(obviously limited like the pads on disc brakes). The brushless motors use electronics to measure abuse by measuring heat, when overheated they turn off, without the electronics the brushless motors could easily be destroyed.

Offline WastedP

  • Posts: 342
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #52 on: October 30, 2017, 11:57 PM »
...If it holds up to laminate trimmer abuse, then it is awesome.

It’s been getting very stellar reviews so far.  I’d be surprised if it didn’t perform with laminate.

Sorry, I was referring to the level of abuse that I tend to put on laminate trimmers.  Ridiculously deep dadoes done in one pass, for example, or trying to flush trim too much or too thick of material.  It's so easy to bite off more than a laminate trimmer can chew.

The smoothness of this laminate trimmer is on a level above pretty much every other small router I've owned or used (PC, Makita, DeWalt, Bosch, Rigid).  I've never used an MFK 700, so I can't compare it to that.  It's a nice tool to use.  I don't know if that's  because the competitive tools are garbage, or if this one is just really good.

An aside about tool reliability:  When I lived in a different area, I used to buy all of my tools from a dealer that carries all kinds of lines and has their own in-house repair department.  Before making any purchase, I'd take the tool to the back repair counter, and ask them what they thought of it.  They weren't working on commission, so they wouldn't hesitate to tell me if a tool had a major flaw or if a competitive tool was better.  They were good at explaining what components were upgraded from one model in a line to another (i.e., Makita makes something like six different cordless drills at six different price points).

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #53 on: October 31, 2017, 09:06 AM »
...If it holds up to laminate trimmer abuse, then it is awesome.

It’s been getting very stellar reviews so far.  I’d be surprised if it didn’t perform with laminate.

Sorry, I was referring to the level of abuse that I tend to put on laminate trimmers.  Ridiculously deep dadoes done in one pass, for example, or trying to flush trim too much or too thick of material.  It's so easy to bite off more than a laminate trimmer can chew.

The smoothness of this laminate trimmer is on a level above pretty much every other small router I've owned or used (PC, Makita, DeWalt, Bosch, Rigid).  I've never used an MFK 700, so I can't compare it to that.  It's a nice tool to use.  I don't know if that's  because the competitive tools are garbage, or if this one is just really good.

An aside about tool reliability:  When I lived in a different area, I used to buy all of my tools from a dealer that carries all kinds of lines and has their own in-house repair department.  Before making any purchase, I'd take the tool to the back repair counter, and ask them what they thought of it.  They weren't working on commission, so they wouldn't hesitate to tell me if a tool had a major flaw or if a competitive tool was better.  They were good at explaining what components were upgraded from one model in a line to another (i.e., Makita makes something like six different cordless drills at six different price points).

Very few cordless and corded edge trimmers/routers are good.  The Rigid would never make anyone’s list.  For all the positive reviews, I would never use the Dewalt models for any laminate dados.

Offline PatR

  • Posts: 183
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #54 on: October 31, 2017, 12:24 PM »
Just to get this thread (almost) back onto the Makita 18v trim router.........I have just received the AimTools (Katsu) offset router base for my DRT50, RT0700 and 240v Katsu trimmers and for £25 delivered, it is an exceptional bit of kit. The Makita OEM version is nearly three times the price and whilst I am sure that it too is excellent, the Katsu base is a cracker and like the other Katsu bases I have, stands up well to the OEM versions in terms of fit and finish.

It comes with an additional knob to mount on the base so that the base, with the offset housing removed, acts as a very effective extension plate.

If anyone is interested in an offset base for any of the Makita palm trimmers, or the Katsu/MerryTools clones at a bargain price, then have a close look at the Katsu version.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SP10174815-Katsu-Trimmer-Plunge-Base-Offset-Base-For-Katsu-Trimmer-101748/292300525752?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649

The Makita 18v trimmer continues to impress and the addition of the two LED lights into the housing top is a brilliant (sic) addition to what is a truly superb, powerful and flexible tool.


Offline Jozsef Kozma

  • Posts: 110
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #55 on: October 31, 2017, 02:08 PM »
Is Festool missing a boat in this line
I love the cordless Sanders the power cord
transformer just makes it everything I can ask

Offline DB10

  • Posts: 899
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #56 on: October 31, 2017, 09:46 PM »
Is Festool missing a boat in this line
I love the cordless Sanders the power cord
transformer just makes it everything I can ask
Yes, but if Festool were to make a cordless trimmer imo, it would need to run on the same system as their 4.2 & 5.2 batteries to compete with the Makita trimmer.

Offline Jozsef Kozma

  • Posts: 110
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #57 on: November 01, 2017, 12:30 PM »
Agreed

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #58 on: November 01, 2017, 01:33 PM »
StevenOwen:

The OFK500 is still the best balanced edge router I have used to date. It would be super if they churned out an 18V'er - that would be the edge routers dream machine for me, if the balance was as good. 

Still, the Makita is surprisingly well balanced as an edge router with a battery on top.
If I had to let one go or just keep one edge router I would keep the Makita  - the slight difference in user ergonomics  is offset by the lack of a cord.

It is better balanced than the Virutex that the Makita replaced. The Virutex is a nice machine with soft start and runs quiet. The Makita has that too, has lower center of gravity  and adds the LED - awesome.

Is it a game changer? Dunno, but Makita shows the competition that it is possible to make a great little 18V router that does not feel weaker than a small corded one. All the "cheap" add ons are just gravy on top. Will make good use of the tilting base tomorrow after thinking of what could be done with it.   

I haven't pushed the machine or made any strenous routing with it but so far I am very impressed.

I picked up the correct collet for it today and will continue the first project with it tomorrow morning; two bedside tables in massive Oak with Staron/Corian tops. Commissioned by the missus and made by "left-overs" from a side board I built years ago that we don't need any longer.

Festool has the best ergonomics.  An 18 V would be a huge improvement.  It might also come down to the law of diminishing returns.  The Festool would be better, you would have to justify paying 3 times the price for a handful of minor advantages.

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #59 on: November 01, 2017, 08:59 PM »
Steven and Jozsef: true!

I might be in the minority but I like the OFK500 router bits. I would continue using them if they were to release an 18V OFK but I am not holding my breath. The German Rep said that the new battery shape and transformer opened up a lot of new possibilities for them and he was genuinely interested in our thoughts on the matter. When pushing for a battery OFK it was clear they were not exactly working on one...  ...but after some discussion it was clear to us both that they have a slightly different approach to dust collection and other regulations in Germany. 

After giving him a few examples of use - and mentioning the Makita a few times too many  [wink] he did catch on to the idea. I made sure to push for a Vecturo. And a Nail Gun. And a lot of other things.  [big grin]

However the only confirmation I could squeeze out of him was that an 18V impact is as good as ready and will most likely hit the market next year. That and a new smooth and flexible vac hose that will pretty much eliminate rail drag. :)
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #60 on: November 01, 2017, 09:47 PM »
Steven and Jozsef: true!

I might be in the minority but I like the OFK500 router bits. I would continue using them if they were to release an 18V OFK but I am not holding my breath. The German Rep said that the new battery shape and transformer opened up a lot of new possibilities for them and he was genuinely interested in our thoughts on the matter. When pushing for a battery OFK it was clear they were not exactly working on one...  ...but after some discussion it was clear to us both that they have a slightly different approach to dust collection and other regulations in Germany. 

After giving him a few examples of use - and mentioning the Makita a few times too many  [wink] he did catch on to the idea. I made sure to push for a Vecturo. And a Nail Gun. And a lot of other things.  [big grin]

However the only confirmation I could squeeze out of him was that an 18V impact is as good as ready and will most likely hit the market next year. That and a new smooth and flexible vac hose that will pretty much eliminate rail drag. :)

Makita won’t be their stiffest competition in the impact and drill category.  Bosch with their 18 V wireless charging platform and Milwaukee with their powerful line-up of impact drivers.

The like the power of the Milwaukee brushless motor but I dislike the noisy chuck that makes a lot of gear rattling noises.  Milwaukee needs a chuck redesign. 

It would be nice to see Makita come-up with a wireless charging platform like Bosch. 

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Offline glass1

  • Posts: 345
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #61 on: November 01, 2017, 10:00 PM »
Are you kidding me.  Milwaukee makes better impact and drill than makita? No. The Milwaukee’s are heavy wobbly chuck crap. The top of the line makitas, impact and drill are debomb. In all seriousness Makita is in a different quality league than Milwaukee. Have you actually used these tools ?

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #62 on: November 01, 2017, 10:24 PM »
Are you kidding me.  Milwaukee makes better impact and drill than makita? No. The Milwaukee’s are heavy wobbly chuck crap. The top of the line makitas, impact and drill are debomb. In all seriousness Makita is in a different quality league than Milwaukee. Have you actually used these tools ?

I was taking about Festool’s line-up of cordless drills; not Makita’s. 

Most reviews go back and forth between the Makita and Milwaukee.  The Milwaukee rates better for pure toque the Makita drill rates better for tasks that require more agility and precision.

If I was doing pocket holes and deck screws, I’d pick the Makita.  If I was looking for a hammer drill to run lags and carriage bolts through a 4x4 or 6x6 post, drilling into a paver block, the 700 lbs of torque on the Milwaukee will deliver.  There’s only 400 lbs of torque on the Makita.  The lighter Makita drill and chuck design make it a better all around drill than Milwaukee for tasks that don’t require tons of torque.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2017, 11:56 AM by Steven Owen »

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #63 on: November 02, 2017, 11:44 AM »
I am not familiar with Milwaukee impact drills but Makita sure is a strong contender in that field.

Metabo has that universally appraised high torque 18V machine  - I have the older one rated at _half_ that torque.  I get by fine with it though it lacks any kind of refinement.

If I could pick any impact I would get the Hitachi triple hammer impact. Fits my hand superbly and has the "right dimensions".
Bosch has one with similar ergonomics but it seems to lack in grunt. I haven't kept track on Bosch impacts lately though.

In all fairness there isn't shortage of decent to great impact drills on the market. We just "need" one more... ;)
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 2956
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #64 on: November 02, 2017, 12:15 PM »
I am not familiar with Milwaukee impact drills but Makita sure is a strong contender in that field.

Metabo has that universally appraised high torque 18V machine  - I have the older one rated at _half_ that torque.  I get by fine with it though it lacks any kind of refinement.

If I could pick any impact I would get the Hitachi triple hammer impact. Fits my hand superbly and has the "right dimensions".
Bosch has one with similar ergonomics but it seems to lack in grunt. I haven't kept track on Bosch impacts lately though.

In all fairness there isn't shortage of decent to great impact drills on the market. We just "need" one more... ;)

That's the way I felt about my first 1/4" hex impact driver, also Hitachi, bought in the mid '80s a couple of years before anyone else offered a similar tool in the US. That was a sleek and comfortable tool in the 9.6 volt NiCad range where the benefit of impact drive really made a difference compared to ordinary drill/drivers. (Also way before that refuge from Nike started designing the skins for Hitachi  [tongue])

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #65 on: November 02, 2017, 03:03 PM »
Since we are heading off course in this thread anyway (let's share the blame) I heard today that since Hitachi Powertools are sold to that investment firm they can no longer use the HITACHI brand name (!) and they will rename the company HiKOKI...

All the molds for the tools need to be redone, they will have to redesign the logo etc etc. HiKOKI stems from the Hitachi Koki name.

Thought it was a joke at first but the info comes from an ex product manager at Hitachi and he showed me the press release / statement.

C'mon; Hitachi is a brand name with a strong brand recognition - but HiKOKI?   I don't know...  ::)


http://torque-expo.com/hitachi-koki-to-change-brand-name-to-hikoki-in-2018
Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.

Offline Steven Owen

  • Posts: 240
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #66 on: November 02, 2017, 05:04 PM »
I have the 2015 model of the Milwaukee Brushless.  I’ll probably end-up getting a Makita for my wood working jobs.  The biggest knock against the Milwaukee is the added weight.   

It’s a bit of a pain if you have 100 dowel holes to drill when your drill is about the weight of an Rotex 150 sander.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2017, 05:57 PM by Steven Owen »

Offline Job and Knock

  • Posts: 91
Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #67 on: November 05, 2017, 05:47 AM »
I wish they would have used a true 36 Volt platform like Dewalt so you wouldn’t have to stick 2 batteries in the saw.  Overtime the two batteries could wear out at different rates impacting performance.
Contrary to what you think I'd say Makita made the right decision. The average Makita cordless user is a site-based trade guy who doesn't have the space to carry yet another charger and buy two more non-compatible batteries which can only be used on a single tool to finish maybe the last cut of the day (I carry DW, Makita dual and phone charfers which is quite enough, thanks). I often can't afford to wait while a 36 volt battery charges up - but I already have 12 no. 18 volt batteries in different capacities (mainly 5Ah) to power my ten plus Makita 18 volt tools. Having a saw where I can pull a live 18 volt battery off another tool to get the job finished is just plain common sense to me. A lot of other tradesmen will see it the same way, I'm certain.

From what I have heard the "trouble" with brushless motors used to be that they would not stand up to abuse / knocks very well.
I don't know how they have evolved to find their way in to handtools that are abused on a daily basis.
They must have evolved. I still use a Makita BTD145 brushless impact most days - it's more than six years old, almost all of it site work, and has been dropped off scaffolding towers, stagings, benches, etc on a few occasions. I'm on my third body casing and my second switch and control plate (the thing on the front which selects the speed - it was the first 3-speed model), but that's just down to the sheer amount of abuse this tool has taken. When it dies it will be replaced by a DTD170, although that may take a while. Similarly my current cordless SDS drill is a brushless 18 volt Makita (DHP242) which has drilled hundreds of 16mm (5/8in) holes in heavy concrete, engineering brick and stonework over the last three years to take resin-anchored threaded bar. That, too, is still going strong and hasn't missed a beat

This morning I finally bit the bullet and ordered the cordless trimmer. It will be used mainly out on site for recessing door ironmongery (hinges, flush bolts, electric closers, keeps, etc) so it won't be having a particularly hard life. It replaces the RT0700C I currently use for the job - and I have to agree that the cord as supplied by the factory is a joke. I cut mine off and replaced it with a far longer one in the second or third week on site. It was that bad
« Last Edit: November 05, 2017, 05:51 AM by Job and Knock »
Simplicity is the embodiment of purity and unity
- Shaker Maxims

Re: Makitas new 18V trim router
« Reply #68 on: November 07, 2017, 02:46 PM »
My Colleague has three RT0700 routers, all fitted with a plug-it cord. They are fitted with the three most used trimming bits and always ready to go at preset depth.

Did some edge trimming on site today with the Makita 18V trimming the end of a laminate floor that had one end sticking out in a doorway, an obstacle for the threshold/endpiece. A straight piece of board and a flush trim bit and it was done in twenty seconds. Floor was 16mm solid wood flooring and the Makita sailed through the cut. Normally I would not have bothered bringing a router out for such a small task but this time it was literally perfect and the router, battery and bit took up very little space.

Well on site it turned out I needed to re-chamfer some oak trim pieces that I had to plane down to size.



Festool:  CS 50EB precisio set, Domino DF500, DF XL 700, OFK500 edge router, OF1010 router EHL65 planer, CTL Mini/Midi Vac, CTL 26 vac MFT800+1080 tables
DSC-AG Grinder,  RAS 115
Rotex 150, ETS EC 150/5 RTS400
Drills: T18, BHC18, CXS.
SysLite KAL II, SYS Rock.
Sys- and Sortainers galore.

Line up has been reduced with the introduction of Mafell/Metabo tools. Red Green and Blue do mix well in the shop.