If only Clinton would be so gracious...   oops, political reference, sorry.....

Actually this is a very good idea. Monte going to Portland to review the machine on the manufacturer's turf, and Michael being sent a prototype (to be returned) to review on his own. There would be little extra cost to the company, and the resulting information to the FOG would be worth more than twice as much in increased objectivity.

At first, I was leaning towards voting for Michael to head to Portland. I've been reading his posts for a while, and my impression is that he has broad technical knowledge, has worked on many complicated projects that involve small pieces, and is very articulate in explaining his thoughts. A perfect resume for this assignment.

Then I saw more of what Monte is involved in, and his skill level, and decided the two guys may be on a par in many ways. At that point what tipped me towards Monte was that he started this whole thing in the first place, and I feel it's only fair to give him the edge for that.


John

Monte, the entire membership of the FOG is now counting on YOU......no pressure there.   


John

Matthew,

I just went to start the new thread and I'm looking at my two choices between,

All Tools & Accessories....... & ........General Chat & Random Ideas.

It seems as even though "All Tools" lists as only Festool related, to quote you.......

"Even though his product is not specifically related to Festool, I sensed a kind of connection.
Like most of us here in this forum, I've always believed that the Festool system represents a way of
working more than just a set of tools, a challenge to some basic assumptions.  I sensed the same
attitude from John and the Jointmaker Pro.  I'm betting it's no coincidence that the Jointmaker Pro
has struck a chord with this forum."

So, on that note I sensed it fit more to "All Tools", but please move it to another location
if you think otherwise.

Monte

I have not met a guy here I would not trust, so we differ on that perspective.

What episode in public are your are referring to? I liked the thread.

Nickao

oops, except Festeringtool, he was kind of hard to believe at times.

Brad, I usually don't respond to compliments for tips I pass on (from wherever I got them?) but this is a very high compliment and I'm awed. Thank you!

Dan,

this is the tread for the Portland trip...... http://festoolownersgroup.com/index.php?topic=3640.msg41835#msg41835

I don't know how to "move" your post, but I will copy it out and repost over at......

FESTOOL OWNERS GROUP > OFF-TOPIC > What Else is in Your Shop? > "The Art & Science of Cutting Wood / The Jointmaster Pro"

.......seeya over there.

Monte

Congratulations Monte!

I have never seen a passel of woodworkers or anybody online for that matter,

conduct themselves in such a diplomatic and democratic manner.

The entire membership should be congratulated.

Really.

Per

FOG members;

Wow! You folks are thorough. We are really looking forward to meeting Monte.

Let's put this experience in perspective. This is a saw machine, and it makes straight cuts within the capacity of the tool. The purpose of the trip (I hope) is to have an independent, non-affiliated woodworker validate that everything we did in the video is replicable with very little training in one fun-filled afternoon.  Cutting wood on the Jointmaker Pro is not the issue, plenty of people have seen this and the results are, and Monte will have the opportunity to validate, unbelievable for a hand saw. Any cut you can make with a Japanese style saw we can replicate much more accurately--which opens up new ways to work without electricity, noise and very little dust.

My main objective for the visit is to have a real woodworker recognize that with slotted linear tables, there are more opportunities for jigs, fixtures and ideas that are not possible without power, and are safe. This is what excites me--the ability to be a woodworker in a back bedroom if required, or finding a tool that expands one's outlook...

For example, somebody challenged me by asking if I could cut a bridle joint in a Starbuck's wooden stirrer. They are .050" thick. Using double stick tape and a two backer boards, I slotted it with a .020" kerf.  Now, this is a test, and not likely high on anybody's list of cutting needs. But it did have a profound effect at how I viewed my own woodworking experiences and I became fascinated with some ideas that use these sticks that are really outside of the box--and that is all I am going to say about that at the moment.... What is important is this would have NEVER happened if I did not have this experience. And frankly, I still can't believe that we can cut compound miters in hardwood or softwood, accurately with a handsaw. Never imagined it possible. So for me, my mind is racing, and I hope your is as well and spawns some really creative questions for Monte.

The saw has applications that we have yet to imagine and that is what I hope is revealed when we start making cuts and that is how I hope your fact finding questions for Monte are tailored. We fully expect durability, engineering and other tangible questions to be addressed when Monte puts pen to paper--with a cost of $995 there is a reason...

Lastly, I want to thank all of you for embracing Bridge City in a positive light. As mentioned earlier, either Michael or myself will do our best to answer any of your questions regarding the Jointmaker Pro. This is really a great oasis of information, I wish all forums were this civil.


Regards,

John Economaki
President
Bridge City Tool Works

Thanks again for providing this opportunity John. It's exciting to know that in little more than a week we'll have someone from own group to pester with questions about your new machine.

Also, thanks for the reminder that we can pester you and Michael in the meantime!

First I want to mention that the video as seen on utube leaves a lot to be desired. The poor quality (haziness and choppy frame rate) combined with the really fantastic nature of the opperations makes it hard to understand what is really happening. An experienced WW friend said he had to watch it three times to convince himself what he thought was happening actually was. I hope you can find a way to improve the online video quality.

I just watched again and this time, for the first time, realized that it often takes a few passes before you manage to get the saw all the way through the wood. I imagine you just push untill it stops, then back up and push again?


As you make clear in your post this machine uses a fine saw blade that even when used by hand will produce very good to outstanding cuts, so it should go without saying that a fine saw as fixtured in the Jointmaker will produce results that are outstanding to perfect. Instead of focusing on how well different species and sizes of wood will be cut we should put our attention on the moving parts; the sliding tables and the saw clamp/trunnion.

Since it appears that the tables slide independently this provides an opportunity to set each table to produce a different angle doesn't it? Or, is the force required to push a piece of wood into the blade until it stops so high that it needs to be distributed across both tables simultaneously? Is there a need or means to lock both tables together. How securely are the tables attached to the rails? Is there any lateral play? Do they lift off?

With independent tables and movable workholding fences on the tables, what is the procedure for setting the fence or fences square to the blade? Do you reference back to the fence from the blade itself or is some part of the table itself suitable?

In the video the user is shown making apparently arbitrary adjustments to the two tables and fences and then cutting pins(?) for dovetails. What is the procedure for setting the fences to an angle that must match the angle the saw is set to in another operation? Have you envisioned or developed jigs to facilitate these settings?

How robust is the saw holding system? How reliable is the means of keeping the plane of the saw parallel to the sliding table rails? How is this adjusted?

That's all for now, thanks again!

One way the golf component companies get new stuff in the hands of peeps is to have some demos do the rounds...peeps keep it for a trial period box it up and then send it on to the next person.

The deal is kind of done re Monte...it might be somthing for John to consider....rather than get peeps to come to him...box one up and let it do the rounds with several guys...ie the original list. The benefit is that then we get several different takes on the machine from fullas who will use it in diferent ways. this might be something that you could do next?

If this thing is the dogs boll0cks (like we all think it is) then John will get brilliant feedback doing this

Piers

Congratulations Monte, looking forward to your review. Michael, really excellent body of work. I'm sorry we didn't have a chance to work together before I left LA. You're exactly the type of guy I used to like to sponge onto for info on set.

On a separate note, today I had the slabs delivered for the bar build I'm doing. You guys would go into cardiac arrest if you saw these things. Himalayan Cedar, the biggest piece is 4.2m x  850mm x 55mm, but  I have two others that are 2.9m x 1090mm x 50mm, and two that are 2.7m x 600mm x 50mm. Massive! dead straight center grain, fiddling all down both sides of the heart. Very light for the size. Spent the morning at the shop over in Kallista flipping through slabs with Ken Hanson, the local slab guy. He brought them out to be drum sanded and delivered just before we went home. He's got the most amazing stuff. I saw a walnut burl that was 2m in diameter. I saw Japanese cedar knees that had been sliced into huge radius pieces 2m long and 550mm wide. Huge slabs of Cal redwood. Huon pine. Japanese cedar. English oak (I've never heard anyone call it 'crap' before).  I almost passed out from the smell of aromatic cedars when I went through the door. I'm going to go broke just meeting this guy. I got home and started figuring out every spot in the house where I could knock out walls and put in beams. I mean like 10" solid beams

I say LA, but meant the biz.

I've been working with Toby Copping, the key grip of the Matrix series here in Australia. Lots of personal photos of the 'time-slice' shot.

Hello Everyone!
Thanks for all of your enthusiasm, John and I are excited to see such a great response from people about the Jointmaker Pro.

As far as the video quality goes, there is a trade off of quality vs load time. If the video quality is too high, then it takes a LOT longer to load. Then, people get impatient and they don't even end up watching it.

You can see what I mean by this Honing Guide video; slower to load (you may have to wait for it to load completely before even watching)  but better quality       

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j0AKg0MEtxo

I am working on getting a better quality JMP video posted. I will let you know when it happens. Youtube has its limitations so we'll see!

Thanks!
Mike

Ok, you if want to very high quality download, here it is:
http://www.bridgecitytools.com/videos/JMP_Intro20.zip

This is about 91 MB, so it will take about 9 or 10 minutes with conventional broadband. Sorry to all with dial-up. Someday we'll be able to zap it to you from satellites...

Mike