Author Topic: What is your preferred countersink bit  (Read 2476 times)

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Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 606
What is your preferred countersink bit
« on: December 04, 2018, 10:31 AM »
I'm wondering which countersink bit and shank types you guys are using.

On a drill press:

Handfree drill:

I currently use the

on the drill press and

handfree drill both from LV. I found both could give me a better result.

I am considering the Amana Tool


Thank you for sharing.
Mario

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Offline six-point socket II

  • Posts: 779
  • aka @the_black_tie_diyer
Kind regards,
Oliver

Offline rst

  • Posts: 2037
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #2 on: December 04, 2018, 11:46 AM »
I use the weldon style as I work with aluminum and plastic regularly, and the Snappy's for wood.

Offline grobkuschelig

  • Posts: 440
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #3 on: December 04, 2018, 11:50 AM »
I use the same as Oliver, the Festool ones with Centrotec.

They are really sharp and I have no complaints.

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5291
  • Does Anyone Know What Time It Is?
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #4 on: December 04, 2018, 11:56 AM »
I use the festool countersink bit and a set of tapered bits with a plug cutter.

I forget who made mind right now (getting senile I guess).

At the time they were the only manufacturers of tapered bits but now there are many manufacturers. Heres example

https://www.amazon.com/Snappy-Brand-Quick-Change-Countersink-Proudly/dp/B000XXZME8/ref=sr_1_21?ie=UTF8&qid=1543942498&sr=8-21&keywords=tapered+drill+bits



Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 5156
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #5 on: December 04, 2018, 12:14 PM »
I really like these KEO Zero Flute countersinks as they're made from cobalt rather than HSS. They work well in wood, aluminum and plastic. No Centrotec shafts but Meh. [smile]

The KEO bits also last a lot longer than the Festool version, if you also have to use them ocasionally on aluminum. I buggered up a Festool version after deburring about 15 aluminum plates. The KEO are also cheaper than Festool.

The 8mm Festool version is $44.
The 5/16" KEO version is $17.

https://www.mscdirect.com/product/details/45117488



Offline George Oliver

  • Posts: 20
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #6 on: December 04, 2018, 12:16 PM »
I use these from Rockler, https://www.rockler.com/8-pro-tapered-countersink-bit, the best I've found locally. I'd like to compare them to the Centrotec though.

Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 606
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #7 on: December 04, 2018, 12:48 PM »
That make 2 for Festool and 2 for Snappy.

@Cheese those Keo bits look really sexy  [wink] How are they performing on hard wood, any burnt?

Keep feeding me people  [big grin]
Mario

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 5156
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #8 on: December 04, 2018, 01:14 PM »

@Cheese those Keo bits look really sexy  [wink] How are they performing on hard wood, any burnt?


No Mario, because they're manufactured from cobalt, they can also be used gingerly on steel. They work especially well on hard maple. Just like a plane they remove very thin shavings.  [smile]  There are also 2 larger sizes available a 1" & a 1 1/4" diameter.

The other advantage is that they're available in 4 different angles, 60º, 82º, 90º and 100º if the need arrises.

Offline RKA

  • Posts: 1288
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #9 on: December 04, 2018, 01:43 PM »
I have to ask a stupid question (well, more than one).  Is there a need to have an array of sizes or can you just get a small and large to cover the bases? These aren't meant to counterbore, just countersink, right?  Also, how do you sharpen these?
-Raj

Offline Jmacpherson

  • Posts: 181
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #10 on: December 04, 2018, 02:01 PM »
@Mario Turcot, the bits you mention from LV and from Amana look similar to the ones I have from Dimar, even use the same descriptions and images?
http://www.dimartooling.com/counter-sinking-plug-maker

Personally I prefer the bit with the metal depth stop because it clears the debris away from the hole better vs the countersink with the plastic depth stop. The downside to the metal stop is I find it leaves a mark regardless but that is more down to technique or lack thereof on my part. The plastic won't leave marks but doesn't have the lifespan of the metal stop and gets clogged up quickly.

Never used centrotec versions but would reckon they are better. I'm basing this on how my centrotec brad point bits perform, nothing comes close.
However a Festool countersink would cost me 3x the price of the Dimar version so I settled for less.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 5156
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #11 on: December 04, 2018, 03:00 PM »
I have to ask a stupid question (well, more than one).  Is there a need to have an array of sizes or can you just get a small and large to cover the bases? These aren't meant to counterbore, just countersink, right?  Also, how do you sharpen these?

As a general rule of thumb, if the counter sink is rated at 1/2” diameter, this style will have a useful range from 1/4-1/2”. Same with the other sizes. A 3/8” diameter will be useful for 3/16-3/8”.

So taking the 1/2” counter sink, it can be used to counter sink #4 (.255 dia) through #10 (.411 dia) flat head screws.

These are meant to countersink, however I’ve counterbored holes, to act as a rain trough, in 60 cast aluminum outdoor lights and it’s still working fine. I’ve not yet sharpened it.

Here’s a photo after 60 counterbores and a couple hundred countersinks in aluminum. It still works fine in maple.



Offline rst

  • Posts: 2037
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #12 on: December 04, 2018, 06:55 PM »
I resharpen my weldons using a grinding point in a dremel (actually a Milwaukee 12v rotary tool).  I sharpen them from inside the shaving cavity.  My biggest is 1 1/2".























Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5291
  • Does Anyone Know What Time It Is?
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #13 on: December 04, 2018, 09:41 PM »
I have to ask a stupid question (well, more than one).  Is there a need to have an array of sizes or can you just get a small and large to cover the bases? These aren't meant to counterbore, just countersink, right?  Also, how do you sharpen these?


The ones I use with te tapered bit are used when I have to drill into hardwoods to prevent splitting ot when Im going to use plugs to hide the holes. Otherwise I use screws with nibs on the screws to allow them to self countersink. good for some woods and paint grade.

Offline RKA

  • Posts: 1288
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #14 on: December 04, 2018, 10:36 PM »
@jobsworth Thanks, I saw that post.  I actually have a set of Fuller bits like that, I’m just filing away the bits @Cheese mentioned for use with aluminum plate or when I’m boring holes in odd sizes (tapping threads in wood).  I might keep a 1/2” in the drawer for those instances.
-Raj

Offline ScotF

  • Posts: 2514
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2018, 10:44 PM »
Centrotec and Snappy for me.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 5156
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #16 on: December 05, 2018, 12:41 AM »
I actually have a set of Fuller bits like that, I’m just filing away the bits @Cheese mentioned for use with aluminum plate or when I’m boring holes in odd sizes (tapping threads in wood).  I might keep a 1/2” in the drawer for those instances.

FWIW Raj, here are a couple of photos of a walnut countertop machined for use with a countersunk 1/4-20 FHCS. If you enlarge the photo, you'll notice an extremely smooth countersunk surface. That's the beauty of this style of countersink. Wood is removed one thin layer at a time. Nothing has been doctored, just a pilot hole was drilled, a KEO countersink was used and the flat head cap screws were installed. The countersinks are a thing of beauty...or as Mario says...Sexy!!!

I'd suggest keeping 2 different sized countersinks in your rucksack. That way you can run the gamut from a #4 FHCS thru a 5/16" FHCS. That's a pretty wide swath of common usage.  [smile]





Because of the wide range of materials I have to deal with, I try to use a single type of machine tool bit for all of the operations. If I had the luxury of only working on wood projects, I'd definitely keep and use one set of KEO countersink bits for only wood working projects  and keep another set for metal working.

Kind of like maintaining two sets of chisels....and who isn't familiar with that?   [big grin]
« Last Edit: December 05, 2018, 12:59 AM by Cheese »

Offline rst

  • Posts: 2037
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #17 on: December 05, 2018, 07:44 AM »
Another note on the weldon style counter sinks is that they can be bought with a pilot to insure the counter is concentric with the pilot hole.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 5156
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2018, 10:23 AM »
Another note on the weldon style counter sinks is that they can be bought with a pilot to insure the countersink is concentric with the pilot hole.

Like these...

http://www.norsemandrill.com/Metal-Countersink-Drills.php



Offline TealaG

  • Posts: 97
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #19 on: December 07, 2018, 06:34 PM »
I tried many...my favorite is the Amana style with the stop. 

Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 606
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #20 on: December 07, 2018, 07:08 PM »
I tried many...my favorite is the Amana style with the stop.

I just received today two from Amana Tools, next will be the Keo ones, especially the larger one. I already have a set like the snappy one.
Mario

Offline rvieceli

  • Posts: 867
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #21 on: December 07, 2018, 07:22 PM »
@Mario Turcot if you want sexy. Switch to socket head cap screws. Counterbore the hole and then chamfer the edge with a countersink.

Ron


Offline Mario Turcot

  • Posts: 606
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #22 on: December 07, 2018, 07:25 PM »
@Mario Turcot if you want sexy. Switch to socket head cap screws. Counterbore the hole and then chamfer the edge with a countersink.

Ron

Wow that is super SEXY lol. The only problem I have is to find head cap screws. Homedepot sells a few in size and length but never the ones I need :( and are crazy expensive... like $1.80 for one screw  [mad]

What you made there is super nice  [big grin]
Mario


Offline rvieceli

  • Posts: 867
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #24 on: December 07, 2018, 07:38 PM »
Heres a nice resource for getting specs on different screw sizes and types.

http://icrank.com/cgi-bin/pageman/pageout.cgi?path=/data/screw/screw_source.htm&t=2

Ron

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 680
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #25 on: December 07, 2018, 07:46 PM »
Grainger - There are physical stores located in Canada.

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 5156
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #26 on: December 08, 2018, 01:09 AM »
@Mario Turcot if you want sexy. Switch to socket head cap screws. Counterbore the hole and then chamfer the edge with a countersink.

Looks nice Ron...it looks like it was chamfered with a zero flute countersink because of the cleanliness of the details.  [smile]



So Mario if you like sexy...here's a box full of semi-sexy, a gaggle of grade 304 stainless 1/4-20 SHCS, BHCS & FHCS in various lengths. The black versions are black oxide coated for aesthetic reasons, but they're still grade 304 for corrosion concerns.



But when it comes to super sexy, these SPS Technologies bolts pull out all of the stops. They're manufactured from a special nickel cobalt stainless named MP35N. It's a limited production material run from SPS. The normal routine, is for the customer to notify SPS every year how many pounds of the material you want to reserve and then SPS will do that for you. Then when you direct them to, SPS will then manufacture for you what you want according to your specs. All material reservation must be done a minimum of 1 year in advance. Well that was 25 years ago, and with the new tariff policy  [eek]  it's probably further into the future than before, and also probably more expensive. These bolts were $18 each 25 years ago. 



This fastener is completely forged, rolled & ground, nothing has been turned. The threads are rolled/ground, the body is ground and the small fillet underneath the head is ground. This fastener is actually relatively cheap considering the number of precision machining operations involved.

« Last Edit: December 08, 2018, 10:06 AM by Cheese »

Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3605
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #27 on: December 08, 2018, 09:26 AM »
@Cheese   SPS = Super Pricey Stainless?

Offline Cheese

  • Posts: 5156
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #28 on: December 08, 2018, 10:19 AM »
@Cheese   SPS = Super Pricey Stainless?

You got that one right.  [big grin]

Just did a search and the current price for raw material is $80 per pound.

Also found out that it's now being used for dental and implant applications.


Offline Michael Kellough

  • Posts: 3605
Re: What is your preferred countersink bit
« Reply #29 on: December 08, 2018, 11:53 AM »
HA!

Picture reminds me, back in the late ‘80’s I was hired to modify 2 dozen prank animated mouths for a play. A salesman’s briefcase was supposed to accidentally open and the mouths fall out and commence chattering, but stop in a certain number of seconds. I added a little Mitsubishi motor, crank arm, and battery and my partner added a custom board for time. Don’t think the play made to the big stage but it was a fun project.