Author Topic: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project  (Read 9478 times)

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Offline Knock on Wood

  • Posts: 25
Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« on: March 25, 2010, 04:49 PM »
I would like to get some woodworking advice for something that I am building.  I want to build a new cart similar to the one that I have in the pictures below. 

Any advice on doing this, or suggestions on alternatives would be much appreciated.

You can see in the drawings that I want to have a board (in orange), on the back of the cart that would be about 6 feet tall.  My problem is in opening the lid, (in green) and not have the back / bottom edge of the lid encroach on that board. 

The only way that I can come up with is to install a spacer (in red), between the board and the cart. 

Which is what I would like to avoid... (I would not like the looks of it).

I can purchase some Lid Stays from Lee Valley, so that the lid could stay up at less than 90 degrees, and not lean into the board, but I would still have the back edge of the lid to contend with.

Lee Valley Lid Stays

Any advice or suggestions so that I can eliminate that spacer, or an alternative lid design to eliminate the spacer.

Thank you,

Jim

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Offline Guy Ashley

  • Posts: 662
  • Furniture & Cabinet Maker/Joiner
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #1 on: March 25, 2010, 05:15 PM »
Hi Jim

How about a 45 degree bevel on the back of the lid and the back frame of the box with the hinges recessed in. That way when you raise the lid there should be minimal fouling with the back board.

Just a word of caution though, you will have to have some lid stays/ catches at the top as the laws of gravity will want to come down.

Guy
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Offline Wim

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Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #2 on: March 25, 2010, 05:20 PM »
Maybe a silly answer, but can you swing the lid sideways?

Offline Knock on Wood

  • Posts: 25
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #3 on: March 25, 2010, 06:02 PM »
Maybe a silly answer, but can you swing the lid sideways?

Wim,

Not a silly answer at all... I had already thought of that, but the lid would be 32" wide, so that would be pretty wide to swing over.  Another alternative is to split the lid in the middle, so it would open like a book... but I would prefer to have the lid flip up as pictured if I could.

Guy,

Here is the pic of the "Stays" from Lee Valley... I have used them before, and it will hold quite a heavy lid at any position without dropping, and they come down slow with a little effort.... (these are used in toy boxes alot so that kids won't get their hands pinched from the lids coming down).

That is a great idea about a 45 degree bevel... that might work...

I will wait to see if anyone comes up with something else.

Jim

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« Last Edit: March 25, 2010, 06:07 PM by Knock on Wood »
Measure twice.... cut once.... pound to fit.

Online Peter Halle

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Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #4 on: March 25, 2010, 06:47 PM »
Jim.

How rude of me.   [welcome] to the FOG.  We look forward to your project and pictures!   [popcorn]

Peter

Offline mastercabman

  • Posts: 1854
  • NORFOLK,VA
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #5 on: March 25, 2010, 06:54 PM »
Maybe you could use cup hinges like for frameless cabinets.That would make the lid flush with the back of the cabinet. You may need some lid stays.
I don't understand!?! I keep cutting it,and it's still too short!

Offline Jesse Cloud

  • Posts: 1732
  • Festooling at the end of a dirt road in New Mexico
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #6 on: March 25, 2010, 07:14 PM »
OK, here's a different approach... how about a spacer that looks better and is functional.  That space could nicely accommodate some awkward to store gadget (Festool TS parallel guide comes to mind).  It need not be one solid piece of wood, lots of opportunity for creativity.

Online Peter Halle

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Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2010, 07:26 PM »
Mastercabman,

You certainly have more experience with euro cup hinges, and I love your idea.  It the lid is a lipped lid like illustrated  in the photos - not the drawings - wouldn't you have to build up - or down in this case - the hinge locations?  I think easily done.  But doesn't the hinge selection with euro hinges also depend on the thickness of the door / lid?  Are hinges available for 1 .5 inch material?

I am asking because I love the idea!  I am ignorant about so much euro hardware questions and theories.

Peter

Offline mastercabman

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Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #8 on: March 25, 2010, 07:40 PM »
Mastercabman,

You certainly have more experience with euro cup hinges, and I love your idea.  It the lid is a lipped lid like illustrated  in the photos - not the drawings - wouldn't you have to build up - or down in this case - the hinge locations?  I think easily done.  But doesn't the hinge selection with euro hinges also depend on the thickness of the door / lid?  Are hinges available for 1 .5 inch material?

I am asking because I love the idea!  I am ignorant about so much euro hardware questions and theories.

Peter
Peter,yes i am looking at the drawing that he's showing.Looks to me that the lid is just solid 3/4"-1" thick.So maybe he could give us more detail on how thick he wants his lid to be. Also he could do some research on-line for hinges that allowed for thicker door/lid.  I have seen some like it on refrigerator,but at what cost?    I have no idea.
I don't understand!?! I keep cutting it,and it's still too short!

Offline balrog

  • Posts: 50
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #9 on: March 25, 2010, 09:00 PM »
Could a sliding top like this cart work for you? Just use drawer slides and you would have two small work areas.

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item.asp?P65=&tool=storage&item_ID=81234&group_ID=21364&store=snapon-store&dir=catalog

Would using Soss hinges be another option?

Your shop looks bright and well kept!
« Last Edit: March 25, 2010, 09:01 PM by balrog »

Offline Wood_Junkie

  • Posts: 1313
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #10 on: March 25, 2010, 09:24 PM »
It sounds like whatcha need are these:
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40647&cat=3,41241

Probably with a bit of a very thin spacer on the rear of the case you could get a flush/inset opening without looking like it's offset when closed.

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« Last Edit: March 25, 2010, 09:25 PM by Wood_Junkie »

Offline Tim Morris

  • Posts: 323
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #11 on: March 26, 2010, 12:01 AM »
Reference the idea for the euro cup hinges. Blum makes a couple of hinges designed for thick door applications. Limited options but they are available. I too would still recommend lid stays in conjunctions or you'll pull the base plates out of the back of the cabinet.

Offline Knock on Wood

  • Posts: 25
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #12 on: March 26, 2010, 12:52 AM »
Jim.

How rude of me.   [welcome] to the FOG.  We look forward to your project and pictures!   [popcorn]

Peter

Thank you for the welcome... I look forward to learning a lot here.

Jim
Measure twice.... cut once.... pound to fit.

Offline Knock on Wood

  • Posts: 25
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #13 on: March 26, 2010, 01:08 AM »
OK, here's a different approach... how about a spacer that looks better and is functional.  That space could nicely accommodate some awkward to store gadget (Festool TS parallel guide comes to mind).  It need not be one solid piece of wood, lots of opportunity for creativity.

That is an option... I will have to think of some creative ways in which that might work.

But I do have some plans for that piece of wood that stands up on the back of the cart.... that will come later.

Jim
Measure twice.... cut once.... pound to fit.

Offline Knock on Wood

  • Posts: 25
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #14 on: March 26, 2010, 01:11 AM »
Mastercabman,

You certainly have more experience with euro cup hinges, and I love your idea.  It the lid is a lipped lid like illustrated  in the photos - not the drawings - wouldn't you have to build up - or down in this case - the hinge locations?  I think easily done.  But doesn't the hinge selection with euro hinges also depend on the thickness of the door / lid?  Are hinges available for 1 .5 inch material?

I am asking because I love the idea!  I am ignorant about so much euro hardware questions and theories.

Peter

The lid will be 1.5" thick and look like the lid of the Lee Valley Stay picture that I have inserted.

Jim

Measure twice.... cut once.... pound to fit.

Offline Knock on Wood

  • Posts: 25
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2010, 01:29 AM »
It sounds like whatcha need are these:
http://www.leevalley.com/hardware/page.aspx?c=2&p=40647&cat=3,41241

Probably with a bit of a very thin spacer on the rear of the case you could get a flush/inset opening without looking like it's offset when closed.

(Attachment Link)


I saw those when I was looking at hinges at Lee Valley... but I didn't think of shimming / using spacers to make it flush with the inset of the lid... I will have to think on that one...

Thank you for your suggestion...

Jim
Measure twice.... cut once.... pound to fit.

Offline Knock on Wood

  • Posts: 25
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2010, 01:34 AM »
Reference the idea for the euro cup hinges. Blum makes a couple of hinges designed for thick door applications. Limited options but they are available. I too would still recommend lid stays in conjunctions or you'll pull the base plates out of the back of the cabinet.

Thank you for your input Tim.... but see my reply to Mastercabman

Jim
Measure twice.... cut once.... pound to fit.

Offline mastercabman

  • Posts: 1854
  • NORFOLK,VA
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #17 on: March 26, 2010, 06:29 AM »
Jim,whatever you decide to do/use,good luck with your project!    ;)
I don't understand!?! I keep cutting it,and it's still too short!

Offline Knock on Wood

  • Posts: 25
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #18 on: March 26, 2010, 09:42 AM »
Balrog had the suggestion of having a sliding top like on this Snap-On Cart....

Would anyone know where I could even begin to look for a "Slide" like that?  It doesn't look like a regular drawer slide.

The only thing that I would be concerned about is that it would not open very wide, so that would cut down on the space of what I want to put in there.

Jim

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« Last Edit: March 26, 2010, 09:45 AM by Knock on Wood »
Measure twice.... cut once.... pound to fit.

Offline harry_

  • Posts: 1275
Re: Advice Wanted on a Shop Project
« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2010, 07:58 PM »
There is nothing 'special' about those slides. You can find generics at any of the big box stores.

If it were me using slides, I would want to there to be a slight friction fit with a Teflon tape (or similar). That way if you dropped/hammered something on the lid the slides would not be taking the abuse.
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