Author Topic: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress  (Read 4278 times)

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Offline HarveyWildes

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Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« on: April 23, 2017, 11:58 AM »
I'm making slow progress on my new workbench, which used the Parf Guide System to drill holes in the top.  The top of the front apron will eventually have a row of holes matching the rest of the bench, and also the vertical surface of the apron will as well for planing.

« Last Edit: April 23, 2017, 12:17 PM by HarveyWildes »

Offline HarveyWildes

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2017, 12:10 PM »
Whoops!  I hit the post button before adding info about the vise.  I decided to add the Veritas tail vise to this bench because it looked considerably easier than a traditional tail vise.  It was very easy to install, but you do have to pay attention to the installation instructions to make sure that the vise travels exactly parallel to the front of the bench.  The vise jaw is 2" thick, and about 5" wide.  Note how far down the bolts are on the jaw - that reflects how far down the mechanism extends.  The bench top is only 1.5" thick, so for a thicker bench, the jaw would have to be that much wider.

The jaw is made of jatoba.  The apron is made of cherry with jatoba laminated on top and bottom for strength.  both the apron and jaw will have jaw pads of Jatoba screwed in and countersunk so that they can be replaced if needed.  The breadboard ends are cherry, and the top is alternating granadillo and soft maple.  I used some pallet oak for hidden structural pieces.  The jatoba was supposed to be granadillo, but I picked up the wrong board because I was in a hurry :).  At least the jotoba is plenty hard and will be up to the task.

« Last Edit: April 23, 2017, 12:17 PM by HarveyWildes »

Offline Michael Kellough

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2017, 12:38 PM »
It's gonna look nice!

Offline HarveyWildes

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2017, 05:39 PM »
All the top holes are drilled using the Parf Guide system, and the top is done aside from finishing.  Haven't drilled the apron side holes yet.

I did in my C18 drilling the top holes in the apron, per another post.  Finished it up with a Milwaukee M18 drill that started getting a little hotter than I liked, and finally finished up with a DeWalt 20V (not brushless).  When using the Milwaukee and DeWalt drills I used the 20mm bit that came with the Parf Guide to drill the tops of the holes, but it is enough shorter that I could not get the full depth and had to do a second pass with the Centrotec version of the bit.

I was going to add on a Moxon vise, but the Veritas tail vise seems to hold boards firmly.  We'll see how it does in use.

Here are some pictures of MFT clamps and dogs on the bench.

« Last Edit: April 29, 2017, 11:09 PM by HarveyWildes »

Offline ear3

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2017, 08:13 PM »
Coming out great. How square is the hole pattern?
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Offline HarveyWildes

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2017, 07:54 PM »
Coming out great. How square is the hole pattern?

I drilled all of the holes except those in the apron about two months ago (?) or so.  At that time they were pretty much as perfect within the limits of my ability to measure.  When I came back to drill the apron, I checked out the Parf guide on the holes to see how they fit.  With the grain the fit was still perfect on the 5-10 holes that I tested.  Cross the grain the fit was maybe .1mm or less off, I presume due to wood movement.

Wood movement in Colorado is minimal due to the low average humidity, so that helps.  Most wood shrinkage occurs between 100% and 60% relative humidity.  Colorado humidity averages lower than 60%.  http://festoolownersgroup.com/building-materials/wood-shrinkage-in-colorado/msg497873/#msg497873

Online ben_r_

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2017, 05:35 PM »
How thick is the top?
If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

Offline ear3

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #7 on: May 20, 2017, 03:29 PM »
I was just reflecting on how since I finished my bench last Fall with the integral vises, and in particular the benchcrafted wagon vise, I can count on one hand the number of times I've had to resort to the clamping elements, which, prior to the bench, were my most frequently used clamps.

It's amazing how much of a difference a customized bench makes.
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • DX 93 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3

Offline HarveyWildes

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #8 on: May 20, 2017, 09:37 PM »

Offline Vondawg

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2017, 08:07 AM »
HW - I see you're using your Festool clamps...with the 'inch and a half' thick  top did you have to open up the holes underneath to allow the clamps to fit in or use a round over bit? I'd be interested to know how they work... Sometimes even on mine (not as thick) it's a challenge.
Thanks
There are no mistakes....just new designs.

Online ben_r_

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #10 on: May 21, 2017, 12:41 PM »
HW - I see you're using your Festool clamps...with the 'inch and a half' thick  top did you have to open up the holes underneath to allow the clamps to fit in or use a round over bit? I'd be interested to know how they work... Sometimes even on mine (not as thick) it's a challenge.
Thanks
Where do you see him using Festool clamps? I dont think he can with an 1.5" thick top. That was why I asked how thick it was. As I understood it the Festool clamps can only be used with a tabletop thickness of around 3/4" or less, like the MFT/3 has.
If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

Offline Richard/RMW

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #11 on: May 21, 2017, 01:08 PM »
I think he disassembles the clamp and inserts it from below, note the pin in the end of the clamp in this photo.



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Online ben_r_

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #12 on: May 21, 2017, 06:45 PM »
I think he disassembles the clamp and inserts it from below, note the pin in the end of the clamp in this photo.

RMW

Good catch. I think you might be right. Kind of a pain, but nice to get the advantages of using clamps like that AND a nice thick work top.
If at first you don't succeed, redefine success!

Offline HarveyWildes

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #13 on: May 21, 2017, 11:18 PM »
HW - I see you're using your Festool clamps...with the 'inch and a half' thick  top did you have to open up the holes underneath to allow the clamps to fit in or use a round over bit? I'd be interested to know how they work... Sometimes even on mine (not as thick) it's a challenge.
Thanks

I tried opening up the holes underneath and found that it simply does not work - at least not leaving a good 3/4" deep hole from the top for dogs, etc. to grab.  The person who suggested that I dissembled the clamps and insert them from below was correct.  Given that, they still work great.  You just have to make sure that you don't fill the space immediately below the top (for ~ 6" or so) with drawers and such.

Offline Vondawg

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #14 on: May 22, 2017, 12:09 PM »
Thanks Richard I didn't look close enough.
And thanks Harvey...great bench!
There are no mistakes....just new designs.

Offline Bert Vanderveen

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #15 on: May 22, 2017, 04:11 PM »
I tried opening up the holes underneath and found that it simply does not work - at least not leaving a good 3/4" deep hole from the top for dogs, etc. to grab.  The person who suggested that I dissembled the clamps and insert them from below was correct.  Given that, they still work great.  You just have to make sure that you don't fill the space immediately below the top (for ~ 6" or so) with drawers and such.

Bessey just introduced clamps with workbench-adapters for most of the hole-systems in use. It is modular, eg you buy a base for the hole diameter you use and the clamp that attaches to it is sold separately.

Unfortunately Bessey's website is not working properly, but the downloadable new catalog is available. The new Workbench adapters and Clamps are on page 113-115.
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

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Online Svar

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #16 on: May 22, 2017, 04:39 PM »
Bessey just introduced clamps with workbench-adapters for most of the hole-systems in use. It is modular, eg you buy a base for the hole diameter you use and the clamp that attaches to it is sold separately.
This one?


It has one limitation. The leverage is too great for thin MDF top and will deform the hole. Will work fine in steel welding table or thick wood bench.
« Last Edit: May 22, 2017, 04:48 PM by Svar »

Offline Bert Vanderveen

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #17 on: May 22, 2017, 04:59 PM »
Yep. But the illustrations in the catalogue show the system in use with what looks like material that is about 40 mm thick. Which would suit the OP.
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

TS55 · TS55R · OF1010 · DF500 Mk2 · MFT/3 + CMS TS55 + CMS PS300 + LA-CS 70/CMS · CTL Midi · RTS400 EQ · 2 x CXS Li 1,5 · T15+3 Li 4,2 · TI15 Impact Li 4,2 · PSB300 · LR32-SYS · RO150 · Kapex KS120 · MFK700 · RO90 · OFK700  … | Hammer A3 31 Silent Power · Hammer N4400 

Offline PaulH99

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Offline Bert Vanderveen

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #19 on: May 23, 2017, 07:52 AM »
Just take a look under Clamps for Woodworking. The last item in the menu:

http://www.besseytools.com/en/subcategory?ASIMOID_SC=000000030003cd8400040023&ASIMOID_MC=000000000001f3f000030023

[BTW  I just relay information that I found in the catalogue. I never make up stories about clamps…]
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

TS55 · TS55R · OF1010 · DF500 Mk2 · MFT/3 + CMS TS55 + CMS PS300 + LA-CS 70/CMS · CTL Midi · RTS400 EQ · 2 x CXS Li 1,5 · T15+3 Li 4,2 · TI15 Impact Li 4,2 · PSB300 · LR32-SYS · RO150 · Kapex KS120 · MFK700 · RO90 · OFK700  … | Hammer A3 31 Silent Power · Hammer N4400 

Offline PaulH99

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-Paul
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Offline HarveyWildes

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #21 on: May 23, 2017, 09:38 AM »
Is there a 20mm adaptor for the Bessey clamps?  I did not see one.

I got a Veritas Surface clamp http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/page.aspx?p=70684&cat=1,43838,70865 but apparently I have to be careful not to tighten into the hole too tightly or I will deform the hole.  The main reason I got it was for horizontal clamping on the front of the bench.

Offline Bert Vanderveen

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #22 on: May 23, 2017, 12:48 PM »
The 20 mm adapter is on the German site, not on the English/American one… Yesterday it was on neither, so there is hope.

http://bessey.de/de/product_details.php?ASIMOID=00000001000029b100060023&ASIMOID_SC=000000030002a4e400060023&ASIMOID_MC=000000000000a94700020023

Note the photo — with a wooden bench! Exclamation mark! !
Cheers, Bert Vanderveen

TS55 · TS55R · OF1010 · DF500 Mk2 · MFT/3 + CMS TS55 + CMS PS300 + LA-CS 70/CMS · CTL Midi · RTS400 EQ · 2 x CXS Li 1,5 · T15+3 Li 4,2 · TI15 Impact Li 4,2 · PSB300 · LR32-SYS · RO150 · Kapex KS120 · MFK700 · RO90 · OFK700  … | Hammer A3 31 Silent Power · Hammer N4400 

Offline Vondawg

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #23 on: May 24, 2017, 07:25 AM »
Great info here Bert thanks !
There are no mistakes....just new designs.

Offline ear3

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Re: Parf Guide Inspired Workbench - Making Slow Progress
« Reply #24 on: May 25, 2017, 03:54 PM »
There's also the Seneca clamp dogs, though you have to secure them with a knob from the bottom, like the Festool clamping elements.  I've got Kreg automaxx clamps mounted to mine: https://www.senecawoodworking.com/blogs/news/8385791-introducing-the-seneca-woodworking-mft-clamp-dog
Kapex KS 120 w/UG Cart and Extensions • CXS Set • T18+3 w/Centrotec Installer's Set • PDC 18/4 • TS 75 • TSC 55 • HKC 55 w/250, 420 and 670 FSK rails • Carvex 420 w/Accessory Kit • Domino 500 Set • Domino 700 XL • OF 2200 w/Base Accessory Kit • OF 1400 • OF 1010 • MFK 700 EQ Set • LR 32 • MFS 400 w/2000, 1000, and 700 extensions • Rotex 90 • Rotex 150 • LS 130 • ETS-EC 150/5 • ETS 150/3 • Pro 5 LTD • RTS 400 • RAS 115.04 • DX 93 • HL 850 • Vecturo OS 400 • CT 26 w/Long-Life Bag • CT Sys w/Long-Life Bag • MFT/3