Author Topic: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide  (Read 45673 times)

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Offline Reed Hoyer

  • Posts: 29
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #270 on: May 15, 2019, 07:31 PM »
That makes sense, I suppose.  And I certainly understand the multifunctionalty of having the squares and the guides.  Still, for someone starting from zero, like I am, it makes this an almost 600.00 proposition.  I am sure it's worth it- just makes it a bit harder to jump on.

@Dane $600 is a big number, I agree. If I were starting my woodworking journey today, instead of 6 years ago, I think I would purchase the full TSO setup before I bought my MFT/3. While I really like the table and use it in other ways than making crosscuts, I think I'd much rather have worked from the floor on a 2" sheet of XPS foam with the TSO setup than standing up on a tiny table. It's trivial to make/purchase an inexpensive surface to use for clamping or assembly. Perfect squares and repeatable parallel cuts are tough to come by.

Offline Reed Hoyer

  • Posts: 29
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #271 on: May 15, 2019, 07:33 PM »
From here it looks like the tso parallel guide suffers from the same clumsy ness as the Festool. That the guide stops have to be at the ends of the material being cut. What makes the Seneca and woodpecker easier to handle is that the guide rails that connect to the cutting rails can be at at any distance as they rest on top of what they are cutting as opposed to be at the ends.

@glass1 - please help us understand what makes for "clumsiness" in the FESTOOL parallel guide (- and what you have so far seen of the TSO TPG System) ?

Your feedback may help us decide to speed up the availability of our optional TPG Rail Adapter (p/n 610-409) which accomplishes exactly what you are referring to.

Hans

The clumsiness of the Festool guides is their desire to be perpendicular to the floor rather than parallel. It appears TSO's solution eliminates that by resting its rails on the material rather than next to it.

Offline Mike Goetzke

  • Posts: 298
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #272 on: May 15, 2019, 09:42 PM »
From here it looks like the tso parallel guide suffers from the same clumsy ness as the Festool. That the guide stops have to be at the ends of the material being cut. What makes the Seneca and woodpecker easier to handle is that the guide rails that connect to the cutting rails can be at at any distance as they rest on top of what they are cutting as opposed to be at the ends.

@glass1 - please help us understand what makes for "clumsiness" in the FESTOOL parallel guide (- and what you have so far seen of the TSO TPG System) ?

Your feedback may help us decide to speed up the availability of our optional TPG Rail Adapter (p/n 610-409) which accomplishes exactly what you are referring to.

Hans

The clumsiness of the Festool guides is their desire to be perpendicular to the floor rather than parallel. It appears TSO's solution eliminates that by resting its rails on the material rather than next to it.

When making test cuts before my first project I found my cuts to be off and initially blamed the TSO square but it was my rail. I have two 55"and one 118" Makita rails plus a 75" Festool rail. One of the 55" Makita rails was off by 3/16" over the 55" (it was new so I got it replaced). So first make sure the rail is straight.

I used my TSO GRS 16-PE square on a real project (simple bookcase) for the first time a couple weeks ago. I had to make a few 48" cross cuts. I marked both the near and far end with my cut line. I registered the square and anti-chip edge at the near side and the far end of the anti-chip was spot on the other pencil mark. I measured across the corners and dimensions were within 1/32".

I made several 10" to 12" cross cuts and had excellent results but had to mark every piece while I wait for the TSO TPG.

So, if you are cutting at least up to 48" I see no need for two squares and two sets of parallel guides putting you under $300. I haven't tried the square for a cut with my 118" rail for a full 96" rip but that may require two parallel stops. I use another jig for ripping long lengths.


Mike
« Last Edit: May 16, 2019, 08:44 AM by Mike Goetzke »

Offline BarneyD

  • Posts: 79
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #273 on: May 17, 2019, 04:44 PM »
I just received my TPG 20 & 30 RH kit today (had previously purchased the GRS-16) and I'm very impressed. Took me about 30 seconds to calibrate it to my guide rails. I've not tried the narrow rip rod and likely never will. I prefer to do that on the table saw. But the fit, finish, and packaging are all superb.  So kudos to Hans and Eric for a very well designed and executed product.
Barney

Offline Mike Goetzke

  • Posts: 298
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #274 on: May 22, 2019, 09:33 PM »
@tjbnwi  @TSO_Products

Received my TPG-50 complete set today. These are not only beautiful but very functional and quick to setup. I have three Makita rails and a Festool rail. Once calibrated all line up perfectly. Probably need to tweak calibration if I install one of the other arms??? Didn't test that yet.

Couple questions:

1) Where is the best place to place the cursor? Middle of the tick mark or left/right side of it. Taking me a little bit to have confidence centering right on top of it. Maybe experience will help.

2) Don't know why but I just noticed that the 20 & 30 have etched scales but the 50 a glued on scale. Curious why this is?

I only made a few test cuts but this is a perfect compliment to any track saw. I don't have enough experience with the square but seems to me it is easier to square the lumber the to square with the parallel arm in place. Over the next week I have some planter boxes to build for my wife with many repetitive cuts. Will report back how it works out.

(Side question - anyone else have Makita and Festool rails? I find the guide rib on the Festool rail to be little wider requiring me to adjust the saw when I go from rail to rail. Need a solution to this - maybe shim/tape?)

Thanks,

Mike


Online tjbnwi

  • Posts: 6032
  • Cedar Tucky Indiana
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #275 on: May 22, 2019, 09:52 PM »
@Mike Goetzke,

I set the cursor rail side face in line with the tick mark rail side face. To me that is the distance I am looking for. I also find it easy to align them this way, I'm not splitting the line unless absolutely necessary.

If you're going to use tape to take up some slop use UHMW slick tape.

Tom

Offline TSO_Products

  • Retailer
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  • Posts: 95
    • TSO Products LLC
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #276 on: May 23, 2019, 03:58 AM »
TSO is stepping up production with particular emphasis on the TPG combination purchased most frequently.

@Mike Goetzke- the choice of a STARRETT bench tape on the 50 inch T-track is for reasons of manufacturing convenience. If it turns out that engraving of this long part makes more sense later on, we may change that.

We worked hard on packaging and will appreciate submittal of pictures of any shipping damage of packaging shortcomings  which will help us improve. I was at AXMINSTER TOOLS & MACHINERY earlier this week and the individually FedEx shipped TPG-50 sample arrived completely intact as have all the other test packages we have shipped back  and forth across the US  multiple times.

Your experience reports are appreciated via email to
      info@tsoproducts.com

Hans
(from Europe at the moment)

Offline RobBob

  • Posts: 1378
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #277 on: May 24, 2019, 04:42 PM »
@TSO Products

What is the the maximum width each track can cut to...20", 30", and 50"?

I assume it is approximately the width of the Festool guide rail and splinter strip plus the length of the TSO track used?

Offline TSO_Products

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  • Posts: 95
    • TSO Products LLC
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #278 on: May 25, 2019, 04:26 AM »
@TSO Products

What is the the maximum width each track can cut to...20", 30", and 50"?

I assume it is approximately the width of the Festool guide rail and splinter strip plus the length of the TSO track used?

@RobBob  - TSO's t-track numbering refers to the nominal maximum width you can rip. The actual length of each t-track is shorter than it's name by the width of the guide rail including splinter guard.

Hans

Offline lerabotperche

  • Posts: 43
    • What I do and how I do it :)
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #279 on: June 13, 2019, 05:31 PM »
why cthe DBF-45 can't be set on festool rail ??? I mean, this is a long awaited thing.

Offline Roachmill

  • Posts: 141
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #280 on: June 13, 2019, 05:51 PM »
why cthe DBF-45 can't be set on festool rail ??? I mean, this is a long awaited thing.
Now there's a good idea! Something that would reference off a track with an adjustable offset sounds like a winner. Compatibility with MFS tracks would be a nice to have too.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2019, 05:53 PM by Roachmill »

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5764
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #281 on: June 13, 2019, 08:54 PM »
@TSO_Products

Ill let ya know tomorrow as mines should be delivered tomorrow and Monday.

Bought r/h side then the next day bought l/h side and another grs. Some ones coming Monday and the other Tomorrow


Offline Mike Goetzke

  • Posts: 298
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #282 on: June 14, 2019, 09:20 AM »
@TSO_Products

Ill let ya know tomorrow as mines should be delivered tomorrow and Monday.

Bought r/h side then the next day bought l/h side and another grs. Some ones coming Monday and the other Tomorrow

Your going to like them!

I'm on my second project - sewing machine cabinet for my daughter. Last weekend had half day to work on the dovetailed drawers. I used the GRS/TPG for most of he components but couple drawers have sides narrower than the rail width so I ended up cutting those on the table saw.

I was going to try the narrow stock rods on the TPG but didn’t feel like messing with it and didn’t want to take off my calibrated plunger on the flip stop. I'll probably mess around with it some more this weekend. Need to gain confidence in cutting narrow stock with this setup before applying it to a project piece.

Was thinking another set of flip stops dedicated to the rods might be nice but that a little $pricey$ at about $50/per.

Would be nice if the TSO far end t/track attachment for the second thin stock rod didn’t go under the rail like the GRS's. Maybe attach the t-track like Woodpecker’s or Seneca’s parallel guides to the rail top groove. This way you wouldn’t have to worry about the square needing to register the end of the the wood on the far end and allow more freedom for the position of this second material stop.

I agree with Hans/TSO/others that the TS is better for thinner rips but some don’t have a TS and in my case if I need to drag out and set up my TS in my space constrained garage/shop might as well use that instead of the GRS/TPG for all of my work.

I'm sure as more get their hands on the TPG's there will be ideas/experience on how to accurately produce thin rips.

Mike

Offline ScotF

  • Posts: 2657
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #283 on: June 14, 2019, 06:43 PM »
Just placed my order for the full kit today!

Offline jobsworth

  • Posts: 5764
  • Festool Baby.....
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #284 on: June 15, 2019, 12:17 AM »
My R/H side came today. I must say it was pkg real good. Not even a scratch on the box.

Well done Hans

Offline tazprime38

  • Posts: 260
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #285 on: June 15, 2019, 05:05 AM »
I received my TPG50 kit along with the guide rail connecting bars yesterday. For some reason, delivery took a month to the UK. Had to pay £73.10 (82.08 Euros) customs charge [sad]. UPS have no way of paying this online and only accept cash and they have no facility to provide a receipt.  The drive was great though as he signed the box with his driver ID number and name.

With customs charge added this has cost me 507 Euros which is expensive but the quality of the product is very high.

Items were packaged very well. I don't think there is any damage (have only checked the small tracks so far). The GRC12 guide rail connecting bars were also in the box as I ordered these at the same time. This cost an extra $10 in postage but maybe the postage for the TPG50 alone should have been sufficient to cover this extra small weight?

The TPG50 is well engineered as are the guide rail connecting bars. These also work in connecting the parallel guide tracks together nicely but not needed as the three lengths of the TPG should cover most work. Also, you would not be able to use the stops where the connecting bar is connected as the tracks are single slot t tracks not double.

I sold my Festool parallel guides including the large storage case for a very good price which covered the cost of these TPG50 and GRC12 and still left me in profit  [big grin].

Tariq
« Last Edit: June 15, 2019, 06:07 AM by tazprime38 »

Offline simonh

  • Posts: 68
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #286 on: June 15, 2019, 05:37 AM »
Hans,

Are Axminster UK going to stock this at some point? I'd like to get hold of the TPG-50 but I'd rather buy from a UK dealer without having the import duties and shipping costs for a single package.

Offline Mike Goetzke

  • Posts: 298
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #287 on: June 22, 2019, 10:58 AM »
Working on a sewing cabinet project and thought I'd show off my TPG. The project required two sheets of ply cut into 12 pieces. I was going to make my rip cuts first and thought I'd see how accurate of a cut I could get with only using a RHS t-track and TSO square.

Don't know if I was lucky but I was shocked to find I was only off by 1/32" ove 8'. I measured from the back side of the rail to the edge of the board - so probably not the best way to check but I'm still impressed:








Even though this looked to be acceptable accuracy I added my LHS TPG for my cuts:



I've been working with another track saw systems for many years but this was not only quicker but more accurate than my previous method of breaking down sheet goods. I still had to measure every piece vertical/horizontal/diagonal but my confidence is growing.

Some comments on the system:

1) When I put the various length t-tracks on I held them toward the rail when tightening. Seems like the stop plunger is in the correct position for all tracks w/o need for calibration but I need to verify this with test cuts.

(Edited: test cut with all 6 t-tracks and found the 20” & 30” LHS/RHS are almost spot on to each other but both 50” cut 1/16” oversized. Have to think how to correct for this as I don’t want to calibrate for every setup.)

2) On size of the tracks. A 50" was added from requests but my project had a couple cuts just over that. I just marked them and cut. So maybe no need for the 50" track? This is my second project with the TPG but finding the 30" may be all you need for most of the work.

3) Wish the LHS t-track didn't depend on a square that attaches to the underside of the rail. On setup it's one more thing that takes time to make sure the tracks are centered - i.e. the sheet needs to be trapped between the squares. Maybe a rail connector similar to WP and Seneca PEG's?

4) Holding settings. I saw complaints about the WP system with so many connectors losing setting with common bumping of the stops. I actually found the same on the TPG! This occurred at both the flipstop to t-track and flipstop plunger. I found you really need to tighten everything very tight.

Mike
« Last Edit: June 22, 2019, 01:04 PM by Mike Goetzke »

Offline ScotF

  • Posts: 2657
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #288 on: June 22, 2019, 11:21 AM »
Just got my set delivered yesterday. Tried the GRS16 and had perfect results squaring a plastic panel that I needed to do. Cannot wait to try the rest of the pieces out...

Offline rmhinden

  • Posts: 190
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #289 on: July 11, 2019, 04:02 PM »
I purchased the TPG-20 & TPG-30 Parallel Guide System (Right Hand) set and used them for the first time a few days ago to cut some plywood.

I am impressed, was very easy to install and calibrate on my GRS-16 guide rail square.   Then set the cursor to the width of the cuts I wanted to make and made the cuts.   All very easy and accurate.

Good product!

Bob

Offline Mike Goetzke

  • Posts: 298
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #290 on: July 30, 2019, 10:44 AM »
I know all tools have their limits but I'm having fun working on a project that I'm trying to use the TPG on as much as possible.

For all my panel cuts the GRS/TPG system is spot on! I ran into a small issue over the weekend when I was using the GRS/TPG to cut some hardwood drawer fronts which I would usually do on the TS & SCMS. The parts were 8-1/2" x 9-1/2". I was surprised when I found the cut to be off by almost 1/16" when I was within 1/32" over 96" on the ply cuts. The parts were wider at the end of the cut.

I was thinking that this was probably the result of the part moving as I cut it. Not as much anti-slip pad on the piece and not much area registering against the square.

I have the RH & LH TPG. I know the LH was developed for the long cuts but was thinking it may have helped for material trying to move on my small pieces. If I had the TPG material stops at the top & bottom of the piece to be cut this would resist it from moving during the cut. May try this out this weekend.

Mike

Offline tazprime38

  • Posts: 260
Re: NEW TSO TPG-30 Parallel Guide
« Reply #291 on: August 20, 2019, 06:16 AM »
« Last Edit: August 20, 2019, 06:19 AM by tazprime38 »