Author Topic: Chisel and plane sharpening  (Read 4770 times)

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Online Birdhunter

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Chisel and plane sharpening
« on: May 01, 2019, 05:21 AM »
I received several emails this week touting a Woodpeckers chisel and plane iron sharpening tool.

It looks like Woodpeckers has taken the best aspects of the Lie Nielsen and Veritas  sharpening jigs and improved upon them.

If I was not heavily invested in the LN sharpening jig, I’d go after the Woodpeckers product.
Birdhunter

Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline derekcohen

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #1 on: May 01, 2019, 09:21 AM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=5&v=5qAx0gG8Ubw

Designed by an engineer and not by a woodworker. This honing guide will only sharpen bench chisels and is unsuited for plane blades. Why do I say this? Because it is designed to be used with widely spaced wheels ("for stability"), and it will not be possible to create a cambered edge on this (without building a special jig to do so ... and that is getting unnecessarily complicated).

I suggest that Woodpecker design a central wheel ala the Eclipse and the LN.

The other limitation is that the angle setter only goes up to 47 degrees. For BU planes - which would again be limited to straight blades - the highest cutting angle is 59 degrees. Compare that the LN can do 62 degrees and the Veritas 65 degrees.

The other major issue is that it seems designed around parallel-sided blades. That might rule out many vintage types with tapered sides.

This is an awfully expensive guide when compared with the much cheaper LN, which has so much more potential and is beautifully built.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Online Cheese

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #2 on: May 01, 2019, 09:31 AM »
If I was not heavily invested in the LN sharpening jig, I’d go after the Woodpeckers product.

I ordered one yesterday.

I have the original model Veritas and it's starting to show it's age. I know this is operator error, but if I don't really concentrate sometimes it will tip slightly on the single roller. I also am not enamored with the micro bevel adjuster. I mostly sharpen chisels.

I was ready to pull the pin and purchase the Veritas MK II but this Woodpecker system seemed to tick all the boxes. I really like the positive manner in which they achieve the micro bevel.

Offline tomp

  • Posts: 97
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #3 on: May 01, 2019, 10:27 AM »
While I have and use bench chisels, a lot of my work is done with butt chisels and most honing guides do not work with these short chisels. Looking at the Woodpeckers guide, it appears that the distance between the rods which contact the back of the chisels is about the same as the 1-1/4" projection of the chisel specified so I'm thinking that this guide may not be suitable for a butt chisel. Several years ago, I heard about the Kell Honing Guide, did a little research on them and wound up buying a #2 Guide with the large rollers. Easy to set up and, using a piece of plate glass and wet/dry sandpaper,  I'm able to sharpen all of my chisels and plane blades 
with this guide.



I have a setting jig made out of a scrap of BB plywood and a piece of UHMW that allows me to quickly set the projection.

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1909
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #4 on: May 01, 2019, 10:31 AM »
Lie-Nielsen's jig is definitely a great one and much less expensive than the WP jig. However, LN says up front that their jig is designed for LN chisels and plane blades. No matter which jaws you own, the LN jig just doesn't work for some chisels. I still use the LN jig for the others with great results for those and i love it. There is almost no way you can fail to get your chisels sharp with the LN jig.

Also, the WP wheels can be mounted inside or outside. I would think that, with the wheels mounted inside, just by shifting pressure of your fingers you could create a slight camber. Plus, not everyone puts a camber on their plane blades so that might not be important to some.
Randy

Offline RKA

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #5 on: May 01, 2019, 10:45 AM »
I had a similar observation to grbmds regarding @derekcohen 's statement about camber.  With the wheels turned inward, it should allow you to camber a bevel down blade, which only requires pressure on the outside edges to achieve a few thou of difference from the center to the edge.  But on a bevel up blade which requires a more dramatic camber, may not work well as Derek states?  He has far more experience than I ever will, so maybe he can comment on whether I'm out in left field or not. 

The other thing that struck me as odd was the registration of the back of the blade to the jig.  It seems like the pictures and videos represented a mish mosh of prototypes.  Some appear to have the bushing for the central locking rod machined with some tiny flats (bad idea), others show a groove on the inside edge of the jig to hold the blade (which appears to be the final design).  But it's just a square shoulder, so you would probably have to be careful to fully seat the blade against that shoulder before you tighten it down.  And many chisels have a very narrow edge so the contact area with the honing guide and the chisel might be very limited?  The LN jig uses a V groove which may clamp better and more consistently with very little torque required on the knob. 

One nice thing...no other parts to fuss with when moving from wide blade to narrow blade, just move the wheels. 

This is probably where their one time model fails.  Whether the concerns above are real or perceived, we may not know until trying it.  Meanwhile, there is something on the market that does the job admirably (LN jig) with very little fuss and more flexible if your tool of choice includes a bevel up plane. 
-Raj

Offline Chance B

  • Posts: 48
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2019, 06:20 PM »
I may have asked this in a different forum before but didn't receive a definitive answer. Does anybody use the Lie-Nielsen sharpening jig with Blue Spruce Butt Chisels. My butt chisels do not work in my Veritas MK2. The blades aren't long enough to reach the stones in that jig.

Offline MikeGE

  • Posts: 27
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #7 on: May 01, 2019, 06:26 PM »
I ordered one yesterday.

I hope you're not in a hurry for this, as the expected shipping date is the end of September 2019.   [eek]

Offline RKA

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #8 on: May 01, 2019, 07:47 PM »
I may have asked this in a different forum before but didn't receive a definitive answer. Does anybody use the Lie-Nielsen sharpening jig with Blue Spruce Butt Chisels. My butt chisels do not work in my Veritas MK2. The blades aren't long enough to reach the stones in that jig.

LN has long jaws that attach to their guides that will accommodate short blades.  If it will handle a spokeshave blade, I think you’ll be okay with a butt chisel, but I don’t own any BS butt chisels so I can’t say with 100% certainty.

https://www.lie-nielsen.com/product/honing-guide/long-honing-guide-jaw-pair?node=4239
-Raj

Offline greg mann

  • Posts: 1866
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #9 on: May 01, 2019, 08:40 PM »
The notion of removing and reattaching the wheels is just dumb. This could have easily been designed to just reverse the assemblies on the rods and screw. Who wants to fumble around with the little screws holding the wheels on?
Greg Mann
Oakland, Michigan

Online Cheese

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #10 on: May 02, 2019, 12:53 AM »
I hope you're not in a hurry for this, as the expected shipping date is the end of September 2019.   [eek]

Not in a hurry at all, these chisels have been dull for over the last year, another 9 months will not delay a project. It will just force me to be more creative in my solution.  [smile]

Woodworking exists beyond sharp chisels and sharp planes. Many ways to skin the cat.


Online Cheese

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #11 on: May 02, 2019, 01:52 AM »
Who wants to fumble around with the little screws holding the wheels on?

Well if you own a LN sharpening guide, who wants to fumble around with the little screws that hold on the extraneous jaws that attach to his product? He could have done better...he’s smarter than that.

Truth be told, that's the main reason I never even considered purchasing the LN sharpening guide. Once I saw that there are 7 different jaws offered, that decision was over for me. And I'm a LN fan as I own 8 of his planes so this decision should have been a simple slam-dunk. Instead, I decided to investigate the Veritas MK II.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2019, 10:11 AM by Cheese »

Online Birdhunter

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #12 on: May 02, 2019, 09:37 AM »
My LN guide fits both my LN chisels and my Blue Spruce chisels. I do have several sets of jaws for the LN guide to accommodate  different size chisels and plane irons. I also have a set of LN jaws that allow sharpening of angled plane irons.

To be fair, LN has had their guide out in the field for a while and have the advantage of manufacturing the chisels and planes for which the guide is intended. WP is just getting into the guide business. My guess is they will get up to speed quickly.

The fascinating aspect of the Woodpecker guide offering is the angle setting jig. I made a angle setting guide from the LN plans and it works well. If I were starting over, I'd buy the LN guide and the WP angle setting jig.

I see the biggest problem with the WP guide is the wide stance of the two wheels even when set in the inner most position. It looks like this wide stance would limit how much of the water stone that one could use. The single LN roller allows me to angle the tool tip just about anywhere on the water stone.
Birdhunter

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1909
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #13 on: May 02, 2019, 11:18 AM »
@Chance B To find out about your Blue Spruce chisels you could try calling Lie-Nielsen. If they know they will provide the answer, but they may not actually know since the design of their sharping jig was based on Lie-Nielsen chisels and plane blades. This fact may be the reason they offer multiple jaws - namely to make the jig more universally usable.

Changing jaws isn't a big deal. It takes a couple of minutes. For me, the standard jaws work for the majority of sharpening I do and I only need to switch to the long jaws once in awhile.

I don't necessarily think the Woodpeckers jig is a more universal jig (although it seems they approached the design more from that perspective) or an improvement over the LN jig. It would be hard to assess that without using it and I'm not inclined to spend the money for the WP jig regardless of the fact that I am a Woodpeckers tool lover.

Also, whether you use the WP guide for setting the angle or make one, it seems as if it's about as easy as making a guide for the Lie-Nielsen jig. Does it matter whether the final result is a degree or two off from an exact number? I doubt it.
Randy

Offline Billedis

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #14 on: May 02, 2019, 11:32 AM »
Use the Rob Cosman method and save some money!

Offline jobsworth

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #15 on: May 02, 2019, 12:00 PM »
This is the one Im looking at getting. A buddy in the UK had one and used it onsome of my very dull never sharpened chisels and it did a pretty good job at sharpening them. It can also be used on plane blades

https://www.infinitytools.com/shop-essentials/sharpening/sharpening-honing-guides/m-power-fasttrack-sharpening-system-4365


Offline ChuckM

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #16 on: May 02, 2019, 12:02 PM »
This thread confirms one thing that many of us already know: there is no single perfect honing guide out there including the free hand method that can meet all the sharpening needs. (Try free hand sharpening a skew rabbet plane blade, and one will know how slow it is as compared to using a Veritas MKII jig with the skew registration guide. If your skew angle is off, you will have issues setting the blade to make proper cuts).

If there were, WP's latest jig would not have been coming out. The best one, I suspect, is a combination of different systems (including free hand methods and a power sharpening system (for speed)) that address each individual woodworker's varying needs.

I free hand sharpen regular chisels and plane blades, but use a jig for skew blades, back bevels, mortising chisels and the narrowest  chisel (1/16"). I turn to a grinder to reestablish bevels or remove nicks on edges when needed (which could take a long time to do on a stone, and also wear out the stone).

The requirement to use a screwdriver (for the WP's and L-N's) is indeed a nuisance, but not a deal killer, because you can sort your tools into groups, and finish one group first before changing the wheels or jaws. This is no different from using the domino joiner cutting all the mortises with one width setting (e.g. standard) before switching the dial to the wider setting.

Anyone who wants a jig that is most price competitive should consider this:

I used the modified side-clamping jig (there are other videos out there showing you how to fix the Eclipse) before saving enough change for the MKII guide.

« Last Edit: May 02, 2019, 12:14 PM by ChuckM »

Offline Sanderxpander

  • Posts: 377
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #17 on: May 02, 2019, 04:59 PM »
I like the Veritas Mk2, with the narrow blade head it does well for my chisels. I suppose some folks feel it's too fiddly, but I'm just an amateur and don't need chisels every day or even every week. They get very very sharp with a little effort though. But I really hate the micro bevel thingy. It always ends up skewed and after googling it seems this is almost a universal thing. I've taken to just moving the chisel back a little in the jig.

With some practice, I suppose most jigs can do quite well. I spent ages debating over scary sharp, water stones, 3m lapping film, diamond stones, this jig or that jig... Just try and see what works I guess. Almost any sharpening is better than no sharpening if you're a little sensible. You'd have to try pretty hard to ruin a chisel forever and even then, it's just a chisel.

Offline ChuckM

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #18 on: May 02, 2019, 05:35 PM »
Snip.
But I really hate the micro bevel thingy. It always ends up skewed and after googling it seems this is almost a universal thing. I've taken to just moving the chisel back a little in the jig.


Is the micro bevel skewed or is the edge skewed? If the micro bevel, it won't affect the cut or performance. If the edge is out of square, it may not be the micro-beveling but a registration issue (the tool is not secured square to the jig).

The image shows the kind of micro bevel I usually get from the MKII standard honing guide (05M0901). The micro-bevels will look much less uniform after a few rounds of free hand sharpening. Same observation on the plane blades. The more important part is the squareness of the cutting edge, not the uniformity/slight variation of the micro-bevel.
« Last Edit: May 02, 2019, 05:42 PM by ChuckM »

Offline Sanderxpander

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #19 on: May 03, 2019, 07:27 AM »
It's the microbevel that's not parallel with the edge. The edge is square with the sides. If you google for this you'll see it's a common issue. I can kind of correct it if I heavily lean on one side of the jig. It's not a problem for sharpness but it means grinding way more than I should have to because the mb goes up really high on one side. Plus it looks terrible ;)

Online Birdhunter

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #20 on: May 03, 2019, 08:45 AM »
I tried the micro bevel thing and I guess it's a good idea to protect the chisel's or iron's edge, but, for now, I have decided to not use it. I have not chipped any chisel or iron edges and it's very easy to slide the tool into the LN guide and tune the edge up on 8000 then 10,000 water stones.
Birdhunter

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1909
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #21 on: May 03, 2019, 01:14 PM »
As far as I know, the reason for a micro-bevel is to avoid spending time re-sharpening the primary bevel each time the blade dulls. It definitely is faster to re-hone the micro-bevel rather than the primary; usually a small number of swipes across the 2 finest grit stones. I have not discovered any other reason a micro-bevel is needed.
Randy

Offline ChuckM

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #22 on: May 03, 2019, 08:09 PM »
Snip.
It definitely is faster to re-hone the micro-bevel rather than the primary;

You're spot on, Randy. Only when the micro bevel becomes too large do we re-establish a new primary bevel. A micro-beveled edge lasts longer relatively because of its higher angle. My Japanese chisel does not get a micro bevel, though.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2019, 08:14 PM by ChuckM »

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1909
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #23 on: May 04, 2019, 02:11 AM »
@ChuckM

I have 1 Japanese chisel bought from Lee Valley and it came with a micro-bevel already on. I haven't needed to sharpen yet as I use it mainly for paring and it stays sharp a very long time. Why wouldn't a micro-bevel be just as useful as on other chisels?
Randy

Offline derekcohen

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #24 on: May 04, 2019, 12:43 PM »
The terminology will confuse many.

My version is that there is a primary bevel, and this may be flat, as in created with a belt sander, or hollowed, as on a bench grinder wheel.

Then there is a difference between a secondary bevel (which is a bevel higher than the primary bevel) and a micro bevel, which is simply a tiny bevel. Finally, there is a tertiary bevel, which is when one adds a higher angle to a secondary bevel (as well going to a higher grit).

One may have a micro secondary bevel, which is created when using a honing guide. And one may have a micro coplanar bevel, as when one hones freehand directly on a hollow grind.

Now lets not get started on the many ways in which one can hone a blade :)

What I will say, is that freehand honing directly on a hollow grind is the fastest way I know to hone an edge. And I can re-sharpen a blade in under 30 seconds. I only use a guide when honing BU plane blades. I have a selection of guides (because I am curious). The easiest to use is the LN. You do not need a sophisticated angle setting system. And if you are working on a fine hollow grind, you do not need multiple tertiary bevels.

Freehand hone on a fine hollow grind ...



Regards from Perth

Derek

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1909
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #25 on: May 04, 2019, 05:09 PM »
Free hand May be the fastest way but, for most of us,  the most reliable way is to use a jig like the LN. I get the exact same result every time and it really doesn’t take much longer to establish the correct exposure for the desired angle with a simple homemade gauge. I’m guessing the WP jig would do exactly the same, and as well, as the LN jig. If you didn’t buy the setup guide and made one the price wouldn’t be much more thAn the LN jig when you include at least the long jaws for short blades.   No advantage if you already own the LN jig but might be An improvement over others.
Randy

Offline ChuckM

  • Posts: 1190
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #26 on: May 04, 2019, 05:18 PM »
The simplest way to make an angle setting jig for the side clamping style of honing jig is to make use of an angle gauge (http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.aspx?p=67350&cat=1,43513) in a manner similar to this:

http://tinyurl.com/y5nn4x5l

Offline aufinger

  • Posts: 8
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #27 on: May 04, 2019, 06:33 PM »
LN + the angle jig works well for me. I have the Veritas also and it's slick, but more steps.

Really, if you have a stop on your bench that gets you 25-degrees-ish, that's going to work well for you across most blades. Just but a 1/8 spacer in there for your micro bevel.

Online Birdhunter

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #28 on: May 04, 2019, 08:22 PM »
Is the only advantage of a secondary bevel sharpening time ?
Birdhunter

Offline aufinger

  • Posts: 8
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #29 on: May 04, 2019, 09:01 PM »
Is the only advantage of a secondary bevel sharpening time ?

Yeah. When you go to resharpen, you just just to work the small micro bevel rather than the full bevel. A few swipes should be all you need to turn a burr.

Offline derekcohen

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #30 on: May 04, 2019, 09:37 PM »
Free hand May be the fastest way but, for most of us,  the most reliable way is to use a jig like the LN. I get the exact same result every time and it really doesn’t take much longer to establish the correct exposure for the desired angle with a simple homemade gauge. ...

It is not only fast, but angles are repeatable (for BD plane blades and chisels) if you first hollow grind to the angle you want, and then simpy freehand hone on the hollow. The hollow acts as a jig (no jig to set up). If you use a honing guide to create a secondary bevel, this will creep up and become excessively large, and at some stage you will need to re-grind the primary bevel anyway.

Freehanding on a hollow cuts out the unnecessary, and is much faster and just as reliable as a honing guide. When someone says that they are not in the shop enough to learn this, I remind them that I am also a weekend warrior, and it was no big deal to master the technique. I have used every method under the sun, and this is the one I decided works more efficiently for me.

Regards from Perth

Derek


Festool USA does not pre-approve the contents of this website nor endorse the application or use of any Festool product in any way other than in the manner described in the Festool Instruction Manual. To reduce the risk of serious injury and/or damage to your Festool product, always read, understand and follow all warnings and instructions in your Festool product's Instruction Manual. Although Festool strives for accuracy in the website material, the website may contain inaccuracies. Festool makes no representations about the accuracy, reliability, completeness or timeliness of the material on this website or about the results to be obtained from using the website. Festool and its affiliates cannot be responsible for improper postings or your reliance on the website's material. Your use of any material contained on this website is entirely at your own risk. The content contained on this site is provided for informational purposes only and does not constitute professional advice.


Offline RKA

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #31 on: May 04, 2019, 11:13 PM »
I feel like I’m following your path Derek (trying this and that).  One question I had is why the jig for the BU blades but the hollow grind method for BD?  Is it because you’re putting a high angle on the BU and you don’t get the same solid registration as you do on other blades with lower angles? 
-Raj

Offline derekcohen

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #32 on: May 06, 2019, 11:02 AM »
Hi Raj

Modern blades tend to be thicker and use steel that is more abrasion resistant than high carbon types (such as O1). Modern steels include A2 and PM-V11.

It is notably the BU planes that require a different sharpening strategy from BD planes. First off, the blades from LV are typically 3/16” thick. Secondly, all planes (BU and BD) need to camber the blades to avoid tracks when planing face grain. Thirdly, high cutting angles (I only use a bevel of 50 degrees, but the rule applies for lower angles as well) are needed for BU planes to avoid tearout with interlocked wood. The net result of attempting to freehand a camber on a 50 degree bevel on a thick abrasion-resistant steel scared most BU users away from doing so for many years. Some still have not got the message that there is a simple method to do so.

1. To camber a high angle BU blade you always use a honing guide. I freehand all my other blades - chisels and BD plane blades (on a hollow grind) - but BU plane blades need a guide to get the bevel angle correct.

2. Only ever use a 25 degree primary bevel. Never hone a full angle bevel, such as 50 degrees. Instead, add the 50 degrees as a secondary micro bevel to the 25 degree primary bevel. Add your camber while doing this. There is significantly less steel to remove this way. Honing and cambering BU plane blades can be a quick process.

My system for BD plane blades and all Western chisels is to freehand on a hollow. This creates a coplanar microbevel. An analogy is that this is similar to using a Japanese blade, which is hollowed (relieved) on the back to speed up honing hard steel. Working on the full hollow, rather than freehand creating a secondary micro bevel (tipping the blade), ensures repeatability of the cutting angle.

The quality of the hollow determines the speed at which you can hone. As full a hollow as possible - that is, as close to the edge as you can get without burning steel - reduces the steel to hone and speeds sharpening time, especially with abrasion-resistant steels. The two systems I recommend are the water-cooled Tormek and, better still, a 180 grit CBN wheel on a half-speed bench grinder. The CBN system is fast but also runs cool.

With this system it is possible to hone the first grind with a 5000 grit waterstone, and then proceed to the final polishing stone. I only need 2 or 3 swipes with each. That is fast. As the micro bevel grows, and it does this slowly, add in a 1000 grit stone. I generally re-sharpen about 5 times before touching up the hollow. Note that steel is removed from the hollow and not the length of the blade.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Offline RKA

  • Posts: 1697
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #33 on: May 06, 2019, 01:03 PM »
Thanks @derekcohen !  I don't even want to know how many hours and years you've spent trying and perfecting your methods.  I've only done the hollow grind on the chisels thus far.  All the plane blades were done on a jig.  I've been hesitant to try the plane blades because I have a narrow cambered CBN wheel (toolsforworkingwood).  I can do a pretty good job freehanding up to a 1" chisel keeping the leading edge relatively straight, but with a 2" wide plane blade I think I need a tormek style blade holder for my grinder in order to rake the blade evenly across the cambered wheel.  I guess I'll never know unless I try to freehand it first and see how badly I screw up my blade?  I'm a scared-y cat.  :-P

Edit:  I went digging around for more details on cambering blades (BD and BU) and found the following written by Derek.  I think it goes into exhausting detail about how he arrived with his recommendations.  I've only gone through half of it, but I thought it would be good to add the link below in case anyone else has the same questions.

https://www.inthewoodshop.com/WoodworkTechniques/TheSecretToCamberinBUPlaneBlades.html
« Last Edit: May 06, 2019, 04:11 PM by RKA »
-Raj

Offline grbmds

  • Posts: 1909
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #34 on: May 06, 2019, 01:40 PM »
Free hand May be the fastest way but, for most of us,  the most reliable way is to use a jig like the LN. I get the exact same result every time and it really doesn’t take much longer to establish the correct exposure for the desired angle with a simple homemade gauge. ...

It is not only fast, but angles are repeatable (for BD plane blades and chisels) if you first hollow grind to the angle you want, and then simpy freehand hone on the hollow. The hollow acts as a jig (no jig to set up). If you use a honing guide to create a secondary bevel, this will creep up and become excessively large, and at some stage you will need to re-grind the primary bevel anyway.

Freehanding on a hollow cuts out the unnecessary, and is much faster and just as reliable as a honing guide. When someone says that they are not in the shop enough to learn this, I remind them that I am also a weekend warrior, and it was no big deal to master the technique. I have used every method under the sun, and this is the one I decided works more efficiently for me.

Regards from Perth

Derek
[/quote

Completely understand the process. I just do a better job with a jig and that's why I continue to use one. Many professional woodworkers use a jig also because it's the most reliable for them. We all have our ways of doing things and do what works best for us. I think it's great when people do freehand sharpening/ honing. Just not me.
Randy

Offline derekcohen

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Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #35 on: May 07, 2019, 06:12 AM »
Randy, I have long stated that the important element in woodworking is the building, not the sharpening. No one looks at a piece you have built and asks how you sharpened, or whether you freehanded or used a honing guide :)

How you do it is a personal preference. There are lots of methods that work.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Offline tackdriver

  • Posts: 2
Re: Chisel and plane sharpening
« Reply #36 on: May 31, 2019, 05:02 PM »
Using a small secondary bevel also saves wear on your stones and reduces the need to reflatten them as often.