7 month old Kapex 120eb burn out 😢

[M williams]

Not a happy bunny today...as title suggests kapex motor smoked out after only 7 months v light use!! I just don't understand how Festool can make such a  great saw but with such a poor motor? I know it's under warranty and I have been in touch with Festool service who have sent out a returns form, no problem there... But what gives?? I'm not on here to bash Festool at all but its upsetting to spend so much on a tool and have it go bump so soon. This saw was really looked after too, as It was an upgrade from a 10 yr old dewalt 718 scm which in that time has been absolutely hammered! It is now being used in place of the burned up
Kapex! I can feel my love for my festools starting to wear off...especially now a few are out of warranty!!!!Anyhow just hoping for some positive feedback, that after repairs are carried out this problem is addressed? Maybe with upgraded problem free parts??  [sad]

 

[Cheese]

That sucks ... [mad] [mad] Just curious if it was 120 or 220?

 

[M williams]

Hi I'm from the uk so we're on 110v ( actually 115v, for site use) & 240v... Mine being a 110v version....& Yeah it does indeed suck big time!!

 

[Phil Beckley]

Hi I'm from the uk so we're on 110v ( actually 115v, for site use) & 240v... Mine being a 110v version....& Yeah it does indeed suck big time!!

Hi
I am sure service will resolve your issue quickly. If I can hep in any way please let me know via a pm
Rg
Phil

 

[jimbo51]

Great news. Phil just said that UK Service will resolve the issue of Kapex motors burning out prematurely. At least  that is what it seems he said.  [wink]

 

[bobfog]

I think someone needs to ship a Kapex to that Candaian AvE BOLTR guy on YouTube to get to the bottom of these faults!

^^ just in case anyone missed it, that was sarcasm!

 

[peter halle]

Great news. Phil just said that UK Service will resolve the issue of Kapex motors burning out prematurely. At least  that is what it seems he said.  [wink]

I know that you were posting with sarcasm but just in case other readers don't tune into that even with the emoji, that is not what Phil said.

Peter

 

[M williams]

I think someone needs to ship a Kapex to that Candaian AvE BOLTR guy on YouTube to get to the bottom of these faults!

^^ just in case anyone missed it, that was sarcasm!

Mmmmm I wonder how much it costs to ship a reconditioned kapex to Canada???
^ Again purely sarcasm!!

 

[duburban]

ive been seeing this problem off and on for so long now. isn't it time Festool just put a dewalt motor in there and be done with it?

 

[Cheese]

ive been seeing this problem off and on for so long now. isn't it time Festool just put a dewalt motor in there and be done with it?

Unfortunately, Dewalt doesn't have a German subsidiary... [poke]... [popcorn]

I did notice this was another 110 volt failure.  [eek]

I've also heard several internal rumblings that it's a corporate concern that the German armature supplier doesn't fully understand the needs/issues of the 110/120 volt market. Well, that would certainly be a good starting point to resolve this issue...

 

[antss]

ive been seeing this problem off and on for so long now. isn't it time Festool just put a dewalt motor in there and be done with it?

Unfortunately, Dewalt doesn't have a German subsidiary... [poke]... [popcorn]

I did notice this was another 110 volt failure.  [eek]

I've also heard several internal rumblings that its a corporate concern that the German armature supplier doesn't fully understand the needs/issues of the 110/120 volt market. Well that would certainly be a starting point...

Um........isn't Elu still in business ? 

May not be, but I do know just about everything B&D /Dewalt has that's worth a darn came out of that operation.  And I know Elu made miter saws for the Euro market too.

I'd be really curious to know how this has affected sales of the kapex.  From afar it looks like big business just trying to weather the storm till everyone's warranty expires and it's the owners problem. Classic risk management.  At least they've recognized there "might" be a problem.

The high road would be to halt production and solve the problem lightning fast and or extend current owners warranty with regard to motor failure. But, I have experience with German engineers and they hate to admit fault, assuming you can prove there even is one in their eyes.  Then, they're even slower to implement a solution because that just dings their ego even more.

 

[duburban]

I have no idea how these companies work but it seems like the issue with releasing a new saw/motor would be making amends to current owners of the kapex. Developing a motor thats durable for the existing saw is similar by replacing all current kapex motors. I see how its a sticky situation. I would own a kapex already if it wasn't for this issue which is why I'm sick of seeing the it pop up. Yes, I know that many users have no issues, but enough do to make it a problem for me.

 

[M williams]

I think it would go some way on festools part, to admit that maybe the 110v motor may have issues, then look into the problem.. Then once a service is required, fit the saw out with new updated parts..surely to continue Producing the kapex The motor would need updating anyhow??? For me that would certainly give me back some confidence in the tools.its really a shame tbh as I had the kapex with the ug stand & wings, the whole setup is so well engineered and really is a pleasure to use, but being as the mitre saw is the heart of any job site, I think the motor should be pretty much bombproof. Maybe some of the fancy electronics could be Toned down?? Just a suggestion! I'm sure that's not beyond festools scope?? The other thing is that perhaps I just got a bad unit?

 

[AlexThePalex]

The other thing is that perhaps I just got a bad unit?

Of course you've got a bad unit. Just like so many others because this subject keeps surfacing. Festool's really got to have a plate in front of their head to keep supplying the Kapex with these kind of 110v motors.

 

[Cheese]

Um........isn't Elu still in business ? 

May not be, but I do know just about everything B&D /Dewalt has that's worth a darn came out of that operation.  And I know Elu made miter saws for the Euro market too.

Whoops....I forgot about the ELU connection  [not worthy]

Yes they're  still in business but are now owned by an Italian Holding Company.
http://www.elumatec.com/the-company/history.html

 

[Rip Van Winkle]

Um........isn't Elu still in business ? 

May not be, but I do know just about everything B&D /Dewalt has that's worth a darn came out of that operation.  And I know Elu made miter saws for the Euro market too.

Whoops....I forgot about the ELU connection  [not worthy]

Yes they're  still in business but are now owned by an Italian Holding Company.
http://www.elumatec.com/the-company/history.html

Elumatec manufactures larger stationary saws and machines for industrial manufacturing. Most if the Elumatic machines I've seen appear to use induction motors rather than the universal motors used in most or all current Festool tools.

Black & Decker purchased the the Elu brand in 1984, which included the smaller hand held power tools and woodworking machines, most if which used universal motors. I would presume most of the design engineers for the Elu tools wound up as employees of Black & Decker, unless the employee specifically opted to stay with Elumatic and was allowed to. I believe this is what happened to the design/engineering team from AEG tools when it was purchased by Techtronic Industries from Atlas Copco. Both companies have continued tweaking the power tool designs since the companies have changed hands. Most if not all of the iriginsl designers may be retired by now.

Maybe Festool should see if they can license a motor design from Fein. Fein has been selling tools in 110/120v in the USA for decades. Fein already likely manufactures the Vecturo for Festool, and Fein is an OEM supplier if motors for some other German manufacturers as well.

 

[antss]

Point I was trying to make was/is that there are a couple of Euro companies that can make darn near bullet proof 110v universal motors. 

IF not bullet prof , they certainly last more than 2-3 years on average , and they also weren't from "premimum" (or claimed premimum) tool manuf. and didn't cost 50-100% more than a comparable competitor.

Note to Festool C-Level suits: slick marketing, fancy features, high prices and margins are great in the short term - but if you want to keep your vaunted position and aura long term - you better not lose sight of what got you there in the first place !

Manuf. cost savings and increased sales look nice to the managers receiving bonuses based on those savings and volume but things like smoked saw motors, on $1500 miter saws is not doing you any good long term. Especially when you all but deny publicly that there even is a problem.  I suggest you devote more resources to fixing that problem than designing overpriced LED lights, radios, and drywall screwguns that I'm sure have stellar margins, but do little to really enhance your brand.

 

[M williams]

Just a quick update for anyone who's interested. Sent the saw to the service department & had it back in around a week. Which is good to be fair to Festool. It's all working again as it should and seems to be holding up ok. The items replaced were the field assembley, brushes & brush holder & end shield? They also replaced the table top insert which was fine so not sure why? But hey ho so be it.. Again just out of interest, after looking at spares for the kapex, the parts replaced come to around £150 in all so not a cheap fix but not too bad all in all. Hope this thread is useful to someone looking into a kapex purchase? After all this....I still like the saw and did miss it's accuracy and ease of use for the week it was away. I guess I will just use it and see what happens????

 

[ChuckS]

As an owner of a Kapex (110V) which is still under warranty and has not had any problematic signs, all I can say is the continual reports of Kapex failures worry me. Will mine (almost 2 years old) go bust after another year? One thing I am sure is if it does and the repair bill is $900 (or is it $600 that someone else was quoted on another thread), I'd bite the bullet and throw the whole thing into trash -- no kidding. I'd rather spend the $900 on a new compound mitre saw of another brand and then not to worry about it for another 10 years.

The way this machine is being handled by the manufacturer has dampened my desire to get another Festool machine. I was looking at but have decided not to get a Festool sander. I have also put on hold the intention to think about the TS55 after watching the tracksaw tear-down video (Av). I have a SawStop that handles most of the sawing tasks, except when handling 4x8 sheets.

In the foreseeable future, I will keep my Kapex and Domino DF500 (a wonderful tool), but may get rid of the Kapex one day (before its warranty is over?) before it becomes a liability.

Chuck

 

[HappyCamper]

It was more than a little alarming to hear of these problems with the motor.  I have a very lightly used Kapex that is about 6 years of so old.  It has been a fine saw so far.  It replaced well used Hitachi with a 8.5 inch non-dual bevel saw bought in 1992 and still working beautifully for my son to whom I passed it along.
As to not being able to produce a 110 volt motor, the track saws don't seem to have this problem. Can there be that big a difference? I have had the track saw since 2004 and it is still going strong.