A warning to dealers..

[Bob Marino]

 This comes as a piggyback to the recent discussion about stolen tools on Ebay.  Apparently UPS has a program which allows customers, NOT THE SELLER, to redirect a package after it has shipped. Up until recently, when a package is shipped, the only way to reroute is for the Shipper to request a UPS intercept. Now, with UPS MY CHOICE,  a customer can contact UPS and have the package intercepted  and shipped to another location - without the Shipper being notified. Well, on the face of it, sounds pretty customer friendly, but it doesn't take much imagination of those intent on stealing to turn this into a cash cow.

 I would urge dealers here - and elsewhere, who use UPS, to ensure that they the shipper be notified if a package is being redirected or better yet, to not allow MY CHOICE as an option for their packages.

 Bob

 

[Kev]

Sadly services such as Shipito also have the potential to be abused for scams in a similar way to what Bob describes ... but they are a great way for international buyers to consolidate freight and leverage the service's bulk discount shipping rates.

If a seller is shipping to one of these services and does not already know the buyer, it's a good idea to ensure you've got the actual buyers home address and even potentially request a proof of Id.

Banking and financial services industries seem to take little responsibility for the absolutely massive fraud landscape they themselves have introduced with credit cards. They take little responsibility and place most of the risk on the seller.

 

[RC]

Unfortunately this service is already actively exploited by some credit card fraudsters.

Unless the shipper can prohibit UPS offering this service to the customer there is little that the card brands, merchants or acquirers can do to prevent this type of fraud since the goods are ordered to the legitimate card holders address and after the fraud ranking has been done at transaction time and the authorization has been given by the issuing bank there is nothing the financial institutions can do.

As a merchant I would either find out if there is a box to tick in the senders paperwork to prohibit UPS redirection or change shipping company to one that doesn't have this service if you want to mitigate the risk.

 

[AlexThePalex]

Sounds a bit TOO customer friendly if you ask me. Sure, changing the shipping address afterwards might be useful on occasion, but if you weigh the number of clients who would actually use this verses the potential for misuse, then it doesn't look too good.

Especially when packages could be of some value, clear set conditions should be set before the buy, and not be able to be changed in transit.

 

[wow]

I'd be switching to FedEx ground in a heartbeat...

 

[sancho57]

Thx for the heads up Bob.

I wonder what me as  a customer can do to prevent some fraudster from stealing my stuff?

 

[shed9]

Sounds a bit TOO customer friendly if you ask me. Sure, changing the shipping address afterwards might be useful on occasion, but if you weigh the number of clients who would actually use this verses the potential for misuse, then it doesn't look too good.

Especially when packages could be of some value, clear set conditions should be set before the buy, and not be able to be changed in transit.

I totally agree, I also can't see the benefit of changing address outweighing the risk to both supplier and end customer.

 

[Bob Marino]

  I'm writing this post  chiefly to notify dealers of this program and to inform them that, as a dealer, you can request from UPS that this service not be offered to those ordering from you and perhaps put some pressure on UPS not to get rid of this program but at least to modify it so that a shipper is notified immediately before an address change can be made.  I can not see a reason why the shipper should not be notified of a change in shipping.
Card holders  are always (rightly so) protected against loss, by the issuing bank.

Bob

 

[sancho57]

Thx Bob

 

[peter halle]

To me the whole program seems like "a tail wagging the dog" designed to benefit a tiny amount of buyers.  With the usually short fulfillment time for orders - typically just a day or two, and also short shipping times, it would seem to me that that the risk of having such a program will only benefit those who choose to order without pre planning where they will be in about  a week and also those who have a legitimate emergency.

Peter

 

[Sean7a]

To me the whole program seems like "a tail wagging the dog" designed to benefit a tiny amount of buyers.  With the usually short fulfillment time for orders - typically just a day or two, and also short shipping times, it would seem to me that that the risk of having such a program will only benefit those who choose to order without pre planning where they will be in about  a week and also those who have a legitimate emergency.

Peter

It's strange Peter and you make a good point.  The purpose of the program is a bit silly and I don't see it being legitimately used by many.  We've ensured that this service is no longer available to our buyers, which does stink for the few of you that may find it useful, as we were caught out a few times earlier this year by fraud. 

 

[Claimdude]

I have to chime in here. I am a UPS Choice Customer and love the benefits of it! In fact, I have an order scheduled to be delivered today from Tool Nut (Sean) and just checked and verified that I have the ability to change the delivery address if I want to. It may be that if I proceeded through the menus it would at some point prevent me from executing the change (I am home today so do not wish to change it). I have also purchased a number of items from Bob over the years.

While I understand the concerns and challenges you dealers face this is a hugely convenient tool (pun intended) for me. I travel a great deal for my work and more than several times I have had to request my packages be redirected once shipped. Frankly, a dealer who prohibited me from using my Choice benefits might lose my business for that purchase and maybe more.

From my standpoint if a dealer elects to prohibit address changes and that is not made very obvious to me at time of purchase and it is a circumstance where address change is needed I would be a VERY unhappy customer and would likely never purchase from that dealer again. As dealers you are also painfully aware that 1 unhappy customer will tell 7 to 9 other people. Depending on my travel schedule if notified at time of purchase could not be used I would simply purchase elsewhere.

I share this because you guys (Bob and Sean) are outstanding dealers and think you should be aware that your reactions to one problem (depending on how many UPS Choice members purchase from you) might cause unintended consequences. 

Thanks for all you do!
  Jack

 

[Sean7a]

Jack, no way!  Right off the bat someone who uses it.  Ha, how about that. 

Interesting note that it seems to be active.  I just double checked to ensure it's in fact not, thank you for the heads up.

From our perspective, and I'd be curious what Bob has to say, CSD (customer service department) tells me the percentage of orders that utilize my choice that have NOT been fraud, is nearly non existent.  You may be one of the many few.

When I take taht into consideration, it's tough to say yes to a program like that.  I'm sure you can understand.

I'm curious with your last paragraph.  You mentioned taht dealers who don't offer this service would lose your business and in fact make you an unhappy customer.  Have you found, with other purchases, that ALL UPS accounts offer this service.  Possibly it's a default feature that has to be turned off, not initially turned on, so you've been able to use it when and where you please.

 

[peter halle]

Of course the dealer can also be contacted and asked to redirect.  Just my thought.

Peter

 

[Sean7a]

Of course the dealer can also be contacted and asked to redirect.  Just my thought.

Peter

Yes sir

 

[Claimdude]

Sean,

I haven't paid a lot of attention to it but I don't recall a UPS shipment that did not have the "delivery change" button on it. I only click on the button when I need to use it though so it is entirely possible some functionality is restricted based on dealer elections.... I just checked my package again after your change and it shows delivery address change not available due to dealer request but all other options are available. Still, if I got called to leave town yesterday I would have changed the delivery address to my son's who lives several miles from me as I don't want the high dollar order coming from you to sit on my front porch nor would I want to change delivery date as I would be back late Friday evening and would want to play with my toy Saturday morning ;-) Under the aforementioned circumstance had I found out about your restriction only when I needed to change it I would have come close to blowing a gasket. I could still have had it delivered to the local UPS Store but UPS pops you $5 and the Store adds $5 as well.

Full disclosure up front before order is placed and/or exempting established customers from the restriction is a much better solution in my view. The UPS Choice program is outstanding service in my opinion.

Jack

Jack, no way!  Right off the bat someone who uses it.  Ha, how about that. 

Interesting note that it seems to be active.  I just double checked to ensure it's in fact not, thank you for the heads up.

From our perspective, and I'd be curious what Bob has to say, CSD (customer service department) tells me the percentage of orders that utilize my choice that have NOT been fraud, is nearly non existent.  You may be one of the many few.

When I take taht into consideration, it's tough to say yes to a program like that.  I'm sure you can understand.

I'm curious with your last paragraph.  You mentioned taht dealers who don't offer this service would lose your business and in fact make you an unhappy customer.  Have you found, with other purchases, that ALL UPS accounts offer this service.  Possibly it's a default feature that has to be turned off, not initially turned on, so you've been able to use it when and where you please.

 

[Sean7a]

Thanks so much for the insight Jack.

 

[Brice Burrell]

Of course the dealer can also be contacted and asked to redirect.  Just my thought.

Peter

Agreed, a person with a proven track record like Jack that shouldn't be a problem to allow a redirect.  

 

[Brice Burrell]

.......Full disclosure up front before order is placed and/or exempting established customers from the restriction is a much better solution in my view. The UPS Choice program is outstanding service in my opinion.

Jack

Well, you are now aware of the glaring shortcoming of this program, do you still really think this it is outstanding?

 

[Bob Marino]

Jack,

Thanks for the kind words earlier, but as Peter mentioned, any package can redirected by the shipper/dealer upon a customer's request. Not 15 minutes ago, I received  an email from a customer requesting an address change. All that needs to be done is to call or email the shipper/dealer.
Yes, of course MY CHOICE  can be a convenience in some cases and I would be waaaaaaaaaaaaaay more accepting of that program if the dealer/shipper needed to be notified beforehand, so he can verify that it is the actual card holder, not some thief who is requesting that address change, instead of finding out a month or 2 later that the card was stolen and you as a dealer basically are on the hook for that stolen product.  

 Bob