Another alternative make for guide rail lever clamps. QWORK.

[demographic]

I have never had the Festool screw clamps slip. I have never even heard of that? I have been using both sizes of them for years with no problems at all. I have had the ratchet style ones make dents/impressions, but no slipping from any of them.

A few threads bave mentioned it and initially I liked them.
Simpe, effective, no worries.
But then I started to notice one slipping and after the cut was done had rattled loose.
Lets face it, for 90% of cuts I don't even need them, the gripper stuff manages fine but if I'm cutting expensive laminated bathroom boards I don't want anything to slip or its a board wasted and some time as well.
That adds up.

Its possible I've got something on the threads cos afterall I also use them as general purpose clamps but I've cleaned them with brake cleaner and they're still not reliable.
I have four and two slip, so that means the good ones work out at twice as expensive really.

I like the idea of them, but currently mine aren't that great.

 

[mrboult]

I use these. . . Best by far in terms of rail clamping.
Cheapest (not quite as good quality plastic or quite as long:https://www.axminstertools.com/axmi...dium=affiliates&utm_content=1795&glCountry=GB

Better ones:https://www.sphinxindustrial.co.uk/ProductGrp/001c000e0001

Better ones (US LINK):https://go2toolz.com/product/piher-mini-quick-t-track/

Nice.
Though 600N/130lb is about 5x less force than the ratchet clamps provide.

Yes. But for rail clamps they’re great. Never needed more clamping force than they provide to secure my rail. And I find them far more useful to have around than the festool variants.

But sure if you’re clamping a glue up with them they’re not as good.

 

[mino]

Yes. But for rail clamps they’re great. Never needed more clamping force than they provide to secure my rail. And I find them far more useful to have around than the festool variants.

But sure if you’re clamping a glue up with them they’re not as good.

I found that when clamping laminated, pre-coated and especially foiled materials, I need to secure the clamps a lot so the whole assembly will not move against the table. For this the ratchet clamps are excellent as even the screw clamps cannot be tightened enough by hand.

In that scenario the clamps contact with the table edge for sawing and would use a spreader for other needs so marks are not a concern.

For wood and "woody" raw materials the clamping force is a non-issue indeed.

I would see those quick-clamps as more a replacement of the screw clamp version than the ratchet ones.

Will end up buying these to complement the ratchet and likely replace the screw ones role though.
Thanks for the tip!

 

[wpz]

Bessey also have these for festool rails:
View attachment 1https://www.bessey.de/en-GB/BESSEY-Tool/Products/New-Products/One-handed-table-clamp-EZR

They look quite similar to the ones for the Mafell rails:https://produkte.mafell.de/usa/acce...m-2-pieces-for-fixing-guide-rail-to-workpiece

wpz

 

[wpz]

So, how about $70 for a Bessey quick ratchet clamp, $63 for the Festool version.
Then over here one can talk about saving on copy cats.. Still I buy the standard screw version as I prefer these. In Bessey color they are $18..
On the local market place here they’re trying to get $150 a pair, NIB, but still private sales..

I don’t get that Axminster are selling knock offs.. Axminster have gone more and more over to private label tools. I like supporting the original maker if possible, within limits on the price.

Dictum in Germany sell Japanese saws made by Gyokucho, under their own name, Dictum. They still have Gyokucho stamped on the steel blade - discrete, but visible. They have made versions to their own specifications, handles and such. Pricing is still competitive - good move and work.
I’ll buy from Dictum just for that transparency. Rutlands in UK also sell Gyokucho, as well as a couple of shops locally, pricing is very similar, and sensible. Very good.
Fun is that Hultafors in Sweden have made a knock off of Gyokucho, no Japanese blade, heavier and $20 more - Should have been $15 less, I’d still get the right thing for $15 more.

I believe the Festool clamps are made by Bessey to begin. Would not be surprised if were even designed under a Festool commission. Not so sure the "copycat" applies there.

I do not have a problem with other companies copying an idea. Once patents expire /or if it does not apply directly/ e.g. the Benchdogs squares versus TSO etc.

I do have a problem with someone copying a design right down to a millimeter as that just pure and ugly "quick buck" leeching. This case being the latter. It simply stinks. No thanks.

Err, I've already said that these clamps are NOT total copies.take a look at them, try it with your eyes open that usually helps.
They are different from the Bessey lever clamp I have.
The Bessey clamps are however the same as the Festool ones and I suspect Bessey make the clamps for Festool

Oh and just supposing they were a direct copy? Is the patent still running? Were they copyrighted?
Thats the legal part.

You don't want to buy them? Dont, but get your facts straight before you launch on one eh?

Well Bessey did have a patent on them at some point, at least it says so on the ones I inherited from my grandfather.
They are not the rail type, but normal ones and the ratchet mechanism is a little bit different.
I suppose the patent has expired as these are from the late 1940's, early 50's I believe.

 

[demographic]

As this is a Festool forum theres bound to be a few lawyers on here that will know for sure but as far as I know patents only work in the countries they have been filed in as well.
I think thats how come Wilton nicked (oops, sorry I mean...erm...ahh...were heavily influenced by) the design of York vises from Czechoslovakia then patented them in America so York wasnt even allowed to sell vises they'd been making for years in America cos they unsurprisingly looked like wilton bullet vises.

I expect one or two Wilton Bullet vice owners to protest about this chain of events though and it's possible I've not remembered it correctly.

 

[FestitaMakool]

[member=66126]wpz[/member]  Really nice old set of Bessey clamps you have, even in near mint condition too.
How do they compare to their grand child’s?  [smile]

 

[Mike Goetzke]

For those really on the cheap (me - for some things)  [big grin].

Few years back I made a pair of rail clamps from Irwin Quick-Grip clamps based on a video I saw. You need to heat it, bend it, and grind a little but once done they make great clamps.

 

[ChuckM]

For those really on the cheap (me - for some things)  [big grin].

Few years back I made a pair of rail clamps from Irwin Quick-Grip clamps based on a video I saw. You need to heat it, bend it, and grind a little but once done they make great clamps.

I recall seeing something like that. It's not really cheap, depending on how we value our hours (I know quite a few retirees who think their labor is worth little. I never do). But it's always satisfying to give something surplus in your shop some new life. It's good for the environment, too.

 

[Mike Goetzke]

For those really on the cheap (me - for some things)  [big grin].

Few years back I made a pair of rail clamps from Irwin Quick-Grip clamps based on a video I saw. You need to heat it, bend it, and grind a little but once done they make great clamps.

I recall seeing something like that. It's not really cheap, depending on how we value our hours (I know quite a few retirees who think their labor is worth little. I never do). But it's always satisfying to give something surplus in your shop some new life. It's good for the environment, too.

Careful there one day we all hope to reach retirement age. I know time is not free but this is a hobby for me and to a lesser extent metalworking. For me it was fun/relaxing to do and for about $10 and less than an hours work I had two rail clamps so I thought I'd share it as an alternative.

 

[demographic]

Some good alternatives here, thanks for posting about them folks.
Sometimes one version is too tight for space and another version just works better.
Yeah these are mostly guiderail clamps but lets face it, we all use clamps for all sorts of jobs and versatility is important.
Seeing a few different types is helpful.

 

[wpz]

[member=66126]wpz[/member]  Really nice old set of Bessey clamps you have, even in near mint condition too.
How do they compare to their grand child’s?  [smile]

[member=71478]FestitaMakool[/member] I like the new ones better  [big grin]

The old ones don't differ much from the new ones, the main drawback is that they are completely made of steel that is not coated, so they rust if you don't maintain them properly.
When I found them they were completely rusted and it took me quite some elbow grease (and rust remover) to restore them.
I now rub them with a bit of camelia oil from time to time as I do with my chisels.
Another difference is the angle of the handle when fully opened, it stands out almost horizontally (see picture)
Of course, the new ones don't nearly have the charm the old ones have  [cool]

wpz

 

[FestitaMakool]

Wow, judging only by the photos here, you must have done a great job with the light resto.
They look very fresh with only light markings from use, that’s cool.
The wide opening must have been and are limiting. Nice that they are in use [cool]