Rutabagared
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Bosch Impact Driver
- Thread starter Rutabagared
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Brice Burrell
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Joe, I think you'd be better off with a drill over an impact. Control with impacts isn't anywhere as easy as a drill and for furniture finesse is preferred over the power of an impact. Your limited needs for driving bigger/longer screws or lags could be served by a drill. Impacts excel at driving tasks that require brute strength, that's not furniture making.
GreenGA
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I've been looking to get an impact driver for some time now. Since I am already heavily invested in DeWalt 18v cordless tools (I was already on that road when I discovered Festool ;D), I am looking at their 18v 1/2" unit for about 130 something on eBay. That's not much more than the 12v Bosch you're looking at.
Not sure if this helps, but it is an option.
Not sure if this helps, but it is an option.
GreenGA
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I just reread your original post. Forget my suggestion of the DeWalt. For your application, Brice's suggestion is much better than mine. For those occasions when an impact driver would benefit you, you could always use a ratchet & socket to drive in the big stuff.
Maybe, just maybe, you could find a gently used C12, without the extra chucks, in or near your price range. It's a shame you couldn't, say, double your budget. In that case, I know you could find a C12. :
Maybe, just maybe, you could find a gently used C12, without the extra chucks, in or near your price range. It's a shame you couldn't, say, double your budget. In that case, I know you could find a C12. :
I have two of those Bosch 12v Impactors and absolutely use and love them. This is such a great deal that I'm considering getting a third. Heck, I couldn't buy two replacement batteries for the cost of that kit. I've been abusing mine for over four years and the tools and batteries are still going strong. I've even used them to change the tires on my wife's Altima.
Mind that they would not be a good choice for drilling under any circumstances; but when it comes to driving fasteners, they can't be beat. The variable speed/torque trigger is very responsive allowing for small screws to large lag bolts to be driven with ease. I also have the smaller 10.8v Litheon Impactor, and they are not in the same class.
Just last fall I built a very large deck for my mother (16x24) and used the 12v Impactors. A younger relative couldn't believe the ease at which the assembly went together. He showed up with his 18v DeWalt, and it was back in the case in just a few minutes.
Mind that they would not be a good choice for drilling under any circumstances; but when it comes to driving fasteners, they can't be beat. The variable speed/torque trigger is very responsive allowing for small screws to large lag bolts to be driven with ease. I also have the smaller 10.8v Litheon Impactor, and they are not in the same class.
Just last fall I built a very large deck for my mother (16x24) and used the 12v Impactors. A younger relative couldn't believe the ease at which the assembly went together. He showed up with his 18v DeWalt, and it was back in the case in just a few minutes.
score0matic
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Brice Burrell said:
Brice
I don't know if I can agree with you on this. I use my Mak 10.8 -- same basic set up as the bosch, to drive things like light switch covers. I think you can get just as good of control with a small impact (When you are running it slow you can actually feel and hear it wind up the impact cam and stop it before it hits even once---very light pressure). and it is not like this is a "special" ability either, concentrate on it a few times it becomes a part of your muscle memory.
By the way $99. seems like a good buy.
Craig
While I haven't used the model in question, the compact (10.8/12v offerings from Bosch, Makita, Milwaukee, etc) are a completely different animal compared to a "full size" impact, like the one in question. They turn considerably slower than the full size units, which makes them much easier to control. I have a Bosch 10.8v impact, and it works well for driving small fasteners, but is almost useless for large screws and lags.
Joe,Impact drivers are much better than drills for driving screws and fasteners, though not for really delicate jobs,(you could use a screwdriver ;D).I rarely use my drill for fasteners anymore.Once you use an impact you don't go back.However you need a drill for drilling as impacts are useless.Can you get both?Either way for drywall you can get drywall bits which set the depth automatically.These work fairly well on metal framing with an impact driver but tend to pull in a bit on wood frames.In fact some impact drivers have a drywall "nose" available.
Brice Burrell
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Charimon said:
Fair enough but I'd counter with this, just because you can doesn't always mean you should. With impacts you gain torque at the expense of (at least to some degree) finesse/control, versatility and quietness that drills offer. I have no experience with the Bosch model in question but I'd bet it runs at fairly high RPMs making it harder to control than a drill in low gear. Plus a drill has a clutch and the ability to drill and drive, impacts are more of a one trick pony.
The one thing you don't hear people talk much about with impacts is how often it can go wrong. Impacts are geared high and with torque like crazy so they drive screws fast. This speed is nice when things go as planned but compared to drills screws are snapped, spin or cam out much more often. In furniture making this can be disastrous. So Craig, I concede your point but in the context of Joe's needs, just because you can doesn't necessarily mean you should.
BTW Craig, I jokingly refer to you impact guys as Neanderthals because using impacts is about as sophisticated as using a stick or a stone as a tool. ;D The evolved man uses the Festool T15.
mastercabman
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I am a cabinet installer and still uses regular cordless drill(i have 2 c12) I was introduce to impact driver long time ago(before they were available in cordless).Rutabagared said:
I was using a corded Makita.A friend let me use it to see if i like it. I did! except for the fact that it was corded.But i also toughed that it was overkill just to drive screws for cabinets.After all,a lots of screws this days are design with drill point and nibs.
I do see a lots of installers now that uses those impact driver,cordless of course.I have to agree with Brice about control on driving small screws.But if you plan on driving a lots of long screws all the time,than yes,an impact would be great.I have no plan on buying an impact driver anytime soon,I'm still using my C12's and they are going on over 4 years now and no problem with the drills.I did loose a charger and the batteries are starting to weaken.
As far as using an impact for drywall,i think it's way overkill!
Joe,
I mostly agree with the consensus here. For most screws, a C12 or T15 is the tool of choice. For occasionally driving a few lag screws, a C12 is OK, but a T15 would be better. I've driven lots of 3" X 5/16" lag screws with my C12. It works well, but it transmits a lot of torque to your wrist.
If you are driving lots of long, big screws then an impact driver can be useful as an addition to your C12/T15. IMO, an impact driver is not a screw driving replacement for a good drill. You just don't have the control of a drill. Adding a Mikita impact driver to my drill "stable" has been great. For slamming home big screws, there's nothing like it. But... I never use it near finished wood.
Regarding drywall screws, what you use depends on how much drywall you're going to hang. If just a few sheets, a Festool C12 or T15 with the drywall chuck will work nicely. Here's a review that I did a couple of years ago about that chuck: http://festoolownersgroup.com/index.php?topic=331.0. OTOH...
If you're going to hang lots of drywall, you'll want a corded drywall screw gun for speed. The Festool drills (and almost any other cordless) work OK for this, but don't have the RPMs. Some drywall screw guns can spin at 4500+ rpms. You can get a decent reconditioned drywall screw gun for about $50-$60.
Impact driver for drywall? Never!!! WAY overkill. You will want to sink the drywall screw to the proper depth as fast as possible and then have the drill release it automatically. The Festool Depth Stop Chuck can do that. Drywall drivers do this. An impact driver will drive the screw straight through the rock.
Regards,
Dan.
I mostly agree with the consensus here. For most screws, a C12 or T15 is the tool of choice. For occasionally driving a few lag screws, a C12 is OK, but a T15 would be better. I've driven lots of 3" X 5/16" lag screws with my C12. It works well, but it transmits a lot of torque to your wrist.
If you are driving lots of long, big screws then an impact driver can be useful as an addition to your C12/T15. IMO, an impact driver is not a screw driving replacement for a good drill. You just don't have the control of a drill. Adding a Mikita impact driver to my drill "stable" has been great. For slamming home big screws, there's nothing like it. But... I never use it near finished wood.
Regarding drywall screws, what you use depends on how much drywall you're going to hang. If just a few sheets, a Festool C12 or T15 with the drywall chuck will work nicely. Here's a review that I did a couple of years ago about that chuck: http://festoolownersgroup.com/index.php?topic=331.0. OTOH...
If you're going to hang lots of drywall, you'll want a corded drywall screw gun for speed. The Festool drills (and almost any other cordless) work OK for this, but don't have the RPMs. Some drywall screw guns can spin at 4500+ rpms. You can get a decent reconditioned drywall screw gun for about $50-$60.
Impact driver for drywall? Never!!! WAY overkill. You will want to sink the drywall screw to the proper depth as fast as possible and then have the drill release it automatically. The Festool Depth Stop Chuck can do that. Drywall drivers do this. An impact driver will drive the screw straight through the rock.
Regards,
Dan.
score0matic
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Look just because I make my living with STONE tools don't make me a Neanderthal.....I like to think of my self more a Nebraska man ;D ;D ;D ;DBrice Burrell said:BTW Craig, I jokingly refer to you impact guys as Neanderthals because using impacts is about as sophisticated as using a stick or a stone as a tool. ;D The evolved man uses the Festool T15.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nebraska_Man
Craig
Omaha, NE
Sorry, have to disagree with you guys on this.In my view an impact driver is a valid alternative to a drill for drywall but you have to use the right depth sensitive bits.You can't just stick a standard bit in and hope for the best!You have higher rpm than a drill and for metal frames impacts are better because they help the screw penetrate the metal.This seems to be supported by the fact the manufacturers make additional noses for them .I,ve seen them sold as a complete kit,though how good the noses are I couldn't say.I should also say that my view is related to metal frames and some people may never use this system.However neither are better than a dedicated drywall screw gun.I use a Makita drywall which turns at 6000 rpm and inserts to the right depth in a blink of an eye.Before I got this I used an impact which was an improvement over the cordless I used before that .I agree impacts are not for delicate work but for general carpentry they can't be beat in my opinion.
mastercabman
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Nigel, Impact drill to drive screws in metal stud? Does it really do a better job? If you are using the right screws,why would you need that much more torque?
Also,i have never seen a impact driver that offer a drywall nose.Who makes them?
Also,i have never seen a impact driver that offer a drywall nose.Who makes them?
Yes, those are the bits I was on about thanks mwhafner.However to answer your question mastercbman, both Makita and Hitachi offer dedicated "noses" for their impacts.They clamp to the front end collar and I presume can be adjusted more precisely than the bits,just like a drywall driver. May get one someday as my drywall driver is corded.I really think impacts are better than a cordless drill for metal stud as they seem to" knock" the screw through easier, don't think it's the extra torque. I also find there is less cam out with an impact though agree it is easier to snap screws.
jmbfestool
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You are better off with the Makita small drill because you get two for less the money than the Bosch but also the makita impact is much stronger than the bosch! I would go for festool T15+3 its smaller than the makita and the bosch and has more power than both put together! Also it has a angle and ofset bit making it even better for gettin into small places!
jmbfestool
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mwhafner said:
thats because the bosch 12v isnt very powerfull I have the bosch and the makita and the makita will drive large screws its much stronger and its little bit smaller than the bosh 12v the only bad thing about the makita 10.8 v is its takes a bit longer to charge than the bosch.
