CTL Mini or CTL 22?

[AlexThePalex]

Hello, I was wondering if anybody here could explain to me what the actual difference between the CTL Mini and the CTL 22 E SG model is, besides the size. I mean in functionality.

I realise this site is based in the US and mostly frequented by US people so please read CT Mini and CT 22. But in The Netherlands where I'm from they are called different as they are the newer versions of it. I doubt there's much difference though. I also don't understand why exactly Festool chooses to sell a slightly different line of products in the US.

When it comes to the difference between the Mini and the 22 I mostly mean the suction power. I've read a lot about these two machines already but what remains a bit vague to me is how strong they actually are. I'm mainly looking to use a vac for my Rotex 150 and with my home built saw/router table. The saw and router are not Festools btw, it's that other, yellow brand. :

From what I've read, I get the impression the Mini is alright when sanding, but for the sawing table, does it give you good suction with a hose that's split in two so you can extract dust from the saw under the table and from the blade guard on top? Or would it be better to have the 22 for that?

Another thing I am wondering about, is what happens if you use the machines without a dust bag, because they are so expensive. Will it damage the machine or deteriorate the effectiveness of the dust extraction? I realise Festool advises strongly against not using a bag, but what's the reason exactly?

Last thing I'd like to ask, and maybe there's a European FOG'er who can answer this, is there a big difference between the older CT 22  model and the current CTL 22 E SG? Besides the hose guard? The reason I ask is because I'm on a very tight budget and I'll probably have to settle for a second hand model and the older CT 22 is offered in abundance on the Dutch equivalent of eBay. Also, do they age well?

Only problem is I'll probably have to delay my new vac for quite a while. Been saving up for one and I was there, but now suddenly my %#@& mobo blew and because it's 5 years old I'll have to do a total upgrade for my pc (proc, mobo, ram, vid card) to get it running again. I'll have to stick to my trusty 16 year old home vac for a bit longer.

Oh yeah, that reminds me, got another thing to ask. How exactly do these professional Festool vacs compare to the average home vac when it comes to suction power? Are they just a bit stronger, or do they totally blow them out of the water?

Thanks in advance for any insight you can give me, and I hope I didn't ask too much at once

 

[Forrest Anderson]

Hello, I was wondering if anybody here could explain to me what the actual difference between the CTL Mini and the CTL 22 E SG model is, besides the size. I mean in functionality.

For differences in specification (eg weight, container volume, suction capacity, feature etc) see the table on page 14 of the CT brochure at http://www.festool.co.uk/images/gb_downloads/brochure_ctlmidi.pdf

See also the Dust Extraction section of the Consolidated List of Festool Links for reviews and manuals of the two machines.

From what I've read, I get the impression the Mini is alright when sanding, but for the sawing table, does it give you good suction with a hose that's split in two so you can extract dust from the saw under the table and from the blade guard on top? Or would it be better to have the 22 for that?

I'll have to stick to my trusty 16 year old home vac for a bit longer.

Oh yeah, that reminds me, got another thing to ask. How exactly do these professional Festool vacs compare to the average home vac when it comes to suction power? Are they just a bit stronger, or do they totally blow them out of the water?

I don't have a Festool dust extrator - instead I use a Vax 4100 household vacuum cleaner (1200W max, 1050W nominal). For sanding and the Domino it works very well indeed. For the TS55 it works pretty well, but for my Festool CS50 table saw, where the suction is split between two hoses just like the arrangement you describe, it struggles to clear the dust, particularly from the bottom of the blade shroud. I would imagine that you'd want as much suction power as you can get if you are wanting to use a dust extractor with your table saw.

Last thing I'd like to ask, and maybe there's a European FOG'er who can answer this, is there a big difference between the older CT 22  model and the current CTL 22 E SG? Besides the hose guard? The reason I ask is because I'm on a very tight budget and I'll probably have to settle for a second hand model and the older CT 22 is offered in abundance on the Dutch equivalent of eBay.

The SG suffix indicates that the extractor comes complete with a "hose garage", officially designated "Hose Holder CT-SG". This was initially offered as a separate add-on (ie buy a CTL 22 E and then purchase a CT-SG Hose Holder), but from Sep 2006 in the UK the CT22 series of extractors have been sold complete with the Hose Holder, and the complete kit was given the SG suffix, ie CTL 22 E SG or CTM 22 E SG.

The E suffix indicates that the extractor is fitted with electronics (probably the variable speed control). It's likely that in the early days, the CT22 didn't have variable-speed electronics, but as far as I know they all come with it nowadays. Reducing the suction power is often desirable when sanding, so that the sander doesn't stick to the workpiece. If indeed the plain old-model CT22 doesn't have a variable speed control, you can no doubt reduce the suction power by letting air get into the hose in some way.

Forrest

 

[Tinker]

"Also, do they age well?"

I've had my CT 33 for maybe five years now and the CT 22 for two or three.
Neither one has any wrinkles.  : ;D

About not using bags, i do not recommend.  When my CT 33 started losing suction, i had at first thought it was because I had started using a cyclone bucket to capture debris before it got into the vac.  I thought there was suction lost because of the extra fixture.  When suction actually got so poor, i was starting to fill the hose i investigated.  The HEPA filter was packed full.  The dust in the filter was like soft wood.  I tapped it out onto a piece of cloth and I will tell you, the pile on the cloth was in far more voluum that the actual size of the HEPA.  It is unbelievable how packed it must have been.  with a little blowing out of the final debris, the filter was just like new.  a little deformation of the filter pleats, but works fine nevertheless.

The reason it got so packed was that evidently, as I was installing the bag, I had not seated properly and it had gotten a tear near the neck at the top.  The bag was not yet half full, but because fine dust does not necessarilly settle into the cyclone bucket.  It swirls around and eventually follows the air.  The air goes thru the HEPA filter, but the dust finds a good parking place to settle in between the pleats.

I still use the cylone, but do more periodic checking of bag condition. 
From this description, draw your own conclusions about whether or not to use a bag.
Tinker