Domino in Ipe

[dooer]

I decided to make use of some of my ipe scraps.  I thought I would make some ipe tiles using domino's. 

The first one worked beautiful (see pic before sanding or finishing).  There are 12 #6 domino's in the tile.  Tiles are about 16" square.

I then cut a bunch of ipe scraps to make a bunch more tiles.  Laid out for the mortises and started cut them.  I noticed that it was requiring a lot more effort to plunge the domino.  This bit had maybe 20 plunges on it.  I didn't rush it.  That was my first indication that there might be a problem.

Normally, it doesn't take me much effort to insert the domino in the mortise.  Maybe a occaisional tap.  This time, they did not want to go in.  I had to take the mallet to them and you can see the result.  I couldn't sink the tendons and the ipe began to split.

The dominos have been stored in their systainer and it's been warm and dry out.

Any clues to what is happening.  I have a friend that said he used a bit on ipe and had 1200 plunges, til he hit a screw.  I got 20 on this bit and the dominos do not fit in the mortise.

 

[WarnerConstCo.]

I have cut 2 full boxes worth of 6mm domino's in Ipe, Garapa and Tigerwood.  Bit still cuts like a champ.

I do clean it regularly though. 

 

[tjbnwi]

Post a picture of the bit.  I bet the tip is missing.

Like Darcy, I have cut many a Domino mortice in Ipe. No issues with a good bit.

Tom

 

[dooer]

Problem solved, sort of

Broken bit.

So after 20 uses, what is the most likely cause of broken bit, besides going to fast, which I didn't think that I did.

 

[peter halle]

The Domino has a learning curve.  Listening to what the tool is doing is the best practice, but of course if you are wearing hearing protection that becomes more difficult.  The machine will also try to let you know via vibrations.  If in doubt go slower - don't worry, it is still faster than doing them by hand.

Peter

 

[Neathawk Designs]

This is a little off subject... but I thought I would throw it out there that the last time I was doing an Ipe Deck, I was concerned about the normal dominos holding up, so I made some dominos out of Ipe... which just meant ripping a piece down on the table saw (I think I actually used my miter saw to cut a slice), and then I used my Rotex to shape it into a domino (basically round the corners off).  It's the only way I knew that the Domino would last as long as the Ipe deck.  I then used Gorilla glue (which of course expanded like crazy and made a mess) to glue the dominos in.

 

[tjbnwi]

Problem solved, sort of

Broken bit.

So after 20 uses, what is the most likely cause of broken bit, besides going to fast, which I didn't think that I did.

What size bit? I had 3-5 mm go less than ten plunges (in plywood) and others go 6500.

Call Tom Belemere order the CMT bit.

Tom

 

[dooer]

What size bit? I had 3-5 mm go less than ten plunges (in plywood) and others go 6500.

Call Tom Belemere order the CMT bit.

Tom

It was a 6mm bit.  I ordered a couple more Festool bits.  How do the CMT bits compare to Festool, other then they are cheaper.

This wasn't the first time I've used the Domino, but the first time in ipe.  I will go slower next time.

 

[tjbnwi]

What size bit? I had 3-5 mm go less than ten plunges (in plywood) and others go 6500.

Call Tom Belemere order the CMT bit.

Tom

It was a 6mm bit.  I ordered a couple more Festool bits.  How do the CMT bits compare to Festool, other then they are cheaper.

This wasn't the first time I've used the Domino, but the first time in ipe.  I will go slower next time.

I have yet to have a CMT bit break. They cut cleaner in plywood. They're now my go to bit.

Over the last 7 weeks I have cut a few Domino mortices, final number is slightly over 29,000.

Tom

 

[tbellemare]

You can feel how fast to go...

If it's chattering/vibrating/screeching, you're going too fast. If you can't feel it cutting shavings, you're going too slow. When you once get the plunge rate down, it feels very smooth.

Some people get it right out of the box, others need a little practice. When you plunge at the correct rate for the work piece, it just feels and sounds right.

Tom

 

[jacko9]

Ipe and other very hard woods present a problem with a quick start or quick plunge on cutter bit tips.  Most cutter bits are hardened but they do a trade off between edge retention and fracture toughness the property that resists cracking an edge.  I have used my Domino machines with Ipe, Rosewood, Teak, and other difficult woods without issue but, I have always been careful to start the cut smoothly without the chatter and vibration that Tom refers to.  The Domino learning curve is short but, expensive on cutter replacement if your not careful.

Jack

 

[Kevin D.]

This is a little off subject... but I thought I would throw it out there that the last time I was doing an Ipe Deck, I was concerned about the normal dominos holding up, so I made some dominos out of Ipe... which just meant ripping a piece down on the table saw (I think I actually used my miter saw to cut a slice), and then I used my Rotex to shape it into a domino (basically round the corners off).  It's the only way I knew that the Domino would last as long as the Ipe deck.  I then used Gorilla glue (which of course expanded like crazy and made a mess) to glue the dominos in.

When you say 'normal' Dominos, do you mean the beech ones?  Or do you mean the SIPO/Mahagony ones?

I'm going to use SIPO's for some outdoor stuff this summer, some involving Ipe.  I've researched a lot on this and I'm inclined for most tasks to use West Sytems G-Flex epoxy.  Just as strong as their regular epoxy but has certain properties that are ideal for Ipe type of wood and also outdoor use. 

Pasted from the West Sytems site....

A toughened, versatile epoxy that is conveniently prethickened for permanent waterproof bonding of plastic, fiberglass, ceramics, metals, damp and difficult-to-bond woods. With a modulus of elasticity of 150,000 PSI, it is a bit more flexible than standard epoxies and polyester, but much stiffer than adhesive sealants. This gives G/flex 655 the ability to make structural bonds that can absorb the stress of expansion, contraction, shock and vibration. It is ideal for bonding dissimilar materials. Mixed at a 1:1 ratio, G/flex 655 gives you 45 minutes of working time at room temperature. It reaches an initial cure in 7 to 10 hrs and full cure in 24 hrs.

http://www.westsystem.com/ss/g-flex-epoxy/

 

[dooer]

I've used West Systems normal epoxy for laminations and such.  I've never tried it with ipe.  Seems kind of messy to use with domino's.

 

[Cort]

Problem solved, sort of

Broken bit.

So after 20 uses, what is the most likely cause of broken bit, besides going to fast, which I didn't think that I did.

I broke a Domino bit on my second use of it ever when machining Baltic birch plywood.  I plunged the Domino too quickly and unknowingly broke the tip of the bit.  Sound familiar?